12pt sockets for auto work?

[BerninicaCO3]

Hi!

I've put together 3 or 4 lots of used quality tools off of craigslist, and I'm sorting through them this weekend to build an organized box.

One thing I'm wondering... I seem to have accumulated an awful lot of 12 point sockets! 5mm, 35mm; shallow, deep, chromed, impact; lots of 12pts.

Are these something that I'll *ever* use in automotive?
After all, while you need a 12pt box wrench, the ratchet can get to all angles anyway.
Do these have a strong tendency to strip hex bolts? Should I put all my 12 pts in the feebay box to resell to people who work on aircraft and big trucks and actually see 12pt, and put the profits into 6pts where I'm lacking sizes?


-Bernard

 

[mrholeshot]

Keep the quality ones, Yes you will need them one day. Good quality 12 point sockets don't round the heads off bolts any more that a 12 point wrench. It cheap quality 12 point sockets that gave them that reputaion. The Key is QUALITY. I use 12 points quite often.

 

[DrkMtnDew]

I perfer 6 pt. sockets hands down. however there is a time and a place for 12 pt. sockets, and there are more and more 12 pt. fasteners apearing. for this reason i keep a spare set of 12 pts in the back of the box. so as mrholeshot said keep the quality ones.

 

[tyndall]

As someone that works on aircraft, I can go weeks without seeing a 12pt, but if someone asks me to fix their car, I know there will be one hiding somewhere.

Keep the quality ones, Yes you will need them one day. Good quality 12 point sockets don't round the heads off bolts any more that a 12 point wrench. It cheap quality 12 point sockets that gave them that reputaion. The Key is QUALITY. I use 12 points quite often.

This is a good point. Growing up, when there was some rusty suspension bolt that didn't want to move, the first thing we grabbed was a box end wrench. No socket and breaker bar to slip off. Just a 12pt box and either foot power or a snipe. Never even seen a 6pt box. The bolt either came out or it broke. None of this rounding off you hear about.

With quality 12pts, you seldom need 6pts.

 

[hguerrero]

. Never even seen a 6pt box. The bolt either came out or it broke. None of this rounding off you hear about.

With quality 12pts, you seldom need 6pts.

i'm almost positive snap-on and cornwell have 6pt wrenches available....
maybe i'm mistaken...

 

[jay50]

i'm almost positive snap-on and cornwell have 6pt wrenches available....
maybe i'm mistaken...

i have 6 pt cmans

 

[rayzor32]

yes snap on has 6pt wrenches I have them in addition to my 12pt flank drive set, 6pts only thing that will work when the nut is too rounded/rusted for a 12pt.

Yes you will need 12pt sockets for auto work but only on 12pt fasteners.

 

[magnetnerd]

You have to use a 12pt to get the driveshaft off my Ranger. I think it's the same for most trucks.

 

[MattT]

i'm almost positive snap-on and cornwell have 6pt wrenches available....
maybe i'm mistaken...

I've got 6 point combo wrenches from Matco and Snappy.

Back to the original question you will encounter some 12 point fasteners on automotive. And as mentioned earlier quality 12 points, ideally with flank drive or equivalent, aren't the fastener rounding monsters some folks make them out to be.

 

[GeorgiaHybrid]

Yes you will need 12pt sockets for auto work but only on 12pt fasteners.

And why is that???? Funny thing, the bolts I remove don't seem to care if I use a 12 point or a 6 point socket. For that matter, they don't care if I use a 12 point boxed in wrench. If I had a cheap set of ill fitting sockets, it might be a different result but quality sockets will work just as well as a 6 point.

 

[BerninicaCO3]

Alright-- I'll keep the stuff then!
I've never in my life seen a 12-point bolt, but I imagine that that's going to change as I dig deeper into cars for my classes.

OH-- 'nother question. I also now have square drive, that is, 8-point sockets covering the gamut. Will I ever use those?

 

[RRmech]

I spent almost 30 years as a train mechanic.
Back then, the majority of the sockets I had, were the old Cman -V- logo, 12 point sockets.
I had too many problems from previous mechanics, who used knuckle busters, and rounded off bolt heads.
I went to 6 point sockets (used MAC and Snap-On mostly), and I NEVER went back to the 12 point sockets.

Steve

 

[jay50]

i'm almost positive snap-on and cornwell have 6pt wrenches available....
maybe i'm mistaken...

i have 6 pt cmans

 

[hguerrero]

and the 12 point vs 6 point debate continues...never to resolve itself...

I spent almost 30 years as a train mechanic.
Back then, the majority of the sockets I had, were the old Cman -V- logo, 12 point sockets.
I had too many problems from previous mechanics, who used knuckle busters, and rounded off bolt heads.
I went to 6 point sockets (used MAC and Snap-On mostly), and I NEVER went back to the 12 point sockets.

Steve

 

[wreckercologist]

just use the damned 12 points. I don't recall having any trouble with any of my wrenches....just saying.

 

[wafrederick]

Chrysler uses 12 point too,most of the wheel bearing retaing bolts on Jeeps and full size Dodge trucks are 12 point.Included 4.0 headbolts which are a 1/2 12 point.GM uses them too,a couple bolts are 12 point in the 4L80Es.Some import axle nuts are 12 point and I have seen it on a VW so far.Kia and Hyundia headbolts are 12mm 12 point.Encountered this on a Hyundia Sante Fe when pulling the head off due the valves bending because of a broken timing belt.Even some ARP nuts and bolts are 12 point.

 

[MrMark]

Craftsman 12 pt V series without the Flank drive feature will round bolts. New Craftsman 12 pt have the corner relief and should work nearly as well as 6 pts.

 

[mrholeshot]

I spent almost 30 years as a train mechanic.
Back then, the majority of the sockets I had, were the old Cman -V- logo, 12 point sockets.
I had too many problems from previous mechanics, who used knuckle busters, and rounded off bolt heads.
I went to 6 point sockets (used MAC and Snap-On mostly), and I NEVER went back to the 12 point sockets.

Steve

I'll keep that in mind if I buy a train.

 

[Gary S]

I've been using my Craftsman 12 point sockets to do all my auto mechanic work for 40 years and I'm still happy with them.

 

[jay50]

and the 12 point vs 6 point debate continues...never to resolve itself...

.......................

 

[bmxr4life87]

You will need them sooner or later so I'd keep atleast a set of metric and standard craftsman or better preferrably flank drive type
I use mine mainly to remove ujoint strap bolts but depending what u work on they will get used more on german cars than american

 

[klhitman]

needed a 12pt for a flywheel today

 

[tyndall]

OH-- 'nother question. I also now have square drive, that is, 8-point sockets covering the gamut. Will I ever use those?

Sometimes. Brass plugs in water jackets and oil passages come to mind. I think some transmissions have squares for adjusting the bands. TF727 maybe?

 

[DrkMtnDew]

OH-- 'nother question. I also now have square drive, that is, 8-point sockets covering the gamut. Will I ever use those?

most the time a square plug can be removed with an open end wrench. but for badly rusted or brass fitting it is usually safer to use the 8pt. socket. and sometime an open end wrench just won't fit, so keep the sockets.

 

[MattT]

OH-- 'nother question. I also now have square drive, that is, 8-point sockets covering the gamut. Will I ever use those?

A lot of pipe plugs are square head. You may encounter them on automotive drain plugs. Also useful for square headed coach bolts. And some folks use them to drive taps but they're not as good as tap sockets for that.

 

[BerninicaCO3]

Damn, and here I was thinking that I'd resell all the 12pts and have money back in my pocket and all.... Just kidding

For 6pts it's easier to tell if something has flankdrive, the curve isn't always exaggerated but it's there. How do I tell which 12pts have flank drive?

I've got SK, snappy, cornwell to choose from: depending on the size maybe one of all three! Maybe a wright or a matco. All other things being equal, and if I have two full sets in a couple brands, who makes your favorite 12pt? Or rather: which ones feature flank drive?


...just musing; while I haven't seen a 12pt bolt yet, they are going to be stronger than 6pt (more contact, just like an 80-tooth ratchet if it has a wider pawl). Wonder if the industry is going to use more and more of them?
That, or spline, or external torx.
What I'm waiting to see go away for good is the phillips: maybe they were easier to forge back in 1930s? I was surprised to learn that they came a good 20+ years after square drive. But that lateral component/vector to the design that drives the bit out and away from the hole so that you're always stripping them... VERY irritating!

 

[Krokodil]

I only own 12pt and never had a problem.

 

[D9H 90V]

I was using a 12pt Snap on socket to torque the main cap bolts on the diesel engine im rebuilding to 111 ft. lbs. today, which by the way were hex head bolts, no problem there

 

[dwm]

As mentioned previously, 12 point fasteners are fairly common on wheel bearings. Large, high torque fasteners. One of my own cars has 36mm 12-point nuts there, for which I use a Snap-On 36mm 12-point (3/4" drive).

There's nothing wrong with using quality 12-point sockets on hex heads. I prefer 6-point on hex heads, but others feel differently.

 

[MattT]

For 6pts it's easier to tell if something has flankdrive, the curve isn't always exaggerated but it's there. How do I tell which 12pts have flank drive?

They'll be radiused where the fastener corners go instead of sharp angles.

I've got SK, snappy, cornwell to choose from: depending on the size maybe one of all three! Maybe a wright or a matco. All other things being equal, and if I have two full sets in a couple brands, who makes your favorite 12pt? Or rather: which ones feature flank drive?

Modern production is pretty much all flank drive or equivalent. Snap-on introduced it with patent protection in the '60's. Most tool companies started rolling out their versions in the '90's. All else being equal I'd keep the Snap-on. Better tools for the most part and better/wider warranty coverage for sure. IME Matco trucks are rare and I've never seen a Cornwell truck.

...just musing; while I haven't seen a 12pt bolt yet, they are going to be stronger than 6pt (more contact, just like an 80-tooth ratchet if it has a wider pawl). Wonder if the industry is going to use more and more of them?
That, or spline, or external torx.

What the industry will probably do is wait until we've all bought tools to cover everything they're currently using then introduce yet another pointless fastener head type which forces us to buy even more tools