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A

Adam.C

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Joined
Jan 29, 2013
Messages
1,490
I personally would like more details. Why do they think that round head ratchet willl last 60 years? Did they test it to see if it could still transmit the same torque as a new one?

SK ratchets are 30 years behind the rest of the industry (i.e. companies who copy/steal Snap On patents). Are they just discovering pear shaped ratchets now? If I were them I'd be trying to make smaller, thinner ratchets. Something really innovative that helped people. Not working on a 30 year old design.

And the X wrench looks like it was designed by a 14 yr old. When you turn a bolt using a wrench, you get to a point where, assuming you have space for your hand, the side of the head hits something. For that reason, I look for wrenches with the smallest possible outer profiles. SK has always had this beautiful web (fillet) between the handle and both ends. Its attractive to look at and strong, but not functional. And their wrenches are too short.
 
F

Fedwrench

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Dec 9, 2007
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14,945
Location
Valley of the sun
They have been working a high tooth count pear head ratchet since last year at least. The new ratchet is supposed to based on their new X Frame ratcheting wrench design with multiple pawls. They talked about it at SEMA last November but, haven't released photos yet. Yesterday wasn't the first time they hinted about it on their facebook page either. I think they bring it up every so often to keep interest up. :dunno:

That SK round head ratchet pictured will probably last forever considering how many are still out there working just fine that were made in the 1960's. I don't see their ratchet design being any more behind the times than Cornwell's 30 tooth models which are like 70 years old at least. :lol: If it's not broke why fix it? I feel they are coming out with a high tooth pear head ratchet because many people just don't care for round head ratchets and they need to be competitive.
SK's standard length combination wrenches are a little on the short side because some other brand's standard length are on the long side. :lol: I don't care for their combination wrenches because, of them being wide in the hips around the boxed end but, that's just me. Part of the joy of using a fine tooth ratcheting wrench is being to move the wrench back before your hand hits something. The 1.7 degree tooth engagement on the X frame is sweet. :beer:
 
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SMKS

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Feb 14, 2010
Messages
5,832
Location
USA, planet Earth
Yup, the SK round head ratchet is just fine. It really is a tough design. I've bought many, many used ratchets -and looked at buying many more that turned out to be broken- and the SK round head is one of the ratchets that I almost never find broken. The Wright round head is another one.

As pointed out above, there are pear head ratchets like Cornwell and Proto that aren't somehow more advanced than a round head.

Nothing wrong with modern high-tooth ratchets, but there are still many jobs where the older round head designs is just fine.

Wright even updated their round head designs so it uses two pawls and has 82 clicks per revolution.
 
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Bigblue&Goldie

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Mar 12, 2009
Messages
10,663
Location
AZ
I don't understand why they are hyping them up, they are so late to the game it's ridiculous. The only reason I could see buying them at this point is if they have an ultra slim head. Light backdrag, high strength, and high tooth count can be found from every major manufacturer already.
 
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u118224

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Joined
Jun 9, 2012
Messages
535
Location
Northern MI
A lot of guys complain about SK rats on here but I wonder if they've ever used them? My go to ratchets are SK and they're super smooth with low backdrag. They're sturdy, have good handles and are bulletproof. They don't skip, accidently reverse or have any of the problems other rats have. They just work. I don't know where people are putting their ratchets that they think an SK round head wouldn't fit.
 
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Askme42

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Joined
Dec 9, 2012
Messages
2,538
Location
Goreville IL
u118224 said:
A lot of guys complain about SK rats on here but I wonder if they've ever used them? My go to ratchets are SK and they're super smooth with low backdrag. They're sturdy, have good handles and are bulletproof. They don't skip, accidently reverse or have any of the problems other rats have. They just work. I don't know where people are putting their ratchets that they think an SK round head wouldn't fit.
Click to expand...

I have to admit I really like my armstrong ratchets but the sk ratchets are smoother without a doubt. I just don't care for the feel in my hand on most of them.
 
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Bigblue&Goldie

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Messages
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Location
AZ
u118224 said:
A lot of guys complain about SK rats on here but I wonder if they've ever used them? My go to ratchets are SK and they're super smooth with low backdrag. They're sturdy, have good handles and are bulletproof. They don't skip, accidently reverse or have any of the problems other rats have. They just work. I don't know where people are putting their ratchets that they think an SK round head wouldn't fit.
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They aren't bad ratchets, they just aren't as nice as a Dual 80. I prefer a pear head, so my set never got used and I sold them. They are tougher than nails though!
 
R

Ruger_556

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Joined
Dec 8, 2013
Messages
4,005
You guys complain about every single thing SK does or doesn't do... They come out with a USA made, fine tooth, modified open end, ratcheting wrench and all anyone can do is ***** that it looks different. They say they are coming out with a pear head ratchet and they're too late to the game and no one will buy any, you guys do realize that there are people who haven't already got eighteen Dual-80's in their box or maybe even any ratchets at all that will want to buy these in the future?
 
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Askme42

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Messages
2,538
Location
Goreville IL
Ruger_556 said:
You guys complain about every single thing SK does or doesn't do... They come out with a USA made, fine tooth, modified open end, ratcheting wrench and all anyone can do is ***** that it looks different. They say they are coming out with a pear head ratchet and they're too late to the game and no one will buy any, you guys do realize that there are people who haven't already got eighteen Dual-80's in their box or maybe even any ratchets at all that will want to buy these in the future?
Click to expand...

Plus the way I see it is SK is under new ownership and have showing they would like to be innovative moving forward.



That's a good thing.
 
H

hangfirew8

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
879
Location
Central Maryland
Adam.C said:
I personally would like more details. Why do they think that round head ratchet willl last 60 years? Did they test it to see if it could still transmit the same torque as a new one?

SK ratchets are 30 years behind the rest of the industry (i.e. companies who copy/steal Snap On patents). Are they just discovering pear shaped ratchets now? If I were them I'd be trying to make smaller, thinner ratchets. Something really innovative that helped people. Not working on a 30 year old design.

And the X wrench looks like it was designed by a 14 yr old. When you turn a bolt using a wrench, you get to a point where, assuming you have space for your hand, the side of the head hits something. For that reason, I look for wrenches with the smallest possible outer profiles. SK has always had this beautiful web (fillet) between the handle and both ends. Its attractive to look at and strong, but not functional. And their wrenches are too short.
Click to expand...

I can't dispute a lot of this, yes SK is behind the curve because of ownership and financial problems. Now we are starting to see more new designs. However SK is hardly the only maker to continue to make tough, proven old designs.

As for "their wrenches are too short", they also have Long Pattern wrenches. :lol_hitti

I elected to get the standards in 12 point and the longs in 6 point, and that has worked out well for me.
 
A

Adam.C

Banned
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Jan 29, 2013
Messages
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hangfirew8 said:
I can't dispute a lot of this, yes SK is behind the curve because of ownership and financial problems. Now we are starting to see more new designs. However SK is hardly the only maker to continue to make tough, proven old designs.

As for "their wrenches are too short", they also have Long Pattern wrenches. :lol_hitti

I elected to get the standards in 12 point and the longs in 6 point, and that has worked out well for me.
Click to expand...

You don't get out of financial trouble by remaking old technology. They have to market to 20 something's if they hope to develop a loyal following. Hype won't do it.

SKs wrenches are tiny. Std length is a few mm longer than snap on shorts. SK long pattern aren't as long as Snap On std length.

If it were me, I'd be looking to make titanium ratchets or wrenches with rubber over grips. Or neon colored composite ratchets with built in LED lights. Something, ANYTHING new.
 
S

SK Eric

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 3, 2015
Messages
109
Adam.C said:
I personally would like more details. Why do they think that round head ratchet willl last 60 years? Did they test it to see if it could still transmit the same torque as a new one?

SK ratchets are 30 years behind the rest of the industry (i.e. companies who copy/steal Snap On patents). Are they just discovering pear shaped ratchets now? If I were them I'd be trying to make smaller, thinner ratchets. Something really innovative that helped people. Not working on a 30 year old design.

And the X wrench looks like it was designed by a 14 yr old. When you turn a bolt using a wrench, you get to a point where, assuming you have space for your hand, the side of the head hits something. For that reason, I look for wrenches with the smallest possible outer profiles. SK has always had this beautiful web (fillet) between the handle and both ends. Its attractive to look at and strong, but not functional. And their wrenches are too short.
Click to expand...

Lots of hate, there, Adam C. We will continue to manufacture the round head ratchets as well as a series of new shaped ones. There's no plans to copy anybody's tool, patented or not: we're aiming to innovate. The 14-year-old who designed the outer flange of the X Frame wrench did so because it is significantly stronger than a traditional beam wrench. The wider flare does limit movement in certain situations, which is why we have patented the 6 pawl design (designed by that same 14-year-old:lol:), which allows for a much smaller swing arc. Don't just read the advertised numbers: try one.

We're also developing a dual-paul cartridge for the traditional round head to be a direct fit and give better smoothness/strenght.
 
S

Steinmetz

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 11, 2012
Messages
2,274
Location
Washington State
Adam.C said:
I personally would like more details. Why do they think that round head ratchet willl last 60 years? Did they test it to see if it could still transmit the same torque as a new one?

SK ratchets are 30 years behind the rest of the industry (i.e. companies who copy/steal Snap On patents). Are they just discovering pear shaped ratchets now? If I were them I'd be trying to make smaller, thinner ratchets. Something really innovative that helped people. Not working on a 30 year old design.

And the X wrench looks like it was designed by a 14 yr old. When you turn a bolt using a wrench, you get to a point where, assuming you have space for your hand, the side of the head hits something. For that reason, I look for wrenches with the smallest possible outer profiles. SK has always had this beautiful web (fillet) between the handle and both ends. Its attractive to look at and strong, but not functional. And their wrenches are too short.
Click to expand...

With all due respect, you're in no position to assert that SK (or anyone else) is willfully (or otherwise) infringing any valid patent. It's just your unfounded belief.
 
H

hangfirew8

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
879
Location
Central Maryland
Eric,

Looking forward to those tear drops and round head upgrades!

And don't sweat the critics. 10 years from now you may be doing everything right, except you will still be SK and not a certain other fanatically followed brand name. :)
 
J

JBradley500

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 19, 2013
Messages
781
Ruger_556 said:
You guys complain about every single thing SK does or doesn't do...
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That's pretty much it. They make nice, solid, American made tools that don't cost a fortune. While they don't have tons of groundbreaking products they are doing most everything else right in my opinion.
 
S

sk farmer

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2009
Messages
5,550
Location
nd
SK Eric said:
Lots of hate, there, Adam C. We will continue to manufacture the round head ratchets as well as a series of new shaped ones. There's no plans to copy anybody's tool, patented or not: we're aiming to innovate. The 14-year-old who designed the outer flange of the X Frame wrench did so because it is significantly stronger than a traditional beam wrench. The wider flare does limit movement in certain situations, which is why we have patented the 6 pawl design (designed by that same 14-year-old:lol:), which allows for a much smaller swing arc. Don't just read the advertised numbers: try one.

We're also developing a dual-paul cartridge for the traditional round head to be a direct fit and give better smoothness/strenght.
Click to expand...

thanks for the update eric. i am looking forward to both the new ratchet and the dual pawl rebuild kit. one thing that a lot of people like, me included is a knurled handle. nobody offers a high tooth count knurled handle ratchet. i think that would be one way to set yourselves apart and i hope to see it.

can you sharpen up the knurling on the new ratchets to make them more like the older ones? i like them the best!:thumbup::thumbup:
 
S

sk farmer

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Mar 4, 2009
Messages
5,550
Location
nd
Adam.C said:
You don't get out of financial trouble by remaking old technology. They have to market to 20 something's if they hope to develop a loyal following. Hype won't do it.

SKs wrenches are tiny. Std length is a few mm longer than snap on shorts. SK long pattern aren't as long as Snap On std length.

If it were me, I'd be looking to make titanium ratchets or wrenches with rubber over grips. Or neon colored composite ratchets with built in LED lights. Something, ANYTHING new.
Click to expand...


seriously? this is what you think sk should be? not working so well for the other "gimmick" sellers that specialize in the father's day type tools.
 
B

Bigblue&Goldie

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Messages
10,663
Location
AZ
SK Eric said:
We're also developing a dual-paul cartridge for the traditional round head to be a direct fit and give better smoothness/strenght.
Click to expand...

This is cool, makes me wish I didn't sell mine off.

I'm openly critical, but I'm glad to see SK finally revamping their line.

BTW, there are many here that would love to see the roto ratchet make a comeback.
 
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slob

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Joined
Jun 20, 2011
Messages
342
Location
Bronx, NY
sk farmer said:
seriously? this is what you think sk should be? not working so well for the other "gimmick" sellers that specialize in the father's day type tools.
Click to expand...

Exactly. In a world where you are constantly bombarded by companies trying to sucker you into buying their NEW AND IMPROVED junk, SK's design consistency is a breath of fresh air.
 
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Brownsfan

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Joined
Apr 16, 2012
Messages
5,974
Location
Cleveland Ohio
Most of my new tool purchases have gone to SK. With the exception of some closeout deals. I personally love my SK ratchets. I have finally found a local store that sells them. I can't wait to pick up a set of the ratcheting wrenches and the new ratchet. To all the people saying SK waited too long for this style ratchet. Think about this. Mac just released their fine tooth and Cornwell finally did a few years ago. The biggest reason for them not coming out with this stuff sooner is their commitment to being 100% USA made. They can't just buy parts or designs from Taiwan. They actually have to develop the design in house and manufacture it in house. No just putting their name on someone else's tool like a lot of other companies.
 
R

raiderhillbilly

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Joined
Jul 14, 2013
Messages
610
Location
NC
Adam.C said:
I personally would like more details. Why do they think that round head ratchet willl last 60 years? Did they test it to see if it could still transmit the same torque as a new one?

SK ratchets are 30 years behind the rest of the industry (i.e. companies who copy/steal Snap On patents). Are they just discovering pear shaped ratchets now? If I were them I'd be trying to make smaller, thinner ratchets. Something really innovative that helped people. Not working on a 30 year old design.

And the X wrench looks like it was designed by a 14 yr old. When you turn a bolt using a wrench, you get to a point where, assuming you have space for your hand, the side of the head hits something. For that reason, I look for wrenches with the smallest possible outer profiles. SK has always had this beautiful web (fillet) between the handle and both ends. Its attractive to look at and strong, but not functional. And their wrenches are too short.
Click to expand...

Stolen patents like this?:

http://articles.latimes.com/2001/dec/29/business/fi-rup29.10
 
S

sonvolt

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Joined
Mar 27, 2014
Messages
748
Location
Northern NJ
Ruger_556 said:
You guys complain about every single thing SK does or doesn't do... They come out with a USA made, fine tooth, modified open end, ratcheting wrench and all anyone can do is ***** that it looks different. They say they are coming out with a pear head ratchet and they're too late to the game and no one will buy any, you guys do realize that there are people who haven't already got eighteen Dual-80's in their box or maybe even any ratchets at all that will want to buy these in the future?
Click to expand...

So true, couldn't have said it better myself.
 
A

Adam.C

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Messages
1,490
SK Eric said:
Lots of hate, there, Adam C. The 14-year-old who designed the outer flange of the X Frame wrench did so because it is significantly stronger than a traditional beam wrench. The wider flare does limit movement in certain situations, which is why we have patented the 6 pawl design (designed by that same 14-year-old:lol:), which allows for a much smaller swing arc. Don't just read the advertised numbers: try one.
Click to expand...

Oh dear.
1) Your wrenches are strong enough. Don't join the pointless wrench strength race. Help me change timing belts. I don't see how the open end x frame wrench I saw would result in smaller ratchet angles.

2) the ratchet end is WAY too big.

not trying to be cute here. You guys are on the wrong track. Show this post to your boss. The X wrench is going to flop.

As for ratchets, they are strong enough too. We don't need a multi pawl ratchet in the lengths you currently produce - that's just hype and somebody else's hype at that. Super low back drag reliable ratchets that are comfortable to hold are what we need. Apply your innovation to a range of new super low profile flex head ratchets. Snap On has failed to fully develop their low pro models. That's where you should go.

Then design a range of super long, super strong ratchets with high tooth counts. If you can combine the two, you will get pro customers. Embed some sort of chip (like lo jack) seal the head and maybe you can get aerospace customers.

Call me whatever names you want. As far as I can tell, I'm the best friend your company has.
 
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Bigblue&Goldie

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Mar 12, 2009
Messages
10,663
Location
AZ
Not to gang up on SK, but since you guys market the "benefits" of the X-frame so much, when will all of your combimation wrenches be coming out with the new, improved beam design?
 
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B

Brownsfan

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Apr 16, 2012
Messages
5,974
Location
Cleveland Ohio
Also SK Eric. When should we expect these ratchets to come out ? Will they be available in all drive sizes and different lengths and flex head etc?
 
N

nikonica

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Joined
Apr 23, 2009
Messages
124
Location
Seattle
Adam.C said:
Call me whatever names you want. As far as I can tell, I'm the best friend your company has.
Click to expand...

You have an extremely narrow-minded perspective, and you present a lot of your opinions as facts. What are you compensating for?
 
W

wyo george

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Jul 24, 2014
Messages
933
Location
Wyoming, USA
I for one am excited to see the new developments coming out. I think the X frame is a bit gimmicky in the handle design, but I like the idea of the six pawl design and short throw.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
L

LB-1911

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Joined
Sep 24, 2011
Messages
5,742
Location
Northwestern Il.
Adam.C said:
If it were me, I'd be looking to make titanium ratchets or wrenches with rubber over grips. Or neon colored composite ratchets with built in LED lights. Something, ANYTHING new.
Click to expand...

There is an opening..............

:see:

The Mechanical Design Engineer is responsible for the mechanical design and development of new and existing products. This position also partners with other internal departments in the development and testing of new products, manufacturing support, market research, key account presentation, and field sales support as needed.

https://careers-idealindustries.icims.com/jobs/1382/mechincal-design-engineer/job


Good Luck
 
S

sk farmer

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Messages
5,550
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nd
Adam.C said:
Oh dear. As far as I can tell, I'm the best friend your company has.
Click to expand...

oh this little excerpt tells us a lot. i hate to break this to you sir but you are not nearly as important and knowledgeable as you think you are. i have nothing against opinions. somewhere along the line though you have become delusional enough to believe your opinions are fact. :lol_hitti
 
R

Rarified27

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Joined
Jan 22, 2010
Messages
763
Location
Between PA and NJ
There's something to be said for not constantly "innovating" as a few here have pointed out.

SK's ratchets work- they don't need to prove that anymore than they already have and if a brand that so many trust is going to put something new out that will compete with their own existing sales, believe that they're going to take their sweet *** time to get it right...even if it takes 30yrs.

If the new ratchets are garbage, so be it, but at least wait until they're released to **** all over them.
 
K

kythri

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Joined
Jan 3, 2007
Messages
6,330
Location
Lebanon, OR
Adam.C said:
What does that have to do with all the dual 80 clones out there?
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Amazing that Snap-on hasn't gone after any of these supposed patent thieves for infringing their patents...

You do realize that Snap-on didn't come up with the dual pawl concept, right?
 
P

PJNJ

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Joined
Sep 20, 2013
Messages
1,047
Location
Iowa
Adam.C said:
If it were me, I'd be looking to make titanium ratchets or wrenches with rubber over grips. Or neon colored composite ratchets with built in LED lights. Something, ANYTHING new.
Click to expand...

Adam.C said:
Then design a range of super long, super strong ratchets with high tooth counts. If you can combine the two, you will get pro customers. Embed some sort of chip (like lo jack) seal the head and maybe you can get aerospace customers.

Call me whatever names you want. As far as I can tell, I'm the best friend your company has.
Click to expand...

Neon colored ratchets with lights? Titanium ratchets and wrenches? Lojack? S-K's best friend?

Adam, usually you make at least a pretty good defense of your position and you at least try not to show any bias but I don't personally think there is much of a market for titanium ratchets (or any ratchets for that matter) with lojack built in.

:beer:
 
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