32x32 Workshop Wiring

[HIG]

I've finally had my garage built!!! it's 32'x32' with 12' ceilings and 2 12'x32' with 8' ceilings lean-tos on both sides. In my spare time I enjoy working on cars, mechanical and auto body (over the years I have painted a few vehicles) and hope to get back into wood working. I currently have a attached 32'x26' attached garage that I'm set up to paint in (I have a temporary spray booth with an explosion proof exhaust fan). My current plans are to set the new garage up for woodworking and storage while I finish the interior but with plans of doing mechanical and autobody in there, that's one of the reasons for the 12' ceiling - a lift. I'm planning on fully insulating the garage and apply metal on the interior walls. I really enjoy electric but am not up on all the codes, nor do I fully understand them, so hopefully with some guidance, I will end up with something I'm truly proud of!!

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Sorry I did not start with a question, I just wanted to set the stage and say hello.

Thanks, Steve

 

[1Garageman]

I am subscribing! Awesome looking garage! You'll have to show off your woodworking tools also. There are a lot of us on this website that do a lot of woodworking also!

 

[HIG]

Where should I mount my circuit breaker panel? I was planning behind the door in the corner but I see I need 30" on each side of the panel? Does the door count as an obstruction?

Agree with above.

Need 30” side to side but doesnt have to be centered
Need 36” in front and 6’ 6” minimum height from the floor.

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Thanks, Steve

 

[teamextreme]

I would put in behind the door, mounted with the edge a foot or so away from the door/side wall. Basically right above those 2 white PVC pipes (what are those for anyway? Maybe that will effect the placement of a panel there?) You don't need 30" on either side, you need 30" total in front of the panel. I would give myself some elbow room and mount it like I said, a foot or so away from the door, which is fine for NEC clearance.

 

[spudley]

Nice looking building. Looks like a stealth fighter...

 

[Outlander]

I've finally had my garage built!!! it's 32'x32' with 12' ceilings and 2 12'x32' with 8' ceilings lean-tos on both sides.

Sorry Steve, posting that picture without a dozen more is illegal on this board! Nice garage, absolutely love the lean-tos, I like to work outdoors in the summer.

 

[HIG]

I am subscribing! Awesome looking garage! You'll have to show off your woodworking tools also. There are a lot of us on this website that do a lot of woodworking also!

I can't say I have really nice woodworking tools, Craftsman table and radial arm saws, Delta 6" joiner, 12" planner and dust collector and a small Powermatic shaper table. I've done mostly cabinet work, hopefully some day I'll have time to do more!!!

 

[Bretny]

Personaly i wouldnt put the pannel behind the door. Put it next to the door with it open. Easy acess if/when needed.

 

[HIG]

I would put in behind the door, mounted with the edge a foot or so away from the door/side wall. Basically right above those 2 white PVC pipes (what are those for anyway? Maybe that will effect the placement of a panel there?) You don't need 30" on either side, you need 30" total in front of the panel. I would give myself some elbow room and mount it like I said, a foot or so away from the door, which is fine for NEC clearance.

Great, that's where I was thinking!!

The 2 white PVC pipes are just holes through the concrete, I'll use 1 for my underground power feed and the other is a spare.

Thanks!!

 

[HIG]

Sorry Steve, posting that picture without a dozen more is illegal on this board! Nice garage, absolutely love the lean-tos, I like to work outdoors in the summer.

Thanks for the compliment. I don't have a lot of photos to share but here's one of the ceiling!! My 25 4' LED lights came in yesterday. I can't wait for the 2 10'x10' and 1 9"x7'doors to come in.

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Steve

 

[TractorJeff]

You will like 10 by 10 doors!
No need to know EXACTLY where you are backing in!

 

[Jim greengo]

Where should I mount my circuit breaker panel? I was planning behind the door in the corner but I see I need 30" on each side of the panel? Does the door count as an obstruction?



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Thanks, Steve

That's 30" total

 

[alfredeneuman]

30" Measured from either side, and that 30" includes the width of the panel.

 

[HIG]

Personaly i wouldnt put the pannel behind the door. Put it next to the door with it open. Easy acess if/when needed.

I can see the benefits of not having it behind the door but I know how previous every inch of wall space is!!!

I do plan on recessing the panel so that the trim will be flush with the metal siding once installed on the interior walls. I hope that will not be an issue, I need to come up with a way of running the conduit through the metal and to the boxes fastened to the walls. I'm not sure if I'll use offset bends or LB's, LR's or LL's. I can not believe in the searching I've done I have not seen any circuit breaker panels recessed and metal siding installed. Does anyone have any pics or ideas?

Thanks, Steve

 

[HIG]

That's 30" total

30" Measured from either side, and that 30" includes the width of the panel.

Thanks, that makes sense!!

 

[HIG]

You will like 10 by 10 doors!
No need to know EXACTLY where you are backing in!

I have a boat and I will be so glad to be able to work on it in the garage!!!

 

[HIG]

LED light wiring questions:

I'm installing 5 rows of 5 4' LED lights in the garage and am running a 26" pc. of conduit between them. The leads that came with the lights look just long enough to connect one light to the next.

Should I use the supplied 18 awg wire that came with the lights or run 12 awg solid, I plan on using a 20 amp breaker? If I use the 18 awg wire what is the best way of making a splice, I can use orange wire nuts, I'm just wondering if there's any other options for connecting the wires?

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I was also planning on using the existing ground wire, I'm planning on crimping an eyelet on the end and fasten the ground to the grounding stud.

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I'm always open to better and or quicker ways, any other options?

Thanks, Steve

 

[vcforlife15]

Beautiful looking place! Also from New York here.

When you do your metal walls will your pipes be covered by the wall? If so I wouldn’t use a lb. as the cover will no longer be accessible.

As for lights, keep that factory 18 awg. And yes wire nuts are fine, your going to need them anyways to go light to light.

 

[HIG]

Beautiful looking place! Also from New York here.

When you do your metal walls will your pipes be covered by the wall? If so I wouldn’t use a lb. as the cover will no longer be accessible.

Thanks for the compliment!!

Yes, once I do the corrugated metal is on the walls any LB or box will be covered, I will make sure I use all bends and no covers. Thanks

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[Falcon67]

I put mu box by the door on my 24x40. Thought it was a good idea. 800'+ of NM-B cable later, should have put it more in the middle. Depends on where you have runs, mine turned out to be 80% on the far end LOL.

 

[lakeroadster]

Sorry.. too late to the party, but behind the door has it's disadvantages.

There will be a day when you have the circuit breaker door open, and the man door swings into it... might even break the window.

Nice building!

 

[Shiftless]

Sorry.. too late to the party, but behind the door has it's disadvantages.

There will be a day when you have the circuit breaker door open, and the man door swings into it... might even break the window.

Nice building!

I too like the look of that building. Nice work!

How often do most guys need to access their sub panels? I have a surface mounted sub panel in my little 2 car garage and haven’t needed to open it since the last time I added a circuit.

I know some guys flip the breaker to kill power when they leave the shop. Is this common?
Why?
.
.

 

[HIG]

I put mu box by the door on my 24x40. Thought it was a good idea. 800'+ of NM-B cable later, should have put it more in the middle. Depends on where you have runs, mine turned out to be 80% on the far end LOL.

Good point but I'm going to run 2 conduit runs for outlets, one to the left and one to the right, both will cover 2 walls. My lights should work out okay, I'll run conduit basically straight up to feed my 5 rows of LED lights.

Thanks, Steve

 

[HIG]

Sorry.. too late to the party, but behind the door has it's disadvantages.

There will be a day when you have the circuit breaker door open, and the man door swings into it... might even break the window.

Nice building!

I too like the look of that building. Nice work!

How often do most guys need to access their sub panels? I have a surface mounted sub panel in my little 2 car garage and haven’t needed to open it since the last time I added a circuit.

I know some guys flip the breaker to kill power when they leave the shop. Is this common?
Why?
.
.

Both very good points, I didn't think about the panel door hitting the entry door while open but like said, how often is the panel door open? I've worked around a factory most of my life and am in the habit of always closing the cover then done. I don't plan on using the breaker to turn on and off circuits on a regular basis.

I hope I don't regret it!! Thank for giving me things to think about!!!

 

[MattN03]

Nice looking shop!

 

[mike93lx]

What wire are you running for the feed?

 

[teamextreme]

I hope I don't regret it!! Thank for giving me things to think about!!!

You won't regret it. How likely is that scenario going to happen? I like it behind the door because it's never going to invite **** being piled up in front of the panel, blocking access to it.

 

[HIG]

What wire are you running for the feed?

Wow, you are asking the hard questions!!! Our spring has been very wet this year so it’s going to be a while before I can dig the trench, I’m currently running the saws from a generator. I’m not sure if I’m going to rent a ditch witch or have a mini excavator come in.

I will need to run about 170’ of underground cable from my house to the garage plus my service entrance comes in at the other end of the house so that’s about 80’-90’ more. I was hoping to be able to run the cable through my house but I think it’s going to be easier to bury that was well. So I’m looking at about 250’-270’ of buried cable.

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The garden hose would be the approximate path I would run the cable to avoid my leach field to the front corner of the garage.

I’m planning on a 90 or 100 amp service in the garage, as you can see I’ve done some reading and if I go with 2-2-2-4 aluminum UF I would use a 90amp breaker or I can run 3-3-3-4 Copper and use a 100 amp breaker.
I like the thought of running the aluminum underground feed wire in a bed of sand but I think I’m leaning towards the copper run in PVC conduit. I really would appreciate the pros and cons of each.

Would I be pushing the limits of 2-2-2-4 AL @ 90amps for 270’?

What size conduit would be recommended? It looks like 1” would be okay (under 40% fill) but might be worth stepping up to 1 ¼”.

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How flexible is PVC for making gentle bends (the bend that the garden hose follows), can I heat it with a heat gun if a tighter bend is required?

I would like to run a network cable out to the garage for internet and a security camera from what I’ve read I shouldn’t include it in the conduit with the feed wire because of interference – any suggestions?

What is required when burying cable or conduit, depth, marking tape, sand, etc?

Sorry to answer your questions with more questions but as you can see I don’t know yet.

Any input suggestions are welcome!!

Thanks, Steve

 

[HIG]

Nice looking shop!

You won't regret it. How likely is that scenario going to happen? I like it behind the door because it's never going to invite **** being piled up in front of the panel, blocking access to it.

Thank you!!

 

[mike93lx]

Wow, you are asking the hard questions!!! Our spring has been very wet this year so it’s going to be a while before I can dig the trench, I’m currently running the saws from a generator. I’m not sure if I’m going to rent a ditch witch or have a mini excavator come in.

I will need to run about 170’ of underground cable from my house to the garage plus my service entrance comes in at the other end of the house so that’s about 80’-90’ more. I was hoping to be able to run the cable through my house but I think it’s going to be easier to bury that was well. So I’m looking at about 250’-270’ of buried cable.

View media item 92970
The garden hose would be the approximate path I would run the cable to avoid my leach field to the front corner of the garage.

I’m planning on a 90 or 100 amp service in the garage, as you can see I’ve done some reading and if I go with 2-2-2-4 aluminum UF I would use a 90amp breaker or I can run 3-3-3-4 Copper and use a 100 amp breaker.
I like the thought of running the aluminum underground feed wire in a bed of sand but I think I’m leaning towards the copper run in PVC conduit. I really would appreciate the pros and cons of each.

Would I be pushing the limits of 2-2-2-4 AL @ 90amps for 270’?

What size conduit would be recommended? It looks like 1” would be okay (under 40% fill) but might be worth stepping up to 1 ¼”.

View media item 92971
How flexible is PVC for making gentle bends (the bend that the garden hose follows), can I heat it with a heat gun if a tighter bend is required?

I would like to run a network cable out to the garage for internet and a security camera from what I’ve read I shouldn’t include it in the conduit with the feed wire because of interference – any suggestions?

What is required when burying cable or conduit, depth, marking tape, sand, etc?

Sorry to answer your questions with more questions but as you can see I don’t know yet.

Any input suggestions are welcome!!

Thanks, Steve

No chance i would run copper that far. Way too expensive

2-2-2-4 will be pushing it for that far if you really will pull 90a.

Do a load calc and maybe pad it to plan for the future.

I would probably run 2" conduit and individual conductors. Probably 2/0 RHW-2. Either that or 2/0 MHF direct burial. Direct burial would save a bunch of time, effort and money

Conduit can make sweeping bends no problem.

 

[HIG]

Do a load calc and maybe pad it to plan for the future.

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Does my air compressor draw 21.5 amps while.running? Would I want fo use an 30 amp breaker?

I will make a list of the tools and other items I will use in the garage.

 

[HIG]

I am wondering if it would be worth it to add a new service entrance from the power company. I wanted to avoid another monthly bill just for the service but in the long run it might be worth it, I'm thinking a basic bill might be $20.

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This is a picture taken from the door right by my breaker box.

Thoughts?

Thanks, Steve

 

[tricountytrail]

Where are you in NY?

 

[coljar]

That is a beautiful garage. I put my panel exactly where you put yours and have never regretted it. I also put a red panel light above the breaker panel to remind me as I'm going out the door to flip the switch for the air compressor.

 

[vcforlife15]

I am wondering if it would be worth it to add a new service entrance from the power company. I wanted to avoid another monthly bill just for the service but in the long run it might be worth it, I'm thinking a basic bill might be $20.

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This is a picture taken from the door right by my breaker box.

Thoughts?

Thanks, Steve

what are transmission fees per month by your power provider? Whats your panel like in the house? Do you have spaces free? Will your provider let you put a meter can under your over hang?

I would run the whole thing in pipe regardless of which option you choose. Yes it’s a little bit more time consuming but worth it. I bet you could buy the pipe for about the same price of hauling in sand. Plus now you will only need to rent a mini excavator vs that and a tractor or skid steer to move the sand into the trench. Run use-2 wire, it is rated for raceways and direct burial.

I recently bought 370ft of 2” schedule 40 pipe for 243$ at a supply house and 500’ of 250-250-3/0 use-2 al wire for 1047$ in upstate New York.

 

[mike93lx]

I am wondering if it would be worth it to add a new service entrance from the power company. I wanted to avoid another monthly bill just for the service but in the long run it might be worth it, I'm thinking a basic bill might be $20.

View media item 93014
This is a picture taken from the door right by my breaker box.

Thoughts?

Thanks, Steve

call your POCO and talk to them. won't cost anything to get a quote and depending on how much of the wire they pay for, it could take a while to offset the monthly charges.

 

[lakeroadster]

I know some guys flip the breaker to kill power when they leave the shop. Is this common?
Why?
.
.

I turn the outside outlet off, and all the 220 breakers if we're headed out of town.

Why?

1.0 Years ago, at another home we had there was a contractor, doing work at a neighbors, that was using our outside power outlet without telling us. We found out when we got home and the garage door opener wouldn't work. They were also using our outside water spigot. We turn off the power to the well now too.

2.0 Why not.. better safe than sorry

 

[HIG]

I recently bought 370ft of 2” schedule 40 pipe for 243$ at a supply house and 500’ of 250-250-3/0 use-2 al wire for 1047$ in upstate New York.

Where did you purchase the supplies? I live in between Albany and Syracuse.

Thanks, Steve

 

[HIG]

I turn the outside outlet off, and all the 220 breakers if we're headed out of town.

Why?

1.0 Years ago, at another home we had there was a contractor, doing work at a neighbors, that was using our outside power outlet without telling us. We found out when we got home and the garage door opener wouldn't work. They were also using our outside water spigot. We turn off the power to the well now too.

2.0 Why not.. better safe than sorry

Thank you, I didnt even think about installing outside outlets!! They would come in handy especially under the lean tos.

 

[vcforlife15]

Where did you purchase the supplies? I live in between Albany and Syracuse.

Thanks, Steve

H and z electric out of Latham.