I see guys laying under cars in the Autozone parking lot in 10 degree weather. It'd be nice to have a place to work on their cars so they can keep their cars in good running shape. It's hard to put more than a band-aid on a car when you don't have a shop, lift, air tools, etc..
Civilian Auto Hobby Shop
- Thread starter Blue
- Start date
I remember the Car Talk guys talking about having been involved with one at one time. Their problem was that people would get stuck, ask them for help, and then they'd end up doing the project without getting paid for the work, which would have cost more than the rental price.
I too see tool shrinkage as being the biggest problem, provided you set up rules that say "staff isn't going to help you, don't ask." Might be more viable today, though - implant RFID tags in the tools that set off an alarm if someone tries to take them out of the building.
I too see tool shrinkage as being the biggest problem, provided you set up rules that say "staff isn't going to help you, don't ask." Might be more viable today, though - implant RFID tags in the tools that set off an alarm if someone tries to take them out of the building.
That would be the problem and cars tying up bays with no income.
Larey
Well-known member
I was searching the other day for Custom Garages before I found this website and found http://diytexas.com/ . The charge is up their but includes tools also, they teach classes as well. They post a lot on Facebook also.
ZRX61
Well-known member
They painted the walls black???? I looked at the pics & it looks like they are working in a coal mine.
Makoto
Well-known member
I would only do this with close friends.
People need to remember, a military auto hobby shop does not need to MAKE money to survive- ( government based business) it's a benefit for the members. If it makes money so be it. Last one I utilized was over an 1/8 mile long and @ 120 feet wide. It was a dream place could do everything from start to finish. A person would have to lock up most things- to many one day people can walk around and think those things belong to them.
The employees of auto hobby shops are paid thru recreation services( gsa jobs ).
The employees of auto hobby shops are paid thru recreation services( gsa jobs ).
I look one up every year thinking it'll pop up. But it doesn't. The one on post in WA was legit. They gave us a key chain with like 15 different tags on it. You must show the tool to the guy before getting your tags back and you can't leave until all the tools are returned. Also in the back was a fenced off yard where vehicles that sat with out being paid for got taken too. If you leave it in the bay for more than 3 days with out paying it gets taking out back where you can't get it. Than sold for parts after a month. I want to open one so bad. You must have a form for them to sign with there license and debit card info. I think more good would come out of it. Id want to run it with other vets so no security guard is required. Bunch of cameras and place it in a good area. Not Detroit. It could work.
Rbcsci
Well-known member
We had a shop just as the OP described when I was in the Army so many moons ago. It really was a life saver. I spent a ton of time there working on my old junk and helping buddies work on theirs. There were always a few retirees hanging around to teach us young pups how to perform basic maintenance or replace brakes or adjust valves (aging myself) or even how to replace a head gasket or replace a clutch. It was probably the best automotive education I ever had and I’m eternally grateful to those guys who doled out wisdom. The fee was by the hour, but it was scaled on rank so a lowly PV2 like me probably paid $2 an hour. There was also an option to work off your debt by helping around the shop in various capacities. Its a damn shame that you can’t make it work in the civilian world. I still try to pay it forward today by helping neighborhood kids or anyone else who needs it.
nadogail
Well-known member
I used the Auto Hobby Shops at several bases while in uniform and after retirement. The privilege was a great one.
Several DIY Auto Repair shops have come and gone,mostly because they could not make their overhead expenses.
Also GI's and Civilians are very different from each other; mostly because Civilians lack discipline and responsibility. Screw something up at the Hobby Shop; you will make it right or else.
Screw Something up at a rented DIY Shop; what can they do? Small Claims Court takes too long and seldom makes the victim truly whole.
Several DIY Auto Repair shops have come and gone,mostly because they could not make their overhead expenses.
Also GI's and Civilians are very different from each other; mostly because Civilians lack discipline and responsibility. Screw something up at the Hobby Shop; you will make it right or else.
Screw Something up at a rented DIY Shop; what can they do? Small Claims Court takes too long and seldom makes the victim truly whole.
I found this awhile back in Phoenix. It's a bit of a drive for me and I absolutely hate Phoenix, so it's not something I've used yet.
But found it interesting. About the only thing I miss about working in a shop is having access to a lift... Floor jacks, jack stands and the garage floor *****.
But found it interesting. About the only thing I miss about working in a shop is having access to a lift... Floor jacks, jack stands and the garage floor *****.
I disagree... If you're military (current or former), looking at the topic from a military perspective using your experience of the military version/equivalent of whatever the topic at hand is, I fail to see how the word civilian could be in any way, shape, form or by any stretch of the imagination considered disrespectful.
After all, the literal definition of the word civilian is, per Websters dictionary; "not on active duty in the armed services or not on a police or firefighting force"
Sorry, but I had to chime in on your ignorant statement.
nadogail
Well-known member
You sir have the absolute right to disagree with my poor opinion of those who chose not to do their Patriotic Duty and refused to answer their governments call to arms.
Two words... Reading Comprehension.I would like to suggest that you actually read and understand what someone said before you respond. Especially when your response has nothing to do with what was actually being said. Words are hard.
This is not Twitter and not a political/social debate...
MBfreak
MEMBER EMERITUS
The lawyer and litigation weasels in Sweden killed this kind of business in the 70´s
Will never come back here.
And a friend of mine made the following comment around a coffetable with grown up men:
Do you know how youngsters repair their cars??
No answers from around the table
Then he mimed , holding up his phone to the ear and said " Dad my car died. Please come and fix it"
Ola
Will never come back here.
And a friend of mine made the following comment around a coffetable with grown up men:
Do you know how youngsters repair their cars??
No answers from around the table
Then he mimed , holding up his phone to the ear and said " Dad my car died. Please come and fix it"
Ola
Mikeske
Well-known member
To note I was in the Air Force and trained as vehicle mechanic. I am fresh out technical school and my first assignment was Loring AFB, Maine. I am all ready for advanced training and where did I get assigned as a Airman the Auto Hobby Shop.
In 1977 I was in the Auto Hobby Shop and worked in it as the a military liaison. Yes the civilians ran the place as a benefit for the military member but at least one military member had to be on the staff along with the wood hobby shop which was collocated with the auto hobby shop at Loring.
The model of a auto hobby shop is very doubtful if it would ever succeed in the civilian world they were to many issues with insurance and payments. I actually learned more about vehicles at the auto hobby shop then if I went straight into OJT at the motor pool. I used that as after a year I was sent overseas for the next five years in asia. I completed my time in the Air Force after 7 years and went in the reserves for a additional 7 years and was medically retired for stress fractures in both my feet
Today I am a retiree and just have a nice work shop next my home where I escape the world and take in small projects on the neighbors vehicles and avoid anything that is heavy line.
In 1977 I was in the Auto Hobby Shop and worked in it as the a military liaison. Yes the civilians ran the place as a benefit for the military member but at least one military member had to be on the staff along with the wood hobby shop which was collocated with the auto hobby shop at Loring.
The model of a auto hobby shop is very doubtful if it would ever succeed in the civilian world they were to many issues with insurance and payments. I actually learned more about vehicles at the auto hobby shop then if I went straight into OJT at the motor pool. I used that as after a year I was sent overseas for the next five years in asia. I completed my time in the Air Force after 7 years and went in the reserves for a additional 7 years and was medically retired for stress fractures in both my feet
Today I am a retiree and just have a nice work shop next my home where I escape the world and take in small projects on the neighbors vehicles and avoid anything that is heavy line.
Have never considered doing it commercially, but would be a nice deal for a car club, where everybody knows everybody, place to hangout and help other people work on cars. Went to a neighbor's to help him revive a GT6 from years of slumber last weekend. He didn't have a real well equipped garage.
Would be nice to have a place to hangout and work on cars.
If I were retired and had a big shop would consider some sort of arrangement as discussed for the club.
Would be nice to have a place to hangout and work on cars.
If I were retired and had a big shop would consider some sort of arrangement as discussed for the club.
Steve.S
Well-known member
Hey fellas - The original comment about the term civilian being disrespectful was made 15 years ago when this thread was started, by a member who's no longer around.
I would like to suggest that you actually read and understand what someone said before you respond. Especially when your response has nothing to do with what was actually being said. Words are hard.
This is not Twitter and not a political/social debate...
red61cj5
Well-known member
I would like to use a shop like described, however I was never in the military so clearly I am a worthless POS who cannot be trusted with anything. (sarcasm)
I have two thoughts from friends experiences...
One group of guys I know rented an older warehouse and formed a car club that was mostly guys that drag raced, they chipped in and purchased a couple of lifts for all to use and every member had their own stall. If a big job needed done on a lift it was a team effort so as not to tie them up for too long.
They organized in the mid 70's and are still there, older members who no longer race still belong and are like trustees. They are doing something right.
Another friend who was a good mechanic opened an old three bay garage in the 80's. He was there 10 hours a day as a quick lube and tire place and one bay was dedicated to him. The other two bays were open to rent for the DYI crowd and by pre-arranged appointment he would teach and assist how to work on cars for people that wanted to learn what they couldn't do.
His wife had a full time job as an ER Nurse and only worked Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights for 12 hour shifts. This made her a full time employee who had their Healthcare covered. Mon thru Friday she was the clerk, book keeper, receptionist and baby sitter in the office, If he had an assist/teaching appt, she was capable of changing oil if needed. It lasted about 18 months and the cliental slowly beat them into closing.
He went back to the dealership he had left as a tech and she remained a nurse, They are both retired now and still look fondly back at it as something they both wanted to try even tho they failed.
Most people that wrench on their own hobby cars either have a dedicated space or friends that do..The people that come to your hobby car/slash DIY business will slowly beat you to death...
One group of guys I know rented an older warehouse and formed a car club that was mostly guys that drag raced, they chipped in and purchased a couple of lifts for all to use and every member had their own stall. If a big job needed done on a lift it was a team effort so as not to tie them up for too long.
They organized in the mid 70's and are still there, older members who no longer race still belong and are like trustees. They are doing something right.
Another friend who was a good mechanic opened an old three bay garage in the 80's. He was there 10 hours a day as a quick lube and tire place and one bay was dedicated to him. The other two bays were open to rent for the DYI crowd and by pre-arranged appointment he would teach and assist how to work on cars for people that wanted to learn what they couldn't do.
His wife had a full time job as an ER Nurse and only worked Friday, Saturday and Sunday nights for 12 hour shifts. This made her a full time employee who had their Healthcare covered. Mon thru Friday she was the clerk, book keeper, receptionist and baby sitter in the office, If he had an assist/teaching appt, she was capable of changing oil if needed. It lasted about 18 months and the cliental slowly beat them into closing.
He went back to the dealership he had left as a tech and she remained a nurse, They are both retired now and still look fondly back at it as something they both wanted to try even tho they failed.
Most people that wrench on their own hobby cars either have a dedicated space or friends that do..The people that come to your hobby car/slash DIY business will slowly beat you to death...
pb014
Active member
The Car Talk guys tried it in the '70s or '80s.
FredWanaker
Well-known member
the problem is storing the cars that can't be finished in a reasonable time. One guy puts a car on a lift to do brakes but finds a bad wheel bearing. He can't source a part for a month because it is from the 50's. The lift is ******* for a month. Everyone else is pissed and leaves to just do the work at home. Another guy strips the oil pan bolt changing the oil, and it is an odd size and placement. To fix the suspension has to come partially apart and the pan come off. He can't get right back to it cause he works weekdays. Now a second lift is *******. When I worked as a mechanic we used our own tools, had our own lift, and our own bay. If you screwed up, it was your own pocketbook you were screwing up.
joe_padavano
Well-known member
I actually used their shop when I was in college in Cambridge, MA back in the 1970s. A friend needed a starter in his 1964 Olds, and naturally it was the middle of winter. We pushed the car to their shop and did the swap in heated comfort. Even then the safety and insurance issues were sketchy.
Ak Jim
Well-known member
Been using military AHS for 35 years. Thankfully I live close to a base with a great AHS. The guy running the place use to be a pro mechanic and is super knowledgeable. They also have a few other employees including a gal that runs the alignment rack.
As far as military vs civilian I think the biggest difference is in the military if you screw up at the AHS they contact your commander and they can make your life very miserable and the civilian people don’t have this kind of oversight.
As far as military vs civilian I think the biggest difference is in the military if you screw up at the AHS they contact your commander and they can make your life very miserable and the civilian people don’t have this kind of oversight.
Backyard Imports
Well-known member
There is a place in the Seattle area that, kinda, has/does something like this. Check it out here ——-> https://theshopclubs.com/
rsanter
Well-known member
I would love to do this but I have heard so many stories of places that do not get enough traffic to make money and then close or they take too many losses to make money and then close.
I have seen of a couple places that were “maker spaces” that were not for cars but more for general hobby. That seems to have worked better for them.
If I recall they have the mill but you have to bring in or buy/rent the tooling is the type of model they use
I have seen of a couple places that were “maker spaces” that were not for cars but more for general hobby. That seems to have worked better for them.
If I recall they have the mill but you have to bring in or buy/rent the tooling is the type of model they use
Even makerspaces tend to not have auto lifts even if they do have a general automotive area. The difference in insurance costs between having a lift and no lift is significant enough that it takes more than a handful of members monthly dues just to cover that. Add in the costs to maintain and replace broken or missing tools and the automotive area is one of the most expensive areas to operate. It's still possible if you get a dedicated group of people interested in keeping the automotive area running.
That said it's certainly possible. I'm a member of a makerspace that has had an auto lift and been operating for over a decade. MakeIt Labs in Nashua NH is set up as a 501c3 and is entirely volunteer run. It has helped that we have a handful of people involved in amateur racing, including hillclimb, autocross, Lemons and other auto race types. They really appreciate having access to our other equipment 24/7 like our CNC mill, CNC plasma cutter, tubing bender, etc.
Glemon,
Funny that you mention the car club angle...I was just talking to my girlfriend this afternoon. We were discussing the whole garage space thing, because I'm going to retire shortly, and I'm currently looking for a house where I can build a big custom garage. A bunch of years ago, (maybe 30...ouch) there was a repurposed Amoco station that would rent out bays, and I used it a LOT back then. I also talked about how when I was in High school/college, how guys would get together and talk shop and work on our cars together. Even my best friends grandfather had a shop in his backyard where guys would gather, drink beer and work on cars.
Anyway, she suggested that maybe when I get my new house/garage situation sorted out. that I should do the club thing and have wrenching sessions.
I'm thinking this lady is a keeper.
There are a few places like that by me;
Motorcycles
skidmarkgarage.com
Cars
wingmangarage.com
Motorcycles
Skidmark Garage | DIY Motorcycle Repair | Cleveland, Oh
Skidmark Garage is a community that thrives on helping each other out, getting dirty, jamming tunes, and riding...but mostly we learn how to fix our own motorcycles.
skidmarkgarage.com
Cars
Reserve a Bay – Wingman Garage
wingmangarage.com
joe_padavano
Well-known member
These commercial auto hobby shops come and go regularly. Here in Northern VA, there was one that opened up a couple of years ago. It lasted about a year until it closed. Liability insurance is the biggest problem. Lack of use is the other. No one fixes anything anymore. And let's be honest, there are just too many ways for idiots to screw this up.
Jagmandave
Well-known member
There was a shop in Olathe in a small strip of warehouses......I've sent the owner a note to see if it's still there, but it had been going strong for about 6-7 years last I knew.
In this case the owner rented a small space to work on his own cars, but having a full time job meant the place wasn't used when he wasn't there, so he decided to rent it out to folks. He provided hand tools, lifts, tire equipment, and more and hired a guy to run the place when he wasn't there, and who could also work there on people's cars.
I used it for one whole week to rebuild a MINI for a guy - we did a clutch, all new shocks, suspension parts, power steering pump, shift cables and a whole host of stuff. The price was very reasonable however I brought my own tools to make sure I would have everything I needed as there were a few special things you had to have for what we were doing and I doubted he would have them.
DIY Olathe was the name of it......I'll update the thread if he responds to my email.
In this case the owner rented a small space to work on his own cars, but having a full time job meant the place wasn't used when he wasn't there, so he decided to rent it out to folks. He provided hand tools, lifts, tire equipment, and more and hired a guy to run the place when he wasn't there, and who could also work there on people's cars.
I used it for one whole week to rebuild a MINI for a guy - we did a clutch, all new shocks, suspension parts, power steering pump, shift cables and a whole host of stuff. The price was very reasonable however I brought my own tools to make sure I would have everything I needed as there were a few special things you had to have for what we were doing and I doubted he would have them.
DIY Olathe was the name of it......I'll update the thread if he responds to my email.
TinkerShop
New member
- Joined
- Apr 10, 2024
- Messages
- 1
I am opening a civilian hobby shop in sc, I was raised on base and feel it can be successful when controlled properly. With set rules and liability standards. I’m currently working with an attorney to draw up documents for safety responsibility and theft to allow coverage over both, but also make people held accountable. Wish me luck.
toyotadriver
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 30, 2010
- Messages
- 1,586
I look forward to hearing how it does! Hope you follow up on updates!
Lots of valid concerns have been posted. I LOVED the base hobby shop and spent many happy days there. I even made a little side money repairing things for other people in the base hobby shop. It was staffed with a few retired type people who liked cars and could give people pointers....but they never did the work themselves. They were good about showing you how to do it but you did the work.
My fear today is....fewer and fewer people are able to repair anything today. I am amazed at how many people simply can't fix anything. So, how many of those people would actually use such a facility? And, I could see many people expecting you to do the work and then getting mad at you because "what am I paying for?".
Please share updates as you can!
Nothing in this post should be misunderstood, interpreted, misinterpreted, or construed to be of a political nature.
chris142
Well-known member
Got one near los angelas. Im not sure what the girl in the wedding dress is doing with that pipe wrench though.
urdreamgarage.com
About Us | Your Dream Garage
urdreamgarage.com
yeah, but even Loring was different from other bases iirc. heck, the closest McDonald's was in Presque Isle. my father was one of the deputy commanders on base 1975-76 until he retired, and he's told me about how it was considered hardship duty so even with the extra benefits on base the new grunts would get in trouble with nothing to do up in the north woods of Maine (driving trucks on the flightline in winter, hiding runaways in buildings). I remember the Olympic-sized swimming pool and walking to Damon Elementary School.
I knew a guy who opened one out here American DIY, I wired it up for him, it was in a new commercial park building he rented space in and had I think 4 Lifts and 2 additional work bays with no lift, full tool box rentals for all bays. It was a nice place in Va Beach, Va but unfortunately he closed down after about 6-7 years and auctioned off all of the tools and equipment. Judging from how much I paid for some tools I think he did pretty good on the liquidation (unless the auction company took it). I did not stay in contact with him and do not know why he shut down.
RPH
Well-known member
Many years ago a gas station on Woodward Ave in Royal Oak, Michigan rented its two bays with lifts out. Did my exhaust on my camaro there. It was like $15 an hour. You supplied everything else. Tools, fluids, and any other items required. You got a lift, place to drain fluids, and the dumpster. Place was fairly busy all the time. You would need to schedule an appointment time busy. Sadly, no longer available for the public. Up in Pontiac, Michigan there is a new development on the high end of cars. Private track, garages, and the price tag to go with it.
Drunkonunleaded
Well-known member
Ironically enough, there's one that opened up in a suburb just outside of Detroit in 2015 and is still operational:
Massive garage in Livonia saving people thousands on car repairs
My Mechanics Place is a do-it-yourself car repair shop that saves consumers thousands in car repairs and has changed lives in the process.
www.freep.com
I love using the Auto Skills Center on the base and it's saved me a ton of money. I've also learned a tremendous amount from both other customers and the staff. The mechanics are a great resource always willing to help out and provide supervision. I am lucky to have a full service garage including welding, tire mounting, alignments paint both, etc. A bay only costs $12 an hour. I just helped out a Chaplain there today who needed to drain his gas down to a 1/4 tank to ship the car back stateside. Photo is from a last fall when I worked on the clutch linkage.
My Old Tools
Well-known member
Not that different from the maker space shops that are scattered around major cities. They manage to keep insurance and tools.