A beginner's questions on tools - inc. if ever need AF tools

[leoxdeng]

Dear all

I'm new to this forum, and also fairly new to working on cars. So would like to introduce myself

About 6months ago I bought my first car - a 14 yr old Volvo - and with the help of my dad and wife - I've managed some easy jobs:
- changing enging oil
- changing fuel filter
- flushing coolant
- changing spark plugs
- changing serpentine (aux) belt and tensioner (which almost went horribly wrong but eventually had my wife help me holding tensioner while I fitted new belt)

I will soon need to work on the brakes too (replace hose and maybe more).

Will eventually feel confident enough to work on differentials (as don't think previous owners ever changed the fluids), and timing belt / water pump.

As you may have guessed - over the course of these 6months - I've acquired two big boxes of tools!!

What I have now:
- AF combo wrenches
- AF impact sockets, plus a 1" drive 1-1/2" chrome socket
- AF hex keys - all the way to 1"
- metric hex keys - all the way to 19mm
- metric 6pt sockets (shallow chrome, and deep impact) - 1/4", 3/8" and 1/2" and a couple of 3/4" big chrome ones (12 pt)
- metric special sockets - torx, hex and 'E/star' sockets
- metric combo wrenches
- ratcheting wrenches - 3/8, 1/2 and 3/4, and various extenion bars
- impact wrench (dewalt) 1/2
- torque wrench - up to 350nm
- sliding T - a monstrous 1' drive 700mm one - used as breaker bar with 3/4' and 1/2' reducers
- vice grips - x3 big ones and x2 small ones
- various misc. tools - such as serpentine belt tool, crank holding tool for volvo, brake caliper tool, one-man brake bleeding tool, various screw drivers
- VIDA DICE for volvo

I have a few questions - and hope you can help me out:
1) will I ever need the AF tools referenced above? I bought them on ebay as they were good deals and good old quality makes too - but assume I only work on modern cars (2000- date) - will I ever, ever need these AF tools?
2) will I need both the metric hex keys and metric hex sockets? Seems to me the latter would be sufficient. Again I have some really nice old Umbrako ones
3) what's the most common ways of using vice grips? I've so far only used the small one to hold the rubber shield in wheel well to access various pulleys / aux belt

Thanks in advance guys!
Namo Amituofo

 

[bmwrd0]

You will not need AF (I assume you mean across flats, or inch type) on a Volvo. As that car is Swedish and they adopted the metric system in the 1850's I believe. On the other hand, if you buy an Engish car made before 1979 and after 1960, you will find a lot of those fasteners, as the Whitworth standard had been dropped but metric hadn't been standardized. Or, if you own an older home you might find fasteners sized in that regard.

As far as metric hex keys vs. hex sockets, both come in handy. Different ways to attack a problem are always good.

Vise grips are, in my eyes at least, a tool of last resort. Sure, you're using them right, as there is not "wrong" wat to use them. But they can damage things very quickly.

Good luck!

 

[dnschmidt]

What the hell is "AF".

 

[65k10]

What the hell is "AF".

I think it stands for American Fractional or something along that line.

 

[leoxdeng]

Many thanks bmwrd0 - much appreciate you taking the time to reply

@dnschmidt, 65k10 - indeed AF stands for fractions e.g. - 5/16 socket

I need to convince myself to let these (really nice) AF tools go!

 

[theoldwizard1]

First the commonly accepted abbreviation if inches is the double quote ("). A single quote (') is used to abbreviate feet.

- metric special sockets - torx, hex and 'E/star' sockets

Torx and "E/Star" (a.k.a External Torx) do not come in metric vs "English" sizes. T10 is T10, the world around.

Unless you are planning on working on some OLD English or American cars, I can not imagine why you would ever need anything but metric sized wrenches and sockets. American cars have used all metric sized fasteners for 20-30 years !

Also, unless you are planning on working on trucks (sorry, lorries) you will find that the most commonly used drive in 3/8" followed by 1/4". After over 50 years of "shade tree" (what is the English term for "shade tree" ?) wrenching, I very seldom used any of my 1/2" drive sockets and ratchets except to remove wheel lug nuts.

The BEST "one man brake bleeder" is a 1/2L plastic soft drink bottle and some clear hose that will fit snugly over the end of the bleeder screw and a spring clamp/clip (NOT Jubilee) to hold the hose on the bleeder screw. Drill a hole in the screw cap of the bottle for a tight fit for the hose. Run the hose in to the bottom of the bottle. You need a way to keep the bottle upright. Attach the other end of the hose to the bleeder screw (that you had previously loosened) and open about 1/2 turn. Start pumping the brakes but frequently check the fluid level in the master cylinder.

After 4-6 pump (or until an observer sees no air bubble in the hose), close the bleeder and check for a firm pedal.

 

[leoxdeng]

@theoldwizard1 - very good point - how did I forget that!!

 

[Gmonkee]

Wait five years to unload the AF stuff. Am old Austin may cross your path and they are already paid for.

Metrics rule the world of auto work so future buys should go that route.

Most of all have fun slowly building up to actual needs. Take your time.

 

[bluebolt]

F
Unless you are planning on working on some OLD English or American cars, I can not imagine why you would ever need anything but metric sized wrenches and sockets. American cars have used all metric sized fasteners for 20-30 years !

Don't know about other makes but as far as Ford is concerned the last car with SAE hardware I know of is the 1995 Mustang with the 5.0 engine. Anything that bolts to the head or block is still Standard. Along with that the Explorer kept the old 5.0 through 2001 so that is the last of the light duty trucks I am aware of with Standard hardware.

 

[Toothaker]

Don't know about other makes but as far as Ford is concerned the last car with SAE hardware I know of is the 1995 Mustang with the 5.0 engine. Anything that bolts to the head or block is still Standard. Along with that the Explorer kept the old 5.0 through 2001 so that is the last of the light duty trucks I am aware of with Standard hardware.

That transition from SAE (fractional inch) to Metric took many years. In this article from 1973, GM announces they are transitioning to Metric. Ford's first US-made vehicle to be designed and manufactured using metric measurements was the Pinto in 1971. But as bluebolt correctly says, there were still SAE fasteners in use more than 20 years later. Why? Because Detroit didn't redesign existing major vehicle components. Engines, transmissions and the like stayed SAE throughout their lifecycle. So a car that was metric, if it had a 302 would have both metric and SAE. But as new engines and transmissions were designed they were designed in metric.

Edit: I am fixing up a 1970 Ford. In the armrests in the doors, there are red reflectors. The fasteners that hold the reflectors onto the armrest are metric. I imagine the reflectors come from Ford Europe, and Ford just used them instead of designing their own. It's a minor thing, but a surprise to me.

 

[chrismenke]

Here's my thought...if you have space to keep them organized, keep them. Murohy's Law states that as soon as you no longer have them, you will need them. Also, used tools seldom net the seller the fortune folks think they will.

Secondary reasoning is that a lot of older household fixtures in the UK may be fractional, so if you need to replace the porcelain at which you point Percy, you may find use for them yet.

 

[matthew]

Vise grips are, in my eyes at least, a tool of last resort. Sure, you're using them right, as there is not "wrong" wat to use them. But they can damage things very quickly.

I think there is a true-ism that "Vise-Grips are the wrong tool for every job."

But that can be read two ways - they are the wrong tool. But that they are also the tool for every job. When nothing else is available you can make them work (with the risk that they require more skill to avoid damage than most people realize).

That said, think of them more as a clamp than a wrench or a plier, and you won't have too many regrets.

 

[ddawg16]

You never have enough tools...................just like you never have enough garage space....

Reality....you never know when you will need them....no reason to get rid of them. Chances are you will never recover your money.....until that one day when you need it.

Keep an eye out for some metric stuff...and a bigger tool box.

BTW....what part of London? I have family in the East Horsley area.....My wife is from Preston...FIL Liverpool and MIL Blackburn.

 

[Volvotechdude]

What model Volvo? Don't worry about getting a crank holding tool, if you can secure a good 1/2 impact that'll be more than enough to zip the crank bolt off. Don't worry about E torx either, won't need them on Volvo's if that's the only vehicle type your working on. Hex keys/bits/sockets are used on the caliper bolts as well as the drive shafts coupling to the Angle gear if it's AWD.

 

[JR 42]

I wouldn't get rid of anything I didn't already have a higher- quality duplicate of. I buy all the weird dead sizes I find cheap because I'd rather have it...

 

[Tallpilot]

Here's my thought...if you have space to keep them organized, keep them. Murphy's Law states that as soon as you no longer have them, you will need them. Also, used tools seldom net the seller the fortune folks think they will.

Secondary reasoning is that a lot of older household fixtures in the UK may be fractional, so if you need to replace the porcelain at which you point Percy, you may find use for them yet.

Indeed. If you are starving to death and have a wrench by all means sell the wrench and buy some food. Otherwise hold on to the wrench; they are surprisingly useful at times.

 

[ca90ss]

Don't worry about E torx either, won't need them on Volvo's if that's the only vehicle type your working on.

There was a handful of e torx fasteners on the S70 I had.

 

[JBH]

What the hell is "AF".

"Across Flats," which is English for "SAE."

The term is a contrast to the older British convention, which was based on thread diameter rather than head size. A 1/2" Whitworth is the same as roughly 15/16" AF if memory serves.

 

[mr.lemons]

^^ I think dnschmidt was joking.

Welcome to the forum leoxdeng

Unless you have a specific hobby/occupation that requires them I don't think you will need imperial sizes. Keep an imperial adjustable spanner handy just in case.

If you haven't discovered it already. 'Tools of the old world' is a good thread for info on tools in the UK and Europe.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28952

 

[Wamsutta]

I thought AF = Air Force tools.

 

[leoxdeng]

Thanks a lot guys for all your thoughtful replies!! Much appreciated!

So last night I've put all the imperial size tools on ebay - I bought them from the same place and paid low prices - so they should fetch more or less the same amount.

And if I ever need them - guess I can always buy more used sets!!

My tool box is getting bigger and heavier - and I'd hate to have tools that I'd almost never use - I do believe tools are to be used (not to be stored as collection)

And there is also a theory that left unattended tools tend to breed themselves - which kinda explains why my tool boxes keep getting bigger

@ddawg16 I'm from central London.

@theoldwizard1 thanks for pointing out my school boy error - have corrected the ' to " . And how did I miss my 1/4 ratchet from the list! The most used tools are an old set of Kamasa 1/4 and 3/8 ratchet and sockets. My 1/2 set (Halfords Advanced) is still almost brand new - used it to take off splash guard (13mm recessed bolts) and engine oil bolt cap.

 

[Mr_B]

I guess british english term for shade tree would be DIY mechanic or backyard mechanic .