Sliding Gate Valve - Pool center drain
- Thread starter D45
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mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Why not just run a ball valve?
driftpin
Well-known member
I agree, use a ball valve. And unless you have a union, using a slip-fit to threaded fitting on each side, you need to cut the pipe somewhere to remove the valve anyway.
kaymccampbell
Well-known member
Absolutely use a ball valve. The internals of Hayward valves are easily serviceable and replaceable. I disassemble, clean and grease all the valves in the pool pump manifolds every year.
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
nh_yota
Well-known member
Jandy valve.
rayra
Well-known member
2" pvc ball valves are $15-30. Not cheap, but certainly not 'pricey'.
Jandy's are pricey. Great if you are tying them in with some sort of automation, solar heater, etc.
Jandy's are pricey. Great if you are tying them in with some sort of automation, solar heater, etc.
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Do you mean using unions, right? You'll have to use them to make it removable. Just a threaded valve will still require cutting
I just had a pool built and outside of the equipment connections, there isn't a union anywhere. Valves are all glued in. If one fails and somehow cant be rebuilt, they just cut it out and install a new one.
No not a union, but I could use them.......
I was thinking about a "slip on to threaded" fitting .......that would be glued on to the main line coming up out of the ground
It would be threaded on then and the main control valve would be threaded on to the center drain valve
I was thinking about a "slip on to threaded" fitting .......that would be glued on to the main line coming up out of the ground
It would be threaded on then and the main control valve would be threaded on to the center drain valve
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
pcmeiners
Well-known member
"2" pvc ball valves are $15-30. Not cheap, but certainly not 'pricey'."
He already tried a crappy valve made from PVC, why send him down the same rabbit hole.
Go on Ebay, either get a large full flow metal ball valve or a standard brass or SS full flow gate valve.
He already tried a crappy valve made from PVC, why send him down the same rabbit hole.
Go on Ebay, either get a large full flow metal ball valve or a standard brass or SS full flow gate valve.
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Does anyone use those on pools? Seems beyond unnecessary.
kbuhagiar
Well-known member
I don't think so. I'm a swimming pool maintenance rookie (new owner of a 22-year-old pool) but I am learning fast. I think it has something to do with the pool chemicals, they may cause the metal (brass/copper) to leach out over time and stain pool surfaces.
I haven't yet seen a single pool with anything other than PVC fittings.
But, like I said, I'm still a rookie and I could be wrong.
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Rookie owner as well (2 months on a new build) but I grew up with a pool. Not a piece of metal in the plumbing of either system.
CSRPenFab
Well-known member
The pool at my prior house had Pentair automated ball valves for filter/pump. On the drain side, they added a simple 2" Hayward ball valve since my spa was elevated from the main pool, and it gave you a way to isolate the spa water and prevent drainage when working on the plumbing. Very simple, very reliable, and I never had an issue in 5 years of ownership. Cheap at under $8 too!
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
This would allow you to easily remove it and isn't particularly expensive.
I have a vertical section of 1-1/2" pvc pipe coming up out of the ground
I was going to cut off the failed gate valve thats currently glued to the vertical section of pipe
I would like to then glue on one of these two fittings, depending on the type of valve I go with
Then, when and if, the new valve were to fail I could just thread on a new valve
I was going to cut off the failed gate valve thats currently glued to the vertical section of pipe
I would like to then glue on one of these two fittings, depending on the type of valve I go with
Then, when and if, the new valve were to fail I could just thread on a new valve
Attachments
kbuhagiar
Well-known member
Pictures of your existing setup would be great...
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
BombShelter
Well-known member
I wouldn't use a metal valve with chemicals and outdoors, one frost and they split in 1/2, the chemicals will eat them alive, that's probably what happened to you gate valve, those cheap ones never last long, I don't think I've ever seen one used like that, it looks like a fail-safe valve.
Your looking for a "True-Union" ball valve, they come with two ends, either threaded or socket. These ends are threaded on the main body so the body is like having a union. The good ones, George Fisher, Spears, Hayward are all servicable down the road or easy to replace. I wouldn't use those cheapo valves pictured above, you can't repair them and they quit working after a few years. Hayward will probably be your best value, GF and Spears go into a lot of industrial applications and can be spendy.
Your looking for a "True-Union" ball valve, they come with two ends, either threaded or socket. These ends are threaded on the main body so the body is like having a union. The good ones, George Fisher, Spears, Hayward are all servicable down the road or easy to replace. I wouldn't use those cheapo valves pictured above, you can't repair them and they quit working after a few years. Hayward will probably be your best value, GF and Spears go into a lot of industrial applications and can be spendy.
CSRPenFab
Well-known member
BombShelter
Well-known member
Here's a true union Hayward Valve from Amazon, the ends can be socket or threads, both come with the valve. The cheap Haywards are mostly for leaving on all the time except for an emergency. It looks like the gate valve was relaxing pressure while the diverter valve above was shut off. You almost have to make a loop to make the system fool-proof, if the gate valve fails, you can't stop the water flow to fix it if it's an above ground pool.
OK .... help me out here . Why are you taking all of the piping apart around the Hayward control valve.... ? Was the gate valve used to reduce the flow from the main drain. Also .... you can't really blow out the line to the lower drain in the same way as others -- tricky spot.
With pool piping you have to be strategic. I hard pipe (glue) in Jandy valves from the supply lines and then use the heavy flex PVC to the pump/s. I glue the Jandy side and you need to use a male to the pumps. I glue the male to the flex. I also use the flex from the pump.
Jandy valves last a long time -- you can rebuild them. When things finally fail in 20 years you just cut the whole thing out and start over. Unions on the supply are a pain as they can leak and draw in air .... same with the Hayward valves. There really is no reason to take them apart.
Typically if you need to replace a pump housing (rare) ... you cut the flex and glue it back with a coupling. You can also use a male and female on lines coming out of the ground (or anyplace else) -- this way if you need to fix something you just cut above and unscrew the joint. I find that in most pools you have pipe in the ground -- hard glue it in place and when you need to fix something you just place the hard coupling at or below ground level.
I do use a union at my Polaris pump ..... in my case it is hard piped and the two unions allow me to remove it. For years I just had it hard piped (I just cover them for the winter). When it died I glued in the unions and never use them .... if I do it again to this pool I will just hard pipe them again. I only use the threaded in spots where fixing would be difficult or when the equipment had to have a threaded connection.
Also -- the typical white and red valves w/ white plastic bodies have a limited life. Some are better than others ... the major makers are what you want. The more sun the equipment gets the more you have to worry about them. The handles snap and the balls get tight. The solution is Schedule 40 valves -- they cost a lot more.
The white Hayward valves yellow and get brittle --- very annoying products. Jandy are what I use .... I have never replaced one of the bodies ..... just install a new head. Normally it's just grease or new gasket
With pool piping you have to be strategic. I hard pipe (glue) in Jandy valves from the supply lines and then use the heavy flex PVC to the pump/s. I glue the Jandy side and you need to use a male to the pumps. I glue the male to the flex. I also use the flex from the pump.
Jandy valves last a long time -- you can rebuild them. When things finally fail in 20 years you just cut the whole thing out and start over. Unions on the supply are a pain as they can leak and draw in air .... same with the Hayward valves. There really is no reason to take them apart.
Typically if you need to replace a pump housing (rare) ... you cut the flex and glue it back with a coupling. You can also use a male and female on lines coming out of the ground (or anyplace else) -- this way if you need to fix something you just cut above and unscrew the joint. I find that in most pools you have pipe in the ground -- hard glue it in place and when you need to fix something you just place the hard coupling at or below ground level.
I do use a union at my Polaris pump ..... in my case it is hard piped and the two unions allow me to remove it. For years I just had it hard piped (I just cover them for the winter). When it died I glued in the unions and never use them .... if I do it again to this pool I will just hard pipe them again. I only use the threaded in spots where fixing would be difficult or when the equipment had to have a threaded connection.
Also -- the typical white and red valves w/ white plastic bodies have a limited life. Some are better than others ... the major makers are what you want. The more sun the equipment gets the more you have to worry about them. The handles snap and the balls get tight. The solution is Schedule 40 valves -- they cost a lot more.
The white Hayward valves yellow and get brittle --- very annoying products. Jandy are what I use .... I have never replaced one of the bodies ..... just install a new head. Normally it's just grease or new gasket
I drain the water below the skimmer and remove all the pool hoses and equipment every fall to store them inside the shed
I then blow out the center drain to help protect it from freezing
The gate valve is merely to shut off water to and from the center drain, for maintenance and for winterizing
I then blow out the center drain to help protect it from freezing
The gate valve is merely to shut off water to and from the center drain, for maintenance and for winterizing
I am going to look online and try to get a fitting and ball valve ordered today...........sounds like Hayward or Jandy is the route to go.
I am looking for a slip on (glued) Sch 40 fitting that will go over a 1-1/2" pvc pipe and this fitting will also have a threaded male 1-1/2" portion on the other end (for the valve to thread onto). Is there a special word for this type of fitting?
Will this slip over 1-1/2" pipe?
I am looking for a slip on (glued) Sch 40 fitting that will go over a 1-1/2" pvc pipe and this fitting will also have a threaded male 1-1/2" portion on the other end (for the valve to thread onto). Is there a special word for this type of fitting?
Will this slip over 1-1/2" pipe?
Last edited:
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
MPT x Slip sounds like what you are talking about, but if you are getting a high quality, rebuildable valve, skip the threaded connection and just glue it
mike93lx
ALLIANCE MEMBER
A lot of times debris gets stuck in the gate valve and keeps them from closing. Try this, open and close the valve numerous times, a lot. Sometimes this open and closing will crush and dislodge any junk that was stuck. It's worth the try before rebuilding.