Construction detail drawings?

[Hank11]

I need some scale drawings for my project, please.

1. Cross section of a turned down slab showing soil, excavation, crushed stone, plastic, concrete and rebar.
2. Cross section of a 2x6 double bottom plate and 2x6 studs showing attachment of hold down bolts in slab.
Or:
3. The two above together as one drawing.

Drawings should comply with IBC 2018.
Any idea where to look?

Thank you in advance.

 

[billconner]

Are you looking to retain.the services of someone to draw these, or looking for complete existing drawings you can use?

 

[K'ledgeBldr]

That should cover it!
You can make a copy and “red-line” for your double plate.

 

[Zeke]

Surprisingly, your local building dept (AJH) may have a handout or download you can use. Should be fee. Doesn't hurt to ask.

 

[Hank11]

Surprisingly, your local building dept (AJH) may have a handout or download you can use. Should be fee. Doesn't hurt to ask.

Hmmm you'd think that, but I'm pulling my own permit which seems to indicate I'm going to not build a proper building.

My local guys are just being difficult. My oral explanation was not sufficient to satisfy them so they asked for drawings. Depending on who you talk to its a different question/answer every time. So this go round I am giving them the drawing they asked for. The one the second guy told me he needed.

(And, thank you for the drawing K'ledgeBldr!).

Still looking for someone to do a compaction test on the pad. Local guy who did them seems to have died or retired. Big city people can't be bothered.

I live in a pretty rural county and am surprised in the difference compared to more developed and populated places nearby where I have gotten permits in the past with fewer hoops to jump through. I guess they have time on their hands.

​

 

[nolimits76]

I frequently deal with permitting agencies and other local government agencies. Just my 2 cents, pick your battles wisely. If you get on the wrong side of this they can make your life miserable. And try to remember, the permit is simply the START of the project. They will be doing intermittent inspections and sign offs on various scopes of the work. Last thing you need is a sour relationship with your inspector.

Knowing how to play the game is truly half the battle.

 

[brownbagg]

there a book "construction illustrated" that just full of details on every subject

 

[wssix99]

Still looking for someone to do a compaction test on the pad. Local guy who did them seems to have died or retired. Big city people can't be bothered.

What kind of building are you building? Is this a shed or something people will be living in?

Even if you are doing the construction yourself, you still need professional help. An architect can take care of simple structural drawings for you and will have local networks to help you get a compaction test and whatever else you need. If you pay an Architect to help, a lot of your problems will get solved and you'll go faster.

You'll need some connections to get things done. Even if you could knock on someone's door and get a compaction test, I'd be wary of trusting it. A local architect should have they lay of the land.

 

[Hank11]

You would be amazed at how difficult it is to get anyone to do anything here --- I am or was. Now, mostly just frustrated. Ask the same question of 5 different people and get 5 different answers. Me: "which of the 14 listed inspections do I really have to have for my shop?" Inspector: "All of them". Me: "no, its not ever to be lived in, its a workshop". Inspector: "Oh yeah, well, I don't know". Get transferred to talk with nice lady who runs the mapping section. Me: "Do I have to do all the inspections, this is only a workshop". Nice lady: "Well no, of course not, you already told me this is an accessory building". But she only has authority to talk about set backs, which she helps me with very nicely.

I am fully capable of building the building, I used to be in the business and have done some really technical engineered repairs and remodeling, but I am not an artist with paper and pencil. The county wants drawings of some basic details, perhaps suspicious of me as a do-it my-selfer. I just want to give them what they want all at once one time and be done. 4 inspections (I think) and done with them.

Its a wood/metal shop, not to be inhabited. An "accessory building" in today's parlance. But heated and cooled and finished out like a house. Used to be here you got a permit for an Ag building and they never needed anything but the small fee. Then they figured out how to make money at this. Their salaries have to be met by someone.

 

[Hank11]

there a book "construction illustrated" that just full of details on every subject

Good resource!
Found online version here:

Building Construction Illustrated : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

Building Construction Illustrated -- Fifth EditionFrancis D.K. Ching Preface1 • THE BUILDING SITE2 • THE BUILDING3 • FOUNDATION SYSTEMS4 • FLOOR...

archive.org

 

[wssix99]

Its a wood/metal shop, not to be inhabited. An "accessory building" in today's parlance. But heated and cooled and finished out like a house. Used to be here you got a permit for an Ag building and they never needed anything but the small fee. Then they figured out how to make money at this. Their salaries have to be met by someone.

I think once you start heating and colling the place and drywalling it, they are going to treat you like a regular building. If you had bare walls and no HVAC, then I expect you'd be flying by like a real Ag building.

Its one thing if a building falls down on a bunch of tractors and stored items but a different deal if the space is comfortable and people are in there all the time.

 

[Zeke]

I think once you start heating and colling the place and drywalling it, they are going to treat you like a regular building. If you had bare walls and no HVAC, then I expect you'd be flying by like a real Ag building.

Its one thing if a building falls down on a bunch of tractors and stored items but a different deal if the space is comfortable and people are in there all the time.

Buildings are classified by the type of construction and occupation load, plus certain amenities that are required for residential use. So you can have a tilt-up residence and a stick framed warehouse. You could have a church with bathrooms in another building and it will have to meet occupancy and egress requirements beyond what a warehouse would. If a room is 120 sq ft min and has a closet, it's considered a bedroom. If a building has a kitchen sink that looks like nothing but a kitchen sink, it's a kitchen. A residence must have a kitchen plus sleeping areas and a bathroom. A bathroom with a sink is not a kitchen. Residences require 10% fenestration with respect to the floor sq footage with half of that openable to the outside. All rooms but hallways, closets and bathrooms equipped with an exhaust fan must meet this requirement. All sleeping rooms must meet minimum egress requirements.

So, building types and building uses are not parallel.

 

[wssix99]

So, building types and building uses are not parallel.

Yea, but I've never met a building inspector or building department who cared about those technicalaties. (Even though the law says they should.)

 

[billconner]

Its a wood/metal shop, not to be inhabited.

If you're going to work in it, as I would expect in a shop, it's considered habitable by most building codes. Only pure storage and buildings for livestock, where there is only someone in them for short times are not habitable.

 

[billconner]

Yea, but I've never met a building inspector or building department who cared about those technicalaties. (Even though the law says they should.)

Really? I'm active in codes, a half dozen committees and participate in annual code change hearings, and all the officials I meet clearly understand use and type of construction are different things.

 

[Zeke]

Yea, but I've never met a building inspector or building department who cared about those technicalaties. (Even though the law says they should.)

Well, I certainly have. One notable job was converting a warehouse space into a sound stage. That would have been easy except the broadcasts were going to be religious in front of a live audience. Therefore we had to add extra double doors for egress equipped with panic hardware opening outward. The trickiest part was that the doors needed to be secure from the outside while being fully functional from the inside. They were fitted with a special entry function available to the fire dept. Otherwise they acted locked if you were outside.
In order to facilitate them always closing in the locked condition from the outside they needed sequential closers so the overlaying door always latched second after the first. Otherwise if the overlaying door closed first, the other door stayed ajar.

It took me hours to get those right.

In another incident a guy built a recreation room with a bedroom, closet, bath and kitchen. They let him keep the bed, closet and bath but he had to remove the kitchen. It's livable, but not legally. He was calling the kitchen a wet bar but the AJH was having none of that.

Where I live there are 100's of illegally converted garages. Now they want to make that legal as long as the windows are to code and the bath is separate from the rest of the space. Has to have a door. They call these "ADU's" or accessory dwelling units. They used to be called mother-in-law apts.

 

[Hank11]

Mine is officially (here) an "accessory building".

Partly I think this is a reaction to me telling them too much. In some minds, anyone who is building a shop thats finished out like a home inside must be up to something, 'cause much of the county is redneck half assed construction. There is also the possibility that some folks are trying to sneak in a rental unit. I've been asked that at least once or twice.

To me, its just a box, white inside, with electricity, climate controlled for wood and metal work. To them its the Taj Mahal.

 

[billconner]

Accessory building does not speak to it's construction nor directly to it's use. Any construction - stick, post frame, masonry, metal, etc - is still possible as well as any number of uses including dwelling and storage.

from the IRC
ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. A structure that is accessory to and incidental to that of the dwelling(s) and that is located on the same lot.

My experience is if it's heated and/or cooled, it's deemed habitable, and a bunch of things are required. Add water and sewer, boom, more. Other key is size to determine if it has have a frost protected foundation - exempt if 600 sf or less in light frame, 400 sf other construction in basic IRC - and if a permit is required - 200 sf in basic IRC - but those often are amended by the jurisdiction.

 

[Smoker]

Accessory building does not speak to it's construction nor directly to it's use. Any construction - stick, post frame, masonry, metal, etc - is still possible as well as any number of uses including dwelling and storage.

from the IRC
ACCESSORY STRUCTURE. A structure that is accessory to and incidental to that of the dwelling(s) and that is located on the same lot.

My experience is if it's heated and/or cooled, it's deemed habitable, and a bunch of things are required. Add water and sewer, boom, more. Other key is size to determine if it has have a frost protected foundation - exempt if 600 sf or less in light frame, 400 sf other construction in basic IRC - and if a permit is required - 200 sf in basic IRC - but those often are amended by the jurisdiction.

Not true. My shop at the last house was stick built, insulated, heated an cooled and had gas, water and sewer. Did not require a certificate of occupancy regardless of how much time I would be spending in it. All the cared about was that it met height and setback ordinances, matched the house in style and had the usual inspections for an accessory building.

 

[billconner]

Not true. My shop at the last house was stick built, insulated, heated an cooled and had gas, water and sewer. Did not require a certificate of occupancy regardless of how much time I would be spending in it. All the cared about was that it met height and setback ordinances, matched the house in style and had the usual inspections for an accessory building.

What's not true - that an accessory building can be of many different construction types or my experiences?

 

[nolimits76]

I’m not a code guru but I think the appropriate question to ask your building authority is what specific codes they enforce and if you can get a copy. This will define the rules you should be playing by. Also I’d ask how they classify the building. Be honest but don’t provide unnecessary info.

You mentioned doing a lot of this work yourself. Years ago I finished out about 700sf attic space as a game room, bath, etc. The local code authority had special requirements concerning HVAC and electrical work. Essentially I could only DIY if I were occupy a minimum of 2 years prior to selling. Otherwise I had to hire licensed contractors whom would pull their own separate permits for these systems. In my case, I was using buddies to help with both. The electrician buddy just pulled permits through his business as it wasn’t expensive or hard and made life easier. The HVAC buddy didn’t own his own business but was just a seasoned installer between jobs. Once I informed the code authority on my intentions we adjusted a few things and it was no big deal.

Not sure your future plans or if your local code authority has similar restrictions but it might be something to consider.

 

[Smoker]

What's not true - that an accessory building can be of many different construction types or my experiences?

"My experience is if it's heated and/or cooled, it's deemed habitable"

This is a false statement. Heating/cooling of a building has nothing to do with whether its deemed a dwelling according to the local authority. My shop was heated/cooled and had all the utilities yet the city never once questioned its usage.

 

[billconner]

"My experience is if it's heated and/or cooled, it's deemed habitable"

This is a false statement. Heating/cooling of a building has nothing to do with whether its deemed a dwelling according to the local authority. My shop was heated/cooled and had all the utilities yet the city never once questioned its usage.

Maybe not where you have lived, but I assure you that is the case where I have lived. And I did not say dwelling, I said habitable. You don't have to sleep in a building for it to be habitable; you do have to sleep in a building for so it to be a dwelling.

 

[wssix99]

Well, I certainly have.

The inspectors in my area were good at stopping illegal or dangerous things before COVID. The probelm is that they also ask for tests, inspections, drawings and for other things that outstrip their authority and/or knowledge. Sometimes they do this for internal reasons and other times they do it digging for a bribe.

(After COVID, many inspectors used the crisis as an excuse to stop doing their job. But that's not what my comments are about. The garbage they are letting people build here over the past 2.5 years is unspeakable.)