Four #6 in 3/4 PVC, who's done it?

[Shovelhead]

Trying to find the most effective(cost included) way to get some circuits from main panel to a framed room within my shop. All in the near future bear in mind. Framed room don't even exist yet.
Framed room will likely end up housing woodworking equipment. HVAC - mini split or window unit as well.
Room (16x30) is located 25' from main 200A panel.
When I say room is 25' from main panel, that is closest point of entry. One of the 240V circuits will be 54-60' from the main panel.
Shop is 42W x 54D, all steel frame and siding.

Expected needs:
HVAC circuit.
TWO 240V 20-30A circuits. (woodworking equip.)
THREE 120V 20A circuits. (ceiling outlets, two separate wall outlet circuits)
ONE 120V 15-20A lighting circuit.

Would #6 do it to a sub panel? Within the fill capacity of 3/4 Sch 40 I know.
Cheaper to run all the above from my main panel? Maybe cheaper but dang sure won't be easier.
I figured four to six 3/4" conduits from the main panel. I think....
And running from the main will be a challenge as there will be plywood walls eventually where the main panel lives.

Did y'all know wire and materials are a bit more expensive than 26 yrs ago when I built my last shop? SHEEEEEEE-------it.

 

[Bert_]

Why 4 #6's? Ground definitely doesn't need to be that big.

 

[Shovelhead]

Thank ya Bert. Good point.
#10 for a ground?

 

[sparky 1971]

Three #6 and a #10 ground will fit. If possible, I would run emt panel to panel and not pull a ground wire. Even with a ground wire it will fit in emt better and pull easier. PVC has it's places, but in a garage/shop isn't one of them.

 

[Shovelhead]

Appreciate it Sparky.
The 3/4 pvc I have on the back side of shop is stubbed up out the slab.
As far as EMT goes, well, I’ve never used any. Not to say I couldn’t learn, but I have a bunch of pvc on hand and know how to work with it.

Another thing I’ve thought about is 6/3 cable from the main panel to another panel in the room.
I’m just not up on what type cable is suitable to run indoors along steel framing.

 

[sparky 1971]

Is the PVC run out the bottom the main panel then stubbed up? If so, just stick with it and run the 6's and a 10 to a 60 amp subpanel and be done with it. It will probably be more cost effective and easier with the sub. You shouldn't have any problems running the equipment, you can only do one thing at a time for the most part.

 

[AP514]

I’m just not up on what type cable is suitable to run indoors along steel framing.

I used MC for my Steel Frame Garage.....

 

[Miss the Pontiacs]

I would have thought there would have been a rule on the fill allowed!

 

[Ericbl]

I just finished running 3ea. 6’s and. 1 ea. 8 in 3/4 EMT. wire lubed pushed and pulled, worked fine

 

[Stuart in MN]

I would have thought there would have been a rule on the fill allowed!

Four #6 THHN (or three #6 and one #10) are within the fill rule for 3/4" Sch. 40 PVC.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

as said above, 3 #6s and 1 #10 in 3/4" is fine. lube it up and send it

 

[Shovelhead]

Well.............. after some better measuring and further review.
To use my 3/4 stubbed up at back of shop from main panel, the run will be close to 80' all said and done.
#6 at Lowes is $1.68 a foot.
Already have 500' of green #10.
Total is over 400 bucks just for wire.

I can run from main panel to closest point of entry to framed room in about 40'. So half the wire cost.
Will require drilling two holes in steel wall girts and one hole through main 12" I-beam.
More work, and likely a bit more wire to run to HVAC and 240v circuits from the sub panel in the future.
Going this route is a head scratcher because I'd have to make up my mind NOW on how I'm going to make use of the shop along that run, considering more framed walls, etc.

I think going the short route with 6/3 romex will give me the most flexibility for the future. 50' for $245.
I can't see why I couldn't use romex to feed a sub panel within this shop. I could lay it at the back of the wall girts against the insulation and it would never be a hazzard, especially once there are walls built. Use a few one hole straps if I wanted as well.
Use the clamp type connectors with a lock ring at the points where it passes through the girts and I-beam.

Will I still go to hell if I do it that way?

Thanks for y'alls replies.

 

[sparky 1971]

Do it however you want. I would use a chase ****** instead of dicking around with a romex connector where it's passing through the metal though.

 

[Shovelhead]

Do it however you want. I would use a chase ****** instead of dicking around with a romex connector where it's passing through the metal though.

That will work for getting through the I- beam horizontally but running up from panel through the wall girt I figgered the romex connector would help hold it.
I’ll l figger it out. Since I been staring at the **** for a couple days I knew posting a question about it all would help rattle my brain on some options.

Appreciate your input man.

 

[Terry D]

I personally would go with a 6/3 MC cable. You would not have to worry about bushings when passing through metal. It would be easier to support, Caddy makes a assortment of brackets and hangers for this. Plus, at least to me, exposed romex on metal beams just does not look right. I would still use EMT from your main panel to get up to where you want, and then transition over to MC. You could always stub a few conduits up to a large J-Box and bring your 6/3 MC and any future MC cables out of that

 

[wyliesdiesels]

MC or EMT is the way to go in a shop like that

 

[dcg9381]

Three #6 and a #10 ground will fit. If possible, I would run emt panel to panel and not pull a ground wire. Even with a ground wire it will fit in emt better and pull easier. PVC has it's places, but in a garage/shop isn't one of them.

I've done this. Pay attention to the particular wire type and diameter. It'll work, but it's tight and very marginal. I've only done it for very short runs and not any more than a 90 degree bend in conduit.

 

[sparky 1971]

Its 33% full using THHN/THWN. It will fit just fine if: 1) the head is made up correctly, and 2) the wires don't get twisted together before they go into the conduit. The use of lube will help too.

 

[Shovelhead]

Another question regarding proper grounding when using metal boxes screwed to the steel framing.
Since I've got different answers from folks in the past and I don't mind admitting I don't really know.

Steel box, receptacle or switch, screwed to the steel frame. Using BX cable.
Same as above but using romex.

Do i need to pigtail the receptacle or switch ground to the steel box itself?
Some boxes have a raised area for a ground. Some don't.

Some of this wiring I'm working on now is "temporary / permanent" as we used to say at work sometimes.
Using what wire I have.
Example - running a short (6') piece of romex from panel to a steel box mounted to the wall girt. This will be to power a string of work lights. This circuit will be changed once I have a wood framed wall built to the steel.

Thanks

 

[Terry D]

Another question regarding proper grounding when using metal boxes screwed to the steel framing.
Since I've got different answers from folks in the past and I don't mind admitting I don't really know.

Steel box, receptacle or switch, screwed to the steel frame. Using BX cable.
Same as above but using romex.

Do i need to pigtail the receptacle or switch ground to the steel box itself?
Some boxes have a raised area for a ground. Some don't.

Some of this wiring I'm working on now is "temporary / permanent" as we used to say at work sometimes.
Using what wire I have.
Example - running a short (6') piece of romex from panel to a steel box mounted to the wall girt. This will be to power a string of work lights. This circuit will be changed once I have a wood framed wall built to the steel.

Thanks

Devices need to be connected to the equipment ground, if you are not pulling a actual equipment ground and just using the conduit, then you would use a pigtal with a 10/32 screw. Most boxes now have the raised threaded hole for the ground, the ones that dont can be a pain in the **** when attached over metal.