110 volts vs 220

[Chasbec]

I just purchased a new combination belt/disk sander with a 1 HP motor. It comes prewired for 110 but can be rewired for 220. I have both available in my shop. I've always wondered about this and now have the right place to ask the question: Are there any benefits from having a machine rewired to 220?

 

[MEngineer]

Yes, absolutely.

If you look at the data plate, you will notice that there are 2 voltages as noted (110 and 220) but you should also note that there are amperages associated with each voltage. The amperage associated with the 220 voltage should be approximately 1/2 of the amperage of the 110 volt option.

 

[sberry]

Where did you learn this?

 

[Fixin'Stuff]

Yes, absolutely.

If you look at the data plate, you will notice that there are 2 voltages as noted (110 and 220) but you should also note that there are amperages associated with each voltage. The amperage associated with the 220 voltage should be approximately 1/2 of the amperage of the 110 volt option.

Amperage determines wire gauge, not voltage. (within reason) and amperage is what makes your power meter spin around. The fewer amps you use, the lower your power bill.

The current is cut in half, but the voltage is doubled. Ohm's Law states that Current times Voltage = Watts, proving that you use the same amount of power either way. Your power bill won't change.

 

[Chasbec]

I'm interested in seeing the conclusion of the electric bill aspect, but does 220 volts provide any benefits to the way the tool performs? With a sander, slowing or stalling can be an issue. Would 220 volts help prevent this?

 

[cybrdyke]

You dont pay for amps. You pay for watts....1000's of them....by the hour.
CD

 

[Know Wosad]

At a 1 hp rating you won't see any advantage in performance other than the fact that most people(not me) have many different receptacles on each breaker. When, for instance, a microwave, refrig and toaster oven are on the same break, and the wife cranks the whole line at once....same with tools. A bandsaw and drill press running and someone pulls the trigger on a 110 mig or cranks up a table saw etc.there comes the current drop and you can hear it, IF the breaker doesn't pop. 220 is(should) have a breaker for each receptacle.In all reality a shop should have a dedicated 20 or 30 amp for each 2 socket receptacle.I just put a dedicated one on the outside wall. 30 amp on a 10/3, 2 socket. I can plug the grinder in one, a 140 mig in the other and go at it out there. I'm not good enough to operate them both at once, although I've been known to say I can

 

[Coolerman]

One benefit of wiring for 220V is that you can use smaller wire to connect it. This means you can make longer runs from the breaker panel. However, your breaker for that circuit will be more expensive as it will be a 2 pole breaker. May be a wash cost wise.
Your tool will start faster with 220V and have more torque and may even will run cooler.
I re-wired my table saw for 220V and it made a noticeable difference when cutting thick boards. YMMV

 

[sberry]

At a 1 hp rating you won't see any advantage in performance other than the fact that most people(not me) have many different receptacles on each breaker. When, for instance, a microwave, refrig and toaster oven are on the same break, and the wife cranks the whole line at once....same with tools. A bandsaw and drill press running and someone pulls the trigger on a 110 mig or cranks up a table saw etc.there comes the current drop and you can hear it, IF the breaker doesn't pop. 220 is(should) have a breaker for each receptacle.In all reality a shop should have a dedicated 20 or 30 amp for each 2 socket receptacle.I just put a dedicated one on the outside wall. 30 amp on a 10/3, 2 socket. I can plug the grinder in one, a 140 mig in the other and go at it out there. I'm not good enough to operate them both at once, although I've been known to say I can

A dedicated recept for 30A means just that, it is not for a duplex where other equipment that is designed for 20A to be plugged in to. The use of 10 wire is code legal but not always preferred or needed when plugging in something that has a 14 cord anyway and often allows for more current at starts which actually increases the potential to trip a breaker.
For the original poster, plug it in and use it. There are places that the wire efficiency may make a little difference but this is mostly placebo with this kind of equipment, if a table saw was being used in production it would be possible and really less likely for breaker trips being a problem than anything else. A 20A breaker on 120V trips easier than a 10A load on a 20A breaker at 240.

I just purchased a new combination belt/disk sander with a 1 HP motor. It comes prewired for 110 but can be rewired for 220. I have both available in my shop. I've always wondered about this and now have the right place to ask the question: Are there any benefits from having a machine rewired to 220?

Run is first to see before fixing it for a problem that isn't there.

 

[Norcal]

If the motor is rated 110/220 must be a ChiCom tool as 115/230 is the NEMA standard voltage, for a 1 HP motor there is no advantage to running it on 240 V
volts, 1 1/2 HP could be better off depending on how hard it's used. As 120V receptacles are more common makes more sense to me to use 120V.

 

[zmaxmotorsports]

If the motor is rated 110/220 must be a ChiCom tool as 115/230 is the NEMA standard voltage, for a 1 HP motor there is no advantage to running it on 240 V
volts, 1 1/2 HP could be better off depending on how hard it's used. As 120V receptacles are more common makes more sense to me to use 120V.

I think most people have just grown up hearing 110/220,so they just stick with it is all.
Although depending on where youre working at Ive seen voltages between between 110-120 on a pretty regular basis.

 

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

test the voltage in your house with a voltmeter, it is almost never exactly 120. Mine usually hovers around ~119 or so.

 

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

220v lines in US household power also usually have higher amps, because it's actually 2 hot lines (red and black) on opposite legs... I believe?

 

[Alchymist]

One benefit of wiring for 220V is that you can use smaller wire to connect it. This means you can make longer runs from the breaker panel. However, your breaker for that circuit will be more expensive as it will be a 2 pole breaker. May be a wash cost wise.
Your tool will start faster with 220V and have more torque and may even will run cooler.
I re-wired my table saw for 220V and it made a noticeable difference when cutting thick boards. YMMV

This is true ONLY if the 120v circuit was inadequate, ie long run, small wire, poor connections, etc. As previously posted, watts is watts, just make sure it's delivered properly.

 

[Alchymist]

220v lines in US household power also usually have higher amps, because it's actually 2 hot lines (red and black) on opposite legs... I believe?

Not really, unless some really big machines are running. For a given load, the current will be 1/2 of what it would be on 120. Where power requirements get above 2 hp is where 240 comes into play.

 

[aptdweller]

Wiring to either voltage will have no impact on the power it draws. At higher hp, it is wiser to use 240 v, as you are less likely to trip the breaker if you load it down.

In general, the 240 v option is better in that you have fewer amps flowing and therefore less heat generated. Unless you plan on using this all the time, I would wire it 120 v just so that I wouldn't take up another 240 v receptacle.

 

[Chasbec]

Thanks for all the feedback. Since it's pretty unanimous that there isn't much advantage to going with 220, I'll just plug it in to the regular 110 (or 120?) outlet and use it wired as it comes out of the box. Hopefully, with 1 HP, it won't bog down or stall too easily like my old Craftsman benchtop model that just finally bought the farm. It was cheap but held up well through 15-20 years of heavy use and abuse.

 

[Radix2]

Just to be clear - all of the benefit is in the supply wiring due to the lower amperage at 240VAC.

Inside the motor there is no benefit since all that is happening is that the windings are connected in parallel for 120V and in series for 240v - each individual piece of wire sees the same voltage and current either way so there is no difference in how the motor works at all.

Assuming the same supply wiring gauge is used for both voltages (say 12ga) the benefit of the conversion is ending up with half the voltage loss (1/4 the power loss) in the wiring - which can be important if the wiring is marginal, or not important if the wiring is properly done with low losses to begin with.

 

[rburke65]

OMG...... Did you say 110....220??????? The electrical crazies on here will get you for that! I'm sure YOU WANT to edit that to 120 and 240! Shame on you.....

 

[gungatim]

the only benefit in MY opinion is if you are on a 120 circuit that is NOT dedicated, meaning you just plug it in anywhere, and it's pulling say 15 amps and you turn on lights and use a drill or something on the same circuit, it can pop the breaker. 220 is generally dedicated and you don't have that problem.

for a sander, I wouldn't worry about it.

if it was a 1.5 or 2hp compressor, that's another story, as it's bound to trip a breaker at the most inopportune time when it kicks on and it's on a shared circuit.

everyone else (mostly) is correct, power consumption is the same either way.

 

[My Old Tools]

Just to be clear - all of the benefit is in the supply wiring due to the lower amperage at 240VAC.

Inside the motor there is no benefit since all that is happening is that the windings are connected in parallel for 120V and in series for 240v - each individual piece of wire sees the same voltage and current either way so there is no difference in how the motor works at all.

Assuming the same supply wiring gauge is used for both voltages (say 12ga) the benefit of the conversion is ending up with half the voltage loss (1/4 the power loss) in the wiring - which can be important if the wiring is marginal, or not important if the wiring is properly done with low losses to begin with.

well said....

 

[Lassen Forge]

My experience is when running 220 over 110 (or 234 over 117, or 248 over 124, or whatever) is you get more torque. IMO it's worth it, but that's just me.

My real question is this - when someone says "110" (or 120) instead of "117" or "220" (or 240) instead of "234", why people get their knickers in a wad? I know what they mean... EVERYONE knows what they mean. Why keep beating a dead horse?

BTW - the above readings is what comes off my genset. My line voltage is thereabouts 236 and change on the average.

 

[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

I have tested many sockets with voltmeters, they're all in the 110-120 range. Never 120 exactly.

 

[Wanna Ride]

OMG...... Did you say 110....220??????? The electrical crazies on here will get you for that! I'm sure YOU WANT to edit that to 120 and 240! Shame on you.....

Agreed. People wig out over dumbshit. When someone says 110 as opposed to 120... we all know what the hell they mean.

 

[Alchymist]

My experience is when running 220 over 110 (or 234 over 117, or 248 over 124, or whatever) is you get more torque. IMO it's worth it, but that's just me.

My real question is this - when someone says "110" (or 120) instead of "117" or "220" (or 240) instead of "234", why people get their knickers in a wad? I know what they mean... EVERYONE knows what they mean. Why keep beating a dead horse?

BTW - the above readings is what comes off my genset. My line voltage is thereabouts 236 and change on the average.

If the 120 volt circuit is adequate, then the motor will produce the same torque as it would on 240. Where torque is "less" on 120, the wiring/connections are not up to snuff. The only reason to use 240 volt circuits is in ease of supplying the electrical needs of the device - ie, long runs, lighter wire for hp above 2 hp, and cost considerations in installing said circuit. In every situation where "it runs better, it has more power, it starts quicker, etc on 240), I can pretty much guarantee the 120 circuit was lacking.

 

[Ole Slewfoot]

220/230/240/217.65 circuits are immune to neutral faults too.

 

[Radix2]

If the 120 volt circuit is adequate, then the motor will produce the same torque as it would on 240. Where torque is "less" on 120, the wiring/connections are not up to snuff. The only reason to use 240 volt circuits is in ease of supplying the electrical needs of the device - ie, long runs, lighter wire for hp above 2 hp, and cost considerations in installing said circuit. In every situation where "it runs better, it has more power, it starts quicker, etc on 240), I can pretty much guarantee the 120 circuit was lacking.

you are right

and to the point - a ton of garages are struggling along on the one or two circuits that the builders put in... so that compressor is sucking on the same straw that the lights, coffeepot, and the old neon Bud sign are...


... in those cases, getting some fresh circuits in - be they 240 or just some dedicated 120 outlets - it is going to have a nice effect on the performance of tough loads like our power tools. Converting to 240 might be a good impetus to do what wouldn't happen otherwise.

 

[sberry]

My experience is when running 220 over 110 (or 234 over 117, or 248 over 124, or whatever) is you get more torque. IMO it's worth it, but that's just me.

My real question is this - when someone says "110" (or 120) instead of "117" or "220" (or 240) instead of "234", why people get their knickers in a wad? I know what they mean... EVERYONE knows what they mean. Why keep beating a dead horse?

BTW - the above readings is what comes off my genset. My line voltage is thereabouts 236 and change on the average.

The reason everyone corrects someone on the voltage is that it isn't 110 or 220. Its a 120/240 system. When someone wants to learn the right way then they will want to know the correct term. A lot of guys are talented, but a lot learn trades hand to mouth and its usually obvious when they havnt had the training. Some its impossible to send for a part even let alone sit at a parts counter and list an order.

 

[sberry]

I will 3rd the explanation quoted above. Today I tend to focus on adequate, compliant etc vs the compulsive obsession to wire and pipe 2 sizes larger than it calls for just in case,,, just in case I am special where the rest of the world is happy to leave the frickin plug alone and use it.
A garage should have a dedicated circuit or 2 for power tools very similar to kitchen counter tops. While we like to feel bad azz ant think we will create huge loads most of the time it aint so. My Bud has a couple circuits plus lights but uses pretty much 1 for all the power tools. I have a heavy table saw, my paint fan, all 1 hp 120V
We looked at a little thing the other day, all seemed like a good idea till we figure adding 60$ in equipment minimum and a couple hrs labor would same up to 3$ per year plus the equipment may not last forever and need replacement.

 

[Showkey]

I think we should compromise at .......115/230

As far "230" making more torque.........the placebo is alive and well