20 gpm water purification.

[jrsavoie]

We have nasty water. We don't drink it or give it to our animals.

Or even like to water the garden with it

We have a shallow well. 65 ft. But wevare on a rise, so its actually shallower than that.

Surrounder by farm ground.

We get at least 20 gpm. We could get more with 1-1/4" line, instead of 1"

The well never completely cleaned up after drilling, about 20 years ago. The water has changed for the worse. More iron. And clay. We had water tests done last year and just sent in samples again. Awaiting results.

I have been looking for a kind of do- all water filtration/purification system that will not degrade our volume. The water treatment people all want to sell us a water softener. We have fine clay - it will pass through a 2 micron filter. I am running a filter bank of 7 ea. 4-1/2" x 20" filters that ends with a 1 micron filter now. A 5 micron starter filter and then a parallel filter bank with 3 filters on each side.

We have had the first filter get a quart of clay in the bottom within 4 days.

 

[Mark_17]

For the clay issue, I'm curious if some kind of sediment spin down filter would be best for your first filter.

I've seen it suggested on similar threads. They make some that will auto flush themselves so you wouldn't have to worry about cleaning it once or twice a week.

Something like this- https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07XLP2T2Y/?tag=atomicindus08-20

 

[RPH]

Sounds like a large settling tank treated with alum to collect the particles. I would use another tank to disinfect what cam from the settling tank. This instructable give you an idea of the process.

How to Purify Muddy Water

How to Purify Muddy Water: One of the major problems we face during camping trips is finding clean water suitable for drinking and cooking. Even though you select a camping site near a water source, one can not be sure that the water is fit for consumption. Further, what can …

www.instructables.com

 

[jrsavoie]

I had a guy from California that I thought was going to spec a system.

He talked about a 1500 gallon tank, a spin down filter and a recirculating pump. Large backwashing filter. For iron and other stuff.

I was ready to buy, but He never got back to me. I tried contacting him again several times and never heard back. There was more to it than what I listed, but that was the start. There was also a large backwashing filter.

I wish he would have sent me A schematic before disappearing.

A new well isvat least $8000 and who knows what I would need for a filtration system on that well. If a new well went down 125' to the limestone, I would still have iron. And would also need a softener.

I wanted to go there with this well, but the driller hit that sand and gravel seem and talked me into stopping there.

 

[Pen & Wrench]

Have you contacted your state rural water association? They may be able to get you in touch with companies and people that can help solve that for you.

 

[jrsavoie]

I have not. I'm in Illinois zip 60927.

If you have anybody in particular to contact.

I have contacted the county health inspector and University of Illinois. But never got any recommendations of other places to contact.

 

[Pen & Wrench]

Check out their website: ilrwa.org They have contact info under "About Us" I worked with my state rural water association in my job for many years, and I'd say all the state rural water associations are some of the best resources on drinking water systems and waste water.

 

[jrsavoie]

Thank you.

 

[dcg9381]

Solutions directly depend on what is in the water.. Iron can be treated. Clay can be treated. We use UV as a general disinfectant - and you can get systems that will support 20gpm.

You might do well to generally clean the water up for bathing, dish washing, showers etc.. For drinking water with really fine solids, just install a point-of-use RO system.

 

[mike93lx]

Why do you need 20gpm? How are you supporting that volume now?

My previous well pump was around 5, the new one is 7.5

Runs a house of 4 with never a flow issue.

 

[pcmeiners]

As to the clay I have never any issue like that, almost sound like the pumping area is being feed by a river. As to the iron, you need to find out what amounts of ferric oxide (normal filterable iron particles) and how much ferrous oxide ( a salt which is soluble and will go through a particle filter). If Ferrous is a big issue, if you aerate ( or chlorinate or ozone treat) the water before the clay filter you have, the ferrous oxide turns to ferric oxide, which can be filtered with a particle filter .

 

[jrsavoie]

With the last well I had a dedicated iron filter. It worked well but the diaphram leaked all the time. Always ended up with air in the lines.

But that was 30 years ago.

When you fill a 1000 gallon tank, 20 gpm is nice. I should have gone with 1-1/4" line for more volume yet, so I could fill fire trucks. There aren't many wells out here with that volume and it's an 18 mile round trip to a fire hydrant.

 

[mike93lx]

But you don't need filtered water to put out a fire and the initial fill of a 1000 potable water tank isn't really the issue. Your consumption is. Obviously solve for whatever volume you want, I am just raising this as a thought that maybe you can go smaller/simpler/cheaper

 

[jrsavoie]

But you don't need filtered water to put out a fire and the initial fill of a 1000 potable water tank isn't really the issue. Your consumption is

Actually our water ruins our tanks and pumps. So, yes we do need filtered water. Filling the tanks is part of our consumption.

It also isn't all the great for watering plants. We pump river water when we can. That's the best for watering plants.

 

[mike93lx]

If the water is that bad, I think i would be seeking a new source (drilling another well), even though it is expensive.

Having unusable water is not something I would mess with

 

[jrsavoie]

If the water is that bad, I think i would be seeking a new source (drilling another well), even though it is expensive.

Having unusable water is not something I would mess with

It depends on what it will take to clean it up and maintain the system. $8000 minimum for a new well and we have no, for certain knowledge of what we would have for flow or what we would need for a system for that water.

I would think for something less than the cost of a well, we ought to be able to get some kind of water purification system to do the job on this well. A well that has great recovery and plenty of water volume.

 

[mike93lx]

It depends on what it will take to clean it up and maintain the system. $8000 minimum for a new well and we have no, for certain knowledge of what we would have for flow or what we would need for a system for that water.

I would think for something less than the cost of a well, we ought to be able to get some kind of water purification system to do the job on this well. A well that has great recovery and plenty of water volume.

Do you have any neighbors with good wells? I know that is not a guarantee, but could be a decent indicator.

 

[Showkey]

There’s absolutely no reason the new well on the same property will yield any different water the one he already has......given his outstanding volume..........the new well could yield a small faction of that will all the same issues.

My two homes with wells in Northern IL had clay soils, iron issues and sulfur odor............filters, iron treatment ( that also help with sulfur) softener all helped .........but...........marginal at best. I was treating 7 GPM and the systems were ultra high maintenance and over $8k new that was 10 years ago. Treating 20 GPM could easily be 3-4 times the cost.

 

[mike93lx]

There’s absolutely no reason the new well on the same property will yield any different water the one he already has......given his outstanding volume..........the new well could yield a small faction of that will all the same issues.

My two homes with wells in Northern IL had clay soils, iron issues and sulfur odor............filters, iron treatment ( that also help with sulfur) softener all helped .........but...........marginal at best. I was treating 7 GPM and the systems were ultra high maintenance and over $8k new that was 10 years ago. Treating 20 GPM could easily be 3-4 times the cost.

A deeper well could easily yield dramatically different results

 

[jrsavoie]

The previous well was 125 ft deep. But only 1-1/4" if I remember right

The top 20 ft was 4". If I had it to do over, I might just have dug down and put a pump house for the shallow well pump.

That well still seemed to put out a lot of water when I blew it. But the level dropped a few feet and the shallow well pump couldn't **** it up.

 

[greg13]

I have a friend at work with the same situation. It is a never ending and expensive battle I think he is on his third system (around $8k each) in 20 years. I would find a new source or sink a deeper well.
If your neighbors are having the same problems research creating a municipal water district, expensive but some grant money may be available.

 

[jrsavoie]

I have a friend at work with the same situation. It is a never ending and expensive battle I think he is on his third system (around $8k each) in 20 years. I would find a new source or sink a deeper well.
If your neighbors are having the same problems research creating a municipal water district, expensive but some grant money may be available.

Nearest neighbor is about 1/2 mile away. I haven't asked the neighbors much about their wells. I'm not even sure how old everybody's wells are. 30 years ago. The wells were all about the same age. Not sure how many neighbors had to drill a new well also.

There's no pivots close by.

 

[Mark_17]

I'd talk to a well drilling company about a deeper well.

I'm on a well and the water *****. Lots of iron and solids. I actually have 3 wells. 1 for the household, 2 for my geothermal system

The well driller came out and cleaned my geothermal wells and told me there is another aquifer much much deeper than the aquifer my neighborhood pulls from. His house is on the other side of town and he drilled for that lower aquifer and said the water is pretty much perfect. He just runs a single whole house filter.

YMMV but it might be worth a conversation. Just wanted to toss is out there and there is some back and forth between the potential a deeper well being better or not.

 

[jrsavoie]

I'd talk to a well drilling company about a deeper well.

I'm on a well and the water *****. Lots of iron and solids. I actually have 3 wells. 1 for the household, 2 for my geothermal system

The well driller came out and cleaned my geothermal wells and told me there is another aquifer much much deeper than the aquifer my neighborhood pulls from. His house is on the other side of town and he drilled for that lower aquifer and said the water is pretty much perfect. He just runs a single whole house filter.

YMMV but it might be worth a conversation. Just wanted to toss is out there and there is some back and forth between the potential a deeper well being better or not.

Already talked to a well driller.

What I haven't got yet is specifications or price on a water purification system.

Before I consider a new well, I want to know of any alternatives.

It's hard to make an educated decision with only half the info.

I'd hate to drill a well and have to spend a couple thousand on a water treatment system for that well, and then find out I could have bought a treatment system for this well for 4 or 5 grand.

 

[Mark_17]

Already talked to a well driller.

What I haven't got yet is specifications or price on a water purification system.

Before I consider a new well, I want to know of any alternatives.

It's hard to make an educated decision with only half the info.

I'd hate to drill a well and have to spend a couple thousand on a water treatment system for that well, and then find out I could have bought a treatment system for this well for 4 or 5 grand.

I get that and respect that. Just wanted to put it out there. I was told a min of $12 grand to get setup on that new well in the deeper aquifer..... I ain't ready to drop that coin right now!

 

[pcmeiners]

Just ran across an article referencing colliodal iron which resemble red clay which might be what you have. Please post the test results.

 

[jrsavoie]

I will try posting the results. Not sure if I have the technological expertise to do it on my tablet. We do not have enough service to use the laptop. I can share the test results via email - I can forward the test results.

I have yet to receive a quote or a detailed system recommendation.

I am definitely not of the mindset to figure anything out right now. Maybe in a couple more weeks. It will be months before I would possibly be able to do the work myself.

If you message me an email, I would send a copy of the test results.

I have no idea what to click on the attach pdf's on this site.
Thanks

 

[Bretny]

I think you should try to clean up the well prior to just treating the cause of the problem with a multi thousand dollar complex system.

You could air pump that well your self and possibly get alot of the junk out for under $80 in parts. With an air compressor, 100ft air line and 100ft of black poly you can make your own air pump.

 

[bradpac]

Just thinking out of the box here and not answering your question at all, but what about rain water collection? Yes you would need storage tanks and refilling would be dependent on rain. The tanks would have to be buried or surrounded somehow to keep them from freezing for winter usage, but you would be starting with a lot cleaner source of water.

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

When you fill a 1000 gallon tank, 20 gpm is nice. I should have gone with 1-1/4" line for more volume yet, so I could fill fire trucks. There aren't many wells out here with that volume and it's an 18 mile round trip to a fire hydrant.

50 minutes to fill a fire truck isn't going to work out when it's needed (about the same as round trip to the hydrant).
Maybe OK for refilling a truck after the fire is out.

As far as the OPs issue. I used to have cartrige filters the 30 micron would be plugged in a week or so (with just 2 of us). Finer filters would plug after a couple showers).
I put in a spin down filter. It doesn't seem to collect anything.
I put in a sand filter with automatic back flushing. It works a lot better.

 

[pcmeiners]

When you get a chance, no rush......

Just post a reply,....... on the bottom left of the "post reply" box is "attach files" , you should be able to attach the PDF from there.

 

[oldwino]

We had real crappy water at our coast house. High turbidity, iron, odor and occasional coliform. Installed a “Triple O” system consisting of osmosis treatment, a serviceable filter and UV. shallow well (35’). Results are odorles, tasteless clean water. I bring water samples in for piece of mind about every 6 months and always well below limits

 

[jrsavoie]

50 minutes to fill a fire truck isn't going to work out when it's needed (about the same as round trip to the hydrant).
Maybe OK for refilling a truck after the fire is out.

As far as the OPs issue. I used to have cartrige filters the 30 micron would be plugged in a week or so (with just 2 of us). Finer filters would plug after a couple showers).
I put in a spin down filter. It doesn't seem to collect anything.
I put in a sand filter with automatic back flushing. It works a lot better.

Their idea, not mine. Flow might be better out of a 1" or 1-1/4" line.

For whatever reason, I would be agreeable to whatever the fire department requested. I might just need their services some day.

 

[jrsavoie]

Just thinking out of the box here and not answering your question at all, but what about rain water collection? Yes you would need storage tanks and refilling would be dependent on rain. The tanks would have to be buried or surrounded somehow to keep them from freezing for winter usage, but you would be starting with a lot cleaner source of water.

Since posting and reading on this forum, that thought has actually crossed my mind. I would tap into the existing cistern - that I think I filled with clean rock, when the cap caved in. It took a lot of rock. I'm sure it still holds a lot of water.

I did not dig down and sort the in and out tiles out or reroute anything. Adding an additional storage tank would not be all that hard. If I was not short on time and ability. Seems finding people to hire and do a decent job is near impossible.