Above 1200 Sq/FT Jeff's Mountain Side Shop (Portland)

[sponaugle]

Just an awesome site and build; Hard to believe theres a single lot of this size inside a major city. What a lucky acquisition for you! Thanks for sharing.

Yea, it was luck, as these 'lots' were created in the mid 90s as part of a partition of Forest Park. The result were 14 lots that are mostly in the 10-20 acre size, but have pretty heavy restrictions in terms of conservation and environmental overlays. We had to hire multiple arborists, environmental engineers, surveyors, and geotechs just to get through the permitting process. We have a ton of 'mitigation' we have to do before getting occupancy permits (mostly planting trees and plants).

We happened upon the for sale sign right after it went up. Of course it was $1.2 million just for the lot, so it wasn't exactly just about to 'fly off the shelf'... but it is a unique lot that we feel fortunate to be building on. In some parts of the country this would be a bargain while in others it would be highway robbery.

Jeff

 

[sponaugle]

server room's with full height melamine sheets always struck my fancy. Easy to wipe down for dust and double as white boards when you're trying to do something.

What on earth do you have filling 3 racks worth? audio gear?

Hmm. Interesting idea. I like whiteboards.

The three racks are planned for:

1 Audio/Video rack - still working on this.
1 Server Rack
1 expansion rack, and probably the UPSs.

I'll have plenty of room for expansion later. Right now I have a VMWare cluster running off a ZFS based SAN (over 10gig ethernet), plus some servers for video recording from the cameras, a 4 node Hadoop cluster, and a few other experimental boxes.

Jeff

 

[sponaugle]

My daughter is a Pilot, a recent grad of The University of Portland. I love to visit as she stayed after graduation and says she is never coming back to California. Your build is epic.

Nice! My wife worked at the University of Portland before our now 6 year old daughter was born, and her mom is a regent there. I'm glad to hear your daughter likes it here! Some people don't like the rainy winters, but I personally really like it.

Jeff

 

[rakane]

I cannot imagine the permit fees. For a reasonable 2600 Sq ft house the permits were 45K.

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[sponaugle]

Update 10 - Rebar for Garage and Shop Floors

Rebar installation for the shop floors is underway. We have buttoned up all of the exposed surfaces and covered everything in gravel as we enter winter.

The shop floor with rebar. #5 rebar, 8 inches on center.

A look from 400ft above the property.

Standing on the vault, you can see the rebar for both the lower garage as well as the shop.

Looking up from the shop corner.

This catches us up to real time, so the updates from now on will be much slower (especially with Christmas in the middle).

The next step is the pouring of the floors, and the installation of the steel beams. The concrete floors are dependent on the weather, and Portland being Portland, the next 7 days are pretty socked with rain. If we get a good dry day in there we will jump on it and pour. I believe it will take two pours for the floor due to the lower garage floor being a bit more complex in terms of slope. With two drains there are four different slopes, so that takes a bit more time to setup and get just right.

The rear decking has 6x 16ft W6x20 steel columns supporting a 50 ft W18x40 beam, and the beams for holding up the main floor joists are 5x 30ft W24x62 beams. Those 30ft 62 beams are 1860lbs each, and I assume we will use a crane to place them. I have not done steel beam construction like this before, so I'm looking forward to learning.

Jeff

 

[sponaugle]

I cannot imagine the permit fees. For a reasonable 2600 Sq ft house the permits were 45K.

Just thinking about that topic makes me either cry, or get angry. The real killer is the property tax, as it will probably be 50k/yr.

 

[54earl]

Interesting build.

 

[jblnut]

This is a one of the neater builds that's shown up in the gallery in a while. Just the right amount of overkill for my liking.

It seems like the existing piers are being worked into your building plan. Is that something you'd have needed for your build as well or was that just a happy bonus since they were already there ??

 

[wasfast]

Very impressive and amazing build. For Oregon, yours is a large place. I lived in Oregon (10 different towns) for 51 years, here in San Diego the last 8. Racked my brain trying to figure out approximately where this might be on the west side.....no luck.

This build will get a LOT of interested folks. If you haven't, you should read through LLWilly's build thread. I noticed he commented above. Make sure you have some time, it's long.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=145073

Another epic home.

 

[sponaugle]

Very impressive and amazing build. For Oregon, yours is a large place. I lived in Oregon (10 different towns) for 51 years, here in San Diego the last 8. Racked my brain trying to figure out approximately where this might be on the west side.....no luck.
This build will get a LOT of interested folks. If you haven't, you should read through LLWilly's build thread. I noticed he commented above. Make sure you have some time, it's long.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=145073
Another epic home.

If you look closely, the google earth picture on the first page shows the address.

Here is the view from 400 ft. directly over the house, looking towards Portland. You can see the St. Johns bridge, and across the water to the right you can see the University of Portland.

I will most certainly read LLWilly's thread. There is such a wealth of information in these threads.

Jeff

 

[Boosted1]

The drone shots are cool.
I really like the 400 ft above pic in your last update.

 

[sponaugle]

This is a one of the neater builds that's shown up in the gallery in a while. Just the right amount of overkill for my liking.
It seems like the existing piers are being worked into your building plan. Is that something you'd have needed for your build as well or was that just a happy bonus since they were already there ??

Thanks! I'll try to keep the overkill to a reasonable yet interesting level!

It turned out to be a bonus, as the real constraint was the building envelope allowed. We certainly didn't need to piers for stability. I would normally have done the shop as a seperate building, but in Portland the accessory structures can't be over 900sqft.

Jeff

 

[sponaugle]

Very impressive build! I'm diggin the old school Jahn's system formwork. That system requires honest to God form carpenters (wish I could find a few of those myself) and results in some beautiful concrete. Can't wait to see the rest of the job. Thanks for posting.

I am starting in on your thread, and it looks amazing. Now I see you are a concrete guru, so no surprise you noticed the formwork! I'm looking forward to getting page 117 in your thread!

Jeff

 

[Kyle29A]

Great read!

 

[LXCam]

Just thinking about that topic makes me either cry, or get angry. The real killer is the property tax, as it will probably be 50k/yr.

Ouch!, a couple years back we were seriously looking at moving to Austin. The wife found her perfect home that fit our budget as far as the purchase price. But scrolling down to the property tax section revealed the ugly truth. Just a tad over 30k a year and I told my wife "over my dead body".......she was fine with that


Btw I Do construction management for large projects. When you mentioned the rebar schedule for the garage slab I didn't think twice about it as I figured it would be tied back into the footings which seems to be fairly standard with construction in expansive soil conditions. I was quite surprised to see yours is a floating slab, talk about overkill. You'll be able to do damn near anything down there -I love it!

 

[protegeV]

subbed. This is redonkulous!!!

 

[sponaugle]

Update 11 - First Steel Installed

A few of the vertical steel tubes were put in place today.

The rear tubes give an idea how how high up the rear deck and the first floor of the house is, as well as how high the ceiling will be in the shop. On paper it looks smaller than it does in person.

A Skyjack showed up, which is probably sufficient for the steel installation since the side and rear of the shop is very accessible. This one can lift 10,000 and do 56 feet (but only 6000 lbs at 56 feet).

Here is a drone shot from the downhill side.

Plus the usual overhead shot.

 

[Air_Cooled_Nut]

...
It turned out to be a bonus, as the real constraint was the building envelope allowed. We certainly didn't need to piers for stability...

When the Cascadia subduction event occurs you'll likely be glad you have them.

 

[sponaugle]

Oh and if you have an interest in video, here are three short drone shots:

A quick loop around the building (this is the automated flight path I do every couple of days and will use to make a final buildup video

A 'drive' in from the street. You can see the shared driveway first, then as we pass the other house that is nearby we start on our unfinished driveway.

And last, a quick look up and around..

Jeff

 

[BORING HOP YARD]

So your around German Town Road, nice build.
Cathedral park is cool and the Saint Johns Bridge is one of the nicest looking bridges I have seen. A good buddys Grandfather helped oversee the building of the bridge, I was able to look at some of the original blue prints back when I was in high school, many moons ago.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/135014953@N02/27042701673

 

[sponaugle]

When the Cascadia subduction event occurs you'll likely be glad you have them.

Yes.. and even more so, good earthquake insurance!

So your around German Town Road, nice build.
Cathedral park is cool and the Saint Johns Bridge is one of the nicest looking bridges I have seen. A good buddys Grandfather helped oversee the building of the bridge, I was able to look at some of the original blue prints back when I was in high school, many moons ago.

Yea, about halfway between Germantown Road and Cornell Road on Skyline. That bridge is indeed a beautiful bridge. Interestingly enough if you ever watched the TV show 'The Librarians' (which is filmed here), their lair is underneath that bridge.

Jeff

 

[wasfast]

It's also a bit sad to see the ice cream place on Skyline/Germantown closed down. Not surprising but a cool old place.

Hoping there's not much snow or ice this winter, at least so you can get the upper level dried in.

Last referral: See Mid Century Moto Makeover. He's in Portland also.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=185104

 

[sponaugle]

It's also a bit sad to see the ice cream place on Skyline/Germantown closed down. Not surprising but a cool old place.
Hoping there's not much snow or ice this winter, at least so you can get the upper level dried in.
Last referral: See Mid Century Moto Makeover. He's in Portland also.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=185104

The people that live across from that old ice cream place bought it a few years back, and had a little ice cream social there this summer. I believe they are considering rebuilding and opening it up sometime, which would be cool. Agreed on the snow! We are hoping for a low snow winter up here.

Last year we had a couple of light snows:

Thanks for the referral! It is great to read other threads and see problems and solutions I had not even considered.

Jeff

 

[NickTheGreat]

I just love that long driveway!

 

[infinkc]

Such an awesome build. Great planning. I wish I ran more dedicated circuits in my garage like you did.

I ran at least 2 cat6 and one 12 strand fiber to each room and I’m wishing I ran more also now.

One thing I did was frame out 2 24”monitors in my home to view the security cameras. Running those hdmi over cat6.






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[JDMjunkies.ch]

Update 11 - First Steel Installed
On paper it looks smaller than it does in person.

My experience so far is that on Paper it looks small, Once the base (floor) is made it looks huge, to the open space. When the walls are up, it looks smaller agian and when the Roof / ceiling is atop of the walls it looks bigger again.

It can really give you a false idea at how it will end up before it's finished. things can look huge or tiny, because your normal references are missing and your mind gives you some wrong associations. But if you've checked all the measures on the drawings before you started, everything should be fine

 

[sponaugle]

Such an awesome build. Great planning. I wish I ran more dedicated circuits in my garage like you did.

I ran at least 2 cat6 and one 12 strand fiber to each room and I’m wishing I ran more also now.

One thing I did was frame out 2 24”monitors in my home to view the security cameras. Running those hdmi over cat6.

Very cool idea for the security cameras.

Have you done any presence detection (having the automation system know when you are in a room, and when you move from room to room)?

I have been thinking about using a matrix of Bluetooth BLE receivers that can do a location analysis based on your cell phone. There are some interesting difficulties due to the radio reflectivity of most house surfaces, but I think I might be able to get around that with many localized receivers. It is pretty easy to build up a network of receivers in the walls.

Jeff

 

[sponaugle]

My experience so far is that on Paper it looks small, Once the base (floor) is made it looks huge, to the open space. When the walls are up, it looks smaller agian and when the Roof / ceiling is atop of the walls it looks bigger again.

It can really give you a false idea at how it will end up before it's finished. things can look huge or tiny, because your normal references are missing and your mind gives you some wrong associations. But if you've checked all the measures on the drawings before you started, everything should be fine

Excellent perspective. I will have to remember that while framing is underway! We have done a lot of blue painters tape in our current house to get a feel for room size, and our current great room is a similar 22 foot ceiling, lots of glass window layout, but a slightly different shape.

Jeff

 

[Jayman17]

Sponaugle, subscribed and looking forward to the progress. Great looking project and location. Only hard part is dealing with the dreaded realtime updates. Here's hoping your project runs smoothly, on time and under budget.
Thanks so much for posting, lots of people are going to enjoy this one.

Jay

 

[sponaugle]

I would love to hear some feedback on my overall electrical plan, and in particular anything I am overlooking in the garage/shop area. Fundamentally I am ok with overbuilding a little bit, as electrical is in wall, and the cost difference is very small compared with the overall cost. Of course there is no reason to waste on things that will never has use as well.

A couple things of note:

(1) I don't actually need a primary 600 amp service based on my current load calculations, but I am making a 600 amp primary service possible (the underground cable and conduits are 600 amp capable). We could use a standard 320 meter and almost certainly be fine, especially give the additional dedicated 200 amp meter for EV. A total of 800amps is probably overkill.

(2) On the EV charging, those plugs are on a dedicated separate 200 amp meter as that allows that meter to be on a special rate plan that does time of use charges. If you charge your EV between 10pm and 6am, the cost per kw is 4.2 c/kwh, which is about 1/3 the normal price. The only restrictions of a 2 meter/meter rate setup is the EV meter can only be used for EV charging.

(3) Heat is natural gas, but there are 2 furnaces, 2 ACs, plus a dedicated AC for the server room, and gas heat for the lower shop level. Aside from EVs, the biggest power draw would be the induction top, the infrared heaters, and the server room.

(4) I have not done the plug layout on the shop, but that will come next. Since there is a panel in the garage, it will be easy to do many home runs so plugs don't share breakers very much. One thing I learned is that you never know how power usage will cluster, so I prefer in a case like that for the plugs to not share breakers where possible, or at least keep it to a minimum.

I would love to hear any comments, criticisms, missed opportunities and the like!

 

[Paul_VR6]

Figured you would have 50-100kw of solar worked in somehow. Slightly disappointed (not really).

 

[wasfast]

You've assumed the sun actual comes out in Portland for more than 3 months of the year!

 

[sponaugle]

Figured you would have 50-100kw of solar worked in somehow. Slightly disappointed (not really).

You've assumed the sun actual comes out in Portland for more than 3 months of the year!

True, although I do have a 10.4kw system on my current house. While it is cloudy a good portion of the year, it is very sunny during the peak summer months. I typically produce around 10 - 12 MWh during the year, and over half of that is produced in the middle 3 months of summer.

I will have a system on the new house, but I am going to see how the trees end up before I place a system. I also want to engineer it a bit differently so it is primarily charging batteries, and can be ran off-grid in combination with the generator to both run the house and charge batteries.

Jeff

 

[IdahoJoe]

Great build. Inspiring.

 

[infinkc]

I would love to hear some feedback on my overall electrical plan, and in particular anything I am overlooking in the garage/shop area. Fundamentally I am ok with overbuilding a little bit, as electrical is in wall, and the cost difference is very small compared with the overall cost. Of course there is no reason to waste on things that will never has use as well.

A couple things of note:



(1) I don't actually need a primary 600 amp service based on my current load calculations, but I am making a 600 amp primary service possible (the underground cable and conduits are 600 amp capable). We could use a standard 320 meter and almost certainly be fine, especially give the additional dedicated 200 amp meter for EV. A total of 800amps is probably overkill.



(2) On the EV charging, those plugs are on a dedicated separate 200 amp meter as that allows that meter to be on a special rate plan that does time of use charges. If you charge your EV between 10pm and 6am, the cost per kw is 4.2 c/kwh, which is about 1/3 the normal price. The only restrictions of a 2 meter/meter rate setup is the EV meter can only be used for EV charging.



(3) Heat is natural gas, but there are 2 furnaces, 2 ACs, plus a dedicated AC for the server room, and gas heat for the lower shop level. Aside from EVs, the biggest power draw would be the induction top, the infrared heaters, and the server room.



(4) I have not done the plug layout on the shop, but that will come next. Since there is a panel in the garage, it will be easy to do many home runs so plugs don't share breakers very much. One thing I learned is that you never know how power usage will cluster, so I prefer in a case like that for the plugs to not share breakers where possible, or at least keep it to a minimum.



I would love to hear any comments, criticisms, missed opportunities and the like!

I wish I did wiring for a backup generator, glad to see it done in your plans.

Anyway to get 480v in your area? Maybe an overkill for a home, but I would think Tesla will sell a commercial charger that mimics their super chargers eventually.

The Tesla chargers only support 60a currently max if you are familiar with them. They don’t charge any faster at the 70/80a setting.

If you have 4 Tesla’s plugged in and another extra into your 100a, you are over the 200a rating.

Double check your lift specs, my bendpak I believe requires a 25-30a line, same with my air compressor. I see you only have 20a.

I’m finding they put in arc fault breakers in my garage, and are being tripped very easily, they were a code requirement but I’m swapping them out and they are more of a nuisance.

I wish I put some outlets higher up in my garage now on the walls on switches to add like neon signs.

I see you did electric heaters, we did infatech
ones and they are great. Did the quad filament one and added a timer to them so they are not accidentally left on. Took me a while to source a timer, so let me know if you need the model I used.


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[jeepxj]

garage door opener outlets and gate outlets on generator?

outside lighting?

 

[JDMjunkies.ch]

480V is a must if you want to install some heavy machinery like a big lathe or oldschool press-drill or something in your garage at one pointin the future...

As you said before. The price difference is not so big. Better install "too much" than "not enough" you will regret it at the end. I have installed stuff like a switcheable outdoor Power output where i can hang the christmas lights and switch them by the controller (time or daylight intensity activated), we have special outlets for the vacuum cleaner robot and one on the outside for the lawn-mower robot, etc...

 

[matt_i]

JMO but I'd price out 480v 3ph @600A but only to realize you can get a better deal buying a Phase Perfect (digital phase converter) for things that need it. Or, if you are just running things with motors, buy any other electric-motor-based phase converter.

Most everything built since the 1960s has "9 wire" 3 phase motors that are reconfigurable to 208/230/460 input voltages basically with a set of wire nuts that put the motor windings in series or parallel, adjusting the control voltage tap and also changing any overload heaters. Not saying there aren't 480v-Only motors but in my experience 5 in 100.

 

[Duker]

Wow,.... great build! Looking forward to seeing the progress. As for the trees, you can find guys with a woodmizer or Timberking portable bandsaw and they can knock out that cutting for you. They might swap labor for keeping some of the wood if you have some nice hardwood trees. If you get it cut, have them do 4/4/ 8/4/ 16/4 cuts and from that you can build about anything you might want in the future.

That really is a great idea.. and something I need to think about. There is a lot of wood there that could be turned into some cool furniture! I suspect the hardest part is getting a saw that can cut the really big parts that are 32 inches in diameter.

Those trees could make something for sure!


Jeff

 

[sponaugle]

I wish I did wiring for a backup generator, glad to see it done in your plans.
Anyway to get 480v in your area? Maybe an overkill for a home, but I would think Tesla will sell a commercial charger that mimics their super chargers eventually.
The Tesla chargers only support 60a currently max if you are familiar with them. They don’t charge any faster at the 70/80a setting.

I'm not sure if I could get 480v, although it is just a change in the transformer which is right next to the house, so I'll have to look at that.

Yea, the 100amp circuits for the EVs are just for being prepared for other chargers. The older original dual Tesla chargers would draw up to 80amps, then 72amps in the newer ones, and the Model 3s are 32 and 40amp.

If you have 4 Tesla’s plugged in and another extra into your 100a, you are over the 200a rating.

Yea, that is the purpose of the RS485 wiring, which can allow the chargers to communicate to each other can share a single total amount of capacity. Of course in the current models with the charging at 40 amps that would not be a problem. Since the EVs are charging off a dedicated 200amp meter, the meter is as much of a limitation as the breaker.

Double check your lift specs, my bendpak I believe requires a 25-30a line, same with my air compressor. I see you only have 20a.
I’m finding they put in arc fault breakers in my garage, and are being tripped very easily, they were a code requirement but I’m swapping them out and they are more of a nuisance.
I wish I put some outlets higher up in my garage now on the walls on switches to add like neon signs.

Good idea to check that.. I think my current lift (Challenger CL10) is 240v/30amp, so I'll update that in the diagram. I have not spec'd out the air compressor, but agree I should make that at least a 30amp if not a 40amp.

I see you did electric heaters, we did infatech
ones and they are great. Did the quad filament one and added a timer to them so they are not accidentally left on. Took me a while to source a timer, so let me know if you need the model I used.

Excellent. We are doing Infratech as well. I like the idea of a timer.. I was intended on getting a software controlled 240V switch for them so the home automation controller can automatically turn them off after a set amount of time with no motion where they are at.

Thanks for the suggestions, very helpful!

Jeff