Nope! I posted an intro thread a couple days ago if you're curious.
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50k Unit Heater Small Propane Tank.
- Thread starter Lofty
- Start date
toyotadriver
Well-known member
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- Dec 30, 2010
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- 1,586
I have a heater that has been running B vent horizontally for over 10 years now and when I’ve inspected the pipe, there is no sign of corrosion. I’m not saying you should but it can work.
Yeah I've gathered everyone who did this pre 2009 didn't suffocate but whatever.
I don't want to argue about safety because if you're wrong it's not a good time. Understanding how this works, if you're not sleeping in the place I don't see an issue.
Again. Safety is important and if something bad happens from something you did wrong you're an *******.
I still don't see why there's an issue running it this way.
I don't want to argue about safety because if you're wrong it's not a good time. Understanding how this works, if you're not sleeping in the place I don't see an issue.
Again. Safety is important and if something bad happens from something you did wrong you're an *******.
I still don't see why there's an issue running it this way.
The B-vent will eventually corrode right out.
My furnace in my garage has a vertical B-vent. About 15 years after it was installed I noticed it wasn't running correctly. I checked it over and didn't see anything obvious, so I opened up the B-vent and took a look. It was so corroded that the aluminum liner had fallen to pieces and was restricting the vent. Only thing intact was the outer jacket.
Needless to say I replaced it all and it ran fine.
If you run B-vent I would plan on checking it every fall, and replacing it every 10 years.
One big issue, it doesn't meet code. The code is there to save your ****.
If you have a problem, fire, carbon monoxide poisoning and your insurance gets involved and it is decided the cause of the problem is the improper B-vent, well hang on tight! If nothing else you could get dropped by your insurance co.
I will admit it will work and work fine for sometime, after all, maybe ten years ago B-vent was approved for venting these heaters, but there was issues and the codes were changed. My guess leaking vents allowing carbon monoxide into the building poisoned a few workers, insurance or OSHA got involved so the venting got a serious look over. I did HVAC servicee for years and replaced a lot of B-vent and most of it was not that old.
I replaced venting on heaters in a large truck shop. About three yeaers later I was back there for some other service. While up on the roof I noticed the venting was all rotted out again, three years! Although it wasn't code a the time I had a discussion with the owner of the shop and it was decided to replace it all with stainless.
Carbon monoxide is odorless and it sneaks up on you, then next thing you know you are sleeping. You can be fully alert, nothing wrong and 15 seconds you are face down on the concrete.
I witnessed it first hand. I got carbon monoxide poisoning years ago. I never knew what hit me. I was in the shop, then felt dizzy. I remember heading for the door as I thought I was going to puke. I don't remember walking the last few steps, and opening the door to leave the shop. I walked about twenty feet, opened a heavy shop door and waked another ten feet outside and I don't remember any of it. A friend of mine happened to stop by and he found me passed out in the driveway. He got me sitting up and sat with me for a while until I felt better. The next day I was still sick. I should have gone to the emergency room, but just didn't think of it.
If it had hit me harder and I didn't make it out the door I would have been dead before my buddy showed up.
That was 45 years ago and to this day my body is very sensitive to carbon monoxide. I notice it quickly if I am in a shop with an engine ruining. Guys wonder why I go open doors, but I feel sick immediately.
After going through it I will not take a chance.
My furnace in my garage has a vertical B-vent. About 15 years after it was installed I noticed it wasn't running correctly. I checked it over and didn't see anything obvious, so I opened up the B-vent and took a look. It was so corroded that the aluminum liner had fallen to pieces and was restricting the vent. Only thing intact was the outer jacket.
Needless to say I replaced it all and it ran fine.
If you run B-vent I would plan on checking it every fall, and replacing it every 10 years.
I still don't see why there's an issue running it this way.
One big issue, it doesn't meet code. The code is there to save your ****.
If you have a problem, fire, carbon monoxide poisoning and your insurance gets involved and it is decided the cause of the problem is the improper B-vent, well hang on tight! If nothing else you could get dropped by your insurance co.
I will admit it will work and work fine for sometime, after all, maybe ten years ago B-vent was approved for venting these heaters, but there was issues and the codes were changed. My guess leaking vents allowing carbon monoxide into the building poisoned a few workers, insurance or OSHA got involved so the venting got a serious look over. I did HVAC servicee for years and replaced a lot of B-vent and most of it was not that old.
I replaced venting on heaters in a large truck shop. About three yeaers later I was back there for some other service. While up on the roof I noticed the venting was all rotted out again, three years! Although it wasn't code a the time I had a discussion with the owner of the shop and it was decided to replace it all with stainless.
Umm, sleeping in the area has nothing to do with it.Understanding how this works, if you're not sleeping in the place I don't see an issue.
Carbon monoxide is odorless and it sneaks up on you, then next thing you know you are sleeping. You can be fully alert, nothing wrong and 15 seconds you are face down on the concrete.
I witnessed it first hand. I got carbon monoxide poisoning years ago. I never knew what hit me. I was in the shop, then felt dizzy. I remember heading for the door as I thought I was going to puke. I don't remember walking the last few steps, and opening the door to leave the shop. I walked about twenty feet, opened a heavy shop door and waked another ten feet outside and I don't remember any of it. A friend of mine happened to stop by and he found me passed out in the driveway. He got me sitting up and sat with me for a while until I felt better. The next day I was still sick. I should have gone to the emergency room, but just didn't think of it.
If it had hit me harder and I didn't make it out the door I would have been dead before my buddy showed up.
That was 45 years ago and to this day my body is very sensitive to carbon monoxide. I notice it quickly if I am in a shop with an engine ruining. Guys wonder why I go open doors, but I feel sick immediately.
After going through it I will not take a chance.
toyotadriver
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 30, 2010
- Messages
- 1,586
I suspect it has to do with efficiency of the heaters. Heaters of years ago weren’t that efficient so a lot of heat went up the flue. The advantage was, the flue was too hot to get condensation. Heaters are more efficient today so there is less heat up the flue. Less heat means more likelihood of condensation.
Eventually I’ll replace my flue pipe and when I do, I’ll go with stainless. But for now, I just keep a close eye on it. I also keep a CO detector around as well just in case. So far so good.
Eventually I’ll replace my flue pipe and when I do, I’ll go with stainless. But for now, I just keep a close eye on it. I also keep a CO detector around as well just in case. So far so good.
Thanks for all this great information everyone.
I have a CO meter and a combustible alarm and it stays at 0ppm.
@PoorUB you are definitely a guru when it comes to this and your wisdom and stories are great information. I'm glad you made it out of there. I frequently feel very sick with torpedo heaters so this is actually the reason I installed it. Makes me feel like garbage.
I'm happy I posted this here and I am happy I learned so much.
I have a CO meter and a combustible alarm and it stays at 0ppm.
@PoorUB you are definitely a guru when it comes to this and your wisdom and stories are great information. I'm glad you made it out of there. I frequently feel very sick with torpedo heaters so this is actually the reason I installed it. Makes me feel like garbage.
I'm happy I posted this here and I am happy I learned so much.
They have been building power vent heaters for 20-30 years, some models are virtually unchanged in that time. The B-vent requirement came like 10 - 15 years ago. Even less than ten years ago Modine did not require stainless, but Reznor did. I remember because we sold the **** out of Hot Dawgs because of it.I suspect it has to do with efficiency of the heaters. Heaters of years ago weren’t that efficient so a lot of heat went up the flue.
The Modine Hot Dawgs are pretty much the same before I started installing them on 2000. Reznor went to the FT heater about 2000, and then the UDAP shortly after, maybe 2005?
In the last 25 years the efficiency of the heaters has not changed much, maybe from 80% to 82%. Much higher efficiency and they start condensing and need condensate drains.
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toyotadriver
Well-known member
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- Dec 30, 2010
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Then if B vent worked fine for years then it still should work fine if there are no differences. I pulled some B vent out of a house of mine that was 50 years old. It would have worked fine if I was still using that system.
Minor efficiency improvements could quite easily create a corrosion problem that didn’t exist before.
In the OPs case, move the propane tank outside (for safety) and run it. Nothing wrong with hooking it up like that to test run it but it’s definitely safer to keep the tank outside. Keep an eye on your vent pipe and replace if you find signs of corrosion. Most likely in 20 years it’ll still be working fine.
Minor efficiency improvements could quite easily create a corrosion problem that didn’t exist before.
In the OPs case, move the propane tank outside (for safety) and run it. Nothing wrong with hooking it up like that to test run it but it’s definitely safer to keep the tank outside. Keep an eye on your vent pipe and replace if you find signs of corrosion. Most likely in 20 years it’ll still be working fine.
Great advice, I'll add checking it to my list.The B-vent will eventually corrode right out.
My furnace in my garage has a vertical B-vent. About 15 years after i... It was so corroded that the aluminum liner had fallen to pieces
If you run B-vent I would plan on checking it every fall, and replacing it every 10 years.
For a Propane conversion is a regulator needed on the bottle side? (80K unit, 100lbs tank outside)
- It was not listed in the manual, but they did call for "Line pressure of 13” WC (330mm WC) should be maintained for propane (LP) gas"
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Thanks for the help.A regulator is for sure needed, so long as it matches what the manufacturers recommendation is. My regulator is 10 to 13 WC I believe.
Makes sense to me, as how else are you going to get 13 WC...
However I have yet to see it called out in a video and or a Manal... but then again how else are you going to keep it at 13WC.
The Mr Heater has the gas pressure settings in the manual, and states how to adjust it. Pretty much all equipment I have set up over the years has. It has been rare when it wasn't stated in the set up and install manual.Thanks for the help.
Makes sense to me, as how else are you going to get 13 WC...
However I have yet to see it called out in a video and or a Manal... but then again how else are you going to keep it at 13WC.
You are correct sir, hank you. Not sure how I missed this... Hopefully others reading along see it.The Mr Heater has the gas pressure settings in the manual, and states how to adjust it. Pretty much all equipment I have set up over the years has. It has been rare when it wasn't stated in the set up and install manual.
That said, I have not run it without one and having a forum like this with great people let me ask!
"WARNING: TO PREVENT HEATER DAMAGE. WHEN USING A PROPANE TANK TO SUPPLY HEATER, A MINIMUM 11”W.C. LOW PRESSURE REGULATOR TO A MAXIMUM 14”W.C. LOW PRESSURE REGULATOR IS REQUIRED. THIS REGULATOR MUST BE INSTALLED BETWEEN THE TANK AND THE HEATER. Regulator not supplied with heater."
Make sure its a twin stage regulator and not a bbq regulatorA regulator is for sure needed, so long as it matches what the manufacturers recommendation is. My regulator is 10 to 13 WC I believe.
Thank you for pointing this out... I learn this the hard way and forgot to share.Make sure its a twin stage regulator and not a bbq regulator
Still wonder why I've never seen this mentioned in a video...