Wiring for 2 30A outlets off 1 breaker

[Phydeauxman]

I am in the process of wiring my 52 x 56 shop and would like to put in an outlet for my welder in the front of the shop and one in the back of the shop. I would never be using both outlets at the same time (only have 1 welder) so I would like to put both outlets off of the same breaker. Has anyone done this before? Is there a code legal way to do this?

 

[Terry D]

There is no code violation per the NEC. But the IRC prohibits multiple outlets on a circuit over 20 amps, which is adopted in your state. You would need to run a dedicated circuit to both.

 

[Phydeauxman]

There is no code violation per the NEC. But the IRC prohibits multiple outlets on a circuit over 20 amps, which is adopted in your state. You would need to run a dedicated circuit to both

I kinda thought that would be the response but wanted to ask anyway. Thanks for replying and validating.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Terry beat me to it

 

[nadogail]

IMHO, I would not try to do any serious welding from a 30 Amp circuit. My stick welder is fed from a 50 Amp Breaker.

 

[pattenp]

There is no code violation per the NEC. But the IRC prohibits multiple outlets on a circuit over 20 amps, which is adopted in your state. You would need to run a dedicated circuit to both

Yep.. it's in the Virginia Uniform Statewide Building Code.

 

[mike93lx]

IMHO, I would not try to do any serious welding from a 30 Amp circuit. My stick welder is fed from a 50 Amp Breaker.

Most modern inverter welders are just fine on a 30a. The days of a 50a being the default for a welder are gone

 

[u2slow]

I am in the process of wiring my 52 x 56 shop and would like to put in an outlet for my welder in the front of the shop and one in the back of the shop. I would never be using both outlets at the same time (only have 1 welder) so I would like to put both outlets off of the same breaker. Has anyone done this before? Is there a code legal way to do this?

Its fully electrically possible and safe - and I have done it at my own house & shop... but as already mentioned, may not be code.

 

[mike93lx]

I would do it in my shop and would probably just uninstall it at the time of a sale

 

[amh]

Another consideration, if you have a subpanel in the shop and you are just tight for circuit spaces to use quaduplex breaker (dual tandem with interposer) like: Eaton BQ230230 Type BQ Quadplex Circuit Breaker, 120/240 VAC, 30/30A, they come in different current ratings.

If you don't have a subpanel in the shop (e.g. running dedicated 240V/30A feed from main house), you can add a tiny subpanel just for the two 240V outlets like this: 2-Space 4-Circuit Indoor Single-Phase Main Lug Circuit Breaker Panel ($19.45 at HD) and use a quadplex breaker (of course, you may also use a larger 4-space subpanel if you prefer the regular breakers).

Edit: do not bond/connect the grounds and neutrals in a subpanel, that is only done in the main panel. If your wiring requires 4-wire outlets (2xHot, Neutral & Gnd), you will need to install an additional ground bar/strip inside the metal subpanel box that is not bonded to the neutrals of the subpanel.

 

[tarmy]

I would do it in my shop and would probably just uninstalled it at the time of a sale

Yep...did it in my shop...will undo the second plug and extract the wire prior to sale.

 

[u2slow]

Yep...did it in my shop...will undo the second plug and extract the wire prior to sale.

Check with your realtor or real-estate board. I recently found out my jurisdiction only holds you liable if your "unpermitted" improvements are less than 2yrs old. If it happened more that 2 years ago, you're off the hook - so to speak.

IMHO, make it work for you while you live in it.

 

[kj_mustang]

The national Realtor association has no legal authority. The state's real estate board is usually just a licensing and regulatory authority over state licensed real estate agents. Any real estate person better be quoting from actual state laws as they have no legal authority and a lawsuit is always possible.

 

[mike93lx]

Legal advice from a realtor? No thanks.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Most modern inverter welders are just fine on a 30a. The days of a 50a being the default for a welder are gone

One of my pet peeves ! Why do all modern 240V welders come with a 50A plug ?

I know the answer, but it does not sit right with me !

 

[Crazyjake8493]

IMHO, I would not try to do any serious welding from a 30 Amp circuit. My stick welder is fed from a 50 Amp Breaker.

Other than old tombstone stick welders, most modern home/hobby-grade welders wouldn't require anything more than a 30A circuit. My 180amp MIG and 200amp TIG/stick both only require a 30A circuit and I've not once tripped it, even with the machine maxed out.

 

[tarmy]

Check with your realtor or real-estate board. I recently found out my jurisdiction only holds you liable if your "unpermitted" improvements are less than 2yrs old. If it happened more that 2 years ago, you're off the hook - so to speak.

IMHO, make it work for you while you live in it.

I live in CA where everybody is a victim and will sue you. I appreciate the thought...

When ever I install something like this...I put it in with the idea of removing it.

Having sold a few homes over the years...I disclose EVERYTHING...way easier than dealing with jerks trying to get money back. I have had two try just that...hey...you didn’t tell me about...gimme money. Nope, read your paper work from the sale and disclosures...

 

[u2slow]

I live in CA where everybody is a victim and will sue you. I appreciate the thought...

... I have had two try just that...hey...you didn’t tell me about...gimme money. Nope, read your paper work from the sale and disclosures...

That's what I meant... the 2 year thing ends up in the legal sale paperwork. As I understand it, its in the basic/standard disclosure language up here.

 

[Higgins]

I kinda thought that would be the response but wanted to ask anyway. Thanks for replying and validating.

You can install a manual transfer switch. That way one direction is load "A" and the other direction is load "B".

Installed that setup in our last garage and was approved by the local inspector in Kane County, IL.

AL

 

[Bert_]

This is a design issue not safety. If you try to use both at one time the breaker trips. You cannot reduce wire size for this like a dedicated welder outlet. No reason for a transfer switch other than to satisfy an overreaching code.

If it's not allowed but you want to do it just blank one box for inspection and install the outlet later. Or remove outlet and blank it if you're concerned when selling.

 

[yeldogt]

When was this adopted ?

When I was doing my studio about 15 years ago -- had two possible setups for the three tools. They were so different that I did 6 outlets. 2 on each circuit .. it was all inspected. Did he just miss this?

 

[Terry D]

When was this adopted ?

When I was doing my studio about 15 years ago -- had two possible setups for the three tools. They were so different that I did 6 outlets. 2 on each circuit .. it was all inspected. Did he just miss this?

This is not a NEC restriction, it is a IRC restriction, it prohibits multiple receptacles on circuits over 20 amps. Some states and municipality's fall under the IRC, Virginia being one of them

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Check with your realtor or real-estate board. I recently found out my jurisdiction only holds you liable if your "unpermitted" improvements are less than 2yrs old. If it happened more that 2 years ago, you're off the hook - so to speak.

IMHO, make it work for you while you live in it.

Youre joking right?

 

[haveissues]

I live in CA where everybody is a victim and will sue you. I appreciate the thought...

When ever I install something like this...I put it in with the idea of removing it.

Having sold a few homes over the years...I disclose EVERYTHING...way easier than dealing with jerks trying to get money back. I have had two try just that...hey...you didn’t tell me about...gimme money. Nope, read your paper work from the sale and disclosures...

In NY we have the option of either disclosing or giving the buyer $500 at the closing table. Everyone that is not a complete idiot goes with the $500....