36x40 Attached Garage / Mudroom Build - Layout Suggestions

[z28tt]

I've got the opportunity to build my dream garage - a 36 x 40, so my wife can have a mudroom, of course! We're planning on building it to have a bonus room / bath / bedroom above it, and high ceilings in at least one bay for a 2 post lift.

While it's still in design, changes are way easier. What do I need to have? It'll be a combo garage / woodworking and metal shop. I'm struggling to figure out how to have a clean layout, but still have everything usable (current 2 garage is a disaster, just not enough room, and as I get more tools & materials,

Our designer broke up my 40x40 box into sections so it'd match the house (we're on a 1/2 acre lot in the 'burbs, so no room for a massive out building, and it needs to match for future resale), but that added a bunch of corners.

I'm in Zone 5 (New England), I was considering radiant floor heating with an air:water heat pump. Giving it some more thought, mini splits would give me air conditioning in the summer, as well as winter heat for similar cost. Our existing Cape (built in the 60's) is all-electric, and I plan on adding solar down the road. I'll insulate it like a house since the garage/bonus room/bedroom will be more or less heated.

3 bays, with 9' x 8' doors. I could put a half-wall in front of the daily driver cars to separate the workshop area.

For the 2 post lift, using the left bay with a cathedral ceiling gets me 13'6" over the middle. How much room should I have between the lift column and the wall for comfortable work? I've got 31" below and but could move it over for 36", but it'll pinch into the middle bay when a car is parked. I'm sure we can engineer the support column for the beam to be elsewhere, or go with a larger truss to eliminate it.

I was thinking of having a wash bay inside, but I'm an aspirational waxer. I barely find time to detail the cars now, so it's probably pointless. Not sure if I should try to add a slop sink somewhere (to strip off dirty mtb gear) - bath would be next to the stairs on the 2nd floor, and I could stub out plumbing supply and drains in case the next owner wants to turn this glorious garage into something silly, like a first floor master bedroom and bath. I could probably put in a drain (to daylight), if that's something that really would be good for the future.

The metalworking area is in left back corner (bridgeport, lathe, TIG, chop saw), and woodworking is on the right side. Not sure what the work area should be. I love the F1/NASCAR style race shops, but they don't have anything outside, and everything is in a cabinet. Seems like that's more of an assembly area than a work shop.

Thoughts on this layout (made it in sketchup)? I could go wider / deeper if it's needed, but need to draw the line somewhere. All ears, since this is probably the only chance I'll get.

 

[Smilodon]

I'm trying to understand the difference between the two elevations you pictured. One appears to be a rear view of a different orientation. What is the reasoning behind orientating the new garage differently. Do you have that option?

Also, you should definitely put a sink in the garage/shop if you can. I use mine all the time and it helps me keep cleaner when working, which causes less mess on whatever the project is I'm doing.

 

[shade]

I recently moved from AZ to MI where it snows
My smaller shop was already built and had no drain.
When I built my new shop (still in process with a thread. I have pictures of what i did) a drain was mandatory. The water and snow just stood which irritated me to no end. Do it.

What are your maximum dimensions you are willing to go? Whatever they are, do it.
There's no such thing as too much space.
Is each bay going to be walled off or open. The design made me think walls in-between.

Outlets everywhere. Im dumb and like accent lighting around the perimeter of the ceiling. I put a couple outlets up high for that, then another set for a TV and peripherals

Mini's - perfect idea. Best insulation you can go. Your design looks cool

 

[z28tt]

I'm trying to understand the difference between the two elevations you pictured. One appears to be a rear view of a different orientation. What is the reasoning behind orientating the new garage differently. Do you have that option?

Also, you should definitely put a sink in the garage/shop if you can. I use mine all the time and it helps me keep cleaner when working, which causes less mess on whatever the project is I'm doing.

Sorry, should have been one sketchup screenshot. It's been a living drawing. Orientation is the same as the existing (2 car) garage, which would be dismantled. Renderings are from the designer, which I matched in sketchup to play with layout options.

Thanks on the sink suggestion. It wouldn't take up much room.

 

[z28tt]

shade - I'm comfortable doing the electrical, and plan on 20a receptacles everywhere. Add some 240v/20a for the woodworking and lathe/bridgeport, 30a for the wife's PHEV, and a 50a for the welder. I might run some conduit before pouring the floor, so I can have the table saw in the middle without wires dropping from the ceiling.

Not sure on max dimensions, it'll depend what the quotes come in like. The existing house is only 1700 sq feet - I don't want this to TOTALLY dwarf it. If I go deeper and keep the same roof pitch as the existing house, the peak will be even higher. I probably could extend the left bay another 4' so the rear wall is common.

The bays will be open to the sides, but I'm thinking of having a half wall (and glass windows above?), separating the right two bays from the work area. It'll help contain the dust from woodworking too.

Thanks for the suggestions!

 

[carlaisle]

Regarding the partial wall: dust floats. A cyclone dust collection system will collect a lot of dust, but never all of it.

You'll get a lot of use out of the shop sink.

I would drop wires from above before plugging anything into an outlet in the floor. It will fill up with everything that lands on the floor, which may include water.

An in ground lift would solve a lot of layout headaches.

A radiant slab makes a lot of sense in Saskatchewan; much less so in your climate.

If I was writing the check, the building would need to be sized such that I could open every car door all the way (not simultaneously) without hitting anything.

Keep in mind an 8' tall garage door generally only opens to around 7'. Might be worthwhile to measure a modern F150, Tundra, etc. Even if you have no trucks, consider resale.

Check local codes on garage floor drains before putting much more thought into a wash bay. In some places its easier to permit a nuclear reactor.

 

[72Anthony]

I would plan for some type of heating cooling from the start (I'm from Houston so I don't know what's best for your area.

Definitely add a sink, since you are into car work, metal and wood working.

I would hold off on building the half wall until you get a chance to pull the cars in and see how it feels in real life.

 

[jack stand]

36x40 is humongous coming from your current 2 car regular  parking garage .
It's not the answer you probably want (in terms of interior layout) but I'd have it built with no interior posts or bearing walls.
You're list of desires spaces doesn't match your proposed 36x40.
After 3 builds for myself and being in the business of building, it's really very difficult to visualize a room and it's dimensions and how all of this comes together as a whole plan.
Ideally once you're under roof, start laying things out marking the walls with whatever you want. Strings, garden hose, 2x4's etc. to depict the walls. With no structural restrictions you have a much better chance of designing something that you're comfortable with.

Good luck and I can't recommend a thoughtful insulation package (beyond FG batts) and a radiant slab enough.
Bringing in a frozen 3500# vehicle (or 2) to a air heated space to thaw overnight will force a traditional warm air system to run most of the night until you open the doors in the morning to get the vehicle out and the few hours running it'll take to recover from that!

 

[JuncleJohn]

I’m guessing you must only drive small to mid size vehicles.

Three 9 foot wide doors will be a deterrent for future resale as most households wanting that much garage space will probably have at least one full size truck or SUV. Think about side mirrors, nothing more annoying than having to pull them in to enter and move them out to drive. I strongly suggest different overhead door sizes. One at least 18x8 or 20x8 and the other 10x8.

Also, the parking area doesn’t look deep enough. Get a full size vehicle in there and it’ll almost be right up against your half wall.

Placing the Bridgeport in the corner as shown will severely limit your X axis travel.

John

 

[Stuart in MN]

What about storage of stuff like the lawnmower, snow blower, rakes and shovels and garden tools? A separate shed would be best, but even with one some of that stuff is going to sneak into the garage.

 

[puttinonthekritz]

I’m guessing you must only drive small to mid size vehicles.

Three 9 foot wide doors will be a deterrent for future resale as most households wanting that much garage space will probably have at least one full size truck or SUV. Think about side mirrors, nothing more annoying than having to pull them in to enter and move them out to drive. I strongly suggest different overhead door sizes. One at least 18x8 or 20x8 and the other 10x8.

Also, the parking area doesn’t look deep enough. Get a full size vehicle in there and it’ll almost be right up against your half wall.

Placing the Bridgeport in the corner as shown will severely limit your X axis travel.

John

I totally agree. Unless you are dead set on three separate doors. A 3ft end, 10ft wide door, 4 ft separating the two doors, and a 20ft wide double door, 3ft end. I'd rather loose the dormer above the 3rd stall and put that money toward making it 4ft deeper flushing out the common wall.

 

[JuncleJohn]

Three overhead doors look cute but are not practical today. Unless they were at least 10’ wide. To accomplish that, it would require the garage to be wider by a few more feet.

As I already mentioned above, you need more depth, or will need to eliminate the half wall to park full size vehicles.

John

 

[Danno1]

.


Make your wall outlets 54" high. So you can lean a full sheet of plywood on the wall. You can also "armor" the walls w 4x8 hardboard w/o interfering w electrical.


.

 

[z28tt]

Thanks guys!

@72Anthony - I'll add the slop sink in the corner by the compressor and dust collector. It'll be nice not to have to wash paint brushes in the house bathroom too.

@carlaisle & @JuncleJohn - The half-wall (with glass on the top half for dust control) would be 21'4" from the inside of the garage door wall, vs the 16.5" long Panamera. It'd fit an F250 crew cab w/ short bed with 6" front / back, but not a long bed. Since that wall isn't structural, future owner could remove it. I'd add that myself after the the garage is built. Maybe I won't need it. Also a good point about the in-floor outlets collecting dust/water. Table saw will have a dust hose anyway. I'll check w/ the town on floor drains.

@jack stand - I'll see what the $ difference is to eliminate the posts. Getting a 40' span (vs 20' with posts) would likely force using 2 steel I-beams instead or 24" deep LVL I-beams. The Weyerhaeuser and Boise charts only go to 30' and 36'. If posts are in-line between the car bays, it doesn't seem like it'll interfere too much. I'm a MechE, but will check with my CivE prof friend on sizing. It's been years since taking statics. Looks like residential floors typically use L/360 deflection (for the bonus room above), but I'm not sure how that impacts a support beam vs floor beams every 16 or 24"...

Also a good point about bringing in a frozen car. Google says about 30 kBTU's to warm a 5000 lb car 50 degrees, but probably less since it's not all steel. www.CoolCalc.com is showing roughly 25k BTUH for winter heat for a quick and dirty manual J calc (using their default floor/wall/ceiling types - I need to figure out how to customize that). A 2 ton mini split would work for all but the coldest days.



@JuncleJohn - The existing garage is 24w x 26d, and used to have the race car in it, with the rest as workshop space. Since I started woodworking, the race car has moved outside, under cover. Our current daily drivers are a Panamera and an XC90. Not huge, but not small either. XC90 is 7' mirror to mirror. It'll fit a 9' door easily, but that's a good point on needing to be more careful when backing it out. I'll check if we can bump up the doors to 10x8'. I plan on doing a low clearance door system to keep the tracks close to the ceiling, and get the full 8' height (which the XC90 with large roof box would clear by 7". Looks like an F250 w/ towing mirrors extended is 8.8', so that 10' wide door does make sense. I'll see if we can increase the width of the garage by 4' (and make that mud room 1' wider as well)... A double wide garage door failed the wife test for curbside aesthetics, but I should be able to fit 10x8's.

Bridgeport has a 36" table, and the drive/handles add another 20" to the width. X travel is 24", so the total adds up to 80". I'll have to have some room on either side for sure, and not have the lathe & welding table as close. Looks like it'd have to be a foot away from the wall to get the full x travel. Thanks for bringing that up!

@Stuart in MN - Lawn & garden stuff thankfullly lives in the back yard shed. Garage will need to have a have a sports/ball area. I'll have the side man-door moved back a few feet.

@Danno1 - Yes! Will do that. 54" high receptacles will clear any future workbenches too.

 

[jack stand]

@z28 I confess to not looking at your plans originally. A couple of things,
Is there a reason for the lift bay to not be as deep as the rest of the building? (more lift room with longer "scissors" and corners are not cheap)
Take these plans to a truss company. They do crazy things theses days with girder trusses & attic trusses possibly eliminating beams.
I'm not sure what the 40' beam is doing in between the two bays? Wouldn't attic trusses work here?
A couple of thoughtfully placed post or short bearing walls in the lift bay/ center bay for the 40' support should allow for an LVL . Id carefully place any post that's close to your proposed lift post to not create an even larger obstacle to walk around.
With a 40' scissor @ the lift bay you might be able to push your lift either way front/back for a usable space that amounts to something ahead or behind the lift.
Just tossing out some different perspectives.

 

[z28tt]

Looks like floor drains are no longer allowed in CT... In a perfect world, I'd have the right two daily driver bays pitched 1/8" per foot towards the door, and the left bay with the lift (and race car alignment) flat, along with the back half of the garage (workshop). Last 3 feet at the door would be pitched to shed rain water.

The left bay would need to be blended into the right bay, 2.5" max at the door (20' x 1/8" slope).

I'm concerned that would look janky between the bays, and also frustrate the concrete slab guys.

Should I just have all 3 bays be pitched 1/8" per foot (for 20') and the back half of the shop level?

This also led me down the rabbit hole of whether to have a 1/2" tall weather lip just inside the door... Damn, so many details to get right (or good enough...).

 

[z28tt]

@jack stand - I think the designer did it for aesthetics... And maybe a little shorter beam to free-span the bonus room above. I'd rather have that corner back, and add a 4' deep mez for storage. I'll check in with a truss company too, see what they suggest before bothering the designer for more changes (I'm trying to batch them).

Do posts need to be away from a 2 post lift column a certain distance for safety?

 

[jack stand]

Do posts need to be away from a 2 post lift column a certain distance for safety?

My thoughts are that the posts are something I'm always walking around and 2 posts under 2' apart* is something even bigger to walk around. It might just be my particular "traffic flow" to the toolbox or whatever. I do have the post that's by the wall that's only 22" between the motor/reservoir and the wall that's may as well be closed off.
* structural post and your lift post.

 

[z28tt]

Thanks for everyone's input! We're meeting with the designer next week. Next step is figuring out how to do the foundation. Save existing or demo?

 

[NUTTSGT]

You're not going to like 21' and change to park a CC SB F250. You will not be walking around it or behind at all. How are you going to get from one side of the garage to the other ?

Not sure if you already have a garage and this is an add on or new complete garage build.

Your designer, looking at the measurements, is either an idiot or absolutely clueless on garage design. 12'6" is not wide enough for a bay to work on a vehicle with a lift in there. The lane width on a highway is about 12' and you're only going 6" wider than that.

 

[manwithtools]

12'6" is not wide enough for a bay to work on a vehicle with a lift in there. The lane width on a highway is about 12' and you're only going 6" wider than that.

Actually, that 12'6" dimension is to the outside wall, so in reality the bay is only 12' at the inside dimensions. I agree 100% with you on this Eric.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Actually, that 12'6" dimension is to the outside wall, so in reality the bay is only 12' at the inside dimensions. I agree 100% with you on this Eric.

Yes, I had already figured that. 3.5 for the stud wall plus another 1/2" for drywall/plywood.

A BendPax 10APX 2 post, lists width at (outside of column) at "Width 135 - 145 in." 12' = 144"