The VISES of Garage Journal

drivesitfar · Jul 16, 2015

Bagged: it's a pre 1940's made vise and US made, but picture gets too fuzzy to make out the #'s on the side. most likely a 3 or 4 inch vise. also that American Scale vise looks clean.

TOP: nice guess on the quick release on my Massey, but still haven't found it or had much time to look for it.

bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

drivesitfar said:
Bagged: it's a pre 1940's made vise and US made, but picture gets too fuzzy to make out the #'s on the side. most likely a 3 or 4 inch vise. also that American Scale vise looks clean.

TOP: nice guess on the quick release on my Massey, but still haven't found it or had much time to look for it.

Yeah that's what I'm thinking. I just don't have time to go look at it. I'm going on vacation tomorrow.

Craptain · Jul 16, 2015

bagged89s10 said:
Yeah that's what I'm thinking. I just don't have time to go look at it. I'm going on vacation tomorrow.

That's just masochism. Torment yourself like that when you knowyyou can't act on it.
Actually the whole table full looks interesting.

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bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

Craptain said:
That's just masochism. Torment yourself like that when you knowyyou can't act on it.
Actually the whole table full looks interesting.

Sent from my LG-D801 using Tapatalk

Yea maybe joestriper will buy it all. I really wanted the lathe for parts

sstruckguy · Jul 16, 2015

Anyone seen these handy little rigs?

drivesitfar · Jul 16, 2015

SS: we've seen several posts about them and that is Wilton's imported vise line so several other options have been discussed that were maybe better. check out this vise stand thread and you can make any vise fit in your trailer hitch with a few of the member's ideas.

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=252799

i know this thread goes pretty fast some days and weeks, but maybe last week we talked about your Wilton trailer hitch vise so back 10 or 20 pages or so in your search. not sure.

Bagged: so you heard Joe's vise funds were low so you could finally take a vacation. :lol_hitti

have fun.

Craptain: i don't know about you, but i enjoy looking on Craigslist and shopping while i'm on vacation. it sure beats heading to the shops with my bride and she gets her space.

bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

bagged89s10 said:
American scale 4" vise for sale. I might go grab it.

Edit. I made a deal and I'm going to get it.

Ok so it's an American Scale American Red Seal Guaranteed No. 54 4.5". Some
Weld splatter but overall good shape. Paid $50.

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It looks almost identical to my rock island 571 4.5".

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Craptain · Jul 16, 2015

drivesitfar said:
Craptain: i don't know about you, but i enjoy looking on Craigslist and shopping while i'm on vacation. it sure beats heading to the shops with my bride and she gets her space.

I don't get much vacation but I travel a lot and ALWAYS check CL. Right now I have found stuff I would like but can't take home.

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bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

Craptain said:
I don't get much vacation but I travel a lot and ALWAYS check CL. Right now I have found stuff I would like but can't take home.

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I'm hoping to score some CL or tag sale deals this week while I'm in upstate NY.

bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

Wilton bullet vise question. How many of you have gotten rid of a Wilton bullet vise because you found a similar size vise that you found to be better? Just curious because I know a lot of people put Wilton on a pedestal as far as vises go.

nine4gmc · Jul 16, 2015

I jumped on the bullet bandwagon after joining and searched for about two years before finding one in the wild around here. It's not all that much better than any other vise I've found so I sold it soon after. No regrets!

Rickenbackerman · Jul 16, 2015

A Parker 805 replaced my Wilton 500N. Nothing wrong with a Wilton, I just prefer everything about the Parker - the tapered jaws, the spring loaded handle, the look, everything.

zkling · Jul 16, 2015

I like them for what they are, a machinist vise.

bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

Rickenbackerman said:
A Parker 805 replaced my Wilton 500N. Nothing wrong with a Wilton, I just prefer everything about the Parker - the tapered jaws, the spring loaded handle, the look, everything.

I'm a Parker fan myself for the same reasons. My Parker No. 2 came with a spring around the lead screw to help when you open up the jaws too. Also keeps tension for when you close the jaws which I like.

zkling · Jul 16, 2015

The thing I don't like about older parkers, rock islands, etc is you can't easily fit custom jaws.

Fretters · Jul 16, 2015

Only thing I have to gauge from are the York's. If the Wilton's are roughly similar on dimensions and such, then I'd personally class them as no more than medium duty vices. No comparison to an engineers vice, for example. I'd gladly lean heavily on the latter without worry, but not the former.

That general design of vice is nice, quite tight on tolerance, compact and good for their intended line of use and when used within their limits. I'd still plump for a good QR engineers vice any day of the week though.

Fretters · Jul 16, 2015

bagged89s10 said:
I'm a Parker fan myself for the same reasons. My Parker No. 2 came with a spring around the lead screw to help when you open up the jaws too. Also keeps tension for when you close the jaws which I like.

zkling said:
The thing I don't like about older parkers, rock islands, etc is you can't easily fit custom jaws.

Sounds like our designers figured out all of the little niceties and refinements which people would appreciate quite early on in the production cycle.

zkling · Jul 16, 2015

Fretters said:
Sounds like our designers figured out all of the little niceties and refinements which people would appreciate quite early on in the production cycle.

One thing I've seen on quite a few across the pond vises and also the larger wilton series. Is jaws that mount with bolts from the outside of the jaw tower. That way the jaws are still easily removable yet the face of the jaw is uninterrupted of screw heads to get damaged. Don't have to worry about stripping out holes in the casting either.

JZiggy · Jul 16, 2015

bagged89s10 said:
Wilton bullet vise question. How many of you have gotten rid of a Wilton bullet vise because you found a similar size vise that you found to be better? Just curious because I know a lot of people put Wilton on a pedestal as far as vises go.

Haven't gotten rid of my Wilton C1 yet, but my Yost 32C will probably be its replacement. The square slide is stiffer and stronger than the round.

The full encapsulation of the screw & nut is nice but it just ain't that hard to swab some fresh grease on every once in a while.

Craptain · Jul 16, 2015

bagged89s10 said:
Wilton bullet vise question. How many of you have gotten rid of a Wilton bullet vise because you found a similar size vise that you found to be better? Just curious because I know a lot of people put Wilton on a pedestal as far as vises go.

My Wiltons were not so much a choice as opportunity. Had no need to change as I have other vises for other purposes.

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topop101 · Jul 16, 2015

bagged89s10 said:
American scale 4" vise for sale. I might go grab it.

Edit. I made a deal and I'm going to get it.

VEEPS is that a 53?

bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

topop101 said:
VEEPS is that a 53?

Turned out to be a 4.5" no 54. I guess the seller doesn't know how to read a ruler.

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I just measured it and it weighs 61 lbs 11 oz.

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topop101 · Jul 16, 2015

bagged89s10 said:
Wilton bullet vise question. How many of you have gotten rid of a Wilton bullet vise because you found a similar size vise that you found to be better? Just curious because I know a lot of people put Wilton on a pedestal as far as vises go.

Parkers , Athols Reeds, American scale, Starrett ,Hollands older Columbians and a Craftsman IMHO , certain models are better than any wilton. I'm really just a rectangle slide guy.

Fretters · Jul 16, 2015

zkling said:
One thing I've seen on quite a few across the pond vises and also the larger wilton series. Is jaws that mount with bolts from the outside of the jaw tower. That way the jaws are still easily removable yet the face of the jaw is uninterrupted of screw heads to get damaged. Don't have to worry about stripping out holes in the casting either.

I prefer those types of insert too, over the screwed from the inside type. The only time that design can be a pain is on the cast steel vices. Normally, the bolts will part company quite easily from the cast or malleable iron vices, even when there's plenty of corrosion present. The cast steel ones though, those bolts can seem like they're welded on occasionally, when they get some corrosion on them.

Saying that though, it's still preferable to fighting with a slotted head screw which is rusted into an insert.

bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

zkling said:
One thing I've seen on quite a few across the pond vises and also the larger wilton series. Is jaws that mount with bolts from the outside of the jaw tower. That way the jaws are still easily removable yet the face of the jaw is uninterrupted of screw heads to get damaged. Don't have to worry about stripping out holes in the casting either.

Good point.

Outlawmws · Jul 16, 2015

zkling said:
The thing I don't like about older parkers, rock islands, etc is you can't easily fit custom jaws.

You mean replacement jaws right? I've made many types of jaw covers in different materials for different purposes for my Parker.

KMScott · Jul 16, 2015

zkling said:
The thing I don't like about older parkers, rock islands, etc is you can't easily fit custom jaws.

Not easy but challenging, I was thinking you were a full time Toolmaker or Machinist from a few posts you wrote, excuse me if I am mislead.

Jaws on the most part are square blocks with a couple holes in them and maybe a channel cut like for the Rock Islands. The Parkers are challenging on the surface grinder only. You can rough them out on a Bridgeport pretty easy in a couple hours. Having side wheel grinding experience and good metrology skills makes them easier to make, got to know where to cut and at what angle. Remember if you have a Parker that is in great shape and only needs jaws then spending a little time on it will extend it's life another 50+ years.

I have many vises that has the hard inserts casted in and I am excited to start on those. Those will be challenging just removing the hard inserts, once they are gone then the rest will be fun. Got to clean up the vises I have on my work bench first.

Outlawmws · Jul 16, 2015

Dr. Scott, here is a thought on the cast in insert removal: Slitting saw. Go just past the hardened steel and make 2 cuts, and the jaw drops out. On a mill you shouldn't need to do much cleanup of the saw cuts to get them true and square...

va.grouseman · Jul 16, 2015

KMS,---what is the process for removing those cast in jaws?---And is the casting of those jaws a sort of vulcanization?---Do you know the process they used to get the hard jaws inserted during casting?

Fretters · Jul 16, 2015

KMScott said:
Jaws on the most part are square blocks with a couple holes in them and maybe a channel cut like for the Rock Islands. The Parkers are challenging on the surface grinder only. You can rough them out on a Bridgeport pretty easy in a couple hours. Having side wheel grinding experience and good metrology skills makes them easier to make, got to know where to cut and at what angle. Remember if you have a Parker that is in great shape and only needs jaws then spending a little time on it will extend it's life another 50+ years.

ZK is merely comparing that to the simplicity of the English & European style inserts. As you've already found out with the ones you've modified to have a simple insert shelf like ours, the inserts are a lot easier to make for our style. Bit of rectangular or square stock, cut to length, drill and tap, (or drill and countersink for the ones held via screws), and Bob's your uncle, if you just want smooth inserts.

Thrumcap · Jul 16, 2015

Alright, here's the Record 634 finished this evening.

Glides like a wood drawer now!

Thrumcap
:canada:

Blue Frog · Jul 16, 2015

I picked up this 4" blacksmith's vise and the cordless trimmer today for $20.00. I haven't had the opportunity to check over the vise yet - that'll be tomorrow.

Blue

nine4gmc · Jul 16, 2015

Saw it in the garage sale thread and was going to let it go but now you're just showing off so I'll go ahead and say it.... YOU **** Blue!! Congrats man :beer:

With all the bs vises popping up lately, I hope my time comes soon!

bagged89s10 · Jul 16, 2015

Thrumcap said:
Alright, here's the Record 634 finished this evening.

Glides like a wood drawer now!

Thrumcap

Very nice work! :thumpup: :beer:

KMScott · Jul 16, 2015

VA
This is all I have found on the jaw and vise building procedure. I have a PDf that is to big to load that I was given by a member that shows how Reed built their vises and a enjoyable read except they forgot to mention the jaws and how they are attached. The image I attached says the jaws were welded on but I find it hard to believe. Any one wants a copy then I could e-mail it.

Good idea outlaw, I was going to try my sawzall first as long as there is no weld. I do not have a 90 degree head for the slitting saw.

drivesitfar · Jul 16, 2015

Kevin: can you machine the hardened faces like Carla did on the Reed we like or are the Reeds you are thinking about working on damaged too much?

va.grouseman · Jul 16, 2015

KM,---I was going to suggest making one cut right down the middle of the jaws to create gap and then collapse the two haves inward.---But if they are welded, it wouldn't work.---I'm like you, I just don't see how they could weld them in with no sign of a weld.---Seems like it would have to be something like a massive spot weld, heating both the jaw and the cast, molten hot till they fuse together.---But that changes the temper again altogether.

You got me. :dunno:

KMScott · Jul 16, 2015

drivesitfar said:
Kevin: can you machine the hardened faces like Carla did on the Reed we like or are the Reeds you are thinking about working on damaged too much?

Dean
Reed has hard casted in inserts and so does Rock Island, Athol, Desmond Stephan, Hollands, and Yosts and I bet a few more. Carla's Reed was done like my Holland in the last picture, I used a surface grinder.

KMScott · Jul 16, 2015

va.grouseman said:
KM,---I was going to suggest making one cut right down the middle of the jaws to create gap and then collapse the two haves inward.---But if they are welded, it wouldn't work.---I'm like you, I just don't see how they could weld them in with no sign of a weld.---Seems like it would have to be something like a massive spot weld, heating both the jaw and the cast, molten hot till they fuse together.---But that changes the temper again altogether.

You got me.

I am thinking some sort of brazing procedure, When I get one off I am going to surface grind the backs and see if there is any type braze or weld.

Outlawmws · Jul 16, 2015

I've always thought it was literally "cast in place" - Set the jaws in the mold, (pre heated) make the pour and let them fuse. There may have even been some type of "flux" like a blacksmith used when they hammer weld/forge iron together.

Wiss does something similar with their Inlaid Blades; hardened steel inserts into a cast or forged (probably forged) main handle. grind for the finish and bolt two together...

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