A few roofing Qs

[Anarius]

So, a buddy and I started dismantling all the **** attached to the walls of the two-car detached garage at my recently purchased home to start the prep for insulating this last weekend. Unfortunately, when we moved some boards sitting the trusses, we found a few spots of rot in the OSB sheathing. Nothing huge, but they need to be addressed.

The real bummer is that there are 2 layers of shingles on the roof, which will cause more trouble during repair attempts. My buddy is confident that we can strip out and replace sections of shingles and achieve a good repair, but as far as I can guess the shingles are about 12 years old.

This begs the question of "should I just tear it off and do a new roof, properly?"

I've gotten a few of bids on the work $2400 -$2700. Thats out of the budget right now, I'd be around $400 for the materials to repair it.

However, a few years ago metal roofs became accepted by code in my area. I saw an ad that metal roofing is now "cheaper than shingles". Is this true? Does anyone have any good DIY advice / resources for metal roofing, or an idea of what a reasonable price would be? The garage is a 24x24 with a 4/12 roof.

 

[K'ledgeBldr]

Quotes, quotes, and more quotes. That is the answer-

Once you have 3-4 quotes for both materials you can make an educated decision based on the information before you.

 

[blazentrout]

Are you going to attempt the repairs your self?
I would most likely reroof the whole thing my self. at 12yrs i look at the life span being half over and doing spot repairs on 2 layers of shingles never look right in the end. You could strip one side and repair the rot damage one weekend and the do the other side the next weekend. iirc the last job(24x26) i helped on was $110 a square just for the shingles and he got out of it for less than a grand with beer when it was all said and done. food for thought.

 

[chamoisfive]

I'd go for metal roofing a everytime, but then it's arguably the most common roofing material in this country. Shingles like you have, not so much.
Your climatic conditions have a lot to do with that though.
In my job experience, steel roofing is a lot less labour & materials intensive than shingles, lasts a lot longer and IMNSHO, a better product

 

[CNGsaves]

Re: A few roofing Questions

Not likely to get proper advice without posting up PIC's for fellow GJer's to SEE what you're talking about.

If your "OSB sheathing damage" is just up on roof from some leaking shingles, then cutout bad sections and replace. However, from your description above, you claim some sort of "truss damage" . . . . hard to imagine without pics, and somewhat unlikely after only 12 years.

If roof pitch isn't shedding water (or ice dam problems), then you'll want to upgrade what was there previously. Thus, install better underlayment like Ice/Water shield instead of tar paper. Insulation and proper venting is next area that may need improved.

Metal roof cures lot of above problems as it's so durable.

However, quality composition shingle (ie NOT 3 tab) should give you 20+ year life even in harsh conditions, IF properly installed.

Again . . . . . just NEED to have pics.

 

[Anarius]

I'll try and get some pics tonight after work. And no, there is no truss damage. There was a bunch of junk being stored ON the trusses blocking the view of the under side of the roof sheathing.

 

[Notgrownup]

Start fresh is the best way but you can spot repair , it's a PITA but can be done.

 

[nfk]

I would do a complete tear-off to allow you to check the rest of the roof for damage.

 

[Leaflessshadetree]

OK, so there is some rot. Is it currently leaking? If not can you wait and do it some other day?

 

[404]

Tear if off and do it properly. If rot is visible on the back side think of what the front side looks like. May be to the point where standing on that area a footstep would go through. I redid my roof and tore off 2 or 3 layers. Lots of surprises hidden under all that junk. Flashing with nails in the inside corners, etc.

 

[Jlbc212]

When I bought the metal roofing material for my garage ceiling, it cost just under $1 per square foot. That did not include any trim materials. I didn't need trim. Your garage is 24x24 or 576 square feet. With a 4/12 roof pitch and a bit of overhang you have about 700 square feet.
You could make a temporary repair now, but you'll be throwing it out (and your $400) when you decide to do it right.

 

[volleyball]

Ribbed metal sheets are the best way to go. You could even leave what you have and do no repairs, just new metal on top over purlins.
The old shingles will give noise reduction.
You could remove shingles and then cover with high density foam board and then metal for some insulation and noise reduction.
I kinda like the pater of rain on metal but when it is heavy, it gets annoying.
And 4/12 pitch is plenty.
Best way to get metal is to get it from a supplier who can order it to exact length.

 

[Seppala]

In October 2010 I did a total tear off of one layer of shingles+tarpaper on a garage very close to yours in size, 22x20, with a 4/12 roof pitch. Tarpaper plus 7 square of 3 tab shingles and dump fees came to about $750-$800. Took two weekends to do working alone. Being 57 years old at the time didn't help either.

 

[Catadj78]

Go metal. The place I get it from cuts to exact length. 1.80 lf for painted. If its a gable roof it will be easy to do yourself since its just a layover. Add ridge cap and outside corners to cover the rake edge and be done.

Attach furring strips on top of existing shingles if you are abled. Code may not let you have 3 layers total.

 

[Falcon67]

Around here there are lots of metal roofs and for contracted work, they are about double the cost of shingles. I would tear it down to the decking, fix the OSB, lay synthetic underlayment and re-roof. I did my 24x40 and as I recall, decking and all was under $1K. Yep, it was a *****. And that year a cool summer day was a day under 100F.

 

[NWOhioChevyGuy]

At that age, I would tear off and reroof.

Then you know what you have.

If it is a detached garage, with a two way roof, you and a buddy could do it in two weekends easy.

 

[bczygan]

You are going to get every conceivable answer to your questions.

I'm in SE MI too, with a background as a builder.

Some things to consider.

Metal roofing is not typical in this area. Further north, you start to see it. And it works better on steeper pitches than you have, to let snow just slide off.

Get bids for materials alone, and then get bids for materials and labor, for each roofing type. Then you will know for sure, the price differences.

And as far as repairing, no. Do not even consider it. Especially with 2 layers.

Your roof has reached the end of it's useful life, which for shingles usually runs about 10 years or so, despite warranty claims to the contrary. Time to strip and redo.

It's time for a complete strip in either case

All that said, I have also thought about metal. But it would stick out like a sore thumb in a sea of shingled houses.

 

[Anarius]

OK, thanks for the input so far, folks.

Here are some pics of what I'm dealing with.

<a href="http://imgur.com/pLBYlh5"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/pLBYlh5l.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" /></a>
My poor garage

<a href="http://imgur.com/hKZTJfc"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/hKZTJfcl.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" /></a>

"Big" Leak, approx 18" from the outer edge of the roof

<a href="http://imgur.com/LB1zYbx"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/LB1zYbxl.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" /></a>

"small" leak, 4' from outer edge. The "big" leak is two trusses to the left in this pic

<a href="http://imgur.com/XJOEv8I"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/XJOEv8Im.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" /></a><a href="http://imgur.com/yhBfGKd"><img src="http://i.imgur.com/yhBfGKdm.jpg" title="source: imgur.com" /></a>
Couple pics to show the general construction of the garage. Built in the summer of '91 from what records I can find.

 

[finn]

I'm a contrary: I'd try a repair before I threw in the towel and did a complete reroof, especially if you are strapped at all, as most are after the purchase of a house. Even if you only get a couple of years out of the repair, you have some recovery time and you never know what else is going to happen requiring you to tap your reserve fund.

A shingle roof should have a few more years left, but I agree that the "good" years are past.

Metal is common in rural areas, but looks out of place for the most part in suburban / village locations. It also isn't as cheap it first appears as you need fasteners, a ridge, and soffit / fascia, and perhaps purlins to make the roof look good.

 

[Kevin54]

If the roof is still in decent shape overall, and you only have a couple leaks, repair what you have, until you can afford a rear-off.

What you more than likely have is a nail that is showing in the rain groove of the shingle. Beings that you don't have a ceiling or insulation, it should be relatively easy to locate. First off, walk the roof to see if you can see any nail heads showing in the rain grooves. If not, then where the leak is, tap that nail up slightly and it will hoove the area up where the leak is.

Now only do this in the morning or evening when the shingles are cool, but seeing that you are in Michigan, you can do it anytime now......take a putty knife and slide under the shingle to loosen it from the tar strip. Take some asphalt sealer and coat the nail head, then back under the shingle to seal it down. Do this on each leak. This will get you by for a number of years.

Water runs downhill, so start at the top of the leak on the inside and locate the nail(s). After you have things repaired, give the area a coat or two of Kilz primer and keep an eye on it. If it leaks, it will discolor the Kilz.

Another thing I notice that I can't see, is a lack of sheeting clips. The clips keep the OSB from moving up and down from one another which if someone had walked the roof when it was hot a few times, it could break a shingle horizontally. In that case, if you have a pack or two of spare shingles, you may need to put a couple of new ones in. Not a hard job, but you still have to separate the shingles from the adhesive strip with a putty knife, and remove a few shingles either side, and up and down from the broken shingle. You will also need a flat bar to (CAREFULLY) remove the nails.

Now with no sheathing clips, you really need some for support. To do that, each piece of sheeting would need to be removed. An easier way to fix things would be that when you re-roof it is to put 2x4's between the rafters on the horizontal joint. You can put them in now, and screw them to the rafters with two deck screws, or 16d's on each end, running through the rafter first. Then when you re-roof, even though it will take a little longer, once the roof is stripped, take some deck screws and screw the sheeting down to the already fastened 2x4's.

 

[CTyankee]

You've got a low, easily walkable roof to work on. That's a DIY roof if I've ever seen one.

You don't say how old you are, but unless you're in your 70's...you and your buddy should have no problem stripping, repairing and replacing that roof. Cost wise you should be able to do it for a fraction of the quotes you got.

OTOH, there is no reason you can't successfully make a few repairs to hold you over for awhile. Go for it.

 

[bczygan]

You could always install a blue tarp roof until fall.

 

[Anarius]

OK,

My current plan is to call the "home warranty" folks - maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised? Ha, unlikely.

Once they tell me to take a hike, we are going to finish removing ALL the **** from the garage and go over the roof very carefully and try to fix each leak. If we run into problems with the leak fixin then we will strip it and do it ourselves. This will set me back a couple weeks worth in time, material, and money, but isn't the end of the world. I'd probably take the opportunity to strip the suspect OSB panels wholesale and reinstall new ones using the clips. (I'm not a roofer, and even I'm going "WTF?").

I can afford the roof right now professionally done, but that eats the entire insulating and finishing budget, as well as part of the electrical budget.

On the Kilz stuff, I have some "2", are you suggesting I leave the semi-rotted boards in place, and kilz the underside of them?

 

[Daedalus]

Your home warranty folks will probably charge you just to come out, even if they end up telling you it's not covered. Check your policy.

 

[timewarp]

Are those spots actually wet? If not it is possible that it leaked there and that is why they put the second roof on it. Those stains may have been there for years if they aren't wet, the second layer of roofing may not be leaking and there may be nothing that needs done at this time.

 

[CNGsaves]

No need to call "home warranty" company until you get up on roof and do some investigating yourself.

From pictures, looks like a couple leaks that may have been from first layer of shingles years ago. OP unless you've actually seen water drips while it's raining, do you have any real evidence that roof is leaking now ???

+1 to see if those bad spots of OSB are wet when it rains. Heck if it's dry there now, just go up on roof and pour 5 gal bucket of water just above those bad spots and see if the OSB on underside gets wet. My bet is they do NOT . . and thus you have Old Damage and nothing to really worry about.

Worst case scenario, if bad OSB spots leaking now, then just replace/repair about 3 ft x 3 ft section of shingles where that worst spot is located. Looks to me there in one bad nail hole in middle of that worst spot of OSB. Costs for this would be $11 bucket of tar and one bundle of $33 shingles.

 

[bczygan]

You can also check the wood from inside with an awl or screwdriver, to see if the wood is truly rotted and soft.

 

[404]

Is that olive green furry stuff on the 2 by material in the pics mold?

 

[99_xc600]

I did my roof last June. The garage is 24'x24'. There were 3 layers of shingles on the roof. The hardest part of the job was the tear off. I looked for clear weather during the week and I would do a little stripping each night when the heat of the day was gone. By friday night it was stripped and ready to be shingled.

Saturday morning, I had my brother, a friend and my stepson ready to help. My stepson volunteered to hump all of the bundles up on to the roof while we did the layout, drip edge, ice and water and tar paper. By the time, the shingles were on the roof, we were ready to start nailing.

We had both sides done by 2:00. By then we were in full sun and quit for the day. The next morning, I did the ridge cap and trimmed all of the ends.

If the pitch is low enough and the roof is simple. It's not that hard to do. Not a lot of brain power to do, just a lot of physical stamina.