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Do you do head jobs?

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TheEquineFencer

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I'm in Eastern ,NC BTW.

2003 TRX250TM

I screwed up and tightened the rocker lever cover down wrong and it snapped both valve guides. Yeah, I know.... Now I need either another usable head or someone to put new guides and valves in the one I have. Looking online OEM only list Oversize Guides. I do not have a reamer for them I'm sure. A 2002 model list a different head between TE and TM are the same,EX totally different, but a 2003 list the same cylinder head part number for all three. But none are the same as the 2002 EX.
I'm open to suggestions? I've tried finding a shop around here local that'll fix the head.
 
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RoninB4

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Not familiar with the model but have been a toolmaker for several decades. Perhaps you could carefully press out the old ones, measure them, and turn the oversized down to match. Seems cheaper than automotive shop or purchasing a reamer.
 
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BearsFan315

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had a local head shop do me head work, was a lot cheaper than thought since they were pros at what they were doing, was for my straight 6 head. they put in all new guides and even made 2 new valves to match existing. machined it flat, and a few other small things pressure test magnaflux etc... was all around $250 and they did it in a few days and looked great when done.
 
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BillK

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There are several aftermarket companies that make parts for those ATV engines. Kibblewhite might have the valve guides. I dont do many of them but I do have one customer that works on them and he brings me a head every few months. Most of the newer ones have very small valve stems and most machine shops are not going to have the tooling and sometimes its just not worth buying it for just one or two jobs. You also have to be set up to remachine the seats which are also very small.

Is there a local shop that works on ATVs and dirt bikes ? Ask them if they have someone local to fix the head.

Depending on the price it might just be easier to buy a new head. Or send it off to a specialty shop that does them. If it broke the guides there is a pretty good chance it bent the valves too :(
 
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cannuck

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Wasn't too sure this was an engine thread or a ***** thread.

As mentioned, if the guides broke the valves are probably bent as well. I would NEVER let a cylinder head out of my sight or hands to change valve guides. Very few people will remove them correctly thus the need for oversize OD. You can usually stay standard by coring the guide (you have to grind a step drill from a bit around 0.1" less than guide OD. Leave a shoulder at the bottom (if no top larger OD collar) and use a press to push on the shoulder. This will "shrink" the OD under load and prevent damage to the bore. Lube the new one and press in also from top side to correct depth. Have done hundreds if not thousands of VW heads that way. I don't think I have used a dozen oversize guides in a half century.

Again, as mentioned, you really have to re-cut the valve seats. Look for someone with NuWay carbides and the correct pilot mandrels for your sizes. Or if you are really serious about doing this again in future, shell out for a set (not cheap, though). If not, this is seldom what an automotive shop will have, look for a motorcycle/RV with some history and reputation.
 
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bwringer

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Do some asking around at motorcycle/powersports shoppes, preferably ones involved in racing, for a machine shop experienced with small metric engine work.

It'll take some old-fashioned detective work and it can get frustrating; the people who are the best at this can't be found on Google, and a lot of their customers won't want to share their connections. It's all very cliquey and word-of-mouth. You gotta know a guy who knows a guy who thinks you might be worthy. And the best shops will be very busy, so it might take a while to get to you.
 
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TheEquineFencer

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bwringer said:
Do some asking around at motorcycle/powersports shoppes, preferably ones involved in racing, for a machine shop experienced with small metric engine work.

It'll take some old-fashioned detective work and it can get frustrating; the people who are the best at this can't be found on Google, and a lot of their customers won't want to share their connections. It's all very cliquey and word-of-mouth. You gotta know a guy who knows a guy who thinks you might be worthy. And the best shops will be very busy, so it might take a while to get to you.
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LOL, I've called or been to most of the ATV/Bike and machine shops around the area, so far no luck. I've sent several e-mails and inquiries out, now I'm waiting for responses. Some of the prices I've found online are plain stupid. Like $500-$700 for another rebuilt head. A new ATV like this is under $5000.00USD.

I've got a message into Honda itself to find out about tooling and such to do it myself or what exact size reamers are needed to see if a shop I talked to today has the proper tooling already. They are over an hour away or better.
 
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BillK

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The valve stems are 5.5 mm. Not very many shops are going to have tooling that small. A decent carbide reamer will be $130 and then they need the pilot to set up and cut the seats. Thats another $100 or so. Don't waste your time with Honda on stuff like the guides. They are oddball sizes and you will definitely have to buy a special reamer. Also ask the shop if they can cut valve seats that small. If they have to ream the head for an oversize guide thats another $100 reamer.

I just looked through the Kibblewhite catalog to see if they have the guides and valves.

Valves are $55 each. Guides are $34 and looks like only oversize. So thats almost $200 just for parts :( If I was doing it I would probably charge you $200 labor.

$500 is not unreasonable for a rebuilt head. How much are the valves from Honda ?
 
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TheEquineFencer

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I'm away from the shop computer, I think you're a little high on the OEM parts, but knowing the reamer needed for the valve helps, the old valves miked around 5.41mm. I wonder what reamer it'd take for the guides OD?
 
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BillK

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TheEquineFencer said:
I'm away from the shop computer, I think you're a little high on the OEM parts, but knowing the reamer needed for the valve helps, the old valves miked around 5.41mm. I wonder what reamer it'd take for the guides OD?
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Pretty sure the Kibblewhite site gave the od for their guides. Take a look. I think it might have been .480 so you will probably need a .478 reamer ? I always wait until I have the guide in my hand t measure before ordering a reamer if I dont already have the right one.
 
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TheEquineFencer

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I'll take a look in the morning. One guy I got a message from outside of GJ tonight said he did have a 5.5 and a 5.4 reamer... He's about two hours from me. I told him I'd check on the parts in the morning also.
 
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TheEquineFencer

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I just made it up to the shop a little while ago. OEM parts are $11.20 each for guides, $15.20 for two seals, $25.85 for the intake valve and $43.29 for the exhaust valve, no shipping if I pick the parts up about 20 minutes from me. $115.04 with tax.
 
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TheEquineFencer

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I wish... I'm waiting on my local Honda dealer to get back with me on the parts... I think their internet sales guy is MIA. He's usually pretty responsive. I've found a guy that'll do the work... It's a bit of time for travel or shipping to get everything in one place...
 
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CJM8515

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actually i stand corrected, i just looked and 1 for like 400 bucks on ebay. guess the 250 recon is a unloved quad
 
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TheEquineFencer

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Ye p, 2002 was the start of a new style engine. 2002 TRX25TM and TE list the same head, EX is different, I think 2003 they list the same head....trying to verify this on this tablet is a PITA, but basically 2003-2014 is a sure swap, I've yet to find out the difference in a 2002 engine.
 
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