To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

DIY Calibration Checked My 3 Torque Wrenches...Interesting Results

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
So it has been bugging me recently that I have never had any of my torque wrenches calibrated. I considered having them calibrated, but to be honest, I'm just a DIY'er and the cost would be in excess of just purchasing new ones. :headscrat

I really hate the idea of just purchasing a new, cheap torque wrench every couple years (especially since I use 1/4 and 1/2, and occasionally 3/8), so I decided I would test the ones I own, and then either calibrate them if the mechanism is accessible, or replace them with ones that I can calibrate over and over again, achieving a long service life.

Here is how I went about my testing. It's nowhere near as exact as a certified calibration shop, but it's good enough for me.

I purchased the follow torque adapter: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07DV33XJ5/?tag=atomicindus08-20

The adapter came with it's calibration card showing it passed the standard of 0.5% accuracy, and showing it's output against the standard at several different torque levels across the range. It was inside of 1 ft-lb at every torque level except the max (250 ft-lbs), which it was off by about 1.5 ft-lbs. A very good standard to check against for a redneck like me.

Yes, I know Harbor Freight sells one for 28 dollars, but that one has a minimum ft-lb spec of 29.5, where the AC Delco one goes all the way down to 4 ft-lbs, meaning I could use it to check my inch-lb torque wrench as well. Plus, I trust AC delco much more than HF.


I then torqued a lug nug on my truck to the maximum amount my biggest torque wrench will do. This ensured the nut wouldn't move and I would have a study base to work with. I was going to try to mount something in the vise, but it was just not working out and the truck was easy.

The process I followed was similar to what's found in this video:

I "exercised" each torque wrench at it's maximum setting 3-5 times before backing it down and testing various points. From there, I set the torque on the wrench, hooked it up to the adapter, took all the slack out, and then tried my best to slowly lean on the wrench until it clicked. I set the adapter to "peak" mode, which measures the first peak torque you hit, so when the wrench clicks, the adapter marks down that number and holds it on screen, even if you keep pressing on the wrench. :thumbup:


Now, I didn't get all nerdgasm on this and make a spreadsheet, instead I went for the volume approach, doing many tests at many torque settings, looking more for consistency than accuracy. The reason for this is that I had to use adapters on the 1/4 and 3/8 torque wrenches to get them to interface with the tool, thus losing some torque and affecting the reading, and second...because I didn't want to.

I own the following Torque Wrenches:

1/2: Craftsman Micro-Clicker: https://www.sears.com/craftsman-mic...SellerId=Sears&prdNo=1&blockNo=1&blockType=G1

I got this torque wrench as a gift from my father, brand new, about 5 years ago. It has been my main torque wrench. I used it to torque the head bolts on my truck last year...which really saddens me after today's test.

3/8: KD Tool 2951 (Old, USA Made)

Also a gift from Dear old Dad at the same time, however this was an ebay purchase, so who knows how old it is or how much use it's seen. It's got some wear on it, so I'd imagine it got used semi-professionally for a short period...that or the previous owner just didn't store it very well and it got knicked up.

1/4: Tekton 24320: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00C5ZL2EG/?tag=atomicindus08-20

Purchased in February 2017 and used probably 3-4 times since.


All wrenches are always stored in their case, at the lowest setting, since I took ownership of them. Now, onto the results.


Craftyman: Boy, this was a disappointment. I expected it might be off a little, and need calibration (which I think is possible if you pop the cap off the bottom of the handle and use the nut and allen screw)...but it's not even worth trying to calibrate. The readings were all over the place. Measuring at 150 ft-lbs would regularly produce output anywhere from 125 - 175. Completely unaccepatable. It seemed to be worse at higher torque numbers. At 20 ft-lbs, it was pretty on, at 30, it was slightly worse, at 50, back to being pretty consistent, then at 70 and up, it was just garbage. :(

KD Tools: This was the wild card of the night. A used, old torque wrench with an unknown history. So far as I can tell, it's not user-adjustable with regard to calibration, so I had already resigned myself to throwing this one away, since I figure it was unlikely it would be accurate given it's age and condition. I've honestly never really used this torque wrench, just because I figured "I've got this Craftsman that was brand new, and I know I've always stored it properly and not used it at a breaker bar, so it's probably more reliable".

Turns out, I was dead wrong. The KD was BANG ON at pretty much every torque setting across it's range of 20 ft-lbs to 100 ft-lbs. :bounce: I was very surprised. The variance was often only a couple ft-lbs, not sure how accurate it is percentage wise, but I trust this thing for my uses. I wish I would have used it on my head bolts...

Tekton: Sadly, the Tekton didn't fair so well. I didn't write down any results, but it just seemed to me like there was a lot of variance in the readings at any given setting. I tried not to place much weight on accuracy with this one, since it had to be run through 2 adapters to get up to 1/2" drive, but rather, I was looking for repeat-ability of a given reading. Unfortunately, I didn't see that. Big swings of 20-30 in-lbs at a given setting was the norm.


So it looks like I will soon be in the market for a 1/2 drive torque wrench, and possibly a 1/4 drive as well. I might try buying a 1/4 to 1/2 adapter and retest to see if the tekton fairs better, but it seems unlikely since it was a variance problem and not an accuracy problem.

So yeah...old USA tools rule, as if we all needed any more reminders of that.
'MURICA :rocker::deathmeta:uzi:
 
Last edited:
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

87quest

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 3, 2015
Messages
56
Location
Savannah, GA
Very interesting results. I also have a craftsman click type for 3/8, and a CDI click type in half. Making me think.

quest
 
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
More torque wrench based disappointment has ensued this evening.

I started looking around and found this video:
showcasing what looks to be a super solid Kobalt torque wrench. I googled the part number and found it's no longer available. Looked on Ebay, and couldn't justify the price being asked.

Looked on the Lowes website and there's another one, that looks the same, but with a different part number. https://www.lowes.com/pd/Kobalt-1-2-in-Drive-Click-Torque-Wrench-50-ft-lb-to-250-ft-lb/1000259431

Suspicious that this was a new, Chinesium version, I opened the Chat and asked the associate what the COO was on that part number.

His answer: The states! Holy ****! A 1/2 Drive USA made torque wrench, for $80, on the shelf at the Lowes nearest my house? No way!

So I jump in the truck and run over there, and what do I find? A mangled package, taped together (a return) containing a Taiwanese torque wrench that had been stored at 240 ft-lbs for however long it had been on the shelf........garbage.

I showed it to the associate who said he'd tell the management about it, and I left. Bummer!

It still looks like a nice unit, and I don't hate Taiwanese tools, so I might order one online if I don't find a more suitable option. $80 is real reasonable, especially since I get a veterans discount at Lowes.

When I got home, I opened the chat again, hoping to god that I would be connected with "Seth T" again....and what do you know, I was! I said "Seth, you lied to me brother, that wrench wasn't made in the states!" He answer "Kobalt tools are made in the USA"......:shocking:

I educated him a bit before logging off. Remember guys, these are the people you'll have to deal with to warranty your Craftsman ****.
 
Last edited:

KnurledNut

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
8,198
Location
n/a
Interesting results. Thanks for sharing.
My go-to 1/2 drive is a SO split beam. Very reliable.
 

Mgdoug3

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 2, 2018
Messages
1,391
Location
KY
I tested my torque wrenches a couple of weeks ago but I used an old Thorsen beam style torque wrench I also picked up. I grabbed a 5/8" allen and regular socket. Most of all my torque wrenches were spot on and only one was a few pounds off. My 1977 Craftsman and 2017 Snap on were the most accurate. The Craftsman surprised me since I just bought it for looks and didn't expect it to be accurate.
 
  • Like
Reactions: amh
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416

guy48065

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 12, 2012
Messages
637
Location
Calibration Lab
Well, my bank account isn't very happy about it, but I just bought this matching set of torque wrenches to replace all of mine...

Bummer...maybe. I'm very skeptical of your test results. That degree of non-repeatability is unusual on a simple spring & block tool that otherwise seems to function fine. I was going to offer to calibrate your wrenches free if you'll pay the shipping both ways. I still will if you care to settle the questions.

I've calibrated several of the cheap HF digital adapters on my torque stand and all have been VERY close to reference quality so I do completely trust that type of unit. My stand uses a gear-drive loader that won't overload a clicker beyond it's setting. I suspect even though your adapter is supposed to catch the 1st peak--it may not actually be doing that.
 
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
Bummer...maybe. I'm very skeptical of your test results. That degree of non-repeatability is unusual on a simple spring & block tool that otherwise seems to function fine. I was going to offer to calibrate your wrenches free if you'll pay the shipping both ways. I still will if you care to settle the questions.

I've calibrated several of the cheap HF digital adapters on my torque stand and all have been VERY close to reference quality so I do completely trust that type of unit. My stand uses a gear-drive loader that won't overload a clicker beyond it's setting. I suspect even though your adapter is supposed to catch the 1st peak--it may not actually be doing that.

I am skeptical as well, and tried to be as transparent as possible with the flaws of the methodology. That being said, there certainly can be a human error component to this, as I'm not experienced in calibrating torque wrenches, and am using a sub-standard method of validation.

That being said, there was considerable consistency with the KD Tools wrench with the method, while the same consistency was not observed in the other 2 wrenches. I find it hard to believe that I just happened to be heavier or lighter in the hand with 2 of the wrenches and perfect on the hand with the 3rd. I also went far any beyond the normal 3 tests at a given torque setting that I see in videos online, especially with the craftsman and tekton because they were giving poor results and I was trying to determine if I could be causing the error. To try to rectify that problem, I tried even harder than normal to press very slowly, and get off as soon as it clicked. I didn't really do this with the KD and it still gave good readings.

So with the Craftsman, I started at 20lb-ft and did anywhere from 5 - 10 clicks, noting the variance in my head, then moved up to 30lf-ft and continued in the same fashion. The thing that bothered me was that occasionally, I'd hit a streak where 2-3 readings would be pretty close, and then there would be a random wild card again right after. Again, this wasn't really noted with the KD.

I did much the same with the Tekton, starting at the bottom and working up, with lots of data points.

All that being said, I'm 100% sure there was some human error here, I am just convinced that the amount of human error isn't sufficient to explain away the drastic swings in results.

Here's my other thought. Let's say there was a perfect way to put uniform pressure on the wrench until just the very instant it clicked, and then pull the pressure off, getting rid of the human error component.....so what? When I'm torquing head bolts or lug nuts or pinion flange bolts I am not capable of re-creating that perfection anyway, and that's when it counts. When you're actually using the wrench, you just slowly pull on it till it clicks, probably with much LESS care than I was using during these tests. So at the end of the day, you want wrenches that are going to be reasonably consistent in the real world application, not only in the perfect environment of a test. Does that make sense?


Let me do some more fiddling tonight, but I might take you up on your offer to calibrate these wrenches and re-test them more scientifically, just for fun. If you're game, I might wait until my new Napa ones show up, test them with my method, and then have you test those with your method as well. Worst case scenario, they're actually accurate and I was just being a goof, in which case, I can sell them. As it is, I wouldn't consider it ethical to sell these torque wrenches, knowing they're inaccurate, so I'd just throw them away.
 
Last edited:

Danglerb

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
9,736
Location
SoCal
I'm thinking a person with two watches can never be sure what time it is, better to live in ignorance, or go electronic.
 

xin

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 13, 2017
Messages
697
Location
ARKANSAS - NWA
Well, my bank account isn't very happy about it, but I just bought this matching set of torque wrenches to replace all of mine

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Napa-1-2-D...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m2748.l2649
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NAPA-3-8-D...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m2748.l2649
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Napa-1-4-M...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m2748.l2649

I didn't need the 3/8 since the KD was accurate...but I couldn't pass up on having a matching set.

This is the same Manufacturer who makes them for GEARWRENCH as well. Here is the link to the 3/8 one
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HQGI3VY/?tag=atomicindus08-20
 

rlitman

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2010
Messages
24,665
Location
Long Island
... My stand uses a gear-drive loader that won't overload a clicker beyond it's setting. I suspect even though your adapter is supposed to catch the 1st peak--it may not actually be doing that.

That raises a question. Who here uses a gear drive loader to USE their torque wrenches? Under ideal arm-only powered conditions, what sort of variance do you see with clicker wrenches? i.e. in the real world, while your torque wrench's calibration may be within 5%, is the real fastener's ending torque likely to vary by 15% or more? And does that even really matter?
 

Treeman

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 4, 2008
Messages
548
Location
Michigan
Yes, Apex tool has since gone to **** and outsourced the majority of their products. The Napa wrenches however, are USA made, likely on the Armstrong assembly line. :thumbup:

Since your NAPA wrenches look exactly like the Gear Wrench models that state they are made in China, I have to guess that your "assembled in U.S." wrenches are also China made.

The DANAHER/APEX wrenches circa 2010 +/- looked different and were "made/assembled" by JS Technologies in Marietta Georgia. They labeled wrenches for KD, GearWrench, Craftsman, Armstrong, ATD, MATCO, and others.
 
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
That raises a question. Who here uses a gear drive loader to USE their torque wrenches? Under ideal arm-only powered conditions, what sort of variance do you see with clicker wrenches? i.e. in the real world, while your torque wrench's calibration may be within 5%, is the real fastener's ending torque likely to vary by 15% or more? And does that even really matter?

That was my contention. I want a wrench that's within reasonable spec with just the arm. If it's 25 lb-ft off when I'm trying to be super careful, testing it with the adapter, how far is it off when I'm just yanking on it?

The KD seemed immune to how much care I put into the pull.
 
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
Since your NAPA wrenches look exactly like the Gear Wrench models that state they are made in China, I have to guess that your "assembled in U.S." wrenches are also China made.

The DANAHER/APEX wrenches circa 2010 +/- looked different and were "made/assembled" by JS Technologies in Marietta Georgia. They labeled wrenches for KD, GearWrench, Craftsman, Armstrong, ATD, MATCO, and others.

Boy, that's a tad depressing. I guess best I can hope is that these were early production and had more US components than later models. The reverse lever looks exactly like an Armstrong, so there's hope. That and at least the guy putting it together was here in the states, same with the quality control and calibration.

I suppose at the end of the day, so long as they're good wrenches, I'll be happy. I mean if I were to go shopping for $75/piece torque wrenches, I couldn't even buy the upmarket ones at Harbor Freight these days for that. That, and if one fails, I might be able to convince Napa to give me a Carlyle replacement haha (there's no warranty, but you never know, the Carlyle guys have treated me exceptionally well). Better than sending one off to GW for warranty and getting a chinese *************.

That and they sure are freaking beautiful to look at. Never seen a prettier wrench in all my life. It gives me the fizz.
 
Last edited:

American Locomotive

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 8, 2017
Messages
11,014
Location
Rhode Island
Just a FYI: You don't lose torque through adapters or extensions when using torque wrenches. You could have 75 extensions and adapters connected together and 75 lb-ft at one end would still result in 75 lb-ft at the other.

You lose torque with impact wrenches and adapters/extensions because they work on a different principle.
 
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
Just a FYI: You don't lose torque through adapters or extensions when using torque wrenches. You could have 75 extensions and adapters connected together and 75 lb-ft at one end would still result in 75 lb-ft at the other.

You lose torque with impact wrenches and adapters/extensions because they work on a different principle.

Thanks for the info. I had heard the idea that there was torque loss through extensions before and I guess I just never thought about it much or questioned it.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Packard V8

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
Messages
7,380
Location
Spokane, WA
Thanks for the info. I had heard the idea that there was torque loss through extensions before and I guess I just never thought about it much or questioned it.

There's the difference between a steady pull and the hammering action of an impact gun. A torque stick is based upon the idea a hammer loses its ability to increase force as the torque stick twists and untwists. A steady pull doesn't untwist.

Think about the futility of trying to use an impact gun through a stack of extensions; make you crazy, guaranteed.

jack vines
 

visionguru

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 2, 2017
Messages
1,233
Location
Chicago
....
All that being said, I'm 100% sure there was some human error here, I am just convinced that the amount of human error isn't sufficient to explain away the drastic swings in results.
.....

Great minds think alike.:beer:

Yesterday, I happened to do a brief accuracy test of my torque wrenches, with a Powerbuilt torque adapter, with my car lug nut torqued to 80ft-lb. So, I might be one of the few who understand your testing method fully.

Human error can cause torque values all over the place. For example, with "trace" mode, my Craftsman digi-click 3/8" 5~80ft lb were reading 80 ft-lb, when the torque wrench was set at 40 ft-lb, because I didn't release quickly enough after it clicked. After several tries, I learned how to get consistent results: apply slight pressure first, then slow but steadily turn the wrench, quickly release pressure the moment you hear it clicks.

According to the manual of my torque adapter, calibration should be done at 1/4 of the maximum torque. I tested mine at 30 ft-lb. The results were: 29ft-lb, 30ft-lb, 34ft-lb. So, I think my Craftsman torque wrench is accurate enough, about 3% average.

With such long handle, the user can produce huge torque error if not doing it properly: slow, steady, quick reaction. If one likes to do quick "click-click", the torque could be all over the place.


The lowest valid torque setting of my adapter is 30ft-lb. I tested my Craftsman 3/8" 25-250 inch-lb. The value was super consistent. For 120 inch-lb, I got 9ft-lb. For 240 inch-lb, I got 18ft-lb. Unfortunately, I can't tell if it's indeed off by 10%, because that was out of the adapters accurate range.


I doubt your NAPA ones will do any better at high torque value either, due to human error. Why? It's a lot easier to stop quickly when you apply 20ft-lb than 100ft-lb.
 
Last edited:
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
I doubt your NAPA ones will do any better at high torque value either, due to human error. Why? It's a lot easier to stop quickly when you apply 20ft-lb than 100ft-lb.

This fails to account for the fact that my KD tools wrench was consistent at 100 lb-ft, while the Craftsman was not. Same setting, different precision.
 

TwoInch

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2012
Messages
2,828
Location
NW INDIANA
I'm going to say that the issue lies in the electronic device.

Like said, it's hard to get drastically different results from a spring...

I know I can click any of the numerous torque wrenches 20 times on a bolt... And it won't move one single degree past where it clicked. If the bolt doesn't turn the clamping force of that fastener is not changing. Doesn't matter what the electronics say.

Try this. Put the torque wrench via torque adapter on a bolt or lug and torque it to 100ftlbs... Then mark the joining surfaces. Take 10 measurements. See how many are above your 100ftlbs. See if the bolt turned. If there is actually a 20-30ftlbs variance, the bolt will have turned.

Im betting your head bolts are just fine.

Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk
 

seber

Well-known member
Joined
May 31, 2016
Messages
4,206
Location
Deep East Tx.
For what you paid or maybe just a little more, you could have bought a used split beam wrench. I have never heard of one that was not accurate no matter how used it might have been. The beam is always stored unloaded regardless of setting. They are also a pleasure to use.
As to the weight method of testing torque, it can be done but you must account for the added torque due to the weight and length of the handle. The only accurate way to do that is to physically weigh the end of the handle while the socket end is on a pivot and add that weight and distance to the hanging weight. It can be more accurate than the spring scale method but a bit of a pain.
 

rlitman

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2010
Messages
24,665
Location
Long Island
... As to the weight method of testing torque, it can be done but you must account for the added torque due to the weight and length of the handle. The only accurate way to do that is to physically weigh the end of the handle while the socket end is on a pivot and add that weight and distance to the hanging weight. It can be more accurate than the spring scale method but a bit of a pain.

Set it up with the handle turning horizontally, and the weight pulling down over a pulley.
 

KDoug

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 26, 2018
Messages
388
Location
Southeast Texas
Got a question here since y'all mentioned that adapters and extensions don't change the set torque value. How do flex head torque wrenches affect the set torque? I looked at some reviews of a Precision Instruments flex head wrench and didn't see any obvious answers.
 

rlitman

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2010
Messages
24,665
Location
Long Island
They don't flex as much as a normal flex head socket wrench.
At a worst case scenario, if they flexed like a swivel head (where the pivot point was above the centerline of the socket), the torque would vary by the cosine of the flex angle.

Off the top of my head I'd say my Snap On torque wrench (same as the PI) flexes up and down about 10 degrees. So, in that worst case scenario, it could be torquing 1.5% low, which is still within the tolerance of the tool. But because it pivots off-axis, the change is actually less than that. If I remember, I'll get out a protractor and correct these numbers...
 

rlitman

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 18, 2010
Messages
24,665
Location
Long Island
Problem is you're calibrating against a $5 luggage scale....

If you could calibrate the luggage scale 1st. I think that would be best.

Be sure to calibrate that luggage scale with a bucket filled with NIST certified sand.

FYI, $5 luggage scales are surprisingly accurate.
 

guy48065

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 12, 2012
Messages
637
Location
Calibration Lab
For what you paid or maybe just a little more, you could have bought a used split beam wrench. I have never heard of one that was not accurate no matter how used it might have been. The beam is always stored unloaded regardless of setting. They are also a pleasure to use.
...
The only issues with split beams (and I do own a PI 250 ft-lbs) is they only work in the tighten direction. This doesn't matter 99% of the time. The bigger problem is the human variance that has been brought up in some of the other posts. The "regular" type of micrometer-adjust click-type torque wrench has a "break-away" point. When it clicks, the torque drops off quite a bit, and the handle swings several degrees before hitting a stop & then re-applying torque.

The split-beam doesn't have that generous torque let-off. Its action is so tight that it's really easy to "pull through" the click from inertia and give the fastener unwanted additional torque.

I like split-beams & I like how loud & crisp the click is--but the missing torque let-off is a draw-back that never seems to be discussed.
 
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
The only issues with split beams (and I do own a PI 250 ft-lbs) is they only work in the tighten direction. This doesn't matter 99% of the time. The bigger problem is the human variance that has been brought up in some of the other posts. The "regular" type of micrometer-adjust click-type torque wrench has a "break-away" point. When it clicks, the torque drops off quite a bit, and the handle swings several degrees before hitting a stop & then re-applying torque.

The split-beam doesn't have that generous torque let-off. Its action is so tight that it's really easy to "pull through" the click from inertia and give the fastener unwanted additional torque.

I like split-beams & I like how loud & crisp the click is--but the missing torque let-off is a draw-back that never seems to be discussed.

So what you're saying here in effect is that it's unlikely that my human error produced the crazy variance I saw in the readings because these are all micrometer style wrenches...because that's what I'm hearing :beer:


Also funny you mention the only working in one direction thing. The event that sparked me wanting to check the calibration on my torque wrench was that I was assembling a differential carrier last week, which requires the bolts to be torqued on the ring gear and they're left hand thread. So without thinking about it, I bust out my trusty Craftsman and start trying to torque the first bolt to 70lb-ft. Now, I've turned wrenches enough to know vaguely what 70 should feel like, and I was certainly over that and it hadn't clicked. So I got out my old man's SK and it immediately clicked, verifying I was over torque.

Backed the Craftsman down to 20lb-ft to check it, and sure enough, it doesn't click in the reverse direction PERIOD. Never occurred to me that this model wasn't able to torque in reverse (I didn't buy it).

Anyway, that ordeal started the thought process that led to me questioning it's accuracy.
 
Last edited:
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
For what you paid or maybe just a little more, you could have bought a used split beam wrench. I have never heard of one that was not accurate no matter how used it might have been. The beam is always stored unloaded regardless of setting. They are also a pleasure to use.
As to the weight method of testing torque, it can be done but you must account for the added torque due to the weight and length of the handle. The only accurate way to do that is to physically weigh the end of the handle while the socket end is on a pivot and add that weight and distance to the hanging weight. It can be more accurate than the spring scale method but a bit of a pain.

I know this runs contrary to what everyone on this board is always saying...but I used the PI split beams for a while when I worked in a tire shop....and I hated them. I'm sure they're very nice and very accurate....but I just didn't like them at all. Just a personal preference thing.
 

country83

Well-known member
Joined
May 28, 2009
Messages
505
I'm going to say that the issue lies in the electronic device.

Like said, it's hard to get drastically different results from a spring...

I know I can click any of the numerous torque wrenches 20 times on a bolt... And it won't move one single degree past where it clicked. If the bolt doesn't turn the clamping force of that fastener is not changing. Doesn't matter what the electronics say.

Try this. Put the torque wrench via torque adapter on a bolt or lug and torque it to 100ftlbs... Then mark the joining surfaces. Take 10 measurements. See how many are above your 100ftlbs. See if the bolt turned. If there is actually a 20-30ftlbs variance, the bolt will have turned.

Im betting your head bolts are just fine.

Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk
I disagree. I've calibrated many torque wrenches and have seen the variability of mechanical ones firsthand. There's more than just a spring inside, there's pivot blocks, cams on both sides of the blocks, pivot pins, etc. All of which, when worn, can and will throw inconsistent readings. Surprisingly, good electronic wrenches hold their calibration better than mechanical ones provided they are cared for properly.

Plus, when doing multiple clicks on a bolt not only are you trying to retorque the bolt, now you have to overcome the friction holding it too, which takes more torque to get it moving than it did to torque it in the first place.

Sent from my XT1635-01 using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

visionguru

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 2, 2017
Messages
1,233
Location
Chicago
This fails to account for the fact that my KD tools wrench was consistent at 100 lb-ft, while the Craftsman was not. Same setting, different precision.

You might be able to figure it out the reason by setting the adapter to "trace" mode and watch for the real time torque value while turning it very slowly.

But I still think your head bolts were probably torqued properly.

...There's more than just a spring inside, there's pivot blocks, cams on both sides of the blocks, pivot pins, etc. All of which, when worn, can and will throw inconsistent readings. Surprisingly, good electronic wrenches hold their calibration better than mechanical ones provided they are cared for properly.
....

In a professional setting, that maybe true. For a DIYer, with proper care, any torque wrench might never need re-calibration, because there is simply not enough usage to wear off anything.

My digital torque adapter taught me how to use my torque wrenches: when approaching the desired torque, one needs to go as slowly as possible, and when it clicks, release as fast as possible.

For this kind of click type torque wrenches, we only have about 3 degree of free travel after the "click", very short reaction time, even though not feeling movement, more torque may have already been applied. So, user error can be a big factor which can cause the fine 5% calibration meaningless.

There are mechanical solutions, such as:

Advanced digital torque wrench might be the answer to user error.
 
Last edited:
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
Alright everyone, I've received my new Napa torque wrenches, and completed a comparison test with them against the ones I already own.

Here's the short and curly of it.

1. The "peak" reading on the torque adapter was in fact an issue. It wasn't catching the torque peak correctly. I altered the test procedure to use "trace" and just slowly crank on the wrench until it clicked over. This isn't precise in the sense that you don't get one cleanly defined number, but you can get pretty close. This test showed much better consistency across all wrenches.

Maybe the different "clicks" the wrenches made were screwing with the peak sensing. Who knows.

2. The Napa's are more consistent and more accurate. They're excellent, often times clicking over exactly on the number indicated. Also, very very nice to use and look at. Feel very high quality in the hand.

3. The Craftsman MIGHT be in spec. It's consistency got markedly better when I used the trace test...however, it still had a greater variance than the Napa. The swings were usually more like 5 lb-ft instead of the 20 I was seeing with the peak test. I'm reasonably confident the Craftsman is fine, but just not built with the same precision as the Napas. The Napas are rated for +/- 3% and the Craftsman I believe is +/- 5%. Not a huge deal in the DIY world at all.

4. The Tekton was still a problem. Regularly clicking over at 70 in-lbs when 110 was selected. At first I thought maybe the tool just wasn't sensitive enough to pick up the differences and display them, but when I put the Napa on there, I could run it right up through 70 - 80 - 90 - 100 - 110 CLICK. The Napa, naturally, was bang on and consistent.

The good thing about the Tekton is, the mechanism is something I can access, so I might play around with it and see if I can calibrate it. The good thing is it's consistent, just consistently low. So if I dial it up a bit, it might be fine.

I plan to just sell these wrenches and keep the Napas since they're so gorgeous and they give me the fizz. I won't sell the Tekton unless I can get the calibration dialed in...wouldn't want to sell someone a bunk wrench, but I think I can do it.
 
Last edited:
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
O man. Hilarious.

So I walked out into the garage after posting this, took the nut off the Tekton, dialed it up about 1/4 turn. Put it back together...and it's perfect. First freakin try.

On one hand, it kinda ***** to know I just spent all that money on torque wrenches I didn't NEED, because mine were all fine, but on the other, I REALLY like these, and I have a matching set which pleases my OCD.

Sometimes I crack me up...:bounce:

If anyone's looking for a deal on 3 torque wrenches that we now KNOW work and are accurate...hit me up haha.
 

hangfirew8

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
879
Location
Central Maryland
That old beam KD is almost certainly a Sturtevant Richmont. I've been using one for decades, was in my family decades before that, and when I bought a new old stock KD to replace it, since I had my doubts... the two agree with each other.
 
OP
S

Skeptic68W

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
416
That old beam KD is almost certainly a Sturtevant Richmont. I've been using one for decades, was in my family decades before that, and when I bought a new old stock KD to replace it, since I had my doubts... the two agree with each other.

The KD is a clicker, not a beam. I don't think it's that old, probably 90s vintage, but unsure.
 

Packard V8

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2009
Messages
7,380
Location
Spokane, WA
So this thread has most of the torque wrench experts in one place; what's the best cost/benefit electronic torque tester/loader? A quick search show a plethora and between the $28.99 Harbor Freight and the $1795 Checkline TWT410?

jack vines
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom