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Does size matter? lol

ItsNemo

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At least when it comes to grinders...it's actually a bit of an interesting result:


I know it's not Tuesday, so technically not a Tool Test Tuesday video, but this is one I've wanted to do (and have been promising) for a while as I've never seen anyone comparing such different grinders against each other.

I will say, the DWE4597 7" grinder is an absolute beast :)
 
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Ton ton

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You should do a demo of sharpening bushhog blades underneath the bush hog. Real to life grinder usage, LOL.
 
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ItsNemo

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Cliffs? So far I have click bait and nothing.....not watching a video that I don't even know what it's about.

Sorry, it's a test of a bunch of different size grinders to see how much of a difference the size makes. So 4.5" and 5" and 6" and 7" grinders all with the same grit wheels on them and measuring material removal rates.
 
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speed bump

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The 7 inch is going to win just based on feeds and speeds and the grinding media you used. A 6 inch grinder has a 15% smaller diameter with a 6% reduction in RPM. Using a flap disc pretty much self limits how much power you can apply past a certain point. Walter or maybe Sait has a chart that will tell you what the material removal rates are for a given grinding media and then you just apply that to the surface feed speed for a given grinder.
 

CHRIII

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You should do a demo of sharpening bushhog blades underneath the bush hog. Real to life grinder usage, LOL.
My dad bought a Craftsman 9" angle grinder just to sharpen those blades. Apparently he had problems removing the pivoting blade ends to sharpen them with a file or bench grinder.
 

Xcursion88

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I have first hand experience with two of those from your test.
The 414 and the 416

The 414 is an absolute beast for cordless. More power than Milwaukee stuff and won't stall out or overheat and shut down the battery like the red company.

I traded my 414 in (I regret it for sure) for the 416 and here's why...

I had to do extensive grinding work on a project and I was outworking the rate at which my 60v batteries were charging. I have 4 60v batteries but I was killing them faster than they were charging (using multiple chargers)
I have around 10 (20v) batteries but I couldn't use them to finish my project as the 414 will ONLY take 60v batteries.

The 60v batteries will fit on any 20v DeWalt tool but the 20v will not fit in a dedicated 60v tool.
So I traded mine because if I get into another project like that (and I will as we rebuild frames here at times)===I need to be able to use all my batteries 60 or 20. ..

Power...
'The 414 definitely has more *** than the 416 but it's not hugely far apart.
The 414 is quite massive too and thus limits areas of use in particular around an automobile.

Looking at your chart though I think you're being very unkind to the 416.
It was better than the 413 by a similar margin to the 414 being better than the 416.

If you need one grinder to do miscellaneous things and you're not using it for 8 hours erecting skyscrapers cutting rebar by the 100's...
I think the 416 is a great tool. Great power in that size (better than my Milwaukee corded) with the option to boost it with a 60v or just using 20v is plenty adequate as it's more powerful than the 413.

If you're in fact needing to use it 8 hours everyday and size isn't an issue the 414 is definitely the way to go.
 
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ItsNemo

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I have first hand experience with two of those from your test.
The 414 and the 416

The 414 is an absolute beast for cordless. More power than Milwaukee stuff and won't stall out or overheat and shut down the battery like the red company.

I traded my 414 in (I regret it for sure) for the 416 and here's why...

I had to do extensive grinding work on a project and I was outworking the rate at which my 60v batteries were charging. I have 4 60v batteries but I was killing them faster than they were charging (using multiple chargers)
I have around 10 (20v) batteries but I couldn't use them to finish my project as the 414 will ONLY take 60v batteries.

The 60v batteries will fit on any 20v DeWalt tool but the 20v will not fit in a dedicated 60v tool.
So I traded mine because if I get into another project like that (and I will as we rebuild frames here at times)===I need to be able to use all my batteries 60 or 20. ..

Power...
'The 414 definitely has more *** than the 416 but it's not hugely far apart.
The 414 is quite massive too and thus limits areas of use in particular around an automobile.

Looking at your chart though I think you're being very unkind to the 416.
It was better than the 413 by a similar margin to the 414 being better than the 416.

If you need one grinder to do miscellaneous things and you're not using it for 8 hours erecting skyscrapers cutting rebar by the 100's...
I think the 416 is a great tool. Great power in that size (better than my Milwaukee corded) with the option to boost it with a 60v or just using 20v is plenty adequate as it's more powerful than the 413.

If you're in fact needing to use it 8 hours everyday and size isn't an issue the 414 is definitely the way to go.

That's a good take on it...the 414 is an absolute beast for sure.

The 413 to 416 on 20v isn't much of a jump, certainly the 413 to the 416 on 60v is a good margin better...but to get that you need the 60v batteries, and at that point IMO you're better off with the 414 (or probably the newer 418).

If I need to grind for a long time, the corded grinders will come out. Though, typical day of fab work in the garage, I rarely go through more than a single full charge using a grinder for prep and weld cleanup. I don't do much/any cutting with a grinder though, so that helps and I will swap between the smaller/larger ones depending on how much material I need to remove or what sort of finish. Basically use the 414 with a 60 grit for getting things close, then the 413 with an 80 grit to finish it off.

The 416 will probably get thrown into my rotation since I've bought it though, likely on 20v, and likely with a slightly different wheel than my 413 so I have options without swapping wheels.
 

Xcursion88

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I must apologize I was mistaken on the model I traded. I still have the manual. It was the dcg418

I adjusted some of your numbers to create equality in comparing.
The dcg416 with 4.5 ...adjusting the run time to 11.751 the material removed would be 4.00 versus 3 2 on the 413 model.

The 416 with adjusted numbers comparing to the corded 120v model is @ 3.92 vs 4.1 of the corded model. Certainly within a margin of error with the human element.

IMO it's safe to say the 416 outperforms the 413 convincingly and is equal to the corded model.

The 416 gets a bump with the 60v battery and adjusting it's numbers in line with the 414 model using a 4.5" ... 4.42 vs. 6.6

Only an educated guess but it appears the 5" on the 416 model using a 60v if you ran it against the 414 with a 5" (no 5" running on the 414) it would be 6.96 on the 414 and 5.4 on the 416 with a 60v using a 5".
In this case the 416 is holding it's own fairly well compared to the 414.
But the 414 really shines with the 6" just like the 416 shines with the 5"

I appreciate your effort and time to do this.

My observation is this...
The 416 has it's place for sure. It's a top performer using the 20 volt and if you need some extra performance it gets it's best boost using the 60v with a 5"

If you're doing heavy work there is no substitute for displacement (as we say in the automotive business) and the 414 with devoted 60v with a 6" seems like it's best performer.

BTW...
I was able to re-aquire my traded in 418 as it hadnt sold yet.
I got it for my son who needs a grinder as he's a good welder and does lots of it.
 
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ItsNemo

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I must apologize I was mistaken on the model I traded. I still have the manual. It was the dcg418

I adjusted some of your numbers to create equality in comparing.
The dcg416 with 4.5 ...adjusting the run time to 11.751 the material removed would be 4.00 versus 3 2 on the 413 model.

The 416 with adjusted numbers comparing to the corded 120v model is @ 3.92 vs 4.1 of the corded model. Certainly within a margin of error with the human element.

IMO it's safe to say the 416 outperforms the 413 convincingly and is equal to the corded model.

The 416 gets a bump with the 60v battery and adjusting it's numbers in line with the 414 model using a 4.5" ... 4.42 vs. 6.6

Only an educated guess but it appears the 5" on the 416 model using a 60v if you ran it against the 414 with a 5" (no 5" running on the 414) it would be 6.96 on the 414 and 5.4 on the 416 with a 60v using a 5".
In this case the 416 is holding it's own fairly well compared to the 414.
But the 414 really shines with the 6" just like the 416 shines with the 5"

I appreciate your effort and time to do this.

My observation is this...
The 416 has it's place for sure. It's a top performer using the 20 volt and if you need some extra performance it gets it's best boost using the 60v with a 5"

If you're doing heavy work there is no substitute for displacement (as we say in the automotive business) and the 414 with devoted 60v with a 6" seems like it's best performer.

BTW...
I was able to re-aquire my traded in 418 as it hadnt sold yet.
I got it for my son who needs a grinder as he's a good welder and does lots of it.

The rate column already is adjusted for time...it's grams per second. The 416 is better than the 413 by a small margin, but less than the corded on 20v. It sits in the middle of those two. What isn't factored in though is price...the 413 is cheaper than the 416. The 414/418 are only a smidge more than the 416 (at least here in Canada today, regular prices, the 418 is only $30 more than the 416 both as bare tools). This plays into the argument that there's no point in doing a 416 when for a few bucks more, you get a WAY better grinder and you still need to go buy 60v batteries either way.
 

Xcursion88

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The rate column already is adjusted for time...it's grams per second. The 416 is better than the 413 by a small margin, but less than the corded on 20v. It sits in the middle of those two. What isn't factored in though is price...the 413 is cheaper than the 416. The 414/418 are only a smidge more than the 416 (at least here in Canada today, regular prices, the 418 is only $30 more than the 416 both as bare tools). This plays into the argument that there's no point in doing a 416 when for a few bucks more, you get a WAY better grinder and you still need to go buy 60v batteries either way.
Your rate shows material removed given the time ran however it's simpler (IMO) to simply look at model "z" removed "x" amount of material versus model "y" using equal time. Now you can either increase the time of the one that ran shorter time or decrease the time of the one that ran longer either way you see the actual material removed if time is equal.

Using exact time for comparing models the 416 significantly outperforms the 413. 4.0 material removed vs. 3.2 on the 413.

With adjusted time the 416 is within a margin of human error to the corded model.
3.92 material removed versus 4.1 that .2 difference has to be close enough to fall in the human element.

Cost....

Let's use Home Depot on all...(different places have sales but just use one vendor)

Screenshot_20220705-133658_Chrome.jpg
Screenshot_20220705-133635_Chrome.jpg
Screenshot_20220705-133606_Chrome.jpg

They are all within the same ballpark.
Price difference is negligible.


The "need" and battery availability is the driving force here.
If you NEED a big powerful grinder then you have to get a 60v.
That said once you committed to the 60v it's the only battery you can use. You can't use any 20v on it and grinders are battery hogs. You'll need more than one 60v for and possibly more than two.

In my case I was grinding/cutting for 2 plus hours straight. I had 3 60v at the time and I out ran my batteries so I had downtime. (Can't use a 20v on a 60v tool) even with a fast charger

Yet I had 8 20v batteries ready to go staring at me that couldnt be used.

Hence why I got the 416. I can use the 60v on both the 413 and 416 but if I get a bump in power for a negligible price difference between those pair I'm going for it.

The other factor is size. Using them with plenty of room the 60v wins. If you're working in tight spaces the 60v grinders are bigger and can mean fit vs. no fit for the task at hand.

As I said before the 60v grinder is impressive. More power than any Milwaukee I've used.

But the 416 definitely has a place in the lineup.
If someone already has a mix if 20 and 60v batteries the 416 is a great option.

I wouldn't buy it aiming to get the boost I need with a 60v battery. If anyone is doing major work you need batteries. Lots of them and the 60's are damn expensive stand alone. But if you've already got a mix of batteries and just happen to need a grinder the two logical candidates are the 416 and the 418
 
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ItsNemo

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^^ Those prices are ****, I paid $159.99 for my 413b...in Canada at that.

1657079912822.png

Compared to the DCG416 at $209.99:

1657080063908.png

Keep in mind, I own and spent my own money on all three of these cordless Dewalts. I had the corded 4.5" first, the 413 second which was amazing to have a useful cordless grinder, the 414 third which was impressively strong, and the 416 third which disappointed me as it wasn't a 414 on 60v and in use it doesn't feel really any more powerful than my 413. I can see the argument for if you had to have just one grinder AND you owned 60v batteries already for other tools AND you needed something small...but that's about it.
 
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