2 questions on cabinet overhangs

[oldpops]

Hello, I'm thinking of replacing the builders quality kitchen cabinets with those I make myself, but I have a question. My wife wants frameless cabinets, but is also thinking of adding under-cabinet lighting. Our current kitchen upper cabinets are frameless, and there is absolutely NO overhang or lip below the cabinet bottom, so no place to hide under-counter lights.

Q#1) Should there be any type of overhang or lip on the bottom of frameless cabinets? I know our current cabinets (frameless builders quality) don't have any, but I always thought all upper cabinets should have at least a 1/2 inch overhang (sides and front), where the sides of the cabinet and doors extend down below the bottom shelf/cabinet bottom.

Q#2) What is the most common dimension for the toe kick (cutout) on the base cabinets? I have seen several videos online, and many of them use different size toe-kicks.

Thanks in advance for all who offer help and advice. If anyone has, and can post, any pictures of frameless cabinets with a little overhang, that would be great!

 

[The Cobbler]

a valance on the underside of the cabinet is acceptable to hide lighting
4"x4" toe kick is also acceptable

 

[Bucko]

If you are building them yourself you can just raise the bottom shelf an inch and put a filler. The door will cover it just like if the shelf is right at the bottom. I don't like frameless for the reason the bottom shelf does not have any front support and it typically has the most weight put on it because its the easiest to access. Raising the shelf and putting the filler would help with the load and give you a space for lighting.

 

[rayra]

If you are building them you can do whatever you want. Either the bottom is raised to have a place to hide things from view from the front, or you can even make a double bottom with a space deep enough for a light fixture / puck.
There's no right / wrong way.

I build this hanging cabinet over our kitchen island about 8yrs ago just built it so the fascia hung down a couple inches like a skirt. Anybody over 5' tall didn't see under it unless they specifically looked.

Building the 43 door and drawer fronts for that kitchen remodel was a huge chore.

 

[MushCreek]

Just a thought- I built my toe kick into my bottom drawers. Why give up 4" of depth?

 

[Innovate1]

Just a thought- I built my toe kick into my bottom drawers. Why give up 4" of depth?

Interesting. I have seen very short drawers built into toe kicks.

To the OP. Just go to your local big box store - HD, Lowes, etc and look at the cabinets on display and measure. You can make them whatever you like but that will give you a starting point. Then figure out what lights you want to put under them. I found that the height of the space under them was a little tight for older lights but LEDs may be lower profile and you can always add a strip to the front to hide taller lights.

 

[jar944]

Toe kicks are usually 4". I prefer seperare toe kicks. For a variety of reasons, but material usage and ease of install are the top 2.


As for lighting, what type? You can get flush mount or recessed options that don't need a overhang. High end framed cabinet will usually have flushed bottom panels so a overhang isn't a requirement.

 

[Denwood]

On Q#1, I debated building cabs ( @jar944 did an amazing job and you need to check his thread if you are building!!) , then ended up going IKEA with customisations built in my shop. I highly recommend their LED under cabinet lighting system, regardless of which cabinets you choose. They are very cost effective and easy to gang together, particularly if you stick with standard cab widths of 18" 24", 30", 32" or 36". Their LED drivers also integrate nicely with home automation so the under cab lights come on with the overheads on motion during the day, then dimmed at night, again triggered by motion. We chose to go with a valence under the cabs, about 1 3/4". The IKEA cover panels form the ends of each valence (you trim them to fit) and then your front valence matches up to those. It's a detail we fussed over a bit but in the end are 100% happy with it. If you go with a valence, you may want to space your cabs up a touch higher from counter height.

Lighting is something I spent some time/energy on and it truly makes that 10% difference/wow factor. The IKEA Tradfir system will go an any cabinet that follows standard widths, (ganged together) but you can also work with custom widths if you just purchase LED modules to match a width slight less. The LED modules are very low profile and project less than a 1/4" down from the cabinet surface.

Their inside cabinet lights are also easy to install and very slick.

This was the test project to make sure we were ok with IKEA stuff...



Then the full kitchen reno (half of it shown here). The crown up top is not IKEA...just crown moulding (painted with colour matched BM paint) to mirror the door/window profile. Crown was sourced from Windsor Plywood locally.

 

[billconner]

Great kitchen Denwood. I also like Ikea kitchen cabinets and their lighting. Two whole kitchens so far. And like Denwood's, all drawers in base cabinets. It's so much better than cupboards even with pull outs, and more space, a big benefit of frameless.

Continuous under uppers and pucks recessed in top.

 

[rayra]

Toe kicks are usually 4". I prefer seperare toe kicks. For a variety of reasons, but material usage and ease of install are the top 2.

I spy a Paulk truss design workbench / cutting station!

I did a large rolling work table, bought his plans as a 'tip', and did it in two longitudinal halves so I could take half along on some remote projects as a portable work surface / cutting station. Much as you appear to be using yours.