Bonney, Krieger, and others

[Stillgottimefor1]

These followed me home today. Wartime maybe?

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[d42jeep]

The Barcalo wrench is probably from the ‘30s.
-Don

 

[Private Lugnutz]

The Bonney long double offset DBE wrench most probably is wartime and it will have a date code on it. Check the shank in the panel near one of the ends for a set of two letters ending in S (1941), T (1942), U (1943), V (1944), or W (1945).

The Krieger wrench is definitely wartime. It was made by Bonney and will also have a date code. All of the Krieger wrenches I have or have seen have a date code from late 1943 ("HU") to very early 1944 ("AV"). That's because Krieger Steel in Long Island City, NY, which made van and truck bodies, had two (2) small contracts for "Engineers Wrenches" with the U.S. Army Ordnance Dept in late 1943, but they outsourced the production to Bonney. If you search GJ on "Krieger" you will find a thread where they were discussed further.

 

[Stillgottimefor1]

There was something on alloy artifacts saying Krieger was made by Bonney during wartime for a contractor. Didn’t read it all because I was on lunch break and needed to get back to work.


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[Private Lugnutz]

Yeah, well, the profile is a dead ringer, and the date code a dead giveaway. Last time I looked AA says something about it being "almost certain" they were made by Bonney, and "apparently" for a military contract. It is number 'I lost count' on my list of things that I have sent them directly to either correct or confirm their information with hard evidence (which you can see if you search on "Krieger" here on GJ), but they refuse to acknowledge.

 

[DadsTools]

Yeah, well, the profile is a dead ringer, and the date code a dead giveaway. Last time I looked AA says something about it being "almost certain" they were made by Bonney, and "apparently" for a military contract. It is number 'I lost count' on my list of things that I have sent them directly to either correct or confirm their information with hard evidence (which you can see if you search on "Krieger" here on GJ), but they refuse to acknowledge.

I've read in several places on the forum that AA is usually unresponsive to messages. They seem to be very conservative in some of their assessments, preferring at times 'possibly' 'maybe' or wording to that effect instead of 'definitely', which I guess in itself is not so bad a thing. I too have had several instances where I felt AA's 'possibly' was pretty much a 'certainty'. I sometimes get annoyed when they offer no dating on artifacts they are apparently unsure of--even a rough estimate would be appreciated from them. I wouldn't stop sending your info to them though, Lugz. You never know if any of it is being stashed away for future reference.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

My biggest bugaboo with AA is not publishing PDFs of the catalogs they are using. They list them, and in cases where a catalog they cite is available somewhere else, it's possible to doublecheck their analysis, but if they have a catalog nobody else does, there is no way to confirm their analysis. That wouldn't be a problem of their analysis was always solid. Unfortunately, it's not. Second biggest issue is not always explaining their rationale. Third is their refusal to accept and use references (catalogs, ads, other research material, etc) they don't own and analysis they didn't perform themselves. Between their library and "ours" (public domain, TA 1.0, etc), we collectively have a very comprehensive library, but there is no way to conduct complementary and supplementary contiguous research and analysis without seeing their catalogs. Fourth is just not being receptive to corrections. All of that is why Todd started TA 1.0, why we're working on TA 2.0, and why I will never send AA a dang thing again in my lifetime.

 

[Stillgottimefor1]

The knowledge you folks have is astounding. Thank you very much!


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[woody 73]

I myself in the past have many questions too ask the AA web-site and then the silence from them. I chalk it up to his web-site his rules and I just move on.

OP very nice Krieger wrench be sure and take good care it.

 

[Stillgottimefor1]

Woody 73: how much should I clean it and tell me if I should preserve the patina or what? I understand it is kinda rare so I don’t want to screw it up. I may put it on the sale area of this site...would love to frame and display it but almost nobody would know the significance...


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[DadsTools]

My biggest bugaboo with AA is not publishing PDFs of the catalogs they are using. They list them, and in cases where a catalog they cite is available somewhere else, it's possible to doublecheck their analysis, but if they have a catalog nobody else does, there is no way to confirm their analysis. That wouldn't be a problem of their analysis was always solid. Unfortunately, it's not. Second biggest issue is not always explaining their rationale. Third is their refusal to accept and use references (catalogs, ads, other research material, etc) they don't own and analysis they didn't perform themselves. Between their library and "ours" (public domain, TA 1.0, etc), we collectively have a very comprehensive library, but there is no way to conduct complementary and supplementary contiguous research and analysis without seeing their catalogs. Fourth is just not being receptive to corrections. All of that is why Todd started TA 1.0, why we're working on TA 2.0, and why I will never send AA a dang thing again in my lifetime.

Understood. I too get frustrated with AA at times. The catalog thing is an issue--it would be great if AA made them available. Their analysis is not always correct--I've found a number of errors on the site myself, and I'm far from being an expert. There's one instance, for example, where they have an incorrect socket for the set, and then actually use the incorrect one for more detailed photos and analysis. I don't blame you for not sending them anything else. In the end, I'm grateful for all the reference sites out there, TA, AA, Papaws, Progress if Fine, and the like.