The Project Garage/Office

MC · Jan 7, 2009

So what you see above is our typical Texas ranch home. Our family lives just outside of Austin, TX in the quaint little ranch community of Dripping Springs. Drippin' (as us locals call it) off...
To read the rest of this blog entry from The Garage Journal, click here.

Austinite · Jan 7, 2009

This one should be fun to watch. Living in Austin has its perks. There are a ton of great architects that do fantastic work for good prices. And it is very smart to start where you are starting.

Roadsters.com · Jan 7, 2009

I don't know if it would be feasible for you, but in an area where it gets that hot, I'd rather have a larger main floor (or a basement) than an upstairs.

Everything is a compromise, but something that works well for me is to have one room where I do all of my grinding and sanding in addition to anything involving dirt, oil, or grease. This "strictly work" area is not fancy, and need only be as big as it really needs to. This makes it possible to use the main garage area as an assembly room. It's carpeted, and also serves as the office. This way, most of the time you're only paying to heat and cool one room, and it's where you'd want to spend your time anyway, because the computer and the audio and video equipment are with you when you're spinning wrenches. I could take some pictures and post them, but I'm sure you get the idea.

Dave
http://www.roadsters.com/

toadjammer · Jan 7, 2009

I would definately look at a larger single floor space then a two floors. Definately do a price comparison for the same amount of floor space. I know I would have a hard time cleaning up well enough to wall through the office are to use the bathroom. With the bath on ground level you may be able to put a door on each end of the bath seperating offica and garage space so you don't even have to enter the office when greasy or dirty feet. Also make sure to think of a dirty area maybe behind the shop or a small area in the shop. Lets say you build it a little bigger, maybe 30d x 45w you could still have a 30 x 30 garage space, 15x10 office space, 5x10 bathroom and 15x15 dirty room. You could still put a couple of dormers to keep the look and add natural light, and maybe scissor trusses to help with a lift height. And at 30x45 it is within 50 square feet of your first option in your blog.

FrankButlar · Jan 7, 2009

Looks like it's going to be quite a project. I'm going to enjoy seeing it take shape. Show us some pics of your hot rods.

autoist · Jan 7, 2009

Whatever, I think I'd turn it 90-degrees to the house, if possible.

slim53 · Jan 7, 2009

Concept 2 rules. I've always liked the idea of a 2 story garage but have no personal experience with them. Good luck with the build!!

Slim

Ryan · Jan 7, 2009

toadjammer said:
I would definately look at a larger single floor space then a two floors. Definately do a price comparison for the same amount of floor space. I know I would have a hard time cleaning up well enough to wall through the office are to use the bathroom. With the bath on ground level you may be able to put a door on each end of the bath seperating offica and garage space so you don't even have to enter the office when greasy or dirty feet. Also make sure to think of a dirty area maybe behind the shop or a small area in the shop. Lets say you build it a little bigger, maybe 30d x 45w you could still have a 30 x 30 garage space, 15x10 office space, 5x10 bathroom and 15x15 dirty room. You could still put a couple of dormers to keep the look and add natural light, and maybe scissor trusses to help with a lift height. And at 30x45 it is within 50 square feet of your first option in your blog.

I don't think I have the budget for a single floor operation... I'd love to do that though.

autoist said:
Whatever, I think I'd turn it 90-degrees to the house, if possible.

Absolutely. We have a corner lot, so we are set up perfectly for it.

slim53 said:
Concept 2 rules. I've always liked the idea of a 2 story garage but have no personal experience with them. Good luck with the build!!

Slim

Thanks man... We are already getting started with the planning.

Doug B · Jan 7, 2009

slim53 said:
Concept 2 rules.

Slim

Agreed. I'm just finishing up a 24x32 with bonus space above. It will become living space at some point in the future. This will be a great project to watch.

autoist · Jan 7, 2009

I have a 2-story garage...I use the 2nd floor for storage; however, right now, we're converting part of the 2nd floor into a guest apartment.

FunfDreisig · Jan 8, 2009

We are practically neighbors, by Texas Hill Country standards

FWIW I vote for option #2. It has the look and feel of a hill country out building and blends well with the main house which has both gables and dormers..

As you know, the Hill Country is still in a "long dry spell", but please consider rain water collection as part of this addition, none the less. Our water resources are severely stressed. Your new office/garage addition could require 0 additional water resources with the addition of a simple rain water collection system. PM me for more specific info (e.g. design, local suppliers, personal usage history, etc.)

Funf Dreisig - who's ONLY water supply is rain water and can't imagine drinking anything else

Ryan · Jan 8, 2009

autoist said:
I have a 2-story garage...I use the 2nd floor for storage; however, right now, we're converting part of the 2nd floor into a guest apartment.

Do you have a link to your photos? You avatar looks great.

LoRollinLS · Jan 8, 2009

Ryan said:
Do you have a link to your photos? You avatar looks great.

If you'll click on his www.autoist.com link it will take you to his site where he has links to pics about 3/4 down the page.

I personally like concept one better from an exterior standpoint, because your right, it does do a good job mimicking the house's architecture. Concept 2 is a nice design with floor space and all but i dont think the exterior goes well with the house, unless u really WANT it to look like a barn. Concept 3 seems like settling compared to 1 & 2. but it is about what u can afford in the end....

Brad54 · Jan 8, 2009

Is it "Ryan's Office" or will both of you be working out there? I ask, because you say you want a full bathroom: For a guy's shop/office, you only need a urinal. They take up a lot less space, you don't have to add a whole room, just a partition. You make a lot more trips to take a leak than the other.
For those times when you need to "sit down for a spell," make a trip into the house...turn it into a snack run.

Unless MC will be working out there too. Then you'll need the full deal.

Urinals are quicker and easier to clean, too--toilets always seem to be really disgusting.

You might not be thrilled about the outside stairs, but as you said, it will free up a lot of floor space--both inside the shop, and upstairs too. It might be possible to do an old-style covered stairway outside.

If you do the stairs inside, you can put a generous storage closet/air compressor closet under the stairs, and have a storage nook under the lower portion of the stairs for engines, etc. You could also stash the HVAC handler under the stairs.

I have a 32x40 shop, 12-ft walls with no support poles in the middle. For $80 per truss, I could have had the rafters opened up and had a "bonus area" for storage. I have 22 trusses, so that would have been expensive. Plus, I've seen guys' shops with upstairs storage, and they always end up stuffing it with junk. I opted not to spend the money.

However, I wish I would have done at least 11 of the trusses, because then I could put my office up there. Instead, I've lost a 10x10 footprint on my shop floor, walling it off and building my office there.

It will be cheaper for you to have someone build the outside, rough-finish the upstairs and then you guys can finish it off yourselves, and finish the shop-portion yourselves as you can afford it. If you look at it that way, you'll get a bigger shop, it just won't be ready to move in the day the construction workers leave.

-Brad

MC · Jan 8, 2009

No, this space will be for Ryan and I'll be taking over the home office as my own. We've thought about the urinal idea but worry about resell value. Some folks out here have guest houses in the back, so we figured it would be best to install at least a half bath so it could be categorized as living space if we were ever to move.

Thoughts?

boiler7904 · Jan 8, 2009

Concept 2 would be the most interesting but also the most costly to build. The inset second floor also dictates a column in the shop area below which isn't all that great. The second floor is also fairly small and useless as anything but an office.

Options 1 and 3 have the same positive things going for them. Simple rectangle shape is efficient to build and can be enlarged easily now or in the future. Set the building back so there is room to add a bay at one end and frame a large opening (or window) in that end wall. When it comes time to add the third bay, just move the window to the new endwall and cut out the framing below the sill - instant doorway to the new bay. The second floor is built within the envelope created by the roof with dormers added so that makes the space essentially free before you start adding finishes.

If you're thinking about resale, I'd build out a bath upstairs with tub/shower, toilet, and sink. I'd also think about doing the plumbing rough in for the kitchen in either of those plans. Cheap and easy to do now - not so much when the space below is completely finished. You could always add the cabinetry, appliances, and finish plumbing at a later date. Don't get too extravagant. Use a simple single bowl SS sink, undercounter fridge, a microwave and stock cabinets. Becomes a nice selling feature down the road when you decide to move to something else.

General things to think about:

Find out what your budget is now before you start talking to architects or contractors. Once you know what you can spend or finance, talk to contractors and ask them what type of budget would be reasonable for each of the buildings you've shown on YOUR site. Site work in itself can pose all types of budget challenges depending on what's going on below the surface.

Assess what work you can and want to do yourself without affecting the work flow of your hired contractors. See if the savings are worth your time and effort. Insulation is one area that while easy to do is often cheaper or break even if done by a pro.

Get information on the zoning, setbacks, and the permit for the building. No sense designing a 600 sf building that's 18' tall if you're only allowed 500 sf and 15' tall.

You might want to talk to your local property tax assessor and find out the impact to your annual tax bill. A building is not a one time expense. It will increase your monthly bills from the day you start construction until you sell the house.

Plans from a website or planhouse will likely need a local architect / engineer to review and stamp the drawings for permit.

Look at your utility services and find out if you'll need or want larger (even additional) services to feed new building.

Joe Reed · Jan 8, 2009

MC said:
No, this space will be for Ryan and I'll be taking over the home office as my own. We've thought about the urinal idea but worry about resell value. Some folks out here have guest houses in the back, so we figured it would be best to install at least a half bath so it could be categorized as living space if we were ever to move.

Thoughts?

If you intend to ever market it as a guest house, you should put it at least a small shower. A half bath (assuming you mean just a toilet and sink) won't say "guest room" to most people since guest would have to go to the main house for a shower or bath. One of those small pre-fab showers shouldn't be that expensive.

JeffreyJames · Jan 8, 2009

Good luck Ryan. This is something that I think I may end up looking into in the future since I can't stand paying rent on a shop to store my stagnate projects. I'm going to need a small second garage to house 1 or 2 finished cars that can be free from all the grinding and welding that goes on in the main one. I also will have a small battle to win with the HOA. Again good luck, I am going to keep up with this one.

autoist · Jan 8, 2009

Ryan said:
Do you have a link to your photos? You avatar looks great.

Ryan, go to http://www.theautoist.com/garage-mahal.htm & you can follow my build - I just did it as I needed extra space so it meanders, which I like.....the photos of the upstairs apartment project are way down near the bottom.

Tyrol67 · Jan 8, 2009

I had some similar challenges and was interested in similar designs, so I'll share mine. First problem was getting zoning which restricted us to a 2 car ( 600 SF) with no second floor, 14' max. Only way to get around it would be to attach it to the house which I did not want. I received a variance for 26x36 that was 19' high. (not including the cupola). My approach was to visually hide the 2nd floor by using a kneewall and a steep roof, 10/12 pitch. The second floor is 18 x 36. I also sold the board on the final product looking more like a carriage house with good materials and keeping with the older architectural style of the neighborhood. Actually all the doors and windows are recovered/restored items, as I wanted it to look 'older'.

I wanted to build a timber frame and found a great place that sold kits. The design was almost perfect, but they would not add the larger eaves that you see. I chose those to tie in with the house and provide weather protection. So starting with their salt box concept, I ended up designing it myself. The timber frame design and build was a great experience. If I could have lived with the kit, that would have been much quicker and possibly cheaper.

Here some features that may be of interest.

-Inside, one bay is 12' high for a lift, so one bay on the 2nd floor is like a loft.
-The upstairs is for storage, but is high enough for office / living space. The loft would be tighter, but an office would be possible.
-Stairs are inside and convenient, but if you only build a 2 bay, those outside stairs are appealing. Or go for 3 bays. I have 2 bays for cars and the third will be a workshop area.
-Extra deep was well worth it. 26' is nice and 28' is even nicer.
-2nd floor beams and floor are exposed and I love the look. Insulation would be nice, but I had to have the timber frame look. The floor is 2x6 T&G on 3' centers. The span could have been larger per the tables. The beams are 6"x8"x12'. You get a great looking ceiling and floor in one shot.
-Adding the large dormer in the middle opens up the second floor. It is also designed to support an I-beam and hoist.

Good luck on the design!

boiler7904 · Jan 9, 2009

We're going to need more pics. One is just a tease.

Mikea57 · Jan 9, 2009

Ryan,
I'm really afraid that 28 X 28 will very, very quickly end up not being big enough. I have a 24 X 26 and I've got to work really hard to keep enough room in there to get around. Of course, I've got kid's ride-ons, future projects, and assorted junk in there that really doesn't need to be in a "workshop" but hey, that's how it rolls at my house. One day they will be banished and the other projects will be done. (Yeah, RIGHT.)

How many project cars will you be working on at one time? Will you be storing car(s) in there as well? Will you be putting a lift in? Ever? Is the size you're thinking about based on a community restriction or budget constraint?

I'm also into audio/video production and my upstairs will one day be a production studio/office. It's completely unfinished now so I don't know what the finished size will be but I do know that it needs to be roomy enough for at least 2-3 people to work. Are there are times that you and MC or you and someone else work together on some things? Either #1 or #2 gets my vote as either of them will have be enough space for a couple of desks plus a server rack off to the side behind another door to keep the noise at a minimum. (Don't forget a quiet exhaust fan in there to remove the heat.) #2 gets my final vote as I really think it would be just about big enough. 36' instead of 34.5' would better too.

I do have to say too, that the idea of needing just a urinal in the bathroom is hogwash. Unfortunately, there is another bodily function that takes place regularly that requires more than a urinal. A man's gotta have a place to think doesn't he?

I think too that if you are going to be working upstairs that having a small sink, college fridge and counter space for a microwave and a coffee pot will become invaluable to you long term. If you are anything like me when you get going on a project you don't want anything slowing you down or stopping you. Being able to grab a cup of joe, an orange or make a quick sandwich is all you need to sustain you.

autoist · Jan 9, 2009

Definitely, think about those things...I have a small fridge in my garage along with a utility sink...in the project now underway, we're installing a full bath (with shower) and in the studio a small fridge, a microwave, a 20"wide freestanding stove, a vent hood, and a sink. Real estate guys say those things increase the value of my property more than my garage mods.

acme speed shop · Jan 10, 2009

Mikea57 said:
Ryan,
I'm really afraid that 28 X 28 will very, very quickly end up not being big enough. I have a 24 X 26 and I've got to work really hard to keep enough room in there to get around. Of course, I've got kid's ride-ons, future projects, and assorted junk in there that really doesn't need to be in a "workshop" but hey, that's how it rolls at my house. One day they will be banished and the other projects will be done. (Yeah, RIGHT.)

How many project cars will you be working on at one time? Will you be storing car(s) in there as well? Will you be putting a lift in? Ever? Is the size you're thinking about based on a community restriction or budget constraint?

I'm also into audio/video production and my upstairs will one day be a production studio/office. It's completely unfinished now so I don't know what the finished size will be but I do know that it needs to be roomy enough for at least 2-3 people to work. Are there are times that you and MC or you and someone else work together on some things? Either #1 or #2 gets my vote as either of them will have be enough space for a couple of desks plus a server rack off to the side behind another door to keep the noise at a minimum. (Don't forget a quiet exhaust fan in there to remove the heat.) #2 gets my final vote as I really think it would be just about big enough. 36' instead of 34.5' would better too.

I do have to say too, that the idea of needing just a urinal in the bathroom is hogwash. Unfortunately, there is another bodily function that takes place regularly that requires more than a urinal. A man's gotta have a place to think doesn't he?

I think too that if you are going to be working upstairs that having a small sink, college fridge and counter space for a microwave and a coffee pot will become invaluable to you long term. If you are anything like me when you get going on a project you don't want anything slowing you down or stopping you. Being able to grab a cup of joe, an orange or make a quick sandwich is all you need to sustain you.

Ryan and Marcy,

I REALLY agree with Mike57 on the size consideration.

My wife and I built on to our 1953 ranch style garage about 15 years ago and before the walls were even framed I knew I should have gone bigger. My mistake was not making the space deep enough to have work benches and tool storage at the front of the cars by where I need the tools. I should have made the garage part about 5 foot deeper.

We had a 20'x20' garage and added a 35'x20' garage and a 12'x35' bonus room for a total slab size/footprint of 35'x32'.

The issue you will have with a smaller work area is that you cannot separate the messy harsh work from your finished cars.

I strongly urge you to do scale drawings of the floor plan with all of the tools and cars you think you will want to have. Leave some room to add tools too. This will give you an idea of both the shape of the room and the size you need. In my opinion, the shape (rectangle, square, l-shaped) is every bit as important as the size.

Also consider having a big covered area outside attached to theback of the structure like a open sided patio (facing away from the house) that you could store cars, loud equipment and do the really messy work like sanding and grinding.

The biggest advantage you have is your lot size. You have choices that a lot of us surburbanites don't have. You can go larger and play with the orientation of the building on the lot. Make sure to place the building so it uses the suns path to your advantage. And make sure to put big overhangs on the roof to shade the windows from direct sunlight.

One last thing. Check out a local architect called Barley snd Pfeiffer. (www.barleypfeiffer.com) they are in Austin and have won many national awards for their forward thinking green designs. They really focus on the placement of a building on its site and the shape of the structure to take advantage of the suns, wind patterns, etc. forthe particular area you are building. They won't just "bult on" a bunch of "green equipment". I am looking into them for my "somday shop" on our property in Bend Oregan.

Thanks for sharing this with us....

John

toadjammer · Jan 10, 2009

There are some reasons that I suggested a single story. FIrst of age, as we all age we become less agile and it becomes alot of work to go up and down stairs. Disability, alot of newer house builders are building to specs that allow people in wheelchairs and the handicapped to move around easier. I knew a gentleman when I was younger that built a couple of cars and was wheelchair bound, drovw with hand controls. Also if you are or could use this space for a space for customers to come and visit. And there is a concern with children around stairs too.
Just a couple thoughts
Toad

Okie Pete · Jan 12, 2009

Check out Tri-Steel homes.

spankbomb · Jan 12, 2009

We'll be watching this thread as we have many of the same concerns: budget, matching existing architecture, neighborhood approval, environmental and did I mention budget?

Due to budgetary constraints, we may have to consider a third tandem bay instead of a preferable stand-alone building. We're also near the Austin area so we'll be interested in your selections for architect and contractors.

Looking forward to it.

Jon D.

Enloe · Jan 13, 2009

my vote is for # 1

ryno · Jan 16, 2009

if this goes down any time around the round up in april let me know. im down for some framing,electrical,etc..........

we could do a hamb/tgj type build, im sure theres enough folks on here that we could do some sort of exterme make over type bull ****.

ryno · Jan 16, 2009

another though is to use a storage/shipping container for the office portion. you can get those used for really cheap and just build out you rroof line sort of a lean too, to house the contanier. run some ac/heat in there and you ll have more money to spend on a bigger shop.

ive got a buddy who took 8 of these and welded them all together and made a house out them. covered the outside in fake rock build a roof, and sheetrocked the inside, you could never tell from any angle taht is isnt a normal build.

heavytlc · Jan 17, 2009

I bring the unpopular, always think resale. What we like and what John Q Public wants are not the same. Finished living space sells. Most people want living space.

What do I know I live in a shop...

spankbomb · Jan 16, 2010

Updates? My wife and I talked about our garage situation today over lunch so I went back searching through some of the old threads I was interested in to see if there were any updates.

Later,
Jon D.

sundevil64 · Sep 27, 2010

Ryan,

Curious to see on what you decided. I'm in the Austin area also, Cedar Park/Leander area. I found this thread as we are looking at a "new to us" place and was searching for freestanding garage ideas. We would be on two acres with a mid 80's ranch (white stone). One thing that I didn't see was a suggestion for a garage or "roll up" door at the rear. One of the things that even my wife agreed was to put a slab on the back side as a dirty work area something out of site for the neighbors. The idea is to be able to "drive thru" a vehicle for dirty work such as sanding, welding, etc. Just a thought please update when you get a chance. Any idea what cost per sq ft. is now. I would like for it to match the house with a white stone veneer. I agree with a full bath. Should you sell the garage can be converted into a guest house or studio. Also, the additional tax burden is a good point with tax rates rising to fund schools and the like.

The Project Garage/Office

Administrator

New member

Member

Well-known member

New member

MEMBER EMERITUS

Well-known member

Administrator

Well-known member

MEMBER EMERITUS

Well-known member

Administrator

Well-known member

Well-known member

Administrator

Well-known member

Well-known member

Active member

MEMBER EMERITUS

Active member

Attachments

Well-known member

Well-known member

MEMBER EMERITUS

Member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Active member