Calling VFD experts.

[Matt018888]

So I bought a shop made 24" disc sander for my dad. It's a 2hp 3 phase 60hz motor with a rpm of 860. I'm re building this to my liking and giving it to him. Anyways I wanted to add a VFD and got a 3hp 110v Huanyang it's just like the other 4 I have on other machines. I was hoping to have variable speed, forward, reverse and run it off 110 house hold outlet as he does not have 220 currently. I have the unit some what functional.
My issues are:
1. when I press stop than adjust the potentiometer to a lower frequency while the wheel is free spinning than press start it overloads the vfd, same thing happens if it's running and I adjust to a lower frequency quickly.
2. VFD does not seem to go above 50hz even with the max frequency set to 70hz and the potentiometer cranked.
I appreciate any help as I have limited skills with these.

 

[PCustoms]

Maybe I am missing something, but how are you running a 220v motor via 110v?


Note: 120v and 240v are the current nomenclature

 

[ihateminimumwage]

I'll add to that; How are you planning on running a 240VAC 3-Phase motor on single phase 120VAC?

 

[Debcrow]

I'll add to that, trying to hook 240 3 phase on 120v 1 phase you probably will need a
VFD (Volunteer Fire Department). Which is the first thing that popped into my head when you just said VFD.

 

[Matt018888]

Based on the unit I ordered it supposed to be able to step up voltage from 110v with a output voltage of 220v all while magically converting single phase to 3 phase. I have a identical setup just with a 1hp on my drillpress and have not had a single issue.

 

[CallumRD1]

Problem 1 will be the inertia of the system is overloading the regenerative braking circuit and triggering its overload protection. I haven't used that particular model of VFD so I can't comment more specifically. I use a host of KBAC-24D, KBAC-27D, and KBDA-29 VFDs myself. The first two up convert 120V single phase to 240V three phase. They're quite convenient.

 

[Matt018888]

Problem 1 will be the inertia of the system is overloading the regenerative braking circuit and triggering its overload protection. I haven't used that particular model of VFD so I can't comment more specifically. I use a host of KBAC-24D, KBAC-27D, and KBDA-29 VFDs myself. The first two up convert 120V single phase to 240V three phase. They're quite convenient.

Yeah I thought that was the case so I disabled brake and allowed for the motor to come free spin stop. Weird thing is if I press stop while the motor is at full bore thAn adjust speed and press start it will not over load. But if I just adjust the pot to a slower speed quickly from top speed it will fault.

 

[PCustoms]

Based on the unit I ordered it supposed to be able to step up voltage from 110v with a output voltage of 220v all while magically converting single phase to 3 phase. I have a identical setup just with a 1hp on my drillpress and have not had a single issue.

Got a link or model # for this unit?

 

[Ohmthis]

What is the fault? That will help diagnose a possible fix. While a motor free wheels it produces a voltage. Sometimes a braking resistor is required to absorb the voltage and release of he energy.

 

[Matt018888]

What is the fault? That will help diagnose a possible fix. While a motor free wheels it produces a voltage. Sometimes a braking resistor is required to absorb the voltage and release of he energy.

No model number listed other than front plate that says 110v 2.2k Huanyang

 

[PCustoms]

No model number listed other than front plate that says 110v 2.2k Huanyang

Do you have a manual?

Do you have a link to where you bought it?

When I search "110v 2.2k Huanyang" I find one on Amazon:

 

[Matt018888]

Do you have a manual?

Do you have a link to where you bought it?

When I search "110v 2.2k Huanyang" I find one on Amazon:

Yes I believe that's the model I have. Although the listed out put voltage is 110 I am able to set the parameters to 220-380 I have read reviews and seen videos of people using this vfd for that application. Maybe they are mistaken. I have also ordered a 220v model to compare base lines. Seems to drive the motor just fine other than I cant get it passed 50hz no matter what I program.

 

[mike93lx]

I'll add to that; How are you planning on running a 240VAC 3-Phase motor on single phase 120VAC?

Lots of VFD options that take a 120v single phase and output 240v 3 phase

 

[ihateminimumwage]

Lots of VFD options that take a 120v single phase and output 240v 3 phase

Shows what I know. Good to learn that.

 

[Ricoch3T]

Buy a Teco.. those are the ones I use and hadn't had any trouble (Lathe and Mill). I believe they have one that you want. I use 240 to 240 3 ph
It was pretty easy to setup and get going. I'm using all the original controls as well (re wired of course) Hell I hadn't really fooled with many of the settings on them yet.

edit: this is the one I'm using L510-202-H1-U

 

[seber]

Slowing a free running motor will overload every VFD I've ever worked with including Teco. Just don't do that. A bigger problem is trying to run a two horse motor on 110vac. That's going to require around 18 amps or more after startup. You had better have a really solid circuit with nothing else on it.

 

[mike93lx]

Shows what I know. Good to learn that.

To be fair, I don’t think it's happening with a 2hp motor though. They need to be derated when using 120v input. If you are up to about 1hp, it can work though.

 

[Matt018888]

Slowing a free running motor will overload every VFD I've ever worked with including Teco. Just don't do that. A bigger problem is trying to run a two horse motor on 110vac. That's going to require around 18 amps or more after startup. You had better have a really solid circuit with nothing else on it.

I also bought a 220v version as I have expected as much but was willing to try, at 50hz definitely has enough power to sand I just can get it to 60 even with the max hz set to 70 the potentiometer runs out of dial. There must be a parameter setting I'm missing.

 

[shawhite]

I am far from a VFD expert but I was given one of these Huanyang and tried about everything to get it to work. I was having a similar problem only to discover it was 120v 3ph output. The drive should have a label on the right side with a model number on it. You can look the model number up on their website and verify it is 220v output. I also remember you had to set the drive up in a certain order as some options would affect other options. I found a lot of info on the drive on the web by searching the model number.

Good Luck. I ended up with a KB electronics drive and an invertec both are awesome.

 

[MongoTA]

Buy a Teco.. those are the ones I use and hadn't had any trouble (Lathe and Mill). I believe they have one that you want. I use 240 to 240 3 ph
It was pretty easy to setup and get going. I'm using all the original controls as well (re wired of course) Hell I hadn't really fooled with many of the settings on them yet.

edit: this is the one I'm using L510-202-H1-U

I have the same L510, or at least a version of it. L510-101-H1-U, 120v single-phase input, 240v 3-phase output. Runs my old Rockwell drill press and an old Dewalt radial arm saw. Never had a problem with it. I have used the braking feature set at various deceleration levels and never had an issue with it.

 

[86turbodsl]

Nobody has said it yet, but you can't get 3hp of energy out of a standard 110V outlet. There are no 110V VFD's that will output that much energy either. You want to run this on a VFD, you will need to get 220V installed to it. No other option.

 

[mike93lx]

...

 

[shawhite]

Nobody has said it yet, but you can't get 3hp of energy out of a standard 110V outlet. There are no 110V VFD's that will output that much energy either. You want to run this on a VFD, you will need to get 220V installed to it. No other option.

I believe the motor he is trying to run is 2hp which is possible but definitely on the high side and should have a dedicated circuit

 

[Matt018888]

I believe the motor he is trying to run is 2hp which is possible but definitely on the high side and should have a dedicated circuit

In my shop I do have 20 amp wall outlets, seems to spool the motor just fine on 110 but I have decided to go 220

 

[mike93lx]

In my shop I do have 20 amp wall outlets, seems to spool the motor just fine on 110 but I have decided to go 220

Just wait til you see what it's like on 120 and 240

 

[Matt018888]

Alright played a little more with the parameters and got everything working great. Test mounted the electronics and fabricated the table, I even added a visor hook and a slide out table extension. Although I got it to work on 110v with no wood to the sandpaper it was using 16.5 amps, so I decided to go to 220v.

 

[Matt018888]

I don't know why I couldn't add this to the last post

 

[laser3kw]

why were you stopping it to adjust the pot speed? you should be able to adjust speed while running

 

[Matt018888]

why were you stopping it to adjust the pot speed? you should be able to adjust speed while running

For some reason when the motor reached full rpm if I adjusted the pot to a lower rpm it would overload the vfd and trip a fault. But if I pressed stop than adjusted the pot to a lower rpm, than press start again it would not trip.

 

[CallumRD1]

Again, that's because you're overwhelming the braking circuit by asking it to slow down. By turning off the vfd, then changing speed, then turning on the vfd you're bypassing the braking circuit. Most vfds have braking speed setting where you can turn down the aggressiveness and avoid overloading it.

 

[Matt018888]

Again, that's because you're overwhelming the braking circuit by asking it to slow down. By turning off the vfd, then changing speed, then turning on the vfd you're bypassing the braking circuit. Most vfds have braking speed setting where you can turn down the aggressiveness and avoid overloading it.

Yep that's exactly what I did

 

[laser3kw]

For some reason when the motor reached full rpm if I adjusted the pot to a lower rpm it would overload the vfd and trip a fault

Accel / decel rate

 

[Norcal]

The first rule is unless you have money to throwaway do not buy cheap ChiCom no name VFD's, there is no support & you buy cheap you get cheap, the Practical Machinist website even has a sticky banning discussion of the same drive as the OP's, because of the long string of problems with them. https://www.practicalmachinist.com/forum/categories/transformers-phase-converters-and-vfd.11/

Buy a decent drive from a vendor that has good support or ask for help at PM, OWWM.org, or here. But a 2 HP motor is not going to run on a 20A 120V circuit, 120 volt input VFD's top out at 1 HP

 

[PoorUB]

Maybe I am missing something, but how are you running a 220v motor via 110v?


Note: 120v and 240v are the current nomenclature

You can buy 120 volt in, 220 3PH out VFDs. I have one on my drill press.

So I bought a shop made 24" disc sander for my dad. It's a 2hp 3 phase 60hz motor with a rpm of 860. I'm re building this to my liking and giving it to him. Anyways I wanted to add a VFD and got a 3hp 110v Huanyang it's just like the other 4 I have on other machines. I was hoping to have variable speed, forward, reverse and run it off 110 house hold outlet as he does not have 220 currently. I have the unit some what functional.
My issues are:
1. when I press stop than adjust the potentiometer to a lower frequency while the wheel is free spinning than press start it overloads the vfd, same thing happens if it's running and I adjust to a lower frequency quickly.
2. VFD does not seem to go above 50hz even with the max frequency set to 70hz and the potentiometer cranked.
I appreciate any help as I have limited skills with these.

I can not help but wonder if the VFD is too small for the motor? 2HP out of 120 volts seems to be a bit of a stretch. Input at 120 volts should be at or just over 20 amps.
What is the ratings in amps for the VFD? HP really means nothing as HP and amps don't follow along exactly.

 

[jar944]

You need a breaking resistor and or a longer duration on the deceleration parameter.

I'd bet you can very slowly reduce the speed manually w/o the unit tripping.

 

[shawhite]

Buy a decent drive from a vendor that has good support or ask for help at PM, OWWM.org, or here. But a 2 HP motor is not going to run on a 20A 120V circuit, 120 volt input VFD's top out at 1 HP

While I don’t disagree with your statement on buy a quality FVD. You are incorrect in stating 120v VFDs top out at 1HP. KB, Invertek, and Weg all make VFDs with 120v input and 220v 3ph output up to 2HP.

 

[Matt018888]

You need a breaking resistor and or a longer duration on the deceleration parameter.

I'd bet you can very slowly reduce the speed manually w/o the unit tripping.

Yes, thank you. You are exactly correct.

 

[slodat]

I have a higher quality VFD on my 20" disc sander. If left to decelerate on its own, it takes about 45 minutes. The fastest I'm able to brake it using the drive's braking circuit and resistors is about 45 seconds. There's a LOT of inertia in this type of machine.

 

[Matt018888]

I have a higher quality VFD on my 20" disc sander. If left to decelerate on its own, it takes about 45 minutes. The fastest I'm able to brake it using the drive's braking circuit and resistors is about 45 seconds. There's a LOT of inertia in this type of machine.

Thank you, I ended up figuring it out.