400A Service - Need to Run 200A to Workshop/Barn

[pattenp]

In the US it's known as PVC Jacketed MC Cable. I believe PVC Jacketed MC Cable will cost more than using individual wires in conduit.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

All this conduit talk, no conduit, sizing, pulling why not just buy a piece of 3 conductor #000 cu teck90? Dig your trench, roll it in, backfill, terminate each end and energize! It moves good too if the frost moves the earth.

Time is money right.

good luck finding teck90 anywhere around here

 

[ard]

OP-

Consider a spare conduit (or 2 or 3) in the trench while you are at it. Solar, other stuff at 240V.... Then internet, other communication, etc.

 

[traumadoc2b]

While they were trenching for the water line, I went ahead and dropped conduit at least 2' below grade.

-2.5" for electric to barn/shop
-2" for cable (overkill, but per Comcast/Xfinity spec and will save me thousands over their quote for direct burial)
-1.25" x2 for telecom (phone in from road and low voltage/telecom between house and barn)

Low voltage conduits are clustered together and 1' away from conduit for electric.

Thanks to Brian @bjcouche who suggested the conduit would gradually bend - I ended up not needing any elbows - just the 90 sweeps at each end. It is surprising how much it will curve over distance.

 

[traumadoc2b]

Finally posting some updates to power run to barn. First was finishing the conduit, including installing the sweeps and lining everything up inside. I want to be able to run another sub off of this in a future outbuilding, hence the second set of conduit.

I would have used an LR instead of the LB, but none of the supply houses had one in 2-1/2". The 1-1/4" conduit at the baseboard is for low voltage (interwebs, telephone).

I ordered the wire online by the foot and it arrived via freight on a single pallet, with individual spools. To make life easier, we used compressed air to push a mouse through the conduit with a small, light nylon well line and then used that to fish though a boat anchor line. This is what we pulled the wires through with.

I did use cable lube, but having upsized the conduit to 2-1/2" and only having a sweep on each end made it go so much more smoothly. The other key was paying off the spool, using a chain link fence post (or rebar for the smaller spool) on the pallet forks. I C-clamped a couple of 2x4 scraps to the top of the forks to keep the spindle/spool forward enough that it didn't rub on the back of the forks.

Need to finish the walls in the barn and lots more wiring to do still.

 

[casmurbax]

Glad to see that you were able to get the wires in.

Did you post any pics of your barn build by chance?

 

[dcg9381]

2 x 200A panels is how I've done it. What I learned for special cases is that you can use 200A panels with feed-thru lugs (where appropriate). Panel selection above 200A isn't as broad.

 

[Bert_]

2 x 200A panels is how I've done it. What I learned for special cases is that you can use 200A panels with feed-thru lugs (where appropriate). Panel selection above 200A isn't as broad.

There are lots of panels above 200A and they are actually a lot more flexible than your run of the mill 200A load center. Your not going to find them at the home store though.

The issue is cost. 2x 200A load centers is cheap. They can build whatever you want to an extent. You want a 400A main with a couple 200A breakers and 42 15-100A breakers, no problem. But that panel is probably going to cost about $1,200 depending on what you have in it. Now that price isn't as bad as it seems since it will be full of breakers.

 

[traumadoc2b]

Did you post any pics of your barn build by chance?

I actually haven't. The barn is a work in progress. I should, but the house is taking so much of my time.

Eventually, I really had intended to build a bigger workshop/barn and to use this existing one more for storage (tractor, implements, trailer/RV, etc). I don't see that happening right away (the second barn), so I've started to finish the inside of this barn including a concrete floor.

 

[traumadoc2b]

I might suggest to twin 2x 200 amp panels. Populate the first with the majority of your existing loads. The second with passthrough lugs to your sub panel.

So that is pretty much what I've done in the house. The grouped 200 amp discos are at the H post/meter (these 2 will shut down power to the entire property), the one feeding the house also being a Kohler ATS. The feed for the house comes underground into the basement to a 40 space 200A panel, which has subfeed lugs in the bottom running to another 40 space 200A panel next to it (mounted upside down), which then has subfeed lugs that run to the garage to supply a third 40 space 200A panel. I think even with some solar panels and the potential for electric car chargers, we should be in good shape with 120 spaces to serve a 2k sq ft house.

I didn't really sweat it in the existing barn because I was planning (hoping) to build another, bigger one across from it in the future. Thus the additional 2.5" conduit coming out of the barn panel, which is already in the ground, end capped, and marked with a stake (also marking conduit for low voltage use and a water line). The second 200A disconnect at the H post feeds the 40 space 200A panel in the existing barn, which will hopefully have subfeed lugs to feed the future barn. You guys are right, providing for more than 30-40 spaces in that barn would be cheap insurance for future use.