trijeff
Well-known member
Sorry man, we're not Worthpoint here
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The VISES of Garage Journal
- Thread starter mjozefow
- Start date
va.grouseman
Well-known member
honza.vosalik
Well-known member
this one is in great shape, original paint, no damage. I think I will have to take a group photo soon.
probably anywhere from $25-$135. $135 if it’s not rusted up and works smooth without looking abused and $25 if it’s rusted beat and not working. So if it’s lightly rusted and works with some average wear marks probably right about $100 would be fair. This model would be a toolmakers vise with a swivel jaw and swivel base.
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Bighead38
Well-known member
That’s awesome.
Information incoming! Better late than never
This is a Meier & Weichelt Zeus vise (you can see the M and W in the logo). This is a design from around 1900. Meier & Weichelt was founded around 1874 in Leipzig and was a very big company that made all kinds of things out of iron and steel. For example vises. They didn't use a triangular dovetail but machined 90° angles and steel plates to keep the dynamic jaw in. After WW2, in 1947 they were made a state owned company (boo) and called LES (Leipziger Eisen und Stahlwerke), kept the patterns, just changed the logo. They are now forgotten, even though they could rival Leinen, Boley and the others. Kind of sad.
Most information about this company is stored in some archives, so you won't find much (flyers and declassified CIA documents about them making tank treads for the T-34 for the russians, wikimedia has many photos of them, though).
The V in VS probably stands for Vorn (front) and the S for Schraubstock (vise), the back dynamic ones are called HS (H as in Hinten as in back).
Their back dynamic vises look like your standard back dynamic vise (Leinen or Boley) and work just fine and precise. Best thing about these is that the handle rotates the nut and the screw is fixed in the back, so it is always protected. Especially the LES variant is abundant over here and not that expensive. The M&W labeled ones are offered for $$$ but nobody taking them.
About the value. HS: not so much in germany, maybe more elsewhere if the collector knows his stuff, but as I said, they look kind of generic. The VS model you have? They were common a hundred years ago but time and the wars made them rare. Rare as in a pristine VS6 6" model is offered for 350 Euro right now, a VS4 for 170 or 200, a VS3 just was sold in some rural town and I got this cracked anvil plate VS6 (51 kg) for 100 Euro + driving 100 miles each way and I am happy about that (because I just fell in love with the design - I like the curves it has).
You will find a single video on youtube and a lonely instagram post from asia.
So paying only 5 bucks for this.. Wanna part with it for 10?
bastel
ps: not allowed to post links and attach stuff yet, so no pictures of my fresh buy, but googling Meier Weichelt Zeus gives some results for pictures and the video.
nimrag
Well-known member
Randall2626
New member
Thanks for the information concerning parts for my vice. I would like to have tried to repair it but I am guessing that will be an up hill battle. Probably end up getting a different vice. Thanks.
GETRIDAONE
Well-known member
Information incoming! Better late than never
This is a Meier & Weichelt Zeus vise (you can see the M and W in the logo). This is a design from around 1900. Meier & Weichelt was founded around 1874 in Leipzig and was a very big company that made all kinds of things out of iron and steel. For example vises. They didn't use a triangular dovetail but machined 90° angles and steel plates to keep the dynamic jaw in. After WW2, in 1947 they were made a state owned company (boo) and called LES (Leipziger Eisen und Stahlwerke), kept the patterns, just changed the logo. They are now forgotten, even though they could rival Leinen, Boley and the others. Kind of sad.
The V in VS probably stands for Vorn (front) and the S for Schraubstock (vise), the back dynamic ones are called HS (H as in Hinten as in back).
Their back dynamic vises look like your standard back dynamic vise (Leinen or Boley) and work just fine and precise.
bastel,
This is great information !! I always wondered about this clamp on vise with the "bird" logo. The jaws are 48 mm wide and operates very smooth.
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Shiftless
Well-known member
Nimrag:
Great score on that bullet for only $75. Looks like a 4 inch to me. And it’s an HD model. I have a 3 HD in my collection. I haven’t seen another one (HD) around here.
Did you grab the Equipto bench? Those are top notch quality.
Welcome to the vise group. Your stand is also a classic. Do you have plans to refurbish it and the vise?
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Great score on that bullet for only $75. Looks like a 4 inch to me. And it’s an HD model. I have a 3 HD in my collection. I haven’t seen another one (HD) around here.
Did you grab the Equipto bench? Those are top notch quality.
Welcome to the vise group. Your stand is also a classic. Do you have plans to refurbish it and the vise?
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Mr. Wonderful
Well-known member
What's different about the HD model????
Heavier cast and thicker main screw. Larger opening basically a heavy duty version.
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nimrag
Well-known member
Thanks.
I have plans to refurbish both of them. It’s finally cooling off here in Phoenix, so I hope to work on them soon.
The stand is cast iron, so the two together weigh quite a bit.
Yes, I did get the bench, also.
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Shiftless
Well-known member
I set up this pic to show some of the differences.
The normal 9300 is in the foreground and the 3HD is behind. They are both early production Chicago era models. The black one was refurbed by outlaw. I got in in a complicated bulk trade deal involving a few vises and a vintage SnapOn roller tool chest that needed a LOT of work. I removed the base on the black vise for this photo to better illustrate the differences. I do not have a base for the HD. It is shown here exactly as I found it in Napa CA.
The castings are clearly different, the bases are NOT interchangeable and even the handle diameter is beefier on the HD.
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Mr. Wonderful
Well-known member
Shiftless
Well-known member
Fierljeppen
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 26, 2018
- Messages
- 1,159
Well played!
For anyone interested...Here's a 1945 Wilton brochure scan with all of the HD vs. light duty details. Notice that the acorn nuts were only on the light-duty, while the HD models had the hex nut with the sliding bar.
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Outlawmws
Well-known member
10 years later its different: I have (another) 3" Wilton, its clearly NOT a HD, (just over 25 lbs) but HAS the bar locks and is marked 8300N on the casting. Exp 12-31-59...
KMScott
Well-known member
Look at all the different jaws you could have purchased for the early Wilton's, that is why I get calls all the time for Copper and Brass jaws. Even Plastic jaws. Nice stuff Fierljeppen, never seen this catalog page before.
honza.vosalik
Well-known member
Nice group you got there. I like the little bright red one.
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DFB
Well-known member
That one looks cute
I guess for the super small clamp on models the screw is turning, not the nut and no bolts and steel plate to hold the dynamic jaw in. I wonder what the B in HSB stands for, most likely "Bügel", which is the clamp on bench mechanism.
Btw they also made a Wilton Bullet front style vise, just not bullet shaped but a barrel. And I once saw a photo of a american styled one (i.e. box with a square
but I can't remember how I reached that one.FMC1959
Well-known member
I haven't been on the thread in a while as it has been a busy summer and I am in the process of moving.
I saw this YT video -
- then checked a couple of pages on this thread and saw that Z3K3Y had posted it.
I found the video interesting. What surprised me the most is that when he did his 2nd test, whacking a slab of metal held in the vises, and then in his 3rd test where he tightened till the vise failed, there were no jaws or jaw tower failures.
I thought this was interesting as many photos we see of broken vises often have a broken jaw tower or slide. After seeing how he "tested" all of these vises, I would guess that all the broken jaw tower photos we see is probably from the user whacking the heck out of something being held in their vise and they miss, hitting the jaw or tower head on, causing the break.
The majority of failures he had were because of the screw, and this makes sense as the screw, in comparison to the other components of the vise, is smaller, under a lot of stress and likely the weakest link.
Let's face it, as much as many on this thread say you shouldn't use your vise as an anvil, or compress bearings, or whack the heck out of things being held by your vise; vises are basically a hunk of metal which are appreciated by most owners because they can hold or compress stuff while you work on it and ultimately abuse them.
Most vises hold up quite well...all considered.
I saw this YT video -
I found the video interesting. What surprised me the most is that when he did his 2nd test, whacking a slab of metal held in the vises, and then in his 3rd test where he tightened till the vise failed, there were no jaws or jaw tower failures.
I thought this was interesting as many photos we see of broken vises often have a broken jaw tower or slide. After seeing how he "tested" all of these vises, I would guess that all the broken jaw tower photos we see is probably from the user whacking the heck out of something being held in their vise and they miss, hitting the jaw or tower head on, causing the break.
The majority of failures he had were because of the screw, and this makes sense as the screw, in comparison to the other components of the vise, is smaller, under a lot of stress and likely the weakest link.
Let's face it, as much as many on this thread say you shouldn't use your vise as an anvil, or compress bearings, or whack the heck out of things being held by your vise; vises are basically a hunk of metal which are appreciated by most owners because they can hold or compress stuff while you work on it and ultimately abuse them.
Most vises hold up quite well...all considered.
trijeff
Well-known member
Great points, Franco.
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Did you notice this? Your photo is from the other side.
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Mr. Wonderful
Well-known member
Yes, I saw it but I thought for sure that it couldn't be that simple.Some milling, turning and surface grinder work could make that exceptional.
Shiftless
Well-known member
Yes, the rounded edges detract from the overall spectacular polishing job. Not my particular taste, but nevertheless it’s a fine example of polishing ability. Some eBay buyer will no doubt be happy.
Shiftless
Well-known member
This C1 was delivered to me the day before yesterday. Here are a few pics of it in its original as found condition. The pieces are now taking a nice hot bath in Simple Green.
I don’t remember ever seeing a bullet with this milled pattern on the sides of the jaws. (Best seen in the 3rd pic)
Also, there is no date code stamp on the slide key. No heavy wear in that place...and no hint of a stamp, not a trace of even a partial stamp.
Also, it doesn’t bear the marking C1 but the casting number on the main body (101221) matches C1 designation.
Do these irregularities mean anything?
The end cap and both swivel lock downs are missing as is one of the clip in pipe jaws.
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I don’t remember ever seeing a bullet with this milled pattern on the sides of the jaws. (Best seen in the 3rd pic)
Also, there is no date code stamp on the slide key. No heavy wear in that place...and no hint of a stamp, not a trace of even a partial stamp.
Also, it doesn’t bear the marking C1 but the casting number on the main body (101221) matches C1 designation.
Do these irregularities mean anything?
The end cap and both swivel lock downs are missing as is one of the clip in pipe jaws.
.
.
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va.grouseman
Well-known member
I just finished my brand spanking new Wilton bench, time to get busy.
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AngryBeaver
Well-known member
One of my latest finds.everyone needs a 6” non combo vise on their welding table right? And, a new twist on metal finishing. No paint or BLO on the 2C....
Weird part about the 106R is the static is stamped 9/49 and the dynamic is stamped 12/47. Wondering if part of it was warrantied? There was also no thrust washer.
Might be one of the earliest flat nose/hockey puck R’s...
Weird part about the 106R is the static is stamped 9/49 and the dynamic is stamped 12/47. Wondering if part of it was warrantied? There was also no thrust washer.
Might be one of the earliest flat nose/hockey puck R’s...
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Shiftless
Well-known member
Holy moly Smitty, what a Wilton collection!
One to be proud of - as only one of us mentally defective guys who buy old lumps of cast iron could appreciate! Awesome!
Shiftless
Well-known member
to that!AngryBeaver
Well-known member
Pop the pins and pull the key, Flip the key around and you’ll find your date. Wilton put them on the “top” sides of the keys during a lot of 70/80’s vises. This style c1 doesn’t have C1 cast into it. Have two identical to yours. One one on the service truck and one at the shop. 1982 and 1978 iirc.
