Tools of Japan

GrantCee · Dec 25, 2020

pizza said:
i see you have the zeal 3/8" universal joint. would you mind seeing if there's any difference in feel between how they connect up (nonzeal vs zeal joints on zeal ratchets)?

I have a 3771 and a 3771Z. Aside from the external profile on the female end, they are identical in size: diameter, length, etc.

Hooking both to a 3/8 Z-EAL ratchet, there doesn't seem to be any difference in how they fit to the anvil, or the amount of force needed to remove them.

I don't have any Z-EAL sockets, just some from their regular line, but fit to those sockets seems to be the same.

It's possible that the 3771Z is designed to retain Z-EAL sockets better than the "regular" version, but in all other respects they seem to be the same product with slightly different aesthetics.

pizza · Dec 25, 2020

GrantCee said:
I have a 3771 and a 3771Z. Aside from the external profile on the female end, they are identical in size: diameter, length, etc.

Hooking both to a 3/8 Z-EAL ratchet, there doesn't seem to be any difference in how they fit to the anvil, or the amount of force needed to remove them.

I don't have any Z-EAL sockets, just some from their regular line, but fit to those sockets seems to be the same.

It's possible that the 3771Z is designed to retain Z-EAL sockets better than the "regular" version, but in all other respects they seem to be the same product with slightly different aesthetics.

take a look in there. i'm guessing the ball holding groove is different between the regular and Z.

i'm surprised it doesn't result in a difference in anvil slop. go figure. lol

koken catalog said:
Tolerance – Square drive
Movement at the joint between a socket and a ratchet or other drive accessory has been accepted as unavoidable.
To reduce this movement, we thoroughly reviewed dimensional accuracy of all the joint parts of Z-Series, and any movement in the rotating direction has now been minimized through production technologies.

Ball Holding Groove
The new Ball Holding system was installed. Any movement in the connecting direction has been reduced by a mechanism that pulls the parts together.

superautobacs · Dec 25, 2020

Dave445,

I found the product card! COO is Japan. So, I think it's safe to assume that Taiwan is producing a clone. :dunno:

Looking forward to the new Z-series 72-tooth ratchets :rocker:

Ko-ken's unique floating pawl mechanism is a result of 5 years of R&D and testing. Ultimate-strength testing is a non-issue, but they wanted to ensure their 72-tooth mechanism would pass their own durability testing (50,000 cycles at 50Nm).

Brando_Damo · Dec 27, 2020

pizza said:
nice vid

looks like you (accidentally?) grabbed the 2771 instead of the 2771z 1/4" universal joint?

aside from how the lower part looks, i'm guessing the only difference is there will be a bit of extra slop/wiggle where it connects to the ratchet. curious if that's the case.

i see you have the zeal 3/8" universal joint. would you mind seeing if there's any difference in feel between how they connect up (nonzeal vs zeal joints on zeal ratchets)?

You have a sharp eye! Ordering the non-zeal universal was an accident!

So the z-series 3/8” and the non z-series 1/4” have essentially the exact same feel and fitment, both in the captured ball and the square drive, and there is no difference in slop (both have very little play). From what I can tell the 2771 and the 2771z actually use the exact same ball and have exactly the same fitment with the only difference being the bottom portion is ever so slightly smaller dimensionally. According to Koken the z-series is 1mm shorter in length, 1mm smaller in diameter, and is only 1g lighter. Pretty negligible. It looks like they squeezed it down just so they could say the z-series is more compact and still be telling the truth.

GrantCee · Dec 30, 2020

measuredtwice said:
Take this form to your post office and ask them to give you a street address for your PO box. This service was free for me. It is intended to get around the problem with shippers that won't deliver to a PO box.

https://www.usps.com/pobox/customer-agreement-for-premium-po-box-service-enhancements.pdf

I finally got around to doing this, and placed my first Amazon.jp order on Tuesday the 22rd. It arrived in my PO box on Monday the 28th — from Japan, over a holiday plus a weekend, including a transfer from DHL to USPS. Absolutely amazing.

Thanks for the suggestion, even though it's probably going to cost me a small fortune!

measuredtwice · Dec 30, 2020

GrantCee said:
I finally got around to doing this, and placed my first Amazon.jp order on Tuesday the 22rd. It arrived in my PO box on Monday the 28th — from Japan, over a holiday plus a weekend, including a transfer from DHL to USPS. Absolutely amazing.

Thanks for the suggestion, even though it's probably going to cost me a small fortune!

Haha! You're welcome. :beer:

macgee · Dec 30, 2020

Awesome, glad to hear that DHL Japan is working so fast during this time.

Reed Prince · Dec 30, 2020

Slightly off-topic, but I ordered something from Ali Express (China) on the 25th and Fed Ex delivered it today. I did not expect that to happen.

M6erfan · Dec 31, 2020

Brando_Damo said:
Ko-ken Zeal!

I’m very happy to get my hands on some 1/4 Ko-ken Z-series stuff!
I really like the low back drag on the ratchet, plus it’s extremely compact. I am very impressed and Koken will see me knocking on the door for more items soon.

Here’s a little unboxing with initial impressions.

-Brando

Good video. Those Zeal socket rails are the best.

gjusername · Jan 1, 2021

out of curiosity - what are "LHS" sockets? for example, there is a Ko-Ken set named RS3400LH/7 and it is designated as a "LHS" set. Just wondering what that means?

M6erfan · Jan 1, 2021

gjusername said:
out of curiosity - what are "LHS" sockets? for example, there is a Ko-Ken set named RS3400LH/7 and it is designated as a "LHS" set. Just wondering what that means?

Line Head-Straight, it's a drive type, similar to Torx. LH-S is short for LHSTIX

http://www.koken-tool.co.jp/en/support.html

https://www.j-osp.com/en/products/neji.html#

Negen · Jan 1, 2021

Look like 6 spline sockets ranging from 5s to 16s. With 3/8 drive. I guess these can apply more torque to a fastener than 12 point or something.

gjusername said:
out of curiosity - what are "LHS" sockets? for example, there is a Ko-Ken set named RS3400LH/7 and it is designated as a "LHS" set. Just wondering what that means?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using The Garage Journal mobile app

Dave455 · Jan 1, 2021

superautobacs said:
Dave445,

I found the product card! COO is Japan. So, I think it's safe to assume that Taiwan is producing a clone.

Ahhh! Very interesting! Thank you very much!

I pretty much guessed that. Laser tools, who market one of the copies, are well known pedlars of tat, so once I’d seen they offered one I knew it wasn’t going to be made in Japan!

Once you look closely,you can see some differences too, as I think Mr. Lemons pointed out!

kanai · Jan 1, 2021

Regarding the new 72 tooth Ko-ken Zeal ratchets, this Japanese tool youtuber has reviewed them. The 72 tooth Zeal is in the same ratchet body of the older 36 tooth mechanism. He likes the new 72 tooth mechanism- it has the same low back drag ratchet mechanism that the Zeal line is popular for.

kanai · Jan 1, 2021

GrantCee said:
I wonder if that means we'll be able to buy a 72-tooth rebuild kit to convert our older ratchets?

(Fingers crossed...)

The Japanese tool Youtuber who reviewed the new 72 tooth Zeal says that the body is the same, so if Ko-ken sells a 72 tooth rebuild kit, that should fit in the 36 tooth ratchet.

GrantCee · Jan 1, 2021

kanai said:
Regarding the new 72 tooth Ko-ken Zeal ratchets, this Japanese tool youtuber has reviewed them. The 72 tooth Zeal is in the same ratchet body of the older 36 tooth mechanism. He likes the new 72 tooth mechanism- it has the same low back drag ratchet mechanism that the Zeal line is popular for.

kanai said:
The Japanese tool Youtuber who reviewed the new 72 tooth Zeal says that the body is the same, so if Ko-ken sells a 72 tooth rebuild kit, that should fit in the 36 tooth ratchet.

Thanks for posting this video — it answered all of the questions I had about the new 72-tooth ratchet. I was curious about the backdrag, but apparently it's at least as light, if not lighter, than the 36-tooth version.

And since he was able to swap the new parts into an existing 36-tooth ratchet, as long as they make the repair kits available I'll be able to update my existing ratchet. Can't wait!

Ralf11 · Jan 1, 2021

anybody know where you can buy the Zeal socket rails alone (w/o sockets)?

M6erfan · Jan 1, 2021

Ralf11 said:
anybody know where you can buy the Zeal socket rails alone (w/o sockets)?

Several places, here is a U.S. source...

https://palmac.net/koken-z-series-rsal-200-magnetic-aluminum-rail/

E.T. · Jan 1, 2021

Harbor freight makes sockets rails similar to the Zeal. They are longer and not quite as nicely finished. Good for sticking socket sets to the underside of my cart lid

https://www.harborfreight.com/38-in-magnetic-socket-rail-black-70021.html

noid · Jan 1, 2021

mr.lemons said:

Dammit, I already have a bunch of ratchets, but this might be too strong to resist.

Ralf11 said:
anybody know where you can buy the Zeal socket rails alone (w/o sockets)?

Their magnet rails are awesome; being able to bring along the whole set of sockets to whereever you're working has really been a joy.

E.T. · Jan 2, 2021

Anyone know part numbers for the 72 tooth Zeal kits? Newest catalogue I can find is from 2019

mazdeuce · Jan 2, 2021

Ralf11 said:
anybody know where you can buy the Zeal socket rails alone (w/o sockets)?

Palmac has them. Odd things like that aren't organized super well and sometimes the easiest thing to do is go to the Koken catalog, get the part number and search that on the Palmac site. Here at the 1/4 rails.
https://palmac.net/koken-z-series-rsal200-1-4x12-1-4-sq-dr-socket-set-on-magnetic-rail-clip-set/

Reed Prince · Jan 2, 2021

E.T. · Jan 2, 2021

Reed Prince said:
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/JjBVBsg-Nww" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I have to Trusco version of this box and love it! Main difference between Toyo and Trusco is Trusco box has the lid cantilever open with the box.

Brando_Damo · Jan 2, 2021

I’m getting addicted... I got some more Ko-ken items in, a set of their wobble-fix extensions and a free turn t-handle 3/8” wrench. Also got a couple of those KTC sintered spinner adapters. I really like everything from Ko-ken that I have gotten so far!

Here’s an “unboxing” and closer look at the items for those interested.

rice rocket · Jan 3, 2021

Thanks for the review on those, I've been eyeballing that T-handle for a while.

gjusername · Jan 3, 2021

since the Ko-Ken and Nepros ratchets are renowned for having such low backdrag, I'm curious if anyone has ever actually measured the backdrag and compared it to other ratchets? I would love to see it done like in this video -

M6erfan said:
Line Head-Straight, it's a drive type, similar to Torx. LH-S is short for LHSTIX

http://www.koken-tool.co.jp/en/support.html

https://www.j-osp.com/en/products/neji.html#

Do you know of an application they would be used for?

Dave455 · Jan 3, 2021

I see that KoKen have introduced a Z Series / Zeal version of their 1/2” drive “Cross Wrench”.

I have the regular version of this tool and I really like it. There really isn’t anything faster for spinning off wheel nuts. Even an impact wrench doesn’t have much of an advantage.

I see they have introduced some dedicated wheel nut sockets too.

48548 · Jan 3, 2021

Dave455 said:
I see that KoKen have introduced a Z Series / Zeal version of their 1/2” drive “Cross Wrench”.

I have the regular version of this tool and I really like it. There really isn’t anything faster for spinning off wheel nuts. Even an impact wrench doesn’t have much of an advantage.

I see they have introduced some dedicated wheel nut sockets too.

I have the regular one as well... might go for this and a socket if I can find them...

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

kanai · Jan 3, 2021

Dave455 said:
I see that KoKen have introduced a Z Series / Zeal version of their 1/2” drive “Cross Wrench”.

I have the regular version of this tool and I really like it. There really isn’t anything faster for spinning off wheel nuts. Even an impact wrench doesn’t have much of an advantage.

Takanoura-san, who owns Factory Gear, reviews this cross wrench here: (in Japanese but you can see how smooth it spins)

My truck uses 22mm lugs, so I have to search for that (most are 17, 19 or 21mm)

Dave455 · Jan 3, 2021

kanai said:
Takanoura-san, who owns Factory Gear, reviews this cross wrench here: (in Japanese but you can see how smooth it spins)

My truck uses 22mm lugs, so I have to search for that (most are 17, 19 or 21mm)

Great review, even with the subtitles. He is obviously a real enthusiast!

I was using my regular cross wrench only yesterday. Needed to do a brake fluid change and it’s perfect for pulling 4 wheels off in rapid succession.

At the moment I’m trying to keep one set of tools in my shop, and another “road box”. The cross wrench is one of those tools that I’m always seem to want in both, which is a sure sign they are decent.

The 3/8 drive “free turning” T handle shown by Brando above is actually a very old design. It was a Blackhawk innovation originally (as are many of the designs we use). The Cross handle is pure KoKen though.

KoKen seem to be very committed to expanding their Z Series, but I must admit I wasn’t expecting a Z series cross wrench. I really like the look of those dedicated Z series wheel nut sockets. Again, they really do seem to have been thought through.

Yes, surprised by no 22mm. Japanese vehicles are the only time I seem to need one of those, even Micra’s have them, hence there’s one included with my cross wrench!

48548 · Jan 3, 2021

kanai said:
Takanoura-san, who owns Factory Gear, reviews this cross wrench here: (in Japanese but you can see how smooth it spins)

My truck uses 22mm lugs, so I have to search for that (most are 17, 19 or 21mm)

I think my jeep and dmax are 22mm as well.....

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

Dave455 · Jan 3, 2021

48548 said:
I think my jeep and dmax are 22mm as well.....

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

Yes, it’s a common size on vans and light trucks, but I don’t do much of that personally.

If I ever do have to work on a truck its probably something Whitworth anyway!

The combo shown below wasn’t my problem, but it did seem to be heading in my direction at one stage...

kanai · Jan 3, 2021

As far as 22mm impact wheel sockets, I've seen these (from Japanese brands):

* TONE HP4A-22LLN (this one is 17cm in length; no plastic sleeve )

* Tone HP4A-22LN (slightly shorter; no plastic sleeve)

* SK11 S4WP-22 (has plastic sleeve)

* Ko-ken 14145PM.110-22 (has plastic sleeve)

M6erfan · Jan 3, 2021

gjusername said:
Do you know of an application they would be used for?

Honestly, I have no idea. If I had to guess, it would be aerospace.

Fedwrench · Jan 3, 2021

The knurling on the free spinning cross wrench, makes me long for a ratchet with the same handle knurling. Hopefully, Koken release a 72 tooth model with the knurled handle.

M6erfan · Jan 3, 2021

Fedwrench said:
The knurling on the free spinning cross wrench, makes me long for a ratchet with the same handle knurling. Hopefully, Koken release a 72 tooth model with the knurled handle.

Do you have any of the current Ko-ken ratchets with knurled handle? They're my favorite handles by a long shot, I just wish they extended the knurling a bit more giving the grip area a bit more length. I'd love a 72t version too, but only if they somehow manage to keep the backdrag as light.

48548 · Jan 3, 2021

I use a toptul the green one... not sure why I bought the others 21mm... my bad, I was thinking of using one of these ratchet adapters to tighten... maybe a koken....

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48548 · Jan 3, 2021

Koken adapter and ktc socket but needs the plastic....

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Dave455 · Jan 3, 2021

Fedwrench said:
The knurling on the free spinning cross wrench, makes me long for a ratchet with the same handle knurling. Hopefully, Koken release a 72 tooth model with the knurled handle.

Does it have to be 72 tooth?

The round head and roto head are 45 tooth, and are of course available with the knurled handle.

I think just about every ratchet has a choice of smooth, knurled, or plastic handles.

My 3/8 drive roto head shown, compared to regular 3/8. One of my all time favourite ratchets.

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