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Advice on First Small Set of Automotive Tools

Adam.C

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you guys are funny. I love the guys who carry "full sets" of 6 and 12 pt sockets in their cars in case they break down. Anyone ever done a road side repair with their socket sets? Forget wrenches. Put them out of your head. If you want to start working on cars this is what you need in this order:

1) set of plastic prybars. Can't change a light bulb in some cars with out them.
2) digital multi meter. Electronics stop cars nowadays not broken fasteners or mechanical stuff. A test light is a reasonable compromise. But you'll buy a DMM sooner or later anyway, so get it now.
3) ratcheting screwdriver set - now call me crazy, but I recommend just going out and getting a nice new or gently used Snap On instinct ratcheting screwdriver (Ebay $50). Then get the little red case that holds all the bits. And get good bits, Snap On or Apex. You can take apart a lot of stuff with that one tool. My preference is for the stubby handle. Make sure you get a couple shanks including the 1/4" drive. I know this sounds extravagant, but you'll use this tool more than just about any other and you'll thank me later.
4) good jack and stands and a creeper you like and that fits you. Big wheels are typically better.
5) kick *** LED lights with STRONG magnets. I have Snap On and blue points. I'd try Astro. But the cheapies don't have strong enough magnets and they fall off of the curved surfaces you inevitably must attach them to. A head light is a reasonable alternative and darned helpful.
6) Set of 1/2" impact sockets and a battery impact gun. You don't need an expensive one. I have a Bosch which people say is weak, but it's never let me down.
7) 3/8" drive socket set. Any make will really do. Snap On is best, but the impact gun cures many ills. So don't get wrapped around the axle.
8) Snap On bit sockets- allens and torx - get these used on ebay. Look for a set either missing a piece or with obvious wear to one or two sockets. These will fetch the lowest bids (should be easily under $100/set - shoot for $50). Then turn around and order the replacement parts from Snap On. Now you have a real warranty on likely the most oft used sizes.
9) pick up a crappy pry bar set (usually 20 yr old craftsman are better than new Chinese) and a couple dead blow hammers.
10) I won't start a job without my inspection mirror and magnetic pick up tool. These can be had for super low money but are really invaluable when you need them. An old ipod with a front camera also makes an excellent inspection mirror.

This should allow you to do belts, accessories, brakes, and a myriad of interior and body jobs.

Wrenches, I'd get last. Don't skimp on these. I use mine infrequently, but when I do, I need good ones. I'd skip combos and go straight for some kind of long hi performance models. I think Snap On are best. A set can be had for about $200 on ebay in like new condition. But there are others. In general, these are just better at what we typically use wrenches for.

At the end of the day, the tools we debate endlessly here, are a small fraction of the tools you need. For modern automotive work, they aren't even all that important. The important, hard to reach, frozen in place bolts are usually socket head cap screws (allens or torx). The old MB may have triple squares?? So watch for them.

Oh, and when you buy ratchet handles, don't get the standard length models. Get the longest flex head you can get. These will be more helpful, if less convenient.

Last, a great set of extensions, and GOOD 1/4" drive sockets are luxuries you should treat yourself to after a few jobs.

2 more pieces of advice:
1) Long tools are typically more useful, but they have to be better quality. If you want to budget some silver bullet tools, save your money for the long tools - long Snap On extensions, pry bars, ratchet handles, wrenches. Anybody can make an acceptable short tool, so look there to save money.

2) Think long and hard about getting a decent toolbox sooner than later. I disagree with sentiment about boxes here (" you don't make money with a toolbox"). Your toolbox is the tool you use the most. Finding tools quickly, and putting them back to keep your work area clean helps you work faster and saves real time/money. Its just not obvious. I found a Snap On KRL(761) for $700 - less than a comparable HF box. Deals like that are out there. Start looking now.
 
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Gmonkee

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Can I do all that on budget of 200 bucks?

Its nice to raid the Snappy catalog but there isn't any of that in my stuff at work. I do use a lot of wrenches however.
 

Adam.C

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some guy on another thread said some of race car mechanics only carry an adjustable and ratcheting DBE wrenches no sockets, wonder why that combo

That may have been me. I have a friend who wrenches on race cars. He specializes in data acquisition and only carries gearwrench ratchet wrenches. The guys he works for fly him to the track.

But race car guys, like small engine repair guys, industrial/facility mechanics, all have pretty different needs. I'm rebuilding an old Bridgeport mill. I have these beautiful industrial finish Snap On tools I bought almost exclusively for this job (I didn't really have much in inch sizes). But they are overkill. Nothing is frozen on this mill. I'm using my open end wrenches for stuff - all fine. Chinese Craftsman would have worked for this.
 

Adam.C

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Can I do all that on budget of 200 bucks?

Its nice to raid the Snappy catalog but there isn't any of that in my stuff at work. I do use a lot of wrenches however.

I'm not sure what you do.

I don't think it's realistic to set up even a basic capability to work on cars for $200. I think $1000 is more realistic. And that will take a lot of oil changes and brake jobs to come out ahead. And this is why most people don't do this work themselves.

That said, it depends on what you drive. I recently purchased a 2009 VW GTI with 100,000miles. I got it for a good price because one or both front wheel bearings were shot. The VW dealership wanted $500 per side. A local indy shop quoted around $800 for both.

The parts were $250. And that included brakes. The way I look at it, that one job saved me $5-700 depending on how you look at it. As you get more tools, and more skill, you can tackle bigger jobs. But you have to spend money to save money, unfortunately. I think its a good investment tho. I've been fixing cars as a shade tree mechanic for going on 30 years now. I started with craftsman tools. I picked up a craftsman air compressor and an impact gun and that changed my life. Made all jobs easier and faster and some possible that I couldn't previously do.

Now my tools are all beautiful. And I wouldn't give them up. But the impact gun made the biggest difference in my work. A lift is next for me.

My list is good and should be sticky. Its a good starting place; advice I've given to my sons.
 
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sberry

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I rarely use a flex head ratchet, wouldn't miss them if I didn't. I have some snap wrenches, Only occasionally really need one and I am a full shop. For common hand tools could easily get on with most stuff HF or Cman which I have used for a career and no one beats me on stuck busted and rusted.
I have a lot of stuff but I provide everything needed to work here. I have a master here now, last couple guys were semi retired masters and then some, no one ever complains the stuff I have isn't adequate, in fact I bought some new a while back and my Bud says, not sure why, we got by without it for a long time. I don't own a ratcheting screwdriver, not sure how or where I might need one.
If I lost it all tomorrow the HF would be on my short list to get my feet under myself, doesn't mean I wouldn't buy something else but we are talking to a relative beginner here needs basics, not the best of everything.
But I am not a shade tree mechanic, maybe that makes a difference.
 

StubbyToe

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Gmonkee

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Late model auto in an indy shop. No flat rate and despite air tools present we don't use them.

I am in Mexico and well out of tool truck territory. For me your list is totally unrealistic, for someone in your town probably not.

The shop has big tools, the boss his mixed vintage and quality kit on a cart and I mine in a carry tote.
Pretty basic stuff and pretty much the same as our OP here is doing. Some has been with me front line for a decade and most a few years with no failures beyond my own fault.

I respect those guys with heaps of talent and ability to learn, helps a lot for them to have all the toys too. But some guys here work out of a bucket on a dirt floor and resolve even the electronics problems with just adding a basic scan tool.

Takes all kinds, we do a lot of what you said nobody does and work with more basic tools to the same end goal. The car leaves running better than it came in. Or with better brakes.

I just think each has to find the level of tool to meet the skill level, and that doesn't mean pros need truck tools. Just good tools.

(I will bet some truck tools actually do help do some jobs faster)
 
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Jikst

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would buying a quality adjustable like Channellock 8WCB replace all open end wrenches? tried searching what people think but couldnt find much.
 

General Geoff

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A good adjustable can do about 95% of what a set of traditional open ends can do, with the downside being that you have to re-adjust them frequently. Sometimes overall size can cause a clearance issue vs a small fixed-size open end wrench.
 
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Gmonkee

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No adjustable will work perfectly in car repair use. In small adjustment its too big and can be too short in the bigger setting. The set of wrenches has better proportion for size and is far more useful.
 

Locker537

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I second this suggestion. Looks like a good, solid basic socket set for auto mechanics work. Good quality tools, organized well in a good sturdy case. Might buy one myself lol.

I've got an older USA made Craftsman complete set, but I bought the Tekton to take to the shop for night class. I'm happy so far. I'm probably going to buy the 1/4 inch set and their 1/4 torque wrench since I need it for an upcoming job.
 
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you guys are funny. I love the guys who carry "full sets" of 6 and 12 pt sockets in their cars in case they break down. Anyone ever done a road side repair with their socket sets? Forget wrenches. Put them out of your head.

I keep a basic "crescent" 160 pc tool set and bottle jack in in both my car and truck.
I've used them a handful of times in 10 year's- the last time was over the summer, was 1100 miles from home and had brake problems.. drove the car to an advance auto, bought what i needed and did the repair right in the parking lot in less than an hour. Probably saved me a couple hundred bucks.
 

WildwoodChuck

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Look at what Snap-on, Carlisle (Napa), Craftsman, Gearwrench, and others are bundling as sets. I bet all of them have 90% of the same tools. Also Google what tec schools require at what stage 1st, 2nd year and so on. I used a Gearwrench set for my packing list for my truck for a few years then I found the Carlisle list and it had a few extra things so I'm working on them. Check out vehicle specific stuff for your car e-torx, triple square' sensor sockets, axel nut socket, the spark plug socket (some cars take sockets with a universal built in or extra long sockets) Ford had this thin wall socket for ignition modules for a while.

Screwdrivers, pliers, adjustable wrenches and 3/8" drive stuff, hammer with punches and a chisel will get you started.

I do a lot of work on the road for my job and I enjoy driving older vehicles (late 90's VW & Chevy) long distance for vacations. Other than some stupid long (6") torx bits to change my cap and rotor I have had everything I needed for road repairs that included 2 water pumps, thermostats, blower resistor, alternator, starter, 2 tune ups, installing 2 tow bars, a few hitches. I was not able to change the engine in my jeep when it blew while on the road.

Don't overlook "stuff" you need like green scrubbing pads, emery cloth, steel wool, razor blades (gasket scraper) a simple task like a thermostat can be a costly mistake if the prep work isn't done correctly. Before you turn your first bolt cut up 2 or 3 T-shirts and have them handy as rags, I still forget this after 20+ years of wrenching.
 
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I have a couple different tool sets-
My best advice to you is to stay away from the box store "kits"
Most of them have an array of stuff you will probably never use and even though there are an assortment of sockets most are 12 point-
If i were you i would focus mainly on buying socket sets in 6 point-
For 1/4 drive look into a gear wrench gear driver set- it's essentially a ratcheting screwdriver set that has an assortment of bits, a complete 1/4 drive socket set, various extensions and a ratcheting t handle- they are very handy and wont break you..
As for 3/8 drive buy shallow and deep 6 points from craftsman, stanley, proto, kobalt etc. They will last a weekender for a long time and be at a fraction of the cost of what you would pay for on the tool truck-
Get complete sets of combination wrenches- craftsman are just fine as well as kobalt, husky, etc. For metric start at 8 mm through 26 mm and standard start at 1/4" through 1 1/4"-
If your using air tools get a set of harbor china deep impact sockets- these are surprisingly pretty durable and cheap.
Ratchets- craftsman, kobalt etc.
Get something with a decent warranty that you can get replaced if need be- i seem to go through 3/8 ratchets about once a year.
A set of ball peen hammers, a nice dead blow and a brass hammer will get you through most anything.
Look for a set of axle nut sockets- you will need them and they work great at driving large seals as well.
As for air tools the necessities are a 1/2" impact, a 3/8 air ratchet, a straight die grinder, an angle die grinder and a GOOD air hammer (Ingersoll is the best bang for the buck on air hammers)
You NEED a multi meter- the cheap $2 ones at hf will get you by until you can afford a Nice one.
These are all pretty much the essentials if you truly want to be self sufficient.
Once you have all this look for a tap set, a small MIG welder and quality drill bits.
This is basically what i have in my basement where i work on motorcycles every winter- in my shop where i do most fab work and auto repair i have mostly higher end stuff-
My snap on flank drive wrenches are nice but way overrated for the $$-
Alot of the tool truck stuff is outrageous in price mainly for the convenience of warranty.
 
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hangfirew8

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Anyone ever done a road side repair with their socket sets?

Yes, many, many times. Too many times to count. I don't carry around 6 and 12 points both, and I recall many discussions of minimal road toolsets here on GJ...

Forget wrenches. Put them out of your head.

On the road, I use wrenches every time I can't get a socket in there. At home in my garage I own low profile ratchets and shallow and extra-shallow sockets. On the road I just switch to a wrench.

If you want to start working on cars this is what you need in this order:
1) set of plastic prybars. Can't change a light bulb in some cars with out them.

For my vehicles, only useful for interior work.

2) digital multi meter. Electronics stop cars nowadays not broken fasteners or mechanical stuff. A test light is a reasonable compromise. But you'll buy a DMM sooner or later anyway, so get it now.

I can see where we differ right here. I know plenty of people poor enough, where mechanical stuff still can, will & does cause breakdowns. Formerly ultra-reliable older Toyota's and Honda's in the Rust Belt are the primary suspects here.

I agree on the test light. I got along for many years with some wire and a socketed 12V light bulb. Now I keep a free HF DMM in each vehicle (and wire). Just replace the corrosive leak-o-matic Chinese battery with a quality US made alkaline.

But since you bring it up, a good cheap ODBII reader is 100 times faster, handier, and more useful to a new DIY mechanic than a DMM. So I would say get a $22 BAFX ODBII reader first, and Torque Pro on your smartphone.

3) ratcheting screwdriver set - now call me crazy

OK, you're crazy. I had this "brilliant idea" that I would downsize my road toolbag by removing the screwdriver set and replacing it with a 1/4" hex bit screwdriver set.

The very first time I went to use it, it had a clearance problem and I couldn't get to the screw head. I had to borrow a solid shaft screwdriver, it was a Craftsman, and it fit. That was the end of 1/4" hex bit screwdriver sets as road tools. That, and they make poor pry bars.

4-5 OK.

6) Set of 1/2" impact sockets and a battery impact gun. You don't need an expensive one. I have a Bosch which people say is weak, but it's never let me down.

I have the Bosch 24618 and it is indeed too weak to do much (about 110 ft/lb), but it is compact. It can be a real time-saver but has never saved the day. If you have one of the High Torque models, those are useful for wheels but are way too big to get into modern automotive tight spots.

I started out with impacts with what most people get (at least it so seems to me), a set of deep 1/2" impacts. I quickly found that they were only useful for suspension and wheel work. Everywhere else they didn't fit. So I got a quality set of standard depth 1/2" impacts. I quickly found even they didn't fit.

Then I got an Astro Nano 3/8" and a Sunex Master set. Now, that fits. It also has deeps and yes, can do wheels. For a Pro I wouldn't recommend it for doing wheels all day long. But for a DIY guy, I would say, unless/until you're going right into a big suspension job, start out with a compact 3/8 impact and a complete 3/8" impact socket set, and wait on the 1/2 set until you really need it.

7) 3/8" drive socket set. Any make will really do. Snap On is best, but the impact gun cures many ills. So don't get wrapped around the axle.

The 3/8" chromed socket set is the heart of any toolbox, for the road or garage.

8) Snap On bit sockets- allens and torx - get these used on ebay. Look for a set either missing a piece or with obvious wear to one or two sockets. These will fetch the lowest bids (should be easily under $100/set - shoot for $50). Then turn around and order the replacement parts from Snap On. Now you have a real warranty on likely the most oft used sizes.

That's one strategy. Another is get a Sunex impact set, and you'll have a really good warranty on the whole set.

9) pick up a crappy pry bar set (usually 20 yr old craftsman are better than new Chinese) and a couple dead blow hammers.

With the amazing Sears deals on US-made Craftsman prybar sets right now, it's hard to recommend used or crappy. I recently got the 36" for less than $10 and the 3-bar set for less than $20.
10) I won't start a job without my inspection mirror and magnetic pick up tool. These can be had for super low money but are really invaluable when you need them. An old ipod with a front camera also makes an excellent inspection mirror.


This should allow you to do belts, accessories, brakes, and a myriad of interior and body jobs.

Wrenches, I'd get last.

Do you live in the rust belt, and/or work on tight clearance vehicles (meaning anything modern?)

If so, then don't get wrenches last.

2) Think long and hard about getting a decent toolbox sooner than later. I disagree with sentiment about boxes here (" you don't make money with a toolbox"). Your toolbox is the tool you use the most.

The OP said he was a minimalist. It hasn't been determined if all these will go in the back of a car, or if a garage even exists. A big 10 drawer bottom box may not be appropriate here, especially for a minimalist.
 

hangfirew8

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some guy on another thread said some of race car mechanics only carry an adjustable and ratcheting DBE wrenches no sockets, wonder why that combo

Hold that thought.

A "real" race car is often something like a tube frame with a car-looking shell snapped over it. Everything is super easy to get to and replace. Many components are designed to be quick-changed, but cost much more than standard components.

This situation has little to nothing to do with working on a modern production vehicle. For those, tool clearance is everything. Ratcheting wrenches are great... after you own regular wrenches... the extra 1/4" or more of box end thickness makes them no-gos for getting to some fasteners. Thus the reliance on standard sockets and wrenches. And yes, sometimes, even open end wrenches. Sometimes they are the only thing you can get on a fastener.
 

Shark Pilot

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Building my first tool set, mostly to work on my own car (Toyota, 80s MB Diesel), and bike. Id like a small set of high quality tools. So far all I have:

- 11 piece metric bonney v double open end wrenches (saves me buying 22 combo piece)
- 1/2 18" Plomb breaker bar
- plan on buying 1/2 beam torque wrench, sockets/ratchet

My questions are: do double open end wrenches suffice or will i strip stuff by not using a closed end? Should i get a 3/8th ratchet and 3/8th and 1/2th sockets or can I get by just fine with a 1/2th ratchet and just 1/2th sockets (saving money and time by only needing 1/2 sockets or will 1/2 ratchet be too big in many situations)? Also 6 point sockets and 12 point closed wrenches are best correct?


So far you have gotten a lot of good advice from other folks so I will try to answer your questions and add my perspective. I have maintained practically all my cars for the past 42 years including 2 Porsches, a slew of BMW's, 2 Land Rovers, a few VWs and Audis and a few Japanese cars as well.

The first law of DIY home mechanics in terms loosening and tightening fasteners is: DO NOT STRIP, ROUND-OFF, SNAP-OFF or otherwise MUTILATE any nut, bolt or thread. Because if you do, you will be in for some serious pain and suffering at best or, worst case, in a situation where you might have to get the vehicle towed to a professional mechanic to complete the job. And, as a DIY, you just won't have all tool options and resources to deal with some of the issues a ruined fastener can create.

Good quality tools and the knowledge and experience on how and when to use them can significantly reduce the risks of these issues. That is your objective in terms of buying tools.

The core of my tools has been Craftsman sockets, ratchets (1/4, 3/8 and 1/2") and combination wrenches from a tool set I purchased back in the late 1970's (before the internet, big box stores, etc. it was basically CMAN, SK and Snap-On in terms of what most people knew about.) to which I added a set of 1/2" Proto 6-point impact sockets, CMAN click style 3/8" torque wrench, beam torque wrench, CMAN metric hex bit sockets, larger sockets as needed and a set of fractional Blackhawk flare wrenches which somehow work fine on metric. And I have added a bunch of other stuff when a specific job requires something specialized or unique. Plus all the other stuff like floor jacks, jack stands, creeper, work lights, etc. In other words, decent basic stuff which has gotten me thru quite a few jobs - although there have been plenty difficult situations in which better or a more broader range tools would have made the job easier.

Lately, my 17 year-old son (who works part-time at vintage race car shop and has access to huge collection of Snap-On tools) and I have been doing a ton of work on our 2 80's 535i BMW's and I have started to "upgrade" some of my core tools. It had been something I had been thinking about for quite sometime and it was more a matter of figuring out what to upgrade to considering my old CMAN stuff is "pretty good". Well, one day we were pulling the axle half shafts out of my son's car - they are attached with hex head bolts (easy to strip!) - and I had cracked all of them and was letting my son do the final removal. He torqued on the second to last one (which I apparently missed) and the hex head started to strip and he stopped. OK, lets see if we can go out and buy a new hex head bit that fits better. I bought 3 including one from NAPA's Carlyle brand. Let me tell you that the difference in tightness of fit between the Carlyle and anything else was significant. That hex bolt came off with no issues. So, I have been buying Carlyle to upgrade my CMAN stuff and I am really impressed - the sockets fit really tight and I have gotten a high tooth count 3/8" locking flex head long handle ratchet which I never had and I don't know how I ever lived without.

If I was in your position starting out all over again my approach would be to do the following:

1. Buy the most tight fitting six-point sockets you can find for your vehicles fasteners. Priority would be in the 3/8" range because larger fasteners like 19mm and bigger usually don't have as much issues as mid-size fasteners (10mm to 17mm) in my experience. And they are usually found in more accessible locations which helps. For 1/2" you could go with 6-pt impact from Harbor Freight if money is a huge issue (non-impact 1/2 in 6-pt can be hard to find as well). The difference in cost for a 3/8 rail of sockets ranges from $20 to $50 - in the grand scheme not a lot of money for something that actually is the point of contact on the fastener. Here is link to a 3/8 sockets discussion to confuse you further: http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=345135 I am very happy with my recently acquired Carlyle - they have proved their mettle a few times recently and I think do "work better" in marginal situations better than my old CMAN sockets.

2. Sell the open-end wrench set and buy a decent set of combination wrenches. I rarely use my set of CMAN, but sometimes you need them. This set: [URL="https://www.doitbest.com/products/309443"]https://www.doitbest.com/products/309443
by Channellock is identical to the Carlyle long panel wrenches that sell for double the price.

3. Decent torque wrench: Kobalt 3/8 for around $65 made in Taiwan with calibration certificate - decent for the money.

4. If you need flare wrenches - do some research and get the best you can afford - some say Snap-On is really the only choice. Stripping a flare fitting is a huge pain to fix and better wrench quality is probably the only way to avoid that.

5. Ratchet handles: Lower tooth count "beaters" you can put a cheater pipe on and warranty easily! Plus a flex or roto-head high tooth count 3/8" long handle for tough access situations - could be HF, Gearwrench etc. I got my Carlyle on a "Real Deals" sales flyer for less than $50.00 which has a very small head which is great for access but if funds are tight you can spend less.


6. Mercedes often require special tools you can find here:http://www.samstagsales.com/mercedes.htm

7. I would add to your list of hand tools: Long reach straight and bent needle nose pliers, set of 2-foot long screwdrivers, 90 degree needle nose pliers, rubber mallet and dead blow hammer. Also when needed: cable operated remote hose clamp pliers and heavy duty circlip pliers.

This should give you a decent start. Other advice:

1. Soak fasteners with PB Blaster or the like overnight - this is huge.

2. Get the best workshop manuals for your vehicles. Hunt down vehicle specific internet forums for DIY technical advice and step by step how-to for various jobs. Search you tube for how-to. Pick up big tool flyers at NAPA or Car Quest and get familiar with all the various specialized automotive tools.

3. Add more tools as the job requires, rent specialized tools from Advance Auto or Autozone.

4. Only work when your head is clear and double check your work.
 
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