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Black gas pipe left right ****** in wall

branimal

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Can I leave a left/right black gas ****** in the wall? I know unions require an access panel.

I'm running my pipe from stove toward the source. Construction constraints make stove to source much easier than the other way around.

Location is NYC.
 
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luvtheheat

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My neighbor worked for the local gas utility and helped me install one 10 years ago behind drywall when I did some remodeling. No access panel. Knowing him he would not have done it if it were against code.
 

luvtheheat

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I mentioned in
I have never encountered LH threaded pipe!
I mentioned in an earlier post that my neighbor worked for the local gas utility. He had a section of pipe threaded for me left handed.

As some background, my project was I was raising my ceiling a foot in some places, and make use of otherwise dead space. I had to relocate a gas pipe. Neighbor helped me. Rather than disassemble 45 feet of pipe through the attic, we cut the pipe, relocated a small section, then put it back together using the special cut LH pipe and the left/right ******. Nice neighbor!
 

qmdv

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Am retired plumber. You should never use a union in a wall even with access panel. If you get a leak you may have a really big access panel. What size do you need. I have a 3/4 in stock. Use a left and right.
 

qmdv

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I have never heard of these!

I can see how they are quite handy for remodeling - vs a an access panel for a union.
50 years plus as a plumber I was taught as an apprentice to never use a union in a gas line accept at the appliance after the shut off valve or at the gas meter. I never have. How would you change a union in a strait run if the pipe was anchored correctly behind a 12 x 12 access panel. Please show me the code that says it is OK.
 

larry4406

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50 years plus as a plumber I was taught as an apprentice to never use a union in a gas line accept at the appliance after the shut off valve or at the gas meter. I never have. How would you change a union in a strait run if the pipe was anchored correctly behind a 12 x 12 access panel. Please show me the code that says it is OK.
It's not a union.
 

4x4Pete

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In Ontario left/right fittings are illegal for use in gas piping. You woud also need a left/right fitting to screw the left hand portion of the ****** into to make it work. Good luck finding that. They were generally used at the in and out ports on cast iron radiators. Can you run copper instead if it's legal in your jurisdiction?
 
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branimal

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Picked up the l/r coupling and ****** at plumbing supply shop. The ****** was pre-sized to 4". I guess the junction where the pipes meet needs to get measured out pretty precisely to get everything snugged up and leak proof.

I've got a gas pressure gauge I can use to test the line.
 

billconner

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You woud also need a left/right fitting to screw the left hand portion of the ****** into to make it work.
These are easy. If the 2 pieces, only one end of coupling and one end of ****** is left handed. So you couple the ****** into a normal right hand fitting, and then line up left right coupling and thread it on both pipes - the unique left hand ****** and a normal right hand pipe. It's very simple and works great when you want to insert something. I don't understand why they would be illegal - just threaded pipe connections.
 

4x4Pete

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I'm glad I won't ever have to take it apart in the future. Maybe you can install the line with an assortment of different fittings! As long as they're threaded who cares! 😆
 

rlitman

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In Ontario left/right fittings are illegal for use in gas piping. You woud also need a left/right fitting to screw the left hand portion of the ****** into to make it work. Good luck finding that...
Huh? Thye're always sold as a pair, with a L/R coupling and matching L/R ******.
 

4x4Pete

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Huh? Thye're always sold as a pair, with a L/R coupling and matching L/R ******.
Around here the L/R ******* are sold without couplings. They are used typically for cast iron rads. Because of this only big plumbing supply houses carry them. They do have their purpose, I don't think that gas service piping is one of them.
 

billconner

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I've used them in remodeling (like adding a gas line for a cooktop). I can't think of any reason they wouldn't be acceptable.
And I can't imagine you have to disassemble the gas piping in the whole house. I added a gas fireplace at front of house, and there were 5 gas appliances at rear of house. The left right was only practical option. It's the same materials and methods as any pipe fitting.
 

4x4Pete

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The code book here doesn't care how difficult it is to complete a connection in existing piping. If this were an electrical issue there would be no option but to do the correct thing. You can use any fittings or a garden hose if you want but it's still illegal here in Ontario. Good luck with the project and please test for leaks. Screenshot_20220711-162438_Acrobat for Samsung.jpg
 
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branimal

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I have seen Left/ Right ******* used when other trades put a hole in an existing gas pipe.
That’s takes some real determination.
The code book here doesn't care how difficult it is to complete a connection in existing piping. If this were an electrical issue there would be no option but to do the correct thing. You can use any fittings or a garden hose if you want but it's still illegal here in Ontario. Good luck with the project and please test for leaks. Screenshot_20220711-162438_Acrobat for Samsung.jpg
I tested my partial run at 14psi overnight. It’s holding fine. Will test again after the l/r ****** is installed.
 

qmdv

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The code book here doesn't care how difficult it is to complete a connection in existing piping. If this were an electrical issue there would be no option but to do the correct thing. You can use any fittings or a garden hose if you want but it's still illegal here in Ontario. Good luck with the project and please test for leaks. Screenshot_20220711-162438_Acrobat for Samsung.jpg
So if you want to cut in a tee for a bbq or log lighter you may have to demo part of the house. I guess you could weld in a tee. I bet this is in the code when it applies to new construction because when you tighten fittings after the left and right it would back off the left portion. I bet on a remodel if you presented your situation to a building official they would let you use a left and right.
 

nadogail

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In Ontario left/right fittings are illegal for use in gas piping. You woud also need a left/right fitting to screw the left hand portion of the ****** into to make it work. Good luck finding that. They were generally used at the in and out ports on cast iron radiators. Can you run copper instead if it's legal in your jurisdiction?
Sometimes Laws and Codes are, in my opinion, stupidly wrong. Laws often are written by those who have their own interests at heart and passed by legislators who are ignorant.
 

firebirdparts

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Very true. I think there is always some justification for it, but in some cases, the justification is just misguided. If you don't talk to the people who wrote the code, you don't always guess their perspective on it. Obviously inspectors have a LOT of influence on codes, and sometimes maybe outsize influence. They certainly pander to their own convenience, but that helps people doing repairs a lot. It's not exactly all bad.
 

4x4Pete

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Electrical codes in general are stupidly wrong moreso than gas codes. Just the amount of different wire types that can or can't be used indoor or outdoor or buried or in conduit is totally ridiculous.
To me left/right fittings shouldn't be used in a gas piping system. Unions are legal to bury here as long as you pressure tested the piping system. I wouldn't bury one myself because if it were to leak even if a homeowner was working on the piping- the last gas fitter onsite usually takes the rap. In 30 years I've never had a union leak that was tightened properly. If unions were susceptible to leaking they shouldn't be used either buried or not. I know my experience doesn't justify a code change but it is what it is. I've seen all types of codes that are either ridiculously dangerous or just like this one- stupid. Other stupid ones here are like- black iron ******* smaller than 1/2" must be schedule 80. Most residential suppliers don't know this and carry schedule 40. The gas inspectors know this and check the ****** at the bbq quick disconnect. If it isn't a sch80 you will get a red tag. Or a pool heater vent has to be 10' away from an operable window- it's 3' in the US. Our CO must be more poisonous than what's produced south of here.
Most suppliers here won't sell to unlicensed individuals. Home Depot, Lowes and the like will sell to anyone- gas equipment and electrical. I'm surprised that there aren't more explosions, electrocutions and fires.
 
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