2000 explorer primary ignition waveforms

[rdaleyj]

all taken at idle some cylinders look lean and some look rich or something. next step is to identify the cylinders...
flukeview doesnt work o this newer pc so im having to snap pic shots to upload. also used a 10:1 probe

 

[scooterseats]

Verify that all plugs are clean and have equal gaps. While the plugs are out, run a compression test (both wet and dry). If the compressions are all within specs and the plugs clean and gapped, take another set of ignition traces and compare. I have found burned valves with ignition only traces because of the low compression having lower ionization voltages. Since a close gap will also have a lower ionization voltage the gaps need to be verified as well as the compression tested.

 

[rdaleyj]

lower ionization voltages, will that be the reason for the spark line shooting downward?

 

[rdaleyj]

okay ross that was a good call, i pulled one plug"the easiest to get to" and its worn slap out gap = .060 and electrodr is melted gone shopping for new plugs.

 

[MrMark]

rdaleyj,

can you post some pics of your equipment and setup? I'm pretty interested in this type of stuff.

 

[rdaleyj]

okay mr mark heres a pic of my fluke 199c not automotive based but definately works and to the left is the ca600 high amp current probe to check relative compression and to the right is the low amp current probe to check electric motors and electric fuel pumps.

 

[rdaleyj]

i don't think i like the way the that relative compression looks, specifically the way i should see humps on the negative slope. i've seen better.

 

[rdaleyj]

the right shot is after i kept it cranking, not missing any cylinders.

 

[rdaleyj]

okay here's another relative compression i just took. looks better

 

[Moose-LandTran]

I wish i knew what all this meant..

 

[johnsdeere850j]

wheeew you've got some cash sittin right there, wow.

 

[MrMark]

Does this page show your probes?

http://autoditex.com/Products/index.html

Can you get a shot of your connections, please.

 

[MrMark]

wheeew you've got some cash sittin right there, wow.

Yes, about 5 times more money in equipment than the car is worth.

 

[MrMark]

These pics are actual photos of the Fluke 199C screen, correct?

 

[rdaleyj]

that is a 3 minuite relative compression test the trace is drawn by the cylinder with compression and the starter current draw. a cylinder w/o compression would show one or more missing humps. and if there were a missing hump i can use a sync probe on channel2 to the no1 sparkplug wire to identify the cylinder.
well so much for humps and beating dicks with a hammer.
do you go ball peen?

 

[MrMark]

Does this page show your probes?

http://autoditex.com/Products/index.html

Can you get a shot of your connections, please.

These products show no manufacturer information. Kind of weird. Do you know who makes them?

 

[rdaleyj]

sure and the only connection made is to clamp the high current probe around the batt to starter cable, took all of 3 mins.

 

[Toolhorder]

How does that Fluke compare to the 98?

You may do better next time if you post on IATN. They have good known waveforms avail. to view if you are a member.

 

[rdaleyj]

get this i picked up the 199c in a pawn shop for a whopping $120.00 then took it on as a hobby to learn the waveforms and tests.

 

[rdaleyj]

i buy alot from aeswave or tool source they may be a whole lot cheaper than fluke or other brandnames

 

[MrMark]

How many channels do you have? So your oscilloscope has a sync probe and a voltage probe? Inductive pickups? Can you show those>

 

[MrMark]

get this i picked up the 199c in a pawn shop for a whopping $120.00 then took it on as a hobby to learn the waveforms and tests.

That is the world's all time score. Did you post that score, I seem to remember something about that. That is a 4K machine.

 

[rdaleyj]

i wish i could join but im not an ase certified, or a tech for that matter.

 

[I can fix anything]

Someone needs to PM or email STICK i'm sure he will be very helpful.

 

[Toolhorder]

get this i picked up the 199c in a pawn shop for a whopping $120.00 then took it on as a hobby to learn the waveforms and tests.

That's a good deal!

I was looking at my local pawn shop's ebay auctions and was about to spend that much on a Fluke 98 that wouldn't power up.

If you want to learn sign up at IATN. Lots of waveforms there and explainations. It takes some study to be good at it. It's definitely not easy or something that you'll get the first day. I've been working on cars since 98 out of high school and I'm still seeing things that I haven't before. I only use waveforms though on hard to figure out cars. I wish I could use an O-scope on all of the cars that come in for tune ups and see what I difference it makes but time is money.

 

[rdaleyj]

yeah i posted it a few months ago and it came with case,probes flukeview software, manuals. i purchased the 2ndary ignition probe and the current probes from whoever had the best price. and it is a 2 channel. fluke now has a 4 channel

 

[Toolhorder]

i wish i could join but im not an ase certified, or a tech for that matter.

It's not like they check, besides you're using an o-scope to fix a car right? Seems like you're a tech to me.

 

[rdaleyj]

last i checked the iatn doesn't allow any non techs to join, but i might of been wrong

 

[Moose-LandTran]

last i checked the iatn doesn't allow any non techs to join, but i might of been wrong

So lie.

 

[Toolhorder]

yeah i posted it a few months ago and it came with case,probes flukeview software, manuals. i purchased the 2ndary ignition probe and the current probes from whoever had the best price. and it is a 2 channel. fluke now has a 4 channel

Everyone wants a 4 channel but a 2 channel works just fine. You got a good unit for a song and you're using it which is more than I can say for half the techs I know. They spend a boatload of money on a scope and can't use it because they don't know how. I had a co-worker with a Genisys that had the scope kit on it and everytime we needed it to work he was lost. I'd have to take the thing over and show him how to set it up and I have no scope in my box.

 

[rdaleyj]

well a 2ndary connection will definately point us to a particular cylinder we do the checks to find out why theres high resistance or low resistance ect.

 

[johnsdeere850j]

jeeez 120 bucks? Guarantee it was stolen and then pawned and the pawn shop had no clue cuz they probably paid the thief a lot less than 120 bucks to sell it to you at the usual pawn shop 150% of cost markup...im pretty sure you cant get these for under 3 grand...

 

[Toolhorder]

So lie.

lol.

 

[Moose-LandTran]

Don't matter how it came to be in the pawn shop. It belongs to rdaleyj now and he got a badass score on it!

 

[Toolhorder]

jeeez 120 bucks? Guarantee it was stolen and then pawned and the pawn shop had no clue cuz they probably paid the thief a lot less than 120 bucks to sell it to you at the usual pawn shop 150% of cost markup...im pretty sure you cant get these for under 3 grand...

Or they didn't know what it was worth or thought it was a DVOM. You shouldn't assume so much.

 

[MrMark]

what's the big X on some of the screen shots? some sync trigger off of a cylinder firing event?

 

[rdaleyj]

well like i said, i took it up as a hobby and gathered a collection of waveforms off the internet,and also my own collection. a scop with a scantool are very handy when diagnosing. i have the autoxray 6k scantool. wish i could afford genesys evo with infotech

 

[MrMark]

well like i said, i took it up as a hobby and gathered a collection of waveforms off the internet,and also my own collection. a scop with a scantool are very handy when diagnosing. i have the autoxray 6k scantool. wish i could afford genesys evo with infotech

that's basically what I have. Where did you go for looking at waveforms. I would be interested in that.

 

[johnsdeere850j]

Or they didn't know what it was worth or thought it was a DVOM. You shouldn't assume so much.

why would a legit owner of the thing in the first place let it go for less than 120 bucks? just doesn't make any sense to me but hey ill stop assuming toolhorder guy is about to go ape sh%% on me through his screen for assuming too much course i guess the pawn shop could have made a major ooops in that case luck was on your side that day

 

[rdaleyj]

that x is where i set the trigger level and that tells the scope where to start the trace