Above 1200 Sq/FT Speed Metal Garage - rattle_snake’s 34x40 shop build in AZ

[rixtrix1]

Spoiled-Yes. Suckage-For sure. Good for you!

 

[Finallygotit]

Ya know, I kinda remember someone telling me "You ****".

Well guess what Justin, RIGHT BACK AT YA!!

 

[AZpilot]

I need a shop.

 

[MrBreeze]

A/C....sweet! Just in time...the heat is coming!

 

[rattle_snake]

nice updates. Really like the way you did the walls to be easy to access and add stuff.

It has worked out well, thanks for looking.

Spoiled-Yes. Suckage-For sure. Good for you!

Thanks you Sir!

Ya know, I kinda remember someone telling me "You ****".
Well guess what Justin, RIGHT BACK AT YA!!

Uh, well, yes maybe I did say that... however it was justified!

I need a shop.

Yes we all do. Even 2 or 3.

A/C....sweet! Just in time...the heat is coming!

Ya it's already in the 90s. In addition to not being able to commit to a system, I have too much stuff going on... My other 'winter' project didn't happen (garage epoxy).

 

[rattle_snake]

Making slow progress on the A/C install.
Digging the holes for the condenser rack was a pain. Ground is extremely compact (is supposed to be though) had to use digging bar inch at a time. Put a half a bag of concrete in each hole, I think it's plenty stout for the application...


Added a pair of 20A breakers to the sub panel. Unfortunately, it is now full. Should have started with a bigger box but can deal with it later if needed, or add another sub panel from it or main box.


Disconnects ended up in same wall cavity as panel for easy install. This leaves the one next to it for just the line sets.


Placed the units on the rack. Some how my math worked out right and they fit nicely. I planned to use uni-strut washers but they placed all the force on the ends of the feet. To solve I replaced with some strips out of 1/2 rubber mat that support the whole length.


The least fun aspect was running the line sets up the wall cavity. Cut the exterior holes and a large opening up on the shelf to feed from. I used a dowel to push insulation to one side of the cavity to make room for the 4 insulated copper lines.

 

[AZpilot]

That is not slow progress. You are 50% done with 90% to go!

 

[nsula_country]

So far you are moving right along at a good pace.

How long are the linesets?

Are you going to have to cut one or both down to prevent excess or coiling? Coiling is bad for oil return.

Why did you run a neutral? Future proofing? Wire on hand? Service outlet?

Too many questions, I know. Just the engineer view on things...

Going to use lineset covers?

Condenser rack turned out very nice. This Saturday I have a paying job to swap out a 3 ton Condenser, Electric Furnace and Evap Coil... I do about 2 a year for people I like. Keeps me in practice.

CT

 

[OzarkMan]

Looks Good Justin. I finally broke down and picked up a new LG 3 ton unit for my garage. I haven't posted here as life and work really get in the way. I went with the ceiling cassette to keep it out of the way. We are adding another addition for Marie. Her very own closet with island and chandelier. For that I picked up another LG multi split unit since the addition is actually two rooms, a closet and sitting room off the master bedroom. I get the original closet for my gun safe and other toys that go bang! My framer is expanding it by a foot into Maries space but she won't know about it

My advice is to be careful handing the line sets. They do and can kink very easily.

 

[AZpilot]

I did the hillbilly install on mine as I was not in the mood to fight the HoA.

 

[rattle_snake]

That is not slow progress. You are 50% done with 90% to go!

Soon enough I'll be at 90% w/ 90% to go!

So far you are moving right along at a good pace.
How long are the linesets?
Are you going to have to cut one or both down to prevent excess or coiling? Coiling is bad for oil return.
Why did you run a neutral? Future proofing? Wire on hand? Service outlet?
Too many questions, I know. Just the engineer view on things...
Going to use lineset covers?
Condenser rack turned out very nice. This Saturday I have a paying job to swap out a 3 ton Condenser, Electric Furnace and Evap Coil... I do about 2 a year for people I like. Keeps me in practice.
CT

Lineset are 50'/30' and will be cut down to about 25'/42'. Units are pre-charged for 30'.
MY OCD forbids using a white wire as a hot. To me white should only be neutral. Sure one can mark with tape, spray paint or whatever. I had 12/3 on hand so used that.

Looks Good Justin. I finally broke down and picked up a new LG 3 ton unit for my garage. I haven't posted here as life and work really get in the way. I went with the ceiling cassette to keep it out of the way. We are adding another addition for Marie. Her very own closet with island and chandelier. For that I picked up another LG multi split unit since the addition is actually two rooms, a closet and sitting room off the master bedroom. I get the original closet for my gun safe and other toys that go bang! My framer is expanding it by a foot into Maries space but she won't know about it

My advice is to be careful handing the line sets. They do and can kink very easily.

I wasn't worried about kinks... until your warning. Now I can't sleep at night. With the insulation, you cannot visually verify the cross sectional area has not been reduced below some magical threshold.
PO started a 2nd master closet project very similar to yours. Unfortunately every aspect is half-assed so I don't see it moving forward. My wife has confiscated most all closet real estate but I need room for another tall skinny safe. As you know, firearms have been known to reproduce when stored in the right conditions. Found a little 9 in there one day...

 

[FallibleFlyer]

I really like the sliding door upper storage, is there a particular post that details it's construction?

 

[rattle_snake]

I really like the sliding door upper storage, is there a particular post that details it's construction?

Thanks. Somehow I built train tracks on my ceiling. See this page;
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=318925&page=26

 

[rattle_snake]

Outdoor wiring is complete. I suffered acute fastener trauma. The incident started with acknowledgment of the problem caused by potentially dropping a terminal screw inside. Then tragedy struck when the unit sucked in one of the screws. I heard it tumble down into the bowels, like a pinball machine, and I knew I was %@#$'d.
'It's OK' I told myself (I talk to myself a lot in times of turmoil), 'just use another screw'.
After removing just about every screw on the unit I still couldn't get the side cover off, so I reassembled the unit and unhappily installed the tainted backup fastener.

The next day it irritated me to the point of having to try again. I did manage to find a few more elusive screws and get the covers off the unit. I found the offending screw under the pump. After reassembly, balance has been restored to the universe.
This debacle proved that I could service anything inside while on the rack I built.

This is why a simple job takes me forever.


I was able to make large radii on the tubing as it exits the wall buy placing the hole up from the ports and elongating the opening.

 

[nsula_country]

Very nice! Very Nice. You did a better install than a lot (not all) of HVAC companies as far as appearance.

Awaiting the finished photos of the evaporator units.

CT

 

[Finallygotit]

^^^^^ X2

 

[StormcrowAz]

Yes, nice work indeed! I am envisioning you working in a cool and dry environment this summer while I’m grinding away in a marginally cooled, yet still-sweaty, shop. Got to stay positive, though, as I feel very fortunate to have a shop to work in and not be out in the direct sun trying to get stuff done.

My other 'winter' project didn't happen (garage epoxy).

Are you going with epoxy in the garage only? I thought about doing the shop, even got quotes when we first moved in, but came to the conclusion that I fall into the “don’t want to have to worry about the expensive floor when dragging metal around and welding on top of it” crowd. Right now I’m leaning towards putting tile in the garage when time/money permits.

 

[rattle_snake]

Very nice! Very Nice. You did a better install than a lot (not all) of HVAC companies as far as appearance.
Awaiting the finished photos of the evaporator units.
CT

Thanks. But to get things 'pretty' I waste a lot of time. I wouldn't make any money as a HVAC guy. The system will operate the same ugly or pretty but my mind forces me to shape each wire and tube just so....

^^^^^ X2

Yes, nice work indeed! I am envisioning you working in a cool and dry environment this summer while I’m grinding away in a marginally cooled, yet still-sweaty, shop. Got to stay positive, though, as I feel very fortunate to have a shop to work in and not be out in the direct sun trying to get stuff done.

Are you going with epoxy in the garage only? I thought about doing the shop, even got quotes when we first moved in, but came to the conclusion that I fall into the “don’t want to have to worry about the expensive floor when dragging metal around and welding on top of it” crowd. Right now I’m leaning towards putting tile in the garage when time/money permits.

Yes we are spoiled to have a shop to work in. Life is fragile, any given property/shop can be taken away at any time for many reasons even at no fault of our own (health, crazy wife, etc)
I feel very lucky to have one A/C'd or not. Once it's really hot and miserable I'll have a beer for you.

I don't plan to epoxy the shop for those reasons. I did my last to garages that were also my workshop space and floors got trashed welding and dragging gearboxes across them.

 

[Finallygotit]

......floors got trashed welding and dragging gearboxes across them.

That's called patina.

 

[rattle_snake]

Line sets are run to the evap locations. To avoid damage from the junk on the shelves, I mounted them up high on the air piping.
I had a hard time getting lineset tape. Have to be a contractor to get it locally. The Biz doesn't want average Joe fixing or installing his own AC.
Still a few items to wrap up but 2 of the major items are done now. I've settled on exact locations for the handlers so next is provisions for drains.

 

[OzarkMan]

I've tried buying a fan motor for my condenser when it crapped out and they wouldn't even sell that to me. I was wearing my electrical contractor shirt and one of the smug ac guys waiting on his order made a comment about hiring a real hvac guy to come out and change my motor. I turned to him and said "**** off". I found what I needed online for $46. AC companies as you know would have raped me for $500 to replace the condenser motor and run the wiring outside wire tied to the grille instead of threading it through the little piece of conduit.

Funny how you say we are blessed to have what we have as it can really all change in a heartbeat. The crazy wife is the most popular reasons we get screwed in life. My wife has been an amazing woman Now that we are approaching our 50's I doubt mental instability will take over her. I think I am safe with my things

 

[AZpilot]

Line sets are run to the evap locations. To avoid damage from the junk on the shelves, I mounted them up high on the air piping.
I had a hard time getting lineset tape. Have to be a contractor to get it locally. The Biz doesn't want average Joe fixing or installing his own AC.
Still a few items to wrap up but 2 of the major items are done now. I've settled on exact locations for the handlers so next is provisions for drains.

You guys should try Baker on the 60 and Mesa dr. I have bought stuff there. Never asked me a thing. My first order I bought online and went and picked up. After that was easy.

 

[rattle_snake]

Hendels will sell anyone stuff but their prices are really high. Now that I have an inside connection I can get whatever I need. Grainger is another option for motors, caps and such.

 

[rattle_snake]

Opened up south wall for embedded drain pipe so I don't have to look at it. Starts as 1-1/4 PVC then reduces to 3/4 and exits down low.
The north wall just has a short horizontal piece of 1-1/4 PCV as a sleeve to outside. I plan to use a hard pipe on the outside wall next to gutter. Contemplated just plumbing drain into gutter itself.

I mounted evap's up at 9', same as shelf mostly for aesthetics. The piping will remain visible on the inside wall over from shelf. Might make some kind of cover in the future.



I used lineset tape to bundle and a zip tie to secure to the air piping. The radii aren't all perfect but acceptable for a hidden location

Need to build some bumpers for the doors to keep them from crushing the pipes.

 

[Finallygotit]

Seriously, nice job!

 

[rattle_snake]

Thanks Dan. Hope to get the tubes hooked up soon and try it out!

While working on my audio amplifiers, I realized that the sub woofer amp had the low pass filter on and set for 50hz. The options are set with DIP switches inside a little window on the back of the chassis. The subs are tuned to 28 with a -3db @ 24 so choking them off at 50 is a horrible waste of capabilities.
With the filter off and gains re-adjusted, the system is even more of a beast. Holy smokes! Even though I was happy before the extra low end is very impressive. I can really feel the concrete move under my feet now.


Edit:
So, I thought I was in the clear as far as building rattles and shakes were concerned. Well now that the LP filter is off, I have some issues. I spent an extra effort on all the light fixtures to keep them from rattling but now the energy is enough to light them up (and the toolbox full of tools). The fixtures on the bottom of the shelf concern me, the glass tubes flex and want to jump out at me. The sliding doors get brutally pounded as well and the last original panel fell out. The sheet metal on the walls has only a few problem areas and is not as bad as I though it could have been.

 

[rampster]

Cool Thread Justin. How is AC working?

 

[rattle_snake]

Cool Thread Justin. How is AC working?

Thanks it has been quite a journey...

Got the A/C install almost wrapped up and the units running. Still a handful of small items to take care of but have cool breezes blowing.

The indoor evaps are mounted at 9', mostly to match the shelf height. Need to come up with a cover solution for the piping. Perhaps a fabric strip with velcro sewed on. The outdoor units are very quiet and fans run at a slow speed given the conditions. I would assume that they are variable speed and will run faster when heat load is increased.

The air handlers move a fair amount of air with fan at full speed. My initial thoughts are that a single air handler may not have been a good choice for this large of a space.

Since the night temperatures are still relatively cool, I still have the exhaust fan running 4-7 am which gets the temp down in the 70s for most of the day. When it gets hot I will have to come up with some block off plates for the air intake vents and disable automatic fan system.



The north unit is about 2 feet farther from the corner that the other. I centered then on the walls instead of making them the same. It is hard for my mind to accept non-symmetrical things.


The plan is to hang the subwoofer cabinets on either side of this handler.

 

[zmotorsports]

Very nice install Justin.

 

[OzarkMan]

Function over form Justin.... You won't be too worried about symmetry in a week or so! I've got my units connected on the inside but waiting on the stucco guy to put the lath on before I connect the outdoor plumbing and vacuum the lines. Just passed inspection on the addition where I have the garage unit next to.

 

[rattle_snake]

Very nice install Justin.

Thanks, other than the last few feet of piping at the air handlers it almost looks like they were supposed to be there.

Function over form Justin.... You won't be too worried about symmetry in a week or so! I've got my units connected on the inside but waiting on the stucco guy to put the lath on before I connect the outdoor plumbing and vacuum the lines. Just passed inspection on the addition where I have the garage unit next to.

Hope you don't have to wait too long for contractor, it's getting hot summer is almost upon us now.


Extended and sealed up the drain on the north unit. It is not to the quality level I would like but is functional for now, and I can ponder how to best improve it in the future.

Wrapped up the condenser plumbing. The cover structure will have to wait until next winter. Thinking vertical weathered lumber at an angle to allow airflow but hide from patio view.

 

[AZpilot]

You are going to SO happy this summer. Last summer it was 118 and I almost had to put a sweater on in the garage!

 

[OzarkMan]

I'm hoping my LG 3 ton unit keeps me frosty in the 1088 sq ft space myself! I am still in the process of piping it all together along with a dual zone unit for the new closet addition.

 

[rattle_snake]

Yes I am really happy with the idea of not cooking to death in my shop this year. There will still be plenty of outdoor work to suffer through.

With fans on auto I turned on the system to see how long it takes to cool down the area. The units have no temperature display, only set point on remote. The fans run at all times if turned on, so you don't really know if the set point has been reached. It took about an hour drop from 85 to 83 with sun already down. I'm guessing to drop 10 in full sun at 110+ will take several hours.

It occurred to me after switching on A/C the first time that I have more or less completed phase 3 of 3 on this shop build. No it's not 'done', 'finished' or any other mythical milestone, but all the major aspects are done to some degree.

I took most of my nights and weekends for 3 years to get where I am now. I have a long list of to-do's but they are no longer stressful gating items.

I have been working on organizing the storage space I have made, but it is painfully slow committing to what to put where. I have decided to sort though my entire toolbox and put tools in tool box and materials in the bench boxes. Also moving stuff into the cabinets and shuffling the shelving around to best fit.

My wife has made it clear she is ready for me to start on the house renovation projects so I am hesitant to start a fab table build, but I'm on the lookout for a plate steel top.... and I need to get started on finishing the sub woofers.

 

[rattle_snake]

Figured would crack open my drawers to show off my nuts. Also bought some bolts so I have 4 or so of common bolt lengths in 1/4 through 1/2. Have sorted thought about half my fastener/hardware stash, need some more dividers for small items.



Created a paint department by moving all the paint out of laundry room and into shop cabinets. Also moved all my painting equipment into garage workbench drawers. Next step it so move sewing machines and fabric stash out of office and into laundry room.
Nice to have adjustable shelves!

 

[OutlawDrifter]

Nice work. I need to get some bulk hardware setup in my shop. Paint cabinet is the next on my list for storage needs.

 

[rattle_snake]

Upgraded my grinder stand with a foot square 1/2 plate top. Originally placed front of grinder on edge, but flipped it around to have a place to set small pieces. Hope to build another matching stand soon for vice and/or belt/disc sander


Added Wifi interface to A/C system. Didn't get wifi working yet.... connection in shop is crappy at best but enough to stream video. Hope to get it working today

 

[nsula_country]

What is the WiFi interface? Is it from the OEM or is it aftermarket?

CT

 

[rattle_snake]

What is the WiFi interface? Is it from the OEM or is it aftermarket?

CT

The wifi interfaces are OEM Diakin BRP072A43. I was able to get them at cost though my friend's a/c business but had to buy one for each unit. The IR remote still functions which is important to me. They allow use of Diakin's web app for offsite control and scheduling like a 7 day thermostat. This way I can program a profile that works best for me.

But I still can't get it connected. I had to do the unthinkable;

Contact tech support for someone else's software



A non-OEM option is this, which is just emulated IR remote button presses.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075TW3QGN/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[nsula_country]

Interesting. The one in the Amazon link appears to be a WiFi connected IR blaster, for $130... With mixed reviews. At least someone tried to create a product to interface with room ACs and Minis.

Once you get it setup, the scheduler will be awesome.

Could you hardwire a scheduling thermostat to the unit instead of the remote only option?

CT