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A quick note about TGJ and the future...

Lou's Garage

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 12, 2008
Messages
580
Location
Anderson, SC
Thanks to Ryan and all the others who put their time and effort into The Garage Journal. It is a great place to check into, see what everyone's up to, and occasionally help someone out.

If I can be of any help during testing, just let me know.

Lou
 
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Ryan

Administrator
Staff member
Joined
Jan 26, 2006
Messages
5,691
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Texas/Hawaii
Some of you guys act as if I have a choice. I don't. Here's a better explanation:

TGJ is ran on VB 3.8 - widely known as the last version of VB that actually works and scales. However, VB 3.8 doesn't run on newer versions of PHP. In fact, we are quickly getting to the point where in order to stay on VB 3.8, I would have to run an unsupported version of PHP. That's not only risky from a software standpoint as far as security goes, but it risks all of the data posted here since 2005. I'm not willing to do that.

So, my options are to upgrade to VB 5 (which is widely known as a miserable piece of software) or move to Xenforo. I'm moving to Xenforo because I have experience with both VB 5 and Xenforo and know first hand which piece of software works better given the loads that we have.
 

Cardboard Man

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2008
Messages
810
Location
NJ
TGJ is my favorite site and I visit here several times daily when possible. I love the content and volume of information, and I like that it's popular and fast paced. I also appreciate all the hard work that goes on behind the scenes to keep things running.

From what I've been able to gather, changing the platform will make it easier/more efficient to to manage from an administrative standpoint, not necessarily easier to use from a user standpoint.

Since this change is going to happen regardless of who likes it or not, I'd just ask that you don't go crazy with features just because you can. I really like the simplicity of how this place is and I'd hate to see it junked up with a bunch of gaudy gingerbread.

I visited the HAMB and I noticed the following:
- Way too many hard-to-read fonts. Too many styles, and entirely too small. Those "hamburger" things where it says "so-and-so likes this" are uncomfortably small.
- The contrast is not good. Too much light grey text against a white page. Very uncomfortable to read.
- Posting date and # are displayed at the bottom AFTER you read the post, not at the top. I prefer the top so you can tell immediately if the post is new.
- I don't see a "go to last page" option. This is almost a deal breaker.

If this seems critical, it is, but it's meant in a constructive way because I want this place to remain my favorite. I hope you will consider my thoughts when setting things up, but like an old friend of mine always said, "Do what you want, you're going to anyway."
 

ddawg16

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 11, 2008
Messages
21,005
Location
S. California
Some of you guys act as if I have a choice. I don't. Here's a better explanation:

TGJ is ran on VB 3.8 - widely known as the last version of VB that actually works and scales. However, VB 3.8 doesn't run on newer versions of PHP. In fact, we are quickly getting to the point where in order to stay on VB 3.8, I would have to run an unsupported version of PHP. That's not only risky from a software standpoint as far as security goes, but it risks all of the data posted here since 2005. I'm not willing to do that.

So, my options are to upgrade to VB 5 (which is widely known as a miserable piece of software) or move to Xenforo. I'm moving to Xenforo because I have experience with both VB 5 and Xenforo and know first hand which piece of software works better given the loads that we have.

Interesting read about VB and Xenforo....basically, VB is not going anywhere seeing how most of the VB team stepped down in 2009 and started Xenforo....with lawsuits to follow.......

It boiled down to the Team wanted to do a complete re-write and the new owners, Internet Brands, wanted them to do "agile development atop the existing code instead".

As a programmer, I can see both sides.....a lot of time and money was spent getting VB to where it was....the owners didn't want to waste time and money doing a re-write when you could just 'hack' what they had....but I can also appreciate the frustration of trying to improve something you know has issues. It's about par to trying to make an old boat anchor Cadillac handle like a BMW.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XenForo

In a nutshell....the change to Xenforo is future proofing GJ before it becomes impossible to maintain.
 

PCMusicGuy

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Messages
851
Location
Houston, TX
I'm all for back end efficiency changes to the forum. The 2 big things I hate about Xenforo, based on looking at the HAMB as a non-member, are:

1. The stupid waste of vertical screen space. On this forum, at my current 1080 resolution I can see 20 thread listings at a time. On the HAMB, I can only see 11 at a time. That is garbage. Screens are getting wider, not taller, and you don't get any extra benefit of the white space.

2. The thumbnails before every single thread. For me, this serves no purpose other than wasting bandwidth. If the thread title itself is something I'm interested in, I will click on it. I like the clean look that is currently going on here.
 

7echo

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
432
Location
coastal Georgia
Hey Ryan, just a thought.

Is it possible to either add a plumbing section or change the Heating & AC section to a "Plumbing & HVAC" section ? Plumbing questions/suggestion always seemed to get tossed where ever.

Change it to MEP. Would cover Mechanical, Electrical, and Plumbing.
 

NUTTSGT

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Sep 14, 2009
Messages
50,863
Location
Northern Central Ohio
Change it to MEP. Would cover Mechanical, Electrical, and Plumbing.

I think that would create another problem. If it has the word mechanical in the section subtitle, I think there will be a lot of automotive threads getting started in there which would need to get moved.
 

7echo

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 16, 2008
Messages
432
Location
coastal Georgia
I think that would create another problem. If it has the word mechanical in the section subtitle, I think there will be a lot of automotive threads getting started in there which would need to get moved.

Excellent point. I was thinking MEP would work, just thinking from a construction perspective. Also, a lot of guys wouldn't know that HVAC would be under M...
 

astrohip

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 7, 2015
Messages
338
Location
Brenham TX
I'm all for back end efficiency changes to the forum. The 2 big things I hate about Xenforo, based on looking at the HAMB as a non-member, are:

1. The stupid waste of vertical screen space. On this forum, at my current 1080 resolution I can see 20 thread listings at a time. On the HAMB, I can only see 11 at a time. That is garbage. Screens are getting wider, not taller, and you don't get any extra benefit of the white space.

2. The thumbnails before every single thread. For me, this serves no purpose other than wasting bandwidth. If the thread title itself is something I'm interested in, I will click on it. I like the clean look that is currently going on here.
Those are design choices. Whoever created the actual design for that site made those decisions. Xenforo doesn't "look" like that at all.

One of the powerful aspects to Xenforo is the variety of ways you can make a forum look. Of course, that gives you the power to make it look/work well, or not. As many have noted, HAMB would get votes as "not".
 

reader2580

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 31, 2014
Messages
14,514
Location
Minneapolis, MN
Those are design choices. Whoever created the actual design for that site made those decisions. Xenforo doesn't "look" like that at all.

One of the powerful aspects to Xenforo is the variety of ways you can make a forum look. Of course, that gives you the power to make it look/work well, or not. As many have noted, HAMB would get votes as "not".

Most VB forums have a pretty similar look and feel that most users are used to. I don’t think users hate the XenForo software so much as they hate the look and feel of many forums using the software. If forum owners use a XenForo template that matches their current VB forum as closely as possible there will be few complaints.
 

Bad Eye Bill

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 15, 2017
Messages
5,028
Location
New Brunswick Canada
I can't even remember what the HAMB looked like before the change. I have no problems with how it is now but I do remember it taking a little while and some experimenting before I figured it all out.
 

iajonesy

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 8, 2009
Messages
2,467
Location
Iowa
I am a dinosaur as far as technology is concerned, so any changes will not really bother me. I just enjoy this site and any improvements will be welcomed.

I hope this site never loses its "vibe", as it is so much fun the majority of the time. I learn and sometimes add my knowledge ( however limited) and always find it interesting. I appreciate the time and effort that Ryan and the mods put in and hope we always have the GJ.

Mike
 

ARFLY

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 28, 2013
Messages
848
Location
NW Arkansas
Whatever needs to be done is what it is. I just enjoy reading all the great information on here and seeing all the cool stuff. When the site change happens, it will be different but we will adapt and move on and hopefully a great thing continues.
 

PCMusicGuy

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 15, 2009
Messages
851
Location
Houston, TX
Those are design choices. Whoever created the actual design for that site made those decisions. Xenforo doesn't "look" like that at all.

One of the powerful aspects to Xenforo is the variety of ways you can make a forum look. Of course, that gives you the power to make it look/work well, or not. As many have noted, HAMB would get votes as "not".

Yes. I know this. Those are poor design choices.

That would be Ryan.

My concern exactly. :scared:
 
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rharman

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Joined
Apr 22, 2012
Messages
8,735
Location
SoCal
And a sub-category for just PVC Airlines.............:evil:

If you're going to go that specific, we need:
I Love Craftsman
I Hate Craftsman
Harbor Freight is OK
Harbor Freight is the devil's spawn
Can I use some leftover 22ga bell wire to run my 5hp compressor with a 15amp breaker?

and so on and so on....
 

beelsr

Well-known member
Joined
May 6, 2007
Messages
1,324
Location
NE PA, USA
as someone who's done this a few times for the day job, xf is the way i'd go too. at least you waited until xf2 came out. gearing up for a couple migrations as well - from phpbb. i managed to stay away from running vb sites altogether... <whew> ;)

don't care what it runs on as long as it runs, the UI is customizeable enough.



Some of you guys act as if I have a choice. I don't. Here's a better explanation:

TGJ is ran on VB 3.8 - widely known as the last version of VB that actually works and scales. However, VB 3.8 doesn't run on newer versions of PHP. In fact, we are quickly getting to the point where in order to stay on VB 3.8, I would have to run an unsupported version of PHP. That's not only risky from a software standpoint as far as security goes, but it risks all of the data posted here since 2005. I'm not willing to do that.

So, my options are to upgrade to VB 5 (which is widely known as a miserable piece of software) or move to Xenforo. I'm moving to Xenforo because I have experience with both VB 5 and Xenforo and know first hand which piece of software works better given the loads that we have.
 

JasonMcElroy

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 5, 2012
Messages
375
Location
San Jose by way of Philly & NYC
Thanks for all your work to date. I like this place.

I've run a few, far smaller, blogs and sites in the last twenty years and based on the work I had to put in . . . cannot fathom how much it takes to do something at TGJ scale.

Thanks again.

Jason
 

pcmeiners

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
7,826
Location
In the only town in Pennsylvania, Bloomsburg.
Seems everyone has survived Mr. Ryan, good work. :)

"Hell, I even posted in FREE PARKING a couple times. I'm still alive. I didn't self combust... and it wasn't THAT bad. I guess..."

You might change your mind/self combust after reading about dog **** glands; a new scatological depth for Free Parking :lol_hitti
 
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nadogail

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2009
Messages
31,906
Location
Coronado, CA
I am a bit of a dinosaur in that I am now in my 80's. Garage Journal is the only Social Media site I participate in.

I appreciate the site and strive to be a worthy citizen.

Please keep this public forum going.
 

Toolfool

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 22, 2011
Messages
4,981
Location
Tallahassee, FL
I have walked away from three forums in the last couple of years after they "upgraded" their format to something that left me lost. Hoping this place doesn't end up the same.
 

K13

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 24, 2007
Messages
2,222
Location
St. Albert, AB Canada
I love how when formats change on forums people act like they didn't have to learn how to use the original format and now they are under some great hardship to learn a new one. A forum isn't very valuable to you if the couple of hours, at most, it would take to learn a new format is not worth the time. The same hullabaloo happened when the HAMB changed formats.
 
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