6pt or 12pt Sockets for hand tools

[Boogerman]

I tend to start thinking about getting a newer car when the bolts on my car hits that threshold that they start rounding off more and more often. If I'm using my grinder and drill more than just my socket/ratchet and wrenches, the joy of working on my car goes down hill.

I tend to start thinking about getting a newer car when I have to work on it at all. With most cars going 150,000 miles before anything goes wrong or needs replaced, the upholstery and plastic and floor mats and accessories are starting to get worn, and the increased gas mileage and usability of the newer vehicle makes it worthwhile to upgrade, and not work on the old one. My current vehicles have 175,000, 134,000, 31,000, 27,000 and 18,000 miles on them. The 134,000 mile one is the only one I have worked on; it's been heavily abused with heavy loads and trailer pulling and all short trips, and has had the box replaced, seat covers replaced, floor mats replaced twice, torsion bar links, alternator, and spark plugs replaced and two sets of replacement tires. The other cars have had the oil changed and the air filters and tires replaced. One I have worked on extensively, but that's been changing it out to aftermarket performance parts. There is no joy in working on cars to me. It's a grudging necessity occasionally.

 

[Benny Franklin]

I tend to start thinking about getting a newer car when I have to work on it at all. With most cars going 150,000 miles before anything goes wrong or needs replaced, the upholstery and plastic and floor mats and accessories are starting to get worn, and the increased gas mileage and usability of the newer vehicle makes it worthwhile to upgrade, and not work on the old one. My current vehicles have 175,000, 134,000, 31,000, 27,000 and 18,000 miles on them. The 134,000 mile one is the only one I have worked on; it's been heavily abused with heavy loads and trailer pulling and all short trips, and has had the box replaced, seat covers replaced, floor mats replaced twice, torsion bar links, alternator, and spark plugs replaced and two sets of replacement tires. The other cars have had the oil changed and the air filters and tires replaced. One I have worked on extensively, but that's been changing it out to aftermarket performance parts. There is no joy in working on cars to me. It's a grudging necessity occasionally.

My F350 has 244k, I've replaced tires, swaybar end links, added a front leveling kit, built a winch bumper. As far as engine work: studded/deleted, straight pipe, ICP, changed glow plugs, harnesses, and GPCM, did new injectors, oil cooler, and coolant flush at 243k.

I'd like to get airbags and a rear locker but it needs shocks first

 

[M635_Guy]

I said earlier in this thread that I own literally zero 12-point sockets by choice - the only ones I have came with a Sunex chrome set I got several years ago and as a whole is rarely-used these days.

This thread makes me wonder what's changed, or maybe what I'm missing. I don't have a ton of room, so I'm pretty diligent about not acquiring things I'm not going to use, and combining where I can (e.g. both of my impacts are 1/2" so I don't require a 3/8" set). As just a home and auto DIYer, I don't seem to hit scenarios where 12-point got me out of a jam. I can't imagine there are too many worse scenarios for tight access than a Mini, and it seems like tooth count has balanced the equation from the other side. I can't remember the last time I used a 12-point socket . Since I'm working on a fair variety of 21st-century things from several manufacturers (with the exception of an 80's BMW), I feel like I would have 'hit the need' by now.

 

[theoldwizard1]

I respect your knowledge. Why do you say 12 point is useless on smaller sizes?

They round off the corners too easily.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I said earlier in this thread that I own literally zero 12-point sockets by choice - the only ones I have came with a Sunex chrome set I got several years ago and as a whole is rarely-used these days.

This thread makes me wonder what's changed, or maybe what I'm missing. I don't have a ton of room, so I'm pretty diligent about not acquiring things I'm not going to use, and combining where I can (e.g. both of my impacts are 1/2" so I don't require a 3/8" set). As just a home and auto DIYer, I don't seem to hit scenarios where 12-point got me out of a jam. I can't imagine there are too many worse scenarios for tight access than a Mini, and it seems like tooth count has balanced the equation from the other side. I can't remember the last time I used a 12-point socket . Since I'm working on a fair variety of 21st-century things from several manufacturers (with the exception of an 80's BMW), I feel like I would have 'hit the need' by now.

The only times I have found the need for 12pt, outside actual 12pt fasteners, is if you're using a breaker bar or low tooth ratchet and need to compensate for that. The sockets are usually a little thinner than an identical brand 6pt. I'll impact on 12pt deeps to remove goober wheels where the lug holes are too small for the lug nuts they have. In theory this could save you in a very tight area. Sometimes it's easier to stuff a 12pt in a dash and feel some tiny fastener and get the socket lined up whereas you may need to remove, and reclock, a 6 point. If you're going shoulder deep, that's worth a thought.

Or to pound onto wheel locks and remove them.

None of this is very common, aside from the last item.

 

[KnurledNut]

This topic was recently covered in this thread:
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...ow-and-deep-which-drives.509172/#post-9940573

 

[M635_Guy]

The only times I have found the need for 12pt, outside actual 12pt fasteners, is if you're using a breaker bar or low tooth ratchet and need to compensate for that. The sockets are usually a little thinner than an identical brand 6pt. I'll impact on 12pt deeps to remove goober wheels where the lug holes are too small for the lug nuts they have. In theory this could save you in a very tight area. Sometimes it's easier to stuff a 12pt in a dash and feel some tiny fastener and get the socket lined up whereas you may need to remove, and reclock, a 6 point. If you're going shoulder deep, that's worth a thought.

Or to pound onto wheel locks and remove them.

None of this is very common, aside from the last item.

I haven't used a breaker bar in ages either. I have 'em, but my impacts and other tools do the job. I'm fortunate that I don't really have to deal with rust.

This topic was recently covered in this thread:
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...ow-and-deep-which-drives.509172/#post-9940573

Thank Jeebus you're here to keep us all straight...

 

[dchawk81]

I haven't used a breaker bar in ages either. I have 'em, but my impacts and other tools do the job. I'm fortunate that I don't really have to deal with rust.




Thank Jeebus you're here to keep us all straight...

I broke my breaker bar and haven't bothered to replace it.

Apparently ~8,000lbs* is too much for a 1/2" Harbor Freight anvil.

*Probably, not sure. Hydraulic bottle jack + semi truck.

 

[mogandave]

Torque-wrench in limited space would be another good use for 12-points...

 

[2ndGearRubber]

I haven't used a breaker bar in ages either. I have 'em, but my impacts and other tools do the job. I'm fortunate that I don't really have to deal with rust.




Thank Jeebus you're here to keep us all straight...

The breaker bar is king for wiggling. Constantly reversing a ratchet *****. Running extractors it removes the loss of feel through the ratchet gears.

I like my little 3/8 breaker bars. Stick it up top on the nut, impact on the bolt, your hand keeps the thing from popping off while it braces against the unibody, frame, etc while reversing directions over and over to push through the rust.

 

[dnschmidt]

2nd Gear. I remember rust. That's that red stuff that corrodes steel back home in Pittsburgh right? Haven't seen much of that out here in the desert.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

2nd Gear. I remember rust. That's that red stuff that corrodes steel back home in Pittsburgh right? Haven't seen much of that out here in the desert.

In fairness, rust has made me a lot of money.

Now galvanic corrosion? **** that.

 

[ArmyVW_GuyInTX]

Just wait until you work on a newer Ford & have to add Torx + & E Torx +

They are late to the E-torx game if they had to wait until newer Ford products......

 

[honcho]

Unless you have 12 points bolts nuts, 12 points is so undesirable.

I think this statement grossly oversimplifies the reality. The perennial 6pt vs 12pt will never be resolved and I think there's plenty of room for folks to disagree. Much depends on what one works on and if you live in the land of rust.

I own and use both and because of how my tools are configured, I use 12 point chrome sockets more often. While i have a couple of metric 12 point impact sockets, most of the impact sockets i use are 6pt. (i work on small engines, small displacement motorcycles and moderately corroded vehicles.)

 

[M635_Guy]

Torque-wrench in limited space would be another good use for 12-points...

I've replaced pretty much all of my torque wrenches with higher-tooth versions, except my Snap On QD2FR75, which is only 36 teeth. That hasn't been a problem so far.

 

[mogandave]

I've replaced pretty much all of my torque wrenches with higher-tooth versions, except my Snap On QD2FR75, which is only 36 teeth. That hasn't been a problem so far.

I was talking about non-ratcheting torque wrenches, but I admire your commitment to 6-point sockets.

 

[Blind1]

I have a mix of ‘90’s 1/4 and 3/8 drive shallow 12pts. Basically a metric rail and an SAE rail. Has done everything I’ve needed them for so far, which is predominantly on A breaker bar or torque wrench in a limited access spot. These were inherited.

I predominantly use 6 pt.

 

[M635_Guy]

I was talking about non-ratcheting torque wrenches, but I admire your commitment to 6-point sockets.

LoL - I think it's mainly about defending the limited space in my box as much as anything. I try not to have more than I need. The same kind of thinking has put only a set of 1/2" impact sockets in my box - I wanted to conserve space and still have non-adapter-based access to big sockets for things like hub nuts, etc.

If I was pro, I'd have a lot more stuff. As it stands, if a situation cropped up that meant I needed a 12-point socket, I could pop over to the AutoZone a half-mile form my house to grab one. That would be nuts for a pro, but fine for me.

 

[CGarage]

In fairness, rust has made me a lot of money.

How? Do share.

 

[dchawk81]

How? Do share.

He sells it at swap meets. I tried to buy some off him but he plays the sentimental card so I walked away. He drives a hard bargain.

 

[qqzj]

How? Do share.

It is easy. Normal homeowners don't have torch or heavy equipment to do simple job like changing rotors, break hub assembly free, break axle from knuckle etc. Also rust kills rotors like nobody's business. Same rotor that last 15 years in CA can only last 5 in PA. Things like that.