Fast Setting Wood Glue for Models, Recommendations Please

[gahrajmahal]

I did a search first and didn’t find a thread on this subject. My grandson is participating in a science fair and his subject matter is the Wright Brothers. We asked if he had a model of the Wright Flyer and whether he wanted one for his display. He replied that he did. Sadly as kids go, it is last minute. I found a laser cut model with an estimated one hour assembly time. Many of the models of this plane are pro level and this one is insert tab one into slot one. Etc. similar to the Lego models he enjoys doing. In the past working on “models” like his Boy Scouts pinewood derby cars, he has limited patience waiting on glue to set, so I would like to use something that has instant set or nearly so for wood. My experience with generic “super glues” when attempting to use it with wood is the only thing that “instantly glues together” is your fingertips! Mrs. Gahrajmahal is an excellent crafter and has lots of “craft glues” one that comes to mind is “Tacky Glue” which does stick fast if you have the patience to wait then for it to dry, which does take about an hour. Our granddaughters using tacky glue have had some success using it, but are generally more patient than the boys.

What I’m looking for is an instant set or nearly so adhesive. I have the week to find something. If you all come up with a winner, maybe I’ll finally assemble the Italian Vaporetto boat model I’ve had for ten years!

I’ll post photos of the finished Wright Flyer model and evaluate the adhesive (s) used.

Thanks!

 

[gizardlizard]

Tite bond CA glue with accelerator. I use the thick. Spray accelerator on one side and put glue on the other. 4 seconds of alignment time and it’s all over in 30 seconds and VERY strong.

 

[gahrajmahal]

Gizzard, does the accelerator affect the appearance of the wood? In the past the grandkids “skill” involving spray painting is very poor with little understanding about pressure on the nozzle, length of time and where it’s going to spray. I wouldn’t be surprised if he used the complete can to accomplish gluing it together.

My hesitation besides, I could probably come up with this combination easily before Friday. Thanks!

 

[readhead]

I build a lot of wood building kits and I use Titebond yellow glue. I also use tacky glue for some situations. Clamping or weighting helps quite a bit. light handeling can be expected in about ten to fifteen minutes. Don’t overlook the opportunity to teach some patience.

 

[Old tool guy]

I wouldn’t be surprised if he used the complete can to accomplish gluing it together.

Probably. But as long as he is happy with the result …
How old is he?

 

[HoosierBuddy]

I came here to recommend CA glue with accelerator as well.

The accelerator can make the glue surface bubble. CA sets up when it comes in contact with moisture on the surface or air in normal circumstances and sets over several seconds, giving off heat as it does so. When you hit it with accelerator the reaction takes place almost instantly, and the exothermic heat can boil the glue causing a bubbly surface, especially if it was put on kind of thick.

If your grandson uses that bubbly surface to explain how CA glue works and what an exothermic reaction is, he'll win that science fair regardless of how his model looks.

My kid won a trophy and a check with a model of a sterling engine made out of an energy drink can, some bent wire, an old compact disk, and a rubber balloon. It looked like **** and they wouldn't even let him take in the fuel canister it ran off of due to safety concerns. But he had built it, he knew how it worked (explaining the heat cycle) and he spoke well enough that the judges gave him the prize.

That was 20 years ago.

Kid went to Purdue, has a BS and MS in Mechanical Engineering and now is an automation engineer for Amazon.

Good luck to you and your grandson. I expect he'll be working for Lockheed before you know it.

 

[gahrajmahal]

Thirteen, but easily frustrated when things don’t go as initially imagined. His little brother, ten, has much better patience which is infuriating to him! He did work with me to build a high end violin kit from Grizzley. He rides a city bus to high school and his parents and me were cringing when he was cramming himself on the bus with 50 other people, standing room only and heavy bookbags and his thousands $$$ violin rental. So, during the summer break we built, glued, sanded, stained and varnished the violin kit together. It took a month and turned out very nice but I secretly did the bridge and fingerboard myself using micrometers etc. to get an exact tapered form so the strings were exactly the correct distance from the fingerboard. The fingerboard had to be filed flat over the curved length. I used my body shop file. Afterwards we found it wouldn’t hold a tune very long. Young violin players don’t get taught how to tune their violins. The instructors tune everyone prior to their concerts. We took the kit violin to the violin shop to get good strings put on it and buy a case. Their “mechanic” was impressed with the quality of the kit and the job we did. When she played a few melodies on it it sounded like a real violin, but alas with a young player it is still squalky. So, now the good rental lives at school in a secure locker and the kit violin is at home, slightly out of tune so if needed can be used to practice ********* and out of tune playing.

Thanks for your input about the glue!

 

[gahrajmahal]

Hoosierbuddy, congratulations on your successful kid launch into the world. My grandsons dad is an engineer with GE making jet engines so the seed is available for planting. I just try to show them that making stuff can be fun. Once I get them going on a project they enjoy it. Thanks for the glue recommendation and explanation. I love a teaching moment!

 

[Stuart in MN]

Thirteen, but easily frustrated when things don’t go as initially imagined. His little brother, ten, has much better patience which is infuriating to him! He did work with me to build a high end violin kit from Grizzley. He rides a city bus to high school and his parents and me were cringing when he was cramming himself on the bus with 50 other people, standing room only and heavy bookbags and his thousands $$$ violin rental. So, during the summer break we built, glued, sanded, stained and varnished the violin kit together. It took a month and turned out very nice but I secretly did the bridge and fingerboard myself using micrometers etc. to get an exact tapered form so the strings were exactly the correct distance from the fingerboard. The fingerboard had to be filed flat over the curved length. I used my body shop file. Afterwards we found it wouldn’t hold a tune very long. Young violin players don’t get taught how to tune their violins. The instructors tune everyone prior to their concerts. We took the kit violin to the violin shop to get good strings put on it and buy a case. Their “mechanic” was impressed with the quality of the kit and the job we did. When she played a few melodies on it it sounded like a real violin, but alas with a young player it is still squalky. So, now the good rental lives at school in a secure locker and the kit violin is at home, slightly out of tune so if needed can be used to practice ********* and out of tune playing.

Thanks for your input about the glue!

Those little pocket size electronic tuners are pretty inexpensive these days, and can be particularly useful for young musicians who haven't fully developed their musical ears yet. If he doesn't have one already it would be a good gift idea when his birthday comes around.

 

[Shiftless]

How about using a hot glue gun?

 

[gahrajmahal]

How about using a hot glue gun?

Which gun and which glue? Is this something you use? I thought about it but haven't a clue what I would buy. Hot glue is fast though. The keyed slots that will be glued are small. Glue before assembly of after? Needle nose applicators?

 

[zaius]

Likewise, CA glue with accelerator is what instantly came to mind.

InstantBond

InstantBond is the fastest adhesive system in the world, bonding in seconds for professional and DIY repairs. Shop InstantBond kits, SuperBond, activators and accessories—perfect for wood, metal, plastic, tile, automotive and home repairs. Fast, strong, permanent.

instantbond.com

I use this all the time for wood trim.

 

[Shiftless]

Which gun and which glue? Is this something you use? I thought about it but haven't a clue what I would buy. Hot glue is fast though. The keyed slots that will be glued are small. Glue before assembly of after? Needle nose applicators?

Hot glue hardens up in just a few seconds. I would apply just a small dab after the tab was in the slot. The 2 guns on my shelf have pointed tips. There is no needle nose applicator that I know of for hot glue.

 

[gizardlizard]

Gizzard, does the accelerator affect the appearance of the wood? In the past the grandkids “skill” involving spray painting is very poor with little understanding about pressure on the nozzle, length of time and where it’s going to spray. I wouldn’t be surprised if he used the complete can to accomplish gluing it together.

My hesitation besides, I could probably come up with this combination easily before Friday. Thanks!

Not at all. It’s a clear solvent that evaporates quickly. You spray the lightest mist you can and assemble fast. That stuff is crazy strong and crazy fast. If you want both it’s the only way to go. Hot glue is a joke compared to this stuff.

 

[Shiftless]

Likewise, CA glue with accelerator is what instantly came to mind.

InstantBond

InstantBond is the fastest adhesive system in the world, bonding in seconds for professional and DIY repairs. Shop InstantBond kits, SuperBond, activators and accessories—perfect for wood, metal, plastic, tile, automotive and home repairs. Fast, strong, permanent.

instantbond.com

I use this all the time for wood trim.

The instant bond is a good idea. You might be able to apply the glue to the slot, insert *** he tab and then dust on the accelerator to build up a bonding system.

Agreed that hot glue is a cave man approach. It would work, but globs of glue at the joints would greatly detract from the final appearance. But it would still look like the Wright Bros. flyer.

 

[gahrajmahal]

Those little pocket size electronic tuners are pretty inexpensive these days, and can be particularly useful for young musicians who haven't fully developed their musical ears yet. If he doesn't have one already it would be a good gift idea when his birthday comes around.

I bought a highly rated one when the violin was finished and taken to his house. His mom is a singer/guitar player and could help to tune it I thought.

A violin uses friction wooden pegs and are approximately 1 to 1 on gear ratio unlike guitar tuners that can be geared down requiring more than one turn of the knob to get one turn of the post. The first time we tried tuning it using the electronic tuner (not intuitive) he quickly broke two A strings. The little ones. That is why we made the trip to the pro violin shop.

 

[MoonRise]

Hot glue hardens up in just a few seconds. I would apply just a small dab after the tab was in the slot. The 2 guns on my shelf have pointed tips. There is no needle nose applicator that I know of for hot glue.

There ARE needle type tips for some hot glue guns. I have some. Not sewing needle tiny, but smaller diameter nozzle orifice than a 'regular' glue gun tip.

But hot glue can be messy, during application and the final results. And it is HOT. Insta-burn hot. Not what I would necessarily recommend for use by a kid. Or on a wooden fussy model.

Instant? CA adhesive with the spray accelerator.

You can apply the accelerator spray to one side/piece and the CA to the other side/piece and when they touch it's insta-bond. Or you can apply the CA. assemble the item and then give a quick spray of the accelerator. Again, insta-bond. For when 5-30 seconds for regular CA adhesive to grab is too long.

For wood, use a gel or thicker CA adhesive recommended for use on wood.

Wear nitrile gloves to reduce the chances of gluing fingers together. As you probably know, CA adhesive usually bonds skin INSTANTLY.

But I might go for some actual wood glue (Titebond) instead. Safer (not hot, doesn't insta-bond skin, soap and water clean up before it dries).

And for tab-and-slot wood pieces, have him put a little glue in/on a small cup/cap and then use a wooden toothpick to dip into the wood glue and apply the small amount to the tab and the slot and slip them together. Some blue painter's tape can be used as needed to hold pieces together and apply a small amount of clamping force to keep the pieces together while the glue sets up in about an hour (for thin glue lines and glue amounts, if thick globs of glue they shrink and take much longer to dry/cure). Let the glue dry/cure overnight for full strength though.

If all (or by making subassemblies as needed) of the tabs can be inserted into the mating slots and still have access, maybe some fast set epoxy could be used on the exposed tab ends. 1 minute epoxy is probably too fast (IME, it gives you maybe 30 seconds of working/application time), 5 minute might still be too fast for mixing time and working/application time, 30 minute epoxy gives you enough time to mix it and apply it without generally overly rushing the mixing or application time. Drawbacks would be possible epoxy fume sensitivity and it would be visible after application since it was applied to the exposed and visible surfaces.

I'd probably go for Titebond wood glue with the toothpick application method. Enough working time to assemble things, safe, and it's made for use on wood.

 

[BurtEggley]

ca and accelerator. Get a thing of the solvent too. But if you are afraid of the kid gluing himself to himself or something else, then a regular longer drying glue is needed. Yes, the accelerator will cause the glue that is exposed to darken over time. It also causes any excess glue to sort of turn into a frosty looking ice like mess so it the CA has to be applied sparingly.

 

[CraigStu]

I found one of the common brands of instant glue in gel form labeled as being good for wood at Walmart a year ago. Unfortunately I used it all up and don't remember which brand.

 

[dscheidt]

for detail work, I have applied the accelerator with a syringe. (you can get an assortment of syringes and blunt luer lock needles from the usual online places). Something like a tooth pick to place a drop would work, too.

Starbond sell an accelerator that comes in pump bottle, and which is not as fast acting as others, so it's less likely to produce the frosty mess.

 

[Skooterj]

Another option might be to put the model together, then spray glue the whole thing.

Aleene’s DIY Craft Heavy-Duty Adhesive Spray 11 oz.

Aleene’s DIY Craft Heavy-Duty Adhesive Spray is perfect for large projects that need a super strong hold. Its all-purpose formula creates a strong, permanent bond that dries quickly and clearly. Works on a variety of surfaces such as metal, glass, wood, and more.

aleenes.com

 

[tarbellb]

GEL style super glue (ca) is great for kids

Accelerators go a long way to speed up things


And if you really want to go trick-
try the UV light accelerator system, Adam Savage from Myth Busters absolutely loves it

 

[jsigrist]

JB weld makes a UV hardening glue. I buy it at Lowes normally. I use it quite a bit. Of course the downside is you need to get the light to the joint. I sometimes will use another glue in the joint and then the UV glue for positioning. If you go this route, open the package in the parking lot to be sure it is good. I seem to have about 20% where the glue is hard in the tube. I never had issues returning it, it but can be inconvenient.

 

[gahrajmahal]

So, I went shopping. Home Depot and Lowe’s showed on their website that they carried the Instabond brand accelerator and CA glue. They did not. While I was out I decided to stop at Hobby Lobby to purchase a cheap laser cut wood kit. I bought Leonardo Davinci’s helicopter kit. I had to go to the Woodworkers store to find the CA glue and accelerator on the shelf. Spendy at $45 for both.



Opening the kit I decided the bright wood color and razor sharp edges needed to be changed so I tore off some emery cloth and started sanding. After a while my fingers were cramping up from holding the tiny pieces so I decided I should glue a piece onto a paint stir stick and make a sanding stick. What a good way to test the glue setup time!



Following the directions I sprayed the end of the paint stick with the accelerator. A then made a few zig zags on the back of the sandpaper and pressed it into place wiggling it a bit to see how quick it set up.

It immediately glued the tip of my gloved finger to the sandpaper and when I tried to lift it off, tore the glove. Then when trying to grab the sanding stick off my paper covered work surface the bottom of the paint stick was securely glued to the paper. Neither of those surfaces had accelerator on it, the over application of glue dripped under there and made them one. With my knife I cut it free. I’m only sad my grandson wasn’t there to see my major fail as we both would have been laughing a lot.





The model uses lots of dowels cut to length and of different diameters. They fit into their drilled positions both loosely and press fit tight. I attempted gluing before hand and pushing the dowels into the holes and also pushing them into the hole, then applying a little glue and the meerest of spritzes of the accelerator. You could see the glue bubbling and then turn opaque drying very fast. This dried glue looks poor and makes it look sloppy so scraping or sanding cleans it up but not without difficulty around the dowel bases.




Several of the dowels with slop I attempted gluing and the placing in the hole moving it around to see how long it might take to dry without accelerator. I could move it out and back again quite a while before the glue starts to set, so the accelerator is really the way to harden the glue quickly and lock it into place.

As far as the bright white finish I ride some coffee to stain it as I didn’t have any water based stain.


I like a nice torch coloring for wood, so I got out my plumbers torch to add some vintage color to the assembly. This is what I will do, quick and easy.




All of this was to test what to do and what not to do on Sunday when my grandson plans to come over and assemble the wright brothers plane model. We will practice on the Davinci model first and see what method he prefers. Both models come with glue, so maybe we will try those out too. Looks like white Elmers glue.

Thanks again for all your helpful suggestions!

 

[gizardlizard]

There’s definitely a learning curve with this glue. I can from the pics you are using far too much glue. A little goes a long way. Were you at least happy with its strength?

 

[gahrajmahal]

There’s definitely a learning curve with this glue. I can from the pics you are using far too much glue. A little goes a long way. Were you at least happy with its strength?

Yes, the strength seems very good. Especially when it’s sticking my finger to the part!

 

[MoonRise]

Told you to use gloves.

Good that you did some testing first.

Good luck and both of you have fun.

 

[gahrajmahal]

Wanted to put in the photos of the finished plane. It snapped together easily like Legos, so my grandson chose to built it complete before gluing. I had him try gluing wood pieces together with the other model and he decided a puddle of glue placed on some of the plastic packaging that he could dip into with a tooth pick would give him the cleanest joints. After a bit he thought a small paintbrush would work even better. I attempted to convince him that superglue was not like regular glue and the hairs of the brush would be quickly glued together making it an expensive toothpick. I capitulated to his superior knowledge about such things and stole one of the Mrs. small cheap paintbrushes. It almost immediately solidified into a hard blob and he sheepishly continued with it for a few more joints dabbing on the superglue. The puddle did stay liquid for quite some time, maybe 5 minutes or so before I added another squirt to it. He did quickly jettison the gloves though even though I warned him how fast skin glues together. Thankfully he kept his distance from it.

Next, we purchased a new Black Tri-Fold poster board which he decided needed a metallic border. I had some super sticky reinforced duct tape with a paper backing. We developed a team effort to cut and stick down a measured border to his poster. A series of plastic straws taped to the rear became a channel where a heavy wire bracket made from political sign frames swung out to hang the Wright Flyer in front of the poster. A series of historical photos were arranged around his five pages of text finished earlier.

Sadly for you (and me) I didn't get a photo of the finished poster with the plane dangling in front of it. We took five hours to do it here, out of a three-hour allowance, so we were running late! It was an "in class" presentation, so there was no public viewing of the class finished posters. He did get a good grade, and thanks to the GJ guidance pronounced "I love making wood models!"

So, thanks for that!

 

[MoonRise]

Good for him, and good for you for the 'assist'.