2 post car lift anchored from above :-)

[Dave Montgomery]

So I bought a cheaper tho seemingly very nice car lift from Greg Smith co. I've had car lifts before but never really thought about anchoring them from above, besides below... I've always felt a bit (quite a bit) uncomfortable getting under cars on lifts having the crazy(?) notion that it could tip over on me. So, my new lift is tall and is just below the garage rafters so I believe I will attach the posts up there somehow. Doesn't that sound like a good idea?

 

[moriboy]

Hmmm, interesting idea. I'll be watching this thread for responses....

 

[robalmal]

I remember this has been discussed before and I think the general consensus was that it was not a good idea..Something about the hoist is designed to flex if necessary and not bring the roof down.

 

[sberry]

Do it like it says in the instructions.

 

[Bluevista]

Attach the car to the ceiling after you get it up on the lift?

The vehicle slipping off the pads is what'll get you. Those single and two post lifts scare me and I was the go-to guy to set the lift arms and pads when I worked at gas stations in my youth.
If it's a single or double post and it sways enough to be of concern it isn't worth the risk of having unless you have a death wish IMO.
I have a four post and it's not about to fall over.
It will sway a tiny bit side to side if you push on it real hard but things have to be flexible or they break.

 

[unslow1]

Pretty much every shop in America has 1-10 of those two post lifts in use 5 days a week. Mount it according to the specs from the maker. Just make sure you always use the locks. Four post lifts fail also. If you are worried let a pro mount your lift and don't buy the cheapest thing you can find.


https://www.google.com/search?q=fou...hVJ5SYKHXeFD3MQ9QEIQzAG#imgrc=e8Q_bjY_pjvVrM:

 

[koditten]

When I was installing mine, I ran out of time before I could bore the anchor holes. I got hit with a huge amount of overtime and knew I would not find time to finish the job. I worried about the hoist free standing for the next month.

Made bracket that I lagged to the roof trusses. I used heavy duty web straps to go from lift post to the ceiling mounts.

I ended up leaving the the web straps in place. I use them to tell if I have the vehicle properly positioned on the hoist. Depending on the balance, I can see sag in the web straps.

I think it works very well and have no desire to change it.

 

[RVDan]

A friend of mine has his two post anchored to the roof and epoxied to the floor. He. Oils to drill the floor because of the heated floor.

It's been about ten years. He hasn't got killed yet.

 

[Daedalus]

I find it baffling why anyone would want to second guess the integrity of a solid steel structure soundly anchored to a concrete slab, and instead fasten it to a wooden structure that was never envisioned or designed to take those loads.

I keep wondering if people who insist on 2 cubic yard lift footers have any qualms with getting in elevators or flying in airplanes.

 

[RVDan]

I don't have qualms about getting in an airplane built of aluminum conduit and fabric powered by a snowmobile engine, so I certainly don't worry about the lift being attached to the roof.

 

[RWorth]

I have my left column bolted to the floor per instructions and tied it to the building on the top. It is very solid, doesn't move under load, and I use that post as a single hoist for unloading heavy objects from my truck and lifting my tractor, and sometimes just as an adjustable table or wood rack.

My right post is hanging from a 30' I-beam in the center of my shop on a trolly and is pinned to the floor with 7/8" drop in pins, the top I bolt to the beam with 4 7/8" grade 8 bolts. I roll it to the end of the shop when not in use.

I did it a few years ago. I pay attention more to balance now because the posts don't sway at all so I make sure I'm balance properly before I go up.

 

[wssix99]

There are other threads where this is discussed and illustrated why it's a bad idea, so I won't rehash that here. (There is a very high probability that doing that will damage your roof, a complete certainty that it won't make your lift safer, and will create a greater danger by introducing the possibility that your roof could now fall down on you if something goes wrong.)

All lift instructions call for using auxiliary stands under the car, when at height to help stabilize the load:

^ You don't see professionals using these often, but (if you are like me and enjoy being 3 dimensional) you might consider an investment in some with your lift.


Some more food for thought:
- Professional engineers, from multiple disciplines, write the lift instructions. To cover all the bases (mechanical, structural, civil) for a lift, you are looking at a minimum of 10-15 years of intense technical education and apprenticeship standing behind the designs and procedures. - This is similar to a medical situation, but none of us ever see the doctor and strike up a conversation like, "Hi doc, you know; Everyone does this a certain way, but I think I'd really like to explore doing that colonoscopy through my mouth."

- If you are are concerned about your saftey, maybe the least expensive lift isn't the best choice? (If you do go that way, that may be more reason to buy some accessory stands and use them.)

 

[T_R]

It's a bad idea. The forces of the lift post moving around will exert into your roof. All lift posts move some, lighter duty ones more than heavy, it's normal. If the roof structure moves around you get weakness and/or leaks.

 

[coldh2o]

There are other threads where this is discussed and illustrated why it's a bad idea, so I won't rehash that here. (There is a very high probability that doing that will damage your roof, a complete certainty that it won't make your lift safer, and will create a greater danger by introducing the possibility that your roof could now fall down on you if something goes wrong.)

All lift instructions call for using auxiliary stands under the car, when at height to help stabilize the load:

^ You don't see professionals using these often, but (if you are like me and enjoy being 3 dimensional) you might consider an investment in some with your lift.


Some more food for thought:
- Professional engineers, from multiple disciplines, write the lift instructions. To cover all the bases (mechanical, structural, civil) for a lift, you are looking at a minimum of 10-15 years of intense technical education and apprenticeship standing behind the designs and procedures. - This is similar to a medical situation, but none of us ever see the doctor and strike up a conversation like, "Hi doc, you know; Everyone does this a certain way, but I think I'd really like to explore doing that colonoscopy through my mouth."

- If you are are concerned about your saftey, maybe the least expensive lift isn't the best choice? (If you do go that way, that may be more reason to buy some accessory stands and use them.)

Very well stated!

 

[lakeroadster]

2 post car lift anchored from above

"Dave Montgomery is punking everyone here".. signed, Captain Obvious.

Why else would he put a smiley face in the title of this thread?

 

[GMCGarage]

So I bought a cheaper tho seemingly very nice car lift from Greg Smith co. I've had car lifts before but never really thought about anchoring them from above, besides below... I've always felt a bit (quite a bit) uncomfortable getting under cars on lifts having the crazy(?) notion that it could tip over on me. So, my new lift is tall and is just below the garage rafters so I believe I will attach the posts up there somehow. Doesn't that sound like a good idea?

Could be done.
Check the design and make sure the post, connections, etc are all designed for the tension.
Alot more to consider than just compression loads.
Most structural failures are due to bad connections.

 

[rsanter]

They are designed for use connected only at the bottom.
When I was at the Petersen Auto museaum they have two 2 post lifts so they can display cars in the air so you can see the under detail.
Odds are for earthquake reasons that have them anchored top and bottom. However it was not that simple.
They installed a post floor to ceiling next to the lifts post and then have it connected in several places along the side of the lift post.

Can it be done, yes
Does it need to be done, apparently no

 

[firebirdparts]

It's a good idea. I don't think I'd go so far as not bolting it to the floor, like Dan's friend. that really would scare me.

I don't really frequent the 9-foot-lift thread, but I blundered in there and was a bit alarmed that JSK made a claim that top connected lifts would prevent cars from falling. He's wrong, but still. He does represent Bend Pak. I just thought I'd mention that bold claim.

 

[lakeroadster]

I don't really frequent the 9-foot-lift thread, but I blundered in there and was a bit alarmed that JSK made a claim that top connected lifts would prevent cars from falling. He's wrong, but still. He does represent Bend Pak. I just thought I'd mention that bold claim.

I ran the numbers on my Rotary's overhead channel and it indeed is strong enough to hold the columns together in regard to them tilting inward if the anchors fail.

It doesn't really take that much strength in regard to buckling.

 

[Dave Montgomery]

Wow!! That was a lot to come home to!!! Thanks to you all for your thoughts on this anchoring my new lift to the ceiling issue. First off I was not "punking" anyone as I sincerely have legitimate fears about lots of things (no I don't need a psychologist... I am one! But maybe that means I need one more??) and tend to be the careful type .
More info:
I will be anchoring to the floor as directed by the maker (bolts, epoxy, duct tape (ha-ha)).
I do believe that the additional floor supports would be a good idea (especially if I decide to keep my Orangoutang in the garage).
I should not have used the term anchoring as what I meant, now stated more concisely, is that I will build some kind of boxed casing around the tops (loosely) that are just there if by some weird chance the lift was to venture way out of my comfort zone. Frankly, even if I did "anchor" the tops I don't think any damage could occur to the building. As compared to me, it is beeg n strong! So, lots of good ideas and things to think about and incorporate.

Really appreciate the dialogue on this. You might even say I got a "lift" out it! (sorry)

DaveM

 

[like2wheel]

I have my left column bolted to the floor per instructions and tied it to the building on the top. It is very solid, doesn't move under load, and I use that post as a single hoist for unloading heavy objects from my truck and lifting my tractor, and sometimes just as an adjustable table or wood rack.

My right post is hanging from a 30' I-beam in the center of my shop on a trolly and is pinned to the floor with 7/8" drop in pins, the top I bolt to the beam with 4 7/8" grade 8 bolts. I roll it to the end of the shop when not in use.

I did it a few years ago. I pay attention more to balance now because the posts don't sway at all so I make sure I'm balance properly before I go up.

Wait-whaaat??
Aren't there some cables and/or hydraulics involved?
Pics?

 

[Iroc-Z]

If installed like the instructions state and if you lift vehicles properly securing the top is not necessary. If you load it right the floor studs should not have to do much.

 

[Partsguy57]

O good grief, put in according to instructions and go to work. I have two lifts in my shop 4 and two post, both are great my favourite is my two post. My back ground is auto motive as is my fathers and have been around lifts all my life( I'm 51) never any issues. Talk about over thinking ****! Install according to instructions( if not capable of doing that maybe you should reconsider even owing a lift.) The biggest issue with a two post is loading correctly and side loads while wrenching I.e.breaker bar etc pulling to side could twist a car off. Cheers

Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk

 

[Joe Reed]

I should not have used the term anchoring as what I meant, now stated more concisely, is that I will build some kind of boxed casing around the tops (loosely) that are just there if by some weird chance the lift was to venture way out of my comfort zone.
DaveM

Exactly what kind of casing would you use that would would hold up the lift with a 4000 pound car on it?

 

[Buckgnarly]

Wait-whaaat??
Aren't there some cables and/or hydraulics involved?
Pics?

x1,000,000....

 

[kbuhagiar]

I have my left column bolted to the floor per instructions and tied it to the building on the top. It is very solid, doesn't move under load, and I use that post as a single hoist for unloading heavy objects from my truck and lifting my tractor, and sometimes just as an adjustable table or wood rack.

My right post is hanging from a 30' I-beam in the center of my shop on a trolly and is pinned to the floor with 7/8" drop in pins, the top I bolt to the beam with 4 7/8" grade 8 bolts. I roll it to the end of the shop when not in use.

I did it a few years ago. I pay attention more to balance now because the posts don't sway at all so I make sure I'm balance properly before I go up.

 

[johnnyradiant]

I remember the first shop I worked in. It had one of those two post hydraulic lifts in the floor - one front, one back. That thing was scary as all get out - each post had it's own control. I always felt there was way way too much potential for one post to raise or lower at the wrong speed or not at all and the lifting pads didn't seem like they would offer any sort of slip resistance if anything did not go according to Hoyle. Not too mention the two rams sticking up out of the floor were always a pain in the *** or other body parts when trying to work under the vehicles. When I moved shops to what we see everywhere today I never looked back. If the vehicle is balanced on the posts I've always felt fine as long as the mechanical stops were engaged. Hoists just mounted on the slab according to man. instructions have to # in the 10000's across the continent. I think if they had any sort of catostrophic failure rate not attributed to ignorant/impaired users the insurance companies would be all over the shops using them, not to mention state or federal safety boards.

Skip the oraloscopy, make sure your slab is according to hoist requirements and follow the instructions.

Unless your trying to do something beyond it's intended use like like2wheel, the floor mount will be good.

 

[RWorth]

Wait-whaaat??
Aren't there some cables and/or hydraulics involved?
Pics?

I don't have any good pix in my comp, I did find these, the first one is the stationary post and the second pic is the movable post in the stowed position.

There are no cables anymore I plumbed it threw two adjustable flow valves, and put the pump on a floor switch, so when you are operating it you can equalize the pistons to keep the load level. It's pretty easy to do since the lift is so slow. Works great and it's never in the way anymore.


https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=721777&stc=1&d=1515095347


https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=721778&stc=1&d=1515095372

 

[RWorth]

I remember the first shop I worked in. It had one of those two post hydraulic lifts in the floor - one front, one back. That thing was scary as all get out - each post had it's own control. I always felt there was way way too much potential for one post to raise or lower at the wrong speed or not at all and the lifting pads didn't seem like they would offer any sort of slip resistance if anything did not go according to Hoyle. Not too mention the two rams sticking up out of the floor were always a pain in the *** or other body parts when trying to work under the vehicles. When I moved shops to what we see everywhere today I never looked back. If the vehicle is balanced on the posts I've always felt fine as long as the mechanical stops were engaged. Hoists just mounted on the slab according to man. instructions have to # in the 10000's across the continent. I think if they had any sort of catostrophic failure rate not attributed to ignorant/impaired users the insurance companies would be all over the shops using them, not to mention state or federal safety boards.

Skip the oraloscopy, make sure your slab is according to hoist requirements and follow the instructions.

Unless your trying to do something beyond it's intended use like like2wheel, the floor mount will be good.

LMAO, shop I worked in when I was a kid had one of those for large trucks, it had 3 controls, I think one was for up or down, and the other 2 were for front and rear. They were on the floor and you could operate them with your feet Or you could kneel down and do it with your hands.

 

[lakeroadster]

... There are no cables anymore...

So does it have safety latches?

 

[johnnyradiant]

LMAO, shop I worked in when I was a kid had one of those for large trucks, it had 3 controls, I think one was for up or down, and the other 2 were for front and rear. They were on the floor and you could operate them with your feet Or you could kneel down and do it with your hands.

Your right about three controls one was a master up/down but each ram had its own control. I had forgotten that part after all the other years of stupid stuff in my memory banks. The master only determines the ram’s travel direction when you engaged the ram’s control lever. You could lift or lower just one ram by only controlling that ram’s control.

There was also a story about a vehicle left up overnight without the steel safety posts in place and the one ram having a minor leak resulting in a car sitting at the near disaster point. Was never sure if that was a story to scare newbs or not. It didn’t matter ‘cause an overnight failure while I wasn’t under a vehicle or when I was responsible for raising or lowering the vehicle was the least of my concerns.

I don’t know if it was age or a design flaw but ours would never let you just pull the two ram levers and lower or raise a car level without some lever work.


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[like2wheel]

Unless your trying to do something beyond it's intended use like like2wheel, the floor mount will be good.

Hey Johny, what did I do??

 

[johnnyradiant]

Hey Johny, what did I do??

Your handle jumped into my head spinning field of view when I meant to reference rworth. Sorry to any I confused. Too sick to work and apparently too sick to post coherently.


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[63spyder]

Mines bolted top and bottom for the last ten years, no problems- ever. Things are adaptable.

 

[RWorth]

So does it have safety latches?

Oh ya, I didn't alter the posts, the cable between the posts is just to level them, now I level them by hand.

 

[RWorth]

Your right about three controls one was a master up/down but each ram had its own control. I had forgotten that part after all the other years of stupid stuff in my memory banks. The master only determines the ram’s travel direction when you engaged the ram’s control lever. You could lift or lower just one ram by only controlling that ram’s control.

There was also a story about a vehicle left up overnight without the steel safety posts in place and the one ram having a minor leak resulting in a car sitting at the near disaster point. Was never sure if that was a story to scare newbs or not. It didn’t matter ‘cause an overnight failure while I wasn’t under a vehicle or when I was responsible for raising or lowering the vehicle was the least of my concerns.

I don’t know if it was age or a design flaw but ours would never let you just pull the two ram levers and lower or raise a car level without some lever work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

that is pretty much what I have now, only it's side to side instead of front to back. And you do have to manipulate the valves going up or down. Going up you don't even have to watch level because the safety's click at the same time if it's level.

 

[Handyandy23]

Exactly what kind of casing would you use that would would hold up the lift with a 4000 pound car on it?

This! Not sure what kind of overhead structure you'd use that would hold up a lift (in the event it was falling over) without just pulling the structure down with it.

And as others have said, this isn't really "safety first" or "being cautious", it's an irrational fear. All these lifts are designed and stamped by professional engineers, and a lot of them are then again certified by an independent source. If they're installed correctly and the concrete meets the requirements, then it's not going to fall over. I work in a car assembly plant that uses 2-post lifts for repair, and out of the millions of safety rules and "what-if's" the plant safeguards around, tying the lifts into the ceiling is not one of them. We literally have an entire safety team whose only job is to make sure every job is as safe as possible, and they see no issue with using the lifts how the manufacturer intended.

The car falling off the lift is a much bigger worry you should have - if you look at any kind of videos or after-math of incidents with car lifts, it's almost always the car fell off the pads / tipped off the lift. Like someone else said, you're much better off investing in the big safety stands as added peace of mind. Just my two cents.

 

[lakeroadster]

There are no cables anymore

So does it have safety latches?

Oh ya, I didn't alter the posts, the cable between the posts is just to level them, now I level them by hand.

Interesting. So it takes two people to release and hold the safety latches, one on each column, when lowering?

 

[Ironcrow]

...All lift instructions call for using auxiliary stands under the car, when at height to help stabilize the load......You don't see professionals using these often....

Like almost never? I'm not disagreeing with anything you said, but what does it say about a designer of equipment to rely on the operator to execute a safety practice that you KNOW rarely happens? Is that ethical design? Or is the designer blameless?

Add that thought to the majority of safety release levers I see with a convenient bungee cord wrapped around the column so the operator does have to hold two controls for 30 seconds while the lift descends...Just philosophical considerations.

 

[Ironcrow]

Furthermore, I find it interesting that a poster here can complain that they find, say, the floor in their attic too springy when it is designed to code. Somebody will freely suggest to sister the joists, move from 16 oc to 12 oc, or add a column. Just because the the owner prefers a stiffer floor. Nobody will chime in that thousands of floors are designed 16 oc and have not fallen down, therefore the poster should shut up, be happy, and do nothing.

But, lord help you if you don't like the top of your lift column springing around 1/4 inch and would rather see 1/8 inch....