chadwick02
Member
Hi Guys - taking a quick break from garage construction to divert attention to a solar electric project. Massachusetts has great rebates on solar electric systems that end this coming spring, and I just received approval to put a decent sized system on my barn out back. This project will require trenching electric from the top of the property, where the house/garage/main utility service are [going to be] down to the barn. The previous owner had this barn built, but never actually ran electric service too it, about 350' feet from the house to the barn. See picture.
Approval for this project came much sooner than I suspected, and I'd like to get this rolling now, rather than early spring when were in a major time crunch. I have plenty of time this weekend to do the trenching work, and were waiting for concrete to cure on the garage project, so I dont have much else I can do project wise. A mild fall means the ground isnt frozen, yet, but were on borrowed time I'd like to trench THIS weekend and get that done.
Electrical code says a minimum of 18" deep for the electric conduit, we'll be running 2" conduit for the 200a service as well as two 1" conduits with strings for anything in the future. Conduit is cheap and I'd rather not dig another trench to run phone/cable/internet later on. Gonna put an outdoor 120v outlet half way down the run in the middle of the field too - might put a garden there someday, electric fence charger, yard light, power tools, battery charger for the tractor who knows its easy and cheap to to do now when running the power.
I'm open to any and all suggestions or thoughts in terms of running services down to the barn, but the point of this thread actually has nothing to do with electricity....:
Should I run a water line down to the barn as well?? If so, is now the time?
Pros:
1 - It'd be nice to have water in the barn! Why?? Well, I dont really know. Wash sink, potential bathroom... Unsure of the barns ultimate use, now its mostly storage and some shop space, but water will always (someday...) be beneficial, right??. 2nd floor of the barn is partially finished and could become offices, a gym/workout room, bar and pool table, wood shop. Possibilities are endless.
2- Our plan is to possibly plant a garden in the middle of the field. Could put a frost free hydrant half way down for irrigation purposes.
Cons:
1 - there is no septic or sewer in the barn. We'd have to put a system in, or potentially pump up to the septic here at the house (its possible and the septic is sized big enough, but not ideal). So, while running a water line now is cheap and relatively easy, without a septic (or alternatives) our uses are limited currently.
2 - using well water for irrigation is nice... but do we want to use our well (which has good flow) as a source of irrigation, and risk potential issues? For some reason that has me not feeling great.
3 - electric needs to be 18", but water line needs to be below the frost line... 36-48(??) inches. Renting an 18-24" trencher is easy and cheap, renting one that'll go 4' is looking like a 6-$800 adventure.
Someone talk me off the ledge here please. Everyone I've talked too (friends, family, contractors) say drop water line in now, its easy to go a little deeper and then it'll be done). Before we poured the garage floor I stubbed a 1" water line out, so thats all set ready to roll.
Utilities sharing trenches: NEC has no direction (code doesn't say it cant be done). Electrical inspector said ask the board of health (oversees water), board of health says its up to the electrical inspector. Electrician shrugged. If no one says no, I wont push it, i'll do it. I'd love for someone to say yes sharing the trench is fine...
Options:
1 - Just run electric and forget water line. 18" deep, small walk behind trencher, done.
2 - Shallow trench as above, but throw the plastic water line in for fun. Not below frost line, but will serve as a good waterline 3 seasons out of the year, barn isnt insulated or heated regularly anyhow so water will need to be turned off and bled before freezing weather.
3 - Do it all, dig 42" down with a big trenching machine, burry it all, know the water line is there in the future. I've got the time to do it this weekend, I've got a machine on deposit, water line expense is a couple hundred bucks total. Not gonna break the bank. Might not ever use it, but wont regret not doing it(?). The bigger ride on tracked trencher sure will be much more fun to operate than a small walk behind, and my guess is a track machine going deeper will probably prove to be almost as easy as a smaller shallower machine. From digging foundations and footings, so far the soil has been great (even though we are on the side of a mountain).
One more thought in the back of my mind: Shallow well / hand driven point well (basically 1.25" heavy duty steel pipe that is driven by hand down into the ground typically 15-25'). Not usually the quality or quantity of water of a typical deep well, but usually plenty good for irrigation or animal water, and my guess is it'd be fine for drinking too). Gravity drain back so they work year round. Hand pump (no electricity) or electric pump would work similar to regular home well water. I have not tried one on my property yet, so were not positive it'll work, however I know of plenty of households within a few miles that have had good success so I think I would too. I do really like the idea of having a 2nd source of water other than my primary deep well, just in case... And I like the idea of running garden/lawn irrigation off that pump (if it'll handle it) too, rather than working my deep well pump hard. I could put one at the barn and one in the middle of the field, if I really wanted too.
That was way too long a write up for a really simple question.
Sorry. Open to everyone's thoughts about both water and electric. And really, I've spent way too much time thinking about this...
Thanks
Chad
Approval for this project came much sooner than I suspected, and I'd like to get this rolling now, rather than early spring when were in a major time crunch. I have plenty of time this weekend to do the trenching work, and were waiting for concrete to cure on the garage project, so I dont have much else I can do project wise. A mild fall means the ground isnt frozen, yet, but were on borrowed time I'd like to trench THIS weekend and get that done.
Electrical code says a minimum of 18" deep for the electric conduit, we'll be running 2" conduit for the 200a service as well as two 1" conduits with strings for anything in the future. Conduit is cheap and I'd rather not dig another trench to run phone/cable/internet later on. Gonna put an outdoor 120v outlet half way down the run in the middle of the field too - might put a garden there someday, electric fence charger, yard light, power tools, battery charger for the tractor who knows its easy and cheap to to do now when running the power.
I'm open to any and all suggestions or thoughts in terms of running services down to the barn, but the point of this thread actually has nothing to do with electricity....:
Should I run a water line down to the barn as well?? If so, is now the time?
Pros:
1 - It'd be nice to have water in the barn! Why?? Well, I dont really know. Wash sink, potential bathroom... Unsure of the barns ultimate use, now its mostly storage and some shop space, but water will always (someday...) be beneficial, right??. 2nd floor of the barn is partially finished and could become offices, a gym/workout room, bar and pool table, wood shop. Possibilities are endless.
2- Our plan is to possibly plant a garden in the middle of the field. Could put a frost free hydrant half way down for irrigation purposes.
Cons:
1 - there is no septic or sewer in the barn. We'd have to put a system in, or potentially pump up to the septic here at the house (its possible and the septic is sized big enough, but not ideal). So, while running a water line now is cheap and relatively easy, without a septic (or alternatives) our uses are limited currently.
2 - using well water for irrigation is nice... but do we want to use our well (which has good flow) as a source of irrigation, and risk potential issues? For some reason that has me not feeling great.
3 - electric needs to be 18", but water line needs to be below the frost line... 36-48(??) inches. Renting an 18-24" trencher is easy and cheap, renting one that'll go 4' is looking like a 6-$800 adventure.
Someone talk me off the ledge here please. Everyone I've talked too (friends, family, contractors) say drop water line in now, its easy to go a little deeper and then it'll be done). Before we poured the garage floor I stubbed a 1" water line out, so thats all set ready to roll.
Utilities sharing trenches: NEC has no direction (code doesn't say it cant be done). Electrical inspector said ask the board of health (oversees water), board of health says its up to the electrical inspector. Electrician shrugged. If no one says no, I wont push it, i'll do it. I'd love for someone to say yes sharing the trench is fine...
Options:
1 - Just run electric and forget water line. 18" deep, small walk behind trencher, done.
2 - Shallow trench as above, but throw the plastic water line in for fun. Not below frost line, but will serve as a good waterline 3 seasons out of the year, barn isnt insulated or heated regularly anyhow so water will need to be turned off and bled before freezing weather.
3 - Do it all, dig 42" down with a big trenching machine, burry it all, know the water line is there in the future. I've got the time to do it this weekend, I've got a machine on deposit, water line expense is a couple hundred bucks total. Not gonna break the bank. Might not ever use it, but wont regret not doing it(?). The bigger ride on tracked trencher sure will be much more fun to operate than a small walk behind, and my guess is a track machine going deeper will probably prove to be almost as easy as a smaller shallower machine. From digging foundations and footings, so far the soil has been great (even though we are on the side of a mountain).
One more thought in the back of my mind: Shallow well / hand driven point well (basically 1.25" heavy duty steel pipe that is driven by hand down into the ground typically 15-25'). Not usually the quality or quantity of water of a typical deep well, but usually plenty good for irrigation or animal water, and my guess is it'd be fine for drinking too). Gravity drain back so they work year round. Hand pump (no electricity) or electric pump would work similar to regular home well water. I have not tried one on my property yet, so were not positive it'll work, however I know of plenty of households within a few miles that have had good success so I think I would too. I do really like the idea of having a 2nd source of water other than my primary deep well, just in case... And I like the idea of running garden/lawn irrigation off that pump (if it'll handle it) too, rather than working my deep well pump hard. I could put one at the barn and one in the middle of the field, if I really wanted too.
That was way too long a write up for a really simple question.
Sorry. Open to everyone's thoughts about both water and electric. And really, I've spent way too much time thinking about this...
Thanks
Chad
Attachments
Last edited: