Frank Mossberg Salesman Board No. 600

Private Lugnutz · Nov 25, 2018

This is one of the boards I got from Rick, via GJ member UncleDave, on the toolboards thread, linked here. (Note that they have a Classifieds thread now, linked here.)

The board itself is just planks of wood joined by cross-pieces in the back with a water transfer Mossberg decal at the top. The nickeled hooks and stock number plates are original.

How do I know this board is the Frank Mossberg No. 600 Salesman Board?

Because it still has the remains of the original label pasted on the back.

BTW, I am looking for tips on preserving this label in place. It is in a very delicate condition. I have sprayed polyurethane right over water transfer decals with great success, but I am leery of deleterious effects on newsprint type paper which is what this label is. I thought about placing something translucent over the top and sealing that around the edges only so as not to apply anything to the paper itself. Any other ideas?

It came with a few tools, and I have a few others for it. All c. 1920's.

I plan to do just what this part of the label implores...

...just as soon as I re-arrange some things in the Lugzsonian first. Once I do, I will post additional photos

jabberwoki · Nov 25, 2018

Oooof that's gunna be a hard one to fill.

four.cycle · Nov 25, 2018

You'd be surprised how many of those screwball wrenches are listed on Ebay - Mossberg, Walden, and others.

Private Lugnutz - I would err on the side of caution with those labels - I probably don't need to tell you that.
If they're printed on "newsprint" type paper though, time is going to cause them to deteriorate. I have an antique wall mirror with a label on it like that and over the years it's just kind of fallen apart.

Other than consulting with a museum or art curator I have no ideas, other than perhaps maybe a watered-down solution of Clear Matte Acrylic Medium - something used by artists - I have a bottle of it here.
This kind of thing: https://www.dickblick.com/products/liquitex-acrylic-mediums/
I use it to thin acrylic paints, and it's also used as a "glaze" over acrylic paintings.
Again, I'd be asking somebody who does that sort of thing for a living.

I'll see if I've got anything showing that board.

BK

Private Lugnutz · Nov 25, 2018

four.cycle said:
I'll see if I've got anything showing that board.

I was hoping you'd say that. I couldn't find it in some quickie searches on Google Books or Newspapers.com. And thanks for the glaze tip, too.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 25, 2018

jabberwoki said:
Oooof that's gunna be a hard one to fill.

It came with a few and I have a few more, but yeah, not easy for sure.

Isn't it cool how the tools that were hanging on it for so many years kept the wood underneath them free of discoloration - forming an "outline", so to speak, in contrast with the darker wood around them?!

four.cycle · Nov 26, 2018

UV does crazy stuff.

I'm not saying for certain that an acrylic medium is the answer.
It's something that's used for decoupage by some people. I would imagine that it's an acid-free formula, but that seems like a no-brainer.
I actually work more with watercolor - acrylic is just something I dabble in for certain projects. The exteriors of these are done mostly with a flat (matte) acrylic. The interiors are lined with Chinese newspaper overlaid with a couple coats of clear acrylic medium:

This papier-mâché dragon is coated with clear acrylic medium. I made it for a Christmas gift for my mother in 1965. As you can see, it provides for a pretty durable finish. This sat on her coffee table for years, and has been handled by hundreds of hands:

I'd still get a second opinion though. Somebody who restores antiques or something along that line.

I'll dig through "Mossberg" and see what I can come up with.

BK

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

four.cycle said:
I'd still get a second opinion though. Somebody who restores antiques or something along that line.

I plan to make some calls today. I'll let you know what I find out.

(What did she put inside the cleverly hinged jaws?

)

All,

4.c's digging, sent to me via email, resulted in several ads for the No. 600 Salesman board in several hardware store catalogs between 1923 and 1927, which is the "c.1920's" period I had figured for this board based on the tools on it.

The ads also helped me understand that these were "easel back" boards, not meant for hanging, but free-standing, with a third leg propping it up in the back like an easel leg on a chain or something like that. You can see a notch in the top cross-piece where the third "easel" leg would've gone, as well as an eye screw, almost certainly for a retaining chain for the leg.

Thirdly, the ads confirm what the label on the back implies - that there was probably another label on the front at the top with the tools list printed on it. That label, like the one that remains in part on the back, was probably newsprint paper and long gone. Making me want to redouble my efforts to save the one on the back before it has the same fate.

Here is one of the more vibrant ads...

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

I will be making an easel leg for this board. Probably not out of "second growth chestnut", though.

Unless I can find and salvage something suitably similar in the wild. Old barn wood, etc.

MR.X · Nov 26, 2018

On my way to Moab from Denver I stopped in Grand Junction and saw this in the window of an antique mall. Logo was on both sides.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

Looks like same logo/era. I'm on my phone today - is that an 8-drawer chest up on a stool?

tin medic · Nov 26, 2018

It is an 8 drawer.

four.cycle · Nov 26, 2018

Private Lugnutz said:
(What did she put inside the cleverly hinged jaws? )

It was intended to be used as a cigarette box. We always had lots of cigarette boxes all around the house when I was a kid. :wtf:

It's been empty for decades, though.
The "hinges" were just cotton twine, but they've rotted away over the years.

twertsy · Nov 26, 2018

Any ideas on the price of that box? It's pretty cool...…...

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

Haha. Already PMd him for the store name. I already have people checking their windows. Lol

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

four.cycle said:
It was intended to be used as a cigarette box.

That would explain the rectangular shape of the jaws!

My maternal grandfather quit smoking when he was 46. Heart attack etc. Started chewing gum instead. Remember Chiclets? Yellow pack? Problem is when it got stale instead of getting up to spit it out, he would roll it up into a ball between his fingers and leave it somewhere. The arm rest. A side table. The windowsill. My grandmother would always give him heck for it, but it didn't change anything. So I made him a little ceramic baseball glove one year. Perfect size for a "ball" of gum to go right in the pocket. :lol:

twertsy · Nov 26, 2018

Private Lugnutz said:
Haha. Already PMd him for the store name. I already have people checking their windows. Lol

Google is your friend...…..already found the store.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

It's already packed and shipped! :lol:

Kidding. I did talk to someone, though. If they get additional inquiries, the price is definitely going to go up, not down!

LesserSon · Nov 26, 2018

Private Lugnutz said:
I will be making an easel leg for this board. Probably not out of "second growth chestnut", though. Unless I can find and salvage something suitably similar in the wild. Old barn wood, etc.

Despite being effectively extinct, American chestnut should not be difficult to source. In addition to being a typical barn wood, like you mention, it’s the base wood under a lot of oak veneer furniture. I also see solid chestnut kitchen tables and their extra leaves at yard sales in the $25 range on occasion. And I have some scraps. My dogs have chewed a fair amount of chestnut furniture over the years. What dimensions do you need for the leg?
Also, I agree with four.cycle that acrylic is a better bet than polyurethane, if you decide to seal that label. Poly just can’t handle UV long term, even when it’s stuffed with UV- inhibiters. But I’m not sure sealing it is the right thing.
Problem is, the chestnut will continue to expand and contract seasonally, while the paper fibers will lock up in almost any fininsh you put over it. Eventually, the difference will split the paper apart, not just where the boards meet, like now. I wonder if something like glycerine might be better? Something that keeps the paper supple and allows expansion with moisture. Definitely a question for a paper conservator. Doing nothing might be the answer, too.
Tell me you saved the bits that came off with the tape. I can see the tape stole a little of the ink in places. There was a bit in the upper left corner (the red box) that worried me enough that I snapped a picture of it when I was loading it.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

LesserSon said:
I can see the tape stole a little of the ink in places.

It did, unfortunately. I was literally cringing with disbelief and fright as I tried to get it off without ruining the label. I thought I did pretty well under the circumstances. I felt like a plastic surgeon and a safecracker, that's how slowly and painstaking it was. (I have recommended to UncleDave and Rick to be more careful with their other pieces - although I don't think any of them are so old as to have newsprint stock paper labels. I don't think they realized how important it was to the provenance of the piece. Some guys are all and only about the wrenches!

)

woody 73 · Nov 26, 2018

Private the tool boards are beautiful, please tell me that in your last will and testament you will pass a few of them on to a some kind of tool museum. If not the next buyer will store them in their man cave and they will be again lost to time.

I gave every military item my uncle brought back from Nazi Germany to the Holocaust museum in Washington DC; so that many people could see it, not just the few people that would come to my small man cave.

Woody

Private Lugnutz · Nov 26, 2018

Glad you like the boards, Woody.

With all due respect, I don't share your altruistic sentiment about WWII memorabilia (having split up my father's, uncle's and great aunt's stuff with my brothers) or your opinion about the deleterious effects of personal antique and vintage tool collections on our collective historical record.

While I have visited many fine tool museums (including the Smithsonian, Davistown, Newton, Ford, the Trolley Museum in San Francisco, Allaire Village in NJ, West Point, among others) and recognize and admire their purpose and mission, there is no bigger museum, and no greater level of attention to detail and passion, than virtual places such as Tools Archive, Alloy Artifacts, and right here on Garage Journal. In fact, while it's always nice to see the real things in person, the idea that the history of antique and vintage American tool manufacturing could be saved in any number of museums is a pipe (wrench) dream, I would say we collectively do a better job of research, preservation, and presentation right here than most museums, and, without private collections and collectors, we would collectively know very little about these manufacturers and their products than we do right now.

LesserSon · Nov 27, 2018

That is well said, Lugz.
When I was a child, I frequently used and admired a treadle-powered jigsaw my grandfather owned. Later, my father donated the saw to a museum. The museum acknowledged the gift, but never displayed it. If I understand correctly, it sold the saw and used the proceeds toward its operating costs. No reason it couldn’t have been to a PRIVATE COLLECTOR.
This happens A LOT. It is unusual for museums of any sort to put their entire holdings on display in a lifetime, so a LOT of items languish in long-term storage, unseen and untouched. Are they better off? Is the public?
Edit: it looked like this one on eBay (sorry to the denizens of the future when the photos are removed by eBay.)

MR.X · Nov 27, 2018

Here's one. Shorter (36") and tool #'s ( DOE's ?) stamped into the wood. I think this one was hung rather than standing. Looks like it maybe had something paper tacked onto the back too. No evidence of nickel on hooks.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 27, 2018

Narrower, too, looks like. The logo is outstanding, way more vivid in color than mine. And I think you are right about the DOE wrenches. They were 2XX model number series and that's what the hooks are spaced for.

Four.cycle kindly sent me a bunch of 1920's hardware store ads. There were three different kinds of boards in these particular ads, the No. 600 (mine), which was the largest, the No. "D", which was very small (with only three speed handles on it), and a No. 2500, which was 30" x 20", with 12 tools on it. That's an interesting board. They promoted it as the 3 most frequently used sizes - 1/2", 9/16" and 5/8", on the 4 different types of handles they made. There are 6 Tee handles, 3 Ell (or Offset) handles, and 3 Speeders.

No DOE boards, though I am sure they would turn up in ads with more digging.

four.cycle · Nov 27, 2018

did a little more digging. am I close?

1918 Automobile Trade Journal Mossberg wrench ad pp 361.jpg

MR.X if you want that full size send me an email addy via PM. BK

Private Lugnutz · Nov 27, 2018

That's it. So MR. X has the No. X.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 27, 2018

BTW, 4.c, I talked to two different antique furniture people today, in person, at our local antiques center. They both showed me a couple pieces with shipping tags and another with the maker's info that they had glazed over with what they called homemade "Modge Podge". PVA glue and water, 3:1 mix. It goes on milky but dries clear. Acid free. I'm going to test it on an old chiffonier I have with a paper tag on it.

LesserSon · Nov 27, 2018

I checked the label on some of Mrs LesserSon’s Mod Podge, no ingredients listed. But it does seem it’s intended for use on paper, provided humidity is controlled and mold inhibited. We did some jigsaw puzzles with it a few years ago, and they’ve held up in pretty different environments.

four.cycle · Nov 28, 2018

^ Just a wild guess, but I'd bet money marbles and chalk that "Mod Podge" is just another variant of an acrylic medium.

Clear acrylic medium (matte or gloss) looks like Elmer's Glue when it's in the bottle - white milky color - and goes on kind of cloudy and then dries clear.
It can be diluted with water.

Something tells me you're going to have to make a phone call to the factory to find out exactly what it's made out of, because odds are your local retailer doesn't have anybody on the payroll who has that kind of product knowledge.

Sounds like you're on the right track though - you want something rather benign (check), something that won't crack, rot, peel, blister or turn yellow when exposed to UV (check), acid free (check), and easy peasy (check.)

Generally acrylic is applied with a fairly stiff bristle brush, but if the paper is as fragile as I would imagine it is, if it was me I'd buy a 3/4" flat squirrel hair ("Camel hair") watercolor brush (soft soft), dilute the solution (about 3:1 as mentioned above) and lay on a thin coat first, followed by maybe one or two more thin coats. Acrylic dries to recoat in 30-45 minutes - dries hard overnight. Wash the brush between coats with regular soap and water (Not "Dawn" - the most aggressive I use on any of my watercolor/acrylic brushes is Ivory liquid.)
Even better would be to use a flat sumi wash brush:

Just my two cents.

LesserSon · Nov 28, 2018

https://plaidonline.com/eduPDF/mod-podge-ebook.pdf
Looks to me like there are different formulations for different applications. The stuff I have smelled like polyvinyl acetate glue, like Lugz said.
I’ve used artists’ acrylic medium in painting, and it smells a lot like waterbourne “polyurethane” products like this pic.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 28, 2018

four.cycle said:
Something tells me you're going to have to make a phone call to the factory to find out exactly what it's made out of.

Just to re-clarify, 4.c, what I'll be doing is making my own. "Mod Podge" is the brand name. "Modge Podge" is the unofficial street name in the hobby for making it yourself (apparently the brand-name stuff is pricey...) with PVA glue (e.g., Elmer's) and water.

LesserSon said:
I’ve used artists’ acrylic medium in painting, and it smells a lot like waterbourne “polyurethane” products like this pic.

I have had great success preserving vintage toolbox decals with regular polyurethane and acrylic rattle can sprays, and those were paper or foil labels, but they seem more substantive than this, and on steel, not wood. As I said to Todd in this very short thread on the subject, the oils in polyurethane will turn a white decal yellow. It's fine on every other color. I've never thought about a water-based polyurethane - probably because my cheapass self was looking to use whatever I had on hand.

MR.X · Nov 28, 2018

Private Lugnutz said:
That's it. So MR. X has the No. X.

Hi. Not trying to beat this to death but I probably didn't give enough info for a positive ID. My board is shorter than that X in the AD and the numbers are 2XX series on the top two rows and 12XX ( "S" shaped DOE's) on the bottom row.

twertsy · Nov 29, 2018

MR.X said:
Hi. Not trying to beat this to death but I probably didn't give enough info for a positive ID. My board is shorter than that X in the AD and the numbers are 2XX series on the top two rows and 12XX ( "S" shaped DOE's) on the bottom row.

Damn cool piece Mr. X.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 29, 2018

MR.X said:
My board is shorter than that X in the AD and the numbers are 2XX series on the top two rows and 12XX ( "S" shaped DOE's) on the bottom row.

I didn't see a board with that configuration in any of the ads I've been through so far, but I'll go through them again. While it's neat to know the board number, since they numbered them (though very oddly, with no apparent logical pattern - D, X, NS, 600, 2500, etc?), you have the wrench numbers for the fifteen (15) wrenches to fill that board. So let's get crackin'.

MR.X · Nov 29, 2018

twertsy said:
Damn cool piece Mr. X.

Thanks.

Private Lugnutz said:
you have the wrench numbers for the fifteen (15) wrenches to fill that board. So let's get crackin'.

I have used this as a key rack in the past but I can guarantee you that i will not be chasing the wrenches identified on this board.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 29, 2018

MR.X said:
I have used this as a key rack in the past but I can guarantee you that i will not be chasing the wrenches identified on this board.

Key rack is a great idea! Admittedly, I may resort to hanging any Mossberg pieces I have on mine. I have roughly 1/3rd of the pieces I need, but most of the missing pieces are fairly obscure, and, murphyslawishly, the 8 or 9 other Mossberg pieces I have do not go on this board. (I'd be better off with that danged 8-drawer chest in Grand Junction! While it was probably intended for wrenches, a collector could throw just about anything that would fit in those drawers and none the wiser!

)

MR.X · Nov 29, 2018

Hey Lugz, yeah, your board is cool whether the pieces find you or not.

Anyone not familiar with Frank Mossberg might look him up, bikes, cars, Panama Canal, WW1 & WW2 artillery, Edison, 200 patents. Dude was killin' it.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 29, 2018

Yup. And strangely, I am not sure if he was related to the other Mossberg, Oscar, of firearms fame. Both from Wurmland, both emigrated in late 1880's, both in Massachusetts. Maybe Todd knows.

Is that a letter opener? 3baygarage has a cool complimentary piece, too. Can't remember what it is offhand, though. Maybe a key fob. Or something like that.

MR.X · Nov 29, 2018

yep, letter opener.

Private Lugnutz · Nov 29, 2018

Nice piece.

Frank Mossberg Salesman Board No. 600

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