advice on starting a tool collection

[socket_wrench]

i sent this email to my "little" cousin who has recently taken an interest in acquiring a tool set. he's about to graduate college and i doubt he's ever turned a ratchet in his life. so i sent this excessively long email to him on the subject. i'd love to hear your input. i realize i probably exposed some ignorance on my part, but that's ok, i have a good flame suit. just keep in mind that my target audience was not an aspiring mechanic..........



hey,

your mom said you were interested in starting a tool collection? first of all, that's great. every self respecting man needs to know how to (at least) do basic auto maintenance.

i was going to tell you in person, but i thought i'd write it down so i don't forget. and then you can have it for reference, too. i've spent probably over $100 putting together my latest tool kit. it's 95% craftsman usa made.

allow me to make the following recommendations:
i've pretty much only used craftsman tools that were made in the usa. i've never broken a craftsman usa tool. in fact, i've only broken a small handful of tools. they were all super cheap & super crappy quality. i always made a point to buy good stuff. so that probably helped. after years of abuse, i do think i need to get my craftsman 1/2" ratchet rebuilt. however, i have abused it by using it as a breaker bar on many occasions. that's not good to do. but as far as breaking tools, you're not likely to do it regardless of what you buy as long as you buy a good quality brand.

don't subscribe to the logic of "it has a lifetime guarantee and therefore it's good." think about this scene from tommy boy:
Customer: But why do they put a guarantee on the box?
Tommy: Because they know all they sold ya was a guaranteed *************. That's all it is, isn't it? Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will. I got spare time. But for now, for your customer's sake, for your daughter's sake, ya might wanna think about buying a quality product from me.

check out garagejournal.com for tool reviews, info, etc...

decide if you want to buy made in USA or not. if you do, you have to be ready to pay a little more. (fwiw, i try my best to stay made in usa. that means i've had to branch out from craftsman lately. that's how i've come across a lot of this info below)
you can find some good quality imported tools at a reasonable price.
you can find some really crappy quality tools for really cheap.
no matter what you do, don't buy crappy quality tools.
i don't think you can buy a crappy quality USA tool.

a lot of tool companies have consolidated over the years. lots of brands are rebranded or made by other tool brands.
just look up apex tools in wikipedia. or danaher. it's crazy.

anyway, in no order, USA brands are SK, armstrong, cornwell, and wright.

snap-on is mostly usa, although some can be imported now. i think they have two different product lines.

craftsman is going imported. the only thing i find all USA is sockets. and their sets that include a ratchet have a USA ratchet. but all individual ratchets, plus the socket extensions, and wrenches are all imported now.

mac and matco are mostly imported at this point.

proto brand is owned by stanley, but they're higher quality than regular stanley tools. they're imported, i think, though. they're expensive, too.

husky (home depot) is ok, i think. i don't have any of their tools. a coworker has a husky set and likes it. i think a lot of warranty is done through the mail, though. they don't carry very many individual pieces. they cost less than kobalt.

kobalt (lowes) used to be usa but now is imported. although, i think imported kobalt tools are really good quality. also they sell tools individually. so if you broke a socket you should be able to walk in and out with a replacement.

harbor freight has two tool lines. they have pittsburg and pittsburg pro. i've broken a few pittsburg socket adapters and they're complete shite. however, i did buy a set of pittsburg pro sockets to fill in a few missing in a set and they seem ok. haven't used them yet. i feel dirty having them. i think pittsburg pro is supposed to be a new line with higher quality.

oreilly's sells gm performance brand tools. they're imported but good quality. i have a socket set from them that i like. and a couple wrenches i've picked up from pawn shops. they're ok, too.

autozone sells duralast brand. i only have one from them because i needed it ASAP. i feel dirty having that, too. i hate autozone. however, the tool itself seems of decent quality. the wrench is significantly larger (longer handled) than my others. it's almost too big.

crescent brand has some nice looking sets but i've never used one of their tools. i'd be willing to try, though.

same with allen & gear wrench. i've never bought gearwrench but i've heard good things about them. the prices just have never allowed me to buy them.

thorsen - like crescent & allen, i don't know what their quality is like now but i'd buy their usa tools if i found some, needed them, and the price was right.



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if you've made it this far, congratulations. i have a few more things to mention...
i've had 36 tooth ratchets for my entire life. i just bought a 60 tooth ratchet. holy **** is it significantly nicer. but, i bought it after i realized i had about every socket and wrench i could ever need. so i had to find something to "upgrade". if a ratchet doesn't list how many teeth, assume it's a low tooth count. but again, i have done everything in my entire life on cars with a 36 tooth ratchet. so it's not a big deal. but if all things are equal, get higher tooth count.

buy tools in as large of sets as possible. you save money that way.
when buying a set, especially the smaller 7 - 12 piece sets, check the sizes included. lots of times, those sets will skip a size. make sure they're not skipping a size you want / need.

don't intentionally be a brand *****. if you just keep finding deals with one brand, then go for it. if you buy different brands here and there, then you will be able to tell the differences between them. then you'll be able to find what you do and don't like. which is always a good thing.

don't pay full price for anything craftsman because it'll like be on sale in the next month or two.

buy tools when they're on sale if you can instead of when you need them.

6 point sockets & wrenches are better than 12 point sockets & wrenches, but i've never actually had problems with 12 pt sockets or wrenches. so if the price is equal, get 6 point. if 6 point is more, get 12 point.

tools that you must have / are higher priority...

10mm, 15mm, 17mm, 19mm are the most common sizes on your car. your lug nuts use a 21mm socket.

get a shallow and deep socket of everything you buy

get these sizes in wrenches too.

ratcheting wrenches are cool and probably useful if you use them a lot. but there is no job a ratcheting wrench can do that a regular wrench can't. so, in building up a tool kit, i'd go regular wrenches. get ratcheting ones later.

you need a 5/8" socket for the spark plugs. the spark plug sockets (not just a 5/8" size socket) have a rubber insert in them to help hold onto the spark plugs

you'll need a 12" extension to change the plugs on your mazda.

other than that spark plug socket, you shouldn't need anything in standard / SAE sizes.

 

[rsanter]

Advice
Start small

Bob

 

[0311Grunt]

Jesus. Thats going to overwhelm someone with no idea about tools. I didnt go over every detail, but it did look like good information - just a bit too much and bit scattered.

Will you post his reply?

 

[bobcatdan]

Starting a tool collection is easy First flag down a SO truck then sign over first born. Once Mr. Big is full, done.

 

[sk farmer]

i thought you wanted to help him. what a rambling mess of competely accurate to completely inaccurate info. just to start i find these flagrant inaccuracies

1. you can't paint any brand with the single coo label. every brand has had an import in the line at some timein the past or present you neeed to evaluate each on it's own basis

2. the only sae size you will eve need is a 5/8 spark plug socket? what a foolish thought. i suppose the guy will never own a house , lawnmower or run across anything that isn't brand new where sae sizes are still prevelant.

 

[StevePgh]

I'm assuming you are talking in the context of automotive... Other than what you said, I'd suggest:
- a torque wrench (even the HF ones are fine - tell him to make sure to set it to zero religiously when done using)
- a repair manual for the vehicle - one from the mfg. for real torques/instructions and a Haynes/Chilton for general technique/troubleshooting.

If you are talking general handyman/homeowner stuff the list is far broader and vastly different.

 

[silentpoet]

Buy used. I use 1/2 inch most myself, old gms have them by the ton. The only metric I ever really use is 13 or is it 14 mm for changing the oil on my daily driver. I buy used when I find a good enough deal. I only buy new if I am desperate or for odd specialty tools. And that is usually when I need something on the weekend when the pawn shops are already closed. I am resolved to never pay retail. I have a mix of tools, but a few snap on, mac, and a decent amount of USA Craftsman.

 

[creativecars]

I do admire the fact that you are trying to help your cousin out.
I think it is a shame he is about to graduate college and knows nothing about tools.
A person needs both SAE and Metric tools.
Why would you feel dirty about HF tools? Do they not loosen fasteners as well as those that cost X10?
My first thought was why start a tool collection??? I have tools to use, NOT collect. I know it is just wordage, but it bugs me and sounds like a tool collection belongs in a Man Cave, neither of which I am much impressed with.

 

[shoturtle]

Proto is mix of US and taiwan. Actually the majority is made in the USA, as they sell heavily to the US govt. They made their ratcheting wrenches in taiwan for years, and just started making a US once again. Yeah they are expensive tool brand.

HF no longer carry individual socket, can not fill in any more. So warranty is not an issue I guess. Losing one will be hard to replace with HF.

And the part you need to address you can get crappy USA made tools. They are out there.

I would advise to get a larger kolbalt or craftsman set with about 300pc. That way he will have pretty much all his socket needs covered. And it will save him money in the long run. And in the US, you really need a set with both SAE and Metric, even if he never runs into sae on a car. Routine stuff around the house will be all SAE for a good while still. So he will need SAE. And a master set will cover that instance.

Also you neglected to mention screw drivers. Craftsman pros are great drivers, and for the price they are an unbeatable value when on sale. You also did not mention hex and torx. They are more and more common. And getting a set of hex and torx drivers would be a good idea, not just keys.

It sounds like you are gearing him away form sears form personal feeling about craftsman out sourcing. But they still have good tools, and at a price point someone starting out can afford without going with lower quality HF stuff. Sears and Kolbalt would be the route to go with a master set. At their stores you can get replacement if you loose a socket. I suffer form losing a socket in the past, never broken one as a shade tree mechanic. Husky's larger master set is supposedly made in the USA.

I would mention the sears universal set, they are the best consumer grade spline drive out there. They fit as well as my protos stuff. And he can cover 6pt,12pt, e-torx, 4pt. That way he can skip getting etorx sockets. And the spline design grabs way off the corner so they will not round out a bolt like 12pt. Stay away form the kolbalt version. That is junk.

 

[RedFordTruck]

If I were to help someone fill a tool box I would see how much they want to spend and what they want to use them for and then go from there. Id say at somepoint he is going to be a homeowner so buy a wide range of stuff.

Based on whats readily available in retail stores, Id say...

Craftsman screwdrivers work great. For a average use theres no need to spend any more. I have some of the pro screwdrivers and they turn the same screws as the acetate ones.

Channellock or Craftsman for pliers. Great values, USA made. Again, spend a little more and you go from Crappy HF/Kobalt/Evolv/Husky Chinese pliers and get much better. I almost prefer the WF Craftsman tongue and groove to the channellock tongue and groove pliers.

Wrenches I would try to get USA craftsman rp then I would go Taiwan Kobalt after that. Kmart and Ace still have USA Craftsman wrenches for sure.

Sockets You can still get USA craftsman. Best bang for your buck. Buy SAE and Metrichanical.

Ratchets... If you are fine using 36t craftsman then go ahead. I use them all the time and they work great in most uses.

Hammers Id go Vaughan or Craftsman. Same thing. Vaughan makes craftsman hammers so buy which one sparkles the most.

Id get a good set of Bondhus hex keys from Northern Tool for $13.
Stanley Powerlock tape measures can be had for $8-10.
Home Depot has Dewalt Box cutters with a 50 pack of Extra blades for $12.**.


And yes buy SAE and Metric.

 

[socket_wrench]

first of all, thanks for the input... i know it's a long email and somewhat scattered. you'll have to take my word for it that he's a smart kid, he can make sense of it. plus he's probably used to it as well. i give detailed answers to questions.

Jesus. Thats going to overwhelm someone with no idea about tools. I didnt go over every detail, but it did look like good information - just a bit too much and bit scattered.

Will you post his reply?

yes i'll post his response in a bit. i sent him a text as a heads up. his response "holy hell"

i thought you wanted to help him. what a rambling mess of competely accurate to completely inaccurate info. just to start i find these flagrant inaccuracies

1. you can't paint any brand with the single coo label. every brand has had an import in the line at some timein the past or present you neeed to evaluate each on it's own basis

2. the only sae size you will eve need is a 5/8 spark plug socket? what a foolish thought. i suppose the guy will never own a house , lawnmower or run across anything that isn't brand new where sae sizes are still prevelant.

i appreciate your point about painting with a broad brush. i did that in an attempt to keep it as simple as i could for such a long email. but i wanted him to know he couldn't go to lowes and look for a usa kobalt ratchet, or whatever. that was the point at that.

also, this was only for a starting point. he drives a mazda 3, which i also have. and so does his g/f. there are no SAE bolts on there that i have found so far. and i've done a fair bit of work on mine. he lives in an apartment right now. when he graduates, he's moving into another apartment. there's no need for a lawnmower, etc. i don't tell him never to get SAE. just that he doesn't need it to start. this is all a starting point.

I'm assuming you are talking in the context of automotive... Other than what you said, I'd suggest:
- a torque wrench (even the HF ones are fine - tell him to make sure to set it to zero religiously when done using)
- a repair manual for the vehicle - one from the mfg. for real torques/instructions and a Haynes/Chilton for general technique/troubleshooting.

If you are talking general handyman/homeowner stuff the list is far broader and vastly different.

you're right...i thought about a repair manual for his car later. torque wrench would involve doing more work than beginner level stuff. i do have a set of HF click type torque wrenches and they seem to be accurate compared against my beam wrench. why set them to zero? i certainly don't do that but will if i need to.

Buy used. I use 1/2 inch most myself, old gms have them by the ton. The only metric I ever really use is 13 or is it 14 mm for changing the oil on my daily driver. I buy used when I find a good enough deal. I only buy new if I am desperate or for odd specialty tools. And that is usually when I need something on the weekend when the pawn shops are already closed. I am resolved to never pay retail. I have a mix of tools, but a few snap on, mac, and a decent amount of USA Craftsman.

my older cars were 1/2, 9/16, and 5/8 all over the place. my three cars now (a 2001, 2004, and 2008 are all metric all the time. except, of course, for the spark plugs)

the thing with buying used is that he would have to know how to compare what he's getting used vs what it costs new. i would probably only suggest that if he was buying a large used set. but knowing his budget would likely preclude that, i didn't even bring it up.

on our cars, it's like i mentioned... 10mm and 15mm are all over the place, plus 17mm for the oil plug, 19mm ... well i actually used it doing a performance upgrade that he wouldn't do. but i know i've used the 19mm socket in the suspension. and the 21mm, like i said, is for my lug nuts. which, in hindsight, might not actually be the same based on the fact we have different trims in our mazdas.

I do admire the fact that you are trying to help your cousin out.
I think it is a shame he is about to graduate college and knows nothing about tools.
A person needs both SAE and Metric tools.
Why would you feel dirty about HF tools? Do they not loosen fasteners as well as those that cost X10?
My first thought was why start a tool collection??? I have tools to use, NOT collect. I know it is just wordage, but it bugs me and sounds like a tool collection belongs in a Man Cave, neither of which I am much impressed with.

i can't say he knows nothing. but he hasn't had a need before. so here he is. put that kid in front of a computer, and he'll make me look silly. and i have a degree in MIS. haha...

i already addressed my comment on SAE.

i don't like the HF tools because, in my experience, they are more likely to break than work. however, i did say that the socket set (pitt pro) i bought looked like higher quality than what i had used before (regular pitt)

i have a tool collection, that includes a a few different sets. one each in two cars, plus the main box at home. thus, a collection.

Proto is mix of US and taiwan. Actually the majority is made in the USA, as they sell heavily to the US govt. They made their ratcheting wrenches in taiwan for years, and just started making a US once again. Yeah they are expensive tool brand.

HF no longer carry individual socket, can not fill in any more. So warranty is not an issue I guess. Losing one will be hard to replace with HF.

And the part you need to address you can get crappy USA made tools. They are out there.

I would advise to get a larger kolbalt or craftsman set with about 300pc. That way he will have pretty much all his socket needs covered. And it will save him money in the long run. And in the US, you really need a set with both SAE and Metric, even if he never runs into sae on a car. Routine stuff around the house will be all SAE for a good while still. So he will need SAE. And a master set will cover that instance.

Also you neglected to mention screw drivers. Craftsman pros are great drivers, and for the price they are an unbeatable value when on sale. You also did not mention hex and torx. They are more and more common. And getting a set of hex and torx drivers would be a good idea, not just keys.

It sounds like you are gearing him away form sears form personal feeling about craftsman out sourcing. But they still have good tools, and at a price point someone starting out can afford without going with lower quality HF stuff. Sears and Kolbalt would be the route to go with a master set. At their stores you can get replacement if you loose a socket. I suffer form losing a socket in the past, never broken one as a shade tree mechanic. Husky's larger master set is supposedly made in the USA.

I would mention the sears universal set, they are the best consumer grade spline drive out there. They fit as well as my protos stuff. And he can cover 6pt,12pt, e-torx, 4pt. That way he can skip getting etorx sockets. And the spline design grabs way off the corner so they will not round out a bolt like 12pt. Stay away form the kolbalt version. That is junk.

i wasn't sure about proto, thanks for the clarification. (i did give the disclaimer that i wasn't sure. i said "i think")

a $300 - $400 tool set is not in the cards. that's why i said to buy in sets when he can. at least a 10 piece 3/8 drive deep socket set will save money over piecemealing together 10 individual sockets.

i did totally forget screw drivers, i was focusing on socket, wrenches, and ratchets. however, we talked about them in our next emails.

i'll bring up the torx and hex drivers, too.

the majority of my tools are craftsman. when i saw the companion line, i was excited because i hoped that would mean that legit craftsman would remain USA. but i'm not trying to steer him away at all.

i have a small sears universal set. i wasn't impressed b/c it didn't work for my use. i tried to use it on an external torx and it didn't do a bit of good. i had to get an external torx set in the end. i haven't tried to use them again. but the next odd shaped nut / bolt i encounter i intend to try... assuming i don't have the exactly right socket already.

 

[socket_wrench]

lol... i had to shorten my post b/c it was too long. so here's the rest....

If I were to help someone fill a tool box I would see how much they want to spend and what they want to use them for and then go from there. Id say at somepoint he is going to be a homeowner so buy a wide range of stuff.

Based on whats readily available in retail stores, Id say...

Craftsman screwdrivers work great. For a average use theres no need to spend any more. I have some of the pro screwdrivers and they turn the same screws as the acetate ones.

Channellock or Craftsman for pliers. Great values, USA made. Again, spend a little more and you go from Crappy HF/Kobalt/Evolv/Husky Chinese pliers and get much better. I almost prefer the WF Craftsman tongue and groove to the channellock tongue and groove pliers.

Wrenches I would try to get USA craftsman rp then I would go Taiwan Kobalt after that. Kmart and Ace still have USA Craftsman wrenches for sure.

Sockets You can still get USA craftsman. Best bang for your buck. Buy SAE and Metrichanical.

Ratchets... If you are fine using 36t craftsman then go ahead. I use them all the time and they work great in most uses.

Hammers Id go Vaughan or Craftsman. Same thing. Vaughan makes craftsman hammers so buy which one sparkles the most.

Id get a good set of Bondhus hex keys from Northern Tool for $13.
Stanley Powerlock tape measures can be had for $8-10.
Home Depot has Dewalt Box cutters with a 50 pack of Extra blades for $12.**.


And yes buy SAE and Metric.

i don't think he's trying to spend much at all right now. so i didn't suggest anything very expensive.

i think we're on the same page for pretty much everything.

 

[shoturtle]

The master set go down under 200 dollars on sale.

You did use the metric on the etorx you were trying to remove?

 

[socket_wrench]

this was his email response to me:

From:
To:
Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2013 3:26 PM
Subject: Re: tool set?

I'm interested in getting tools for my car as well as just handy stuff around the "house."


I can say that I probably don't need many right now, so that means I can find deals on them later on. Mom has always "pushed" Craftsman because of their quality with what she's used. I've got a Craftsman drill and flashlight set and like it, but I've never had to do anything too intensive.



I want to say most places have tool sets on sale during Black Friday. Do you know if they're like the TV sets that are sold around that time? ie. random models that aren't the standard quality that can be sold for a deep discount.


Thanks for the recommended sizes, I'll keep an eye out for metric sets that include those.


As far as tool recommendations go, what would you recommend other than those socket sets for tools?


I know I have a few cheaper hammers and some screw driver sets. I know I need to pick up drill bit sets and also a rachet and socket set, so those will probably come first.


Thanks again!



Spencer




-------------------------------------------------------------

and this was my reply

well, your mom may not realize that craftsman is now imported. so you might ask her if that changes her opinion. it did mine. you know the two wrench sets i had at the christmas exchange? one was usa and one was china made. the chinese wrenches were noticeably thicker. but in this case, thicker is not better. in fact, i would suggest that thicker meant they used a crappier metal and needed more of it to achieve the needed strength. that said, i did just get a discontinued socket set that was craftsman but all USA made. i'm not anti-craftsman at all. but now that they're going imported, i don't hold them in such high regard. i'd say they're equal to the kobalt tools. so buying between the two would only be a financial decision. in fact, between craftsman, kobalt, mac, matco, gearwrench, and gm performance, i'd say they're probably all equal and would all be a financial decision. (meaning, best price would be final factor)

anyway, that's just my opinion.

get on the craftsman club email list. it's just like but somehow different from shopyourway rewards. get on that email list, and you'll get exclusive offers on tools.

same with harbor freight tools. get on their email list. they send tons of coupons that are for tools at lower prices than their in store sale prices. i know i'm sending mixed signals about them. but some things i'll buy, some things i won't. it just depends on the item.

i know what you mean about black friday deals. i don't think it's the same because they have lifetime warranties. so making crappy tools would only net more exchanges of regular quality tools later. although, some tool sets might not have the same ratchets. that wouldn't be black friday specific, though.

get you a good quality set of pliers. they're not cheap, either. you don't have to get this exact set, but these are the pliers you'll want. the needle nose, regular pliers, channel locks, and then the wire cutters. these craftsmen are probably imported, too. i don't like the soft handles like the koblats have. home depot has a nice husky brand set.

http://www.sears.com/craftsman-4-pc-pliers-set/p-00945235000P?prdNo=6&blockNo=6&blockType=G6

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc...yword=husky+pliers&storeId=10051#.UO83Gnf1UWk

i don't buy sockets / wrenches from harbor freight, but i would buy things like a hammer there. in fact, i have. just a basic 16 oz claw hammer. don't buy anything from harbor freight at full price.

if you have the funds, get an 18 volt impact driver with a lithium battery. it's 100000% better than a drill when using it as a screw driver. i have a makita drill / driver set (two tools) but that was about $225. i bought my dad a kit on black friday from home depot for $100. regular price is $150. you can buy the impact drivers by themselves for less. i don't know how much you'd use it in an apartment, but i use mine all the time around the house. and i regularly use it when i work on my car, too. (example - to change the oil, i have to remove a plastic tray on the bottom of the car. it has something like 10 bolts. i use the driver on that and it takes me 1/4 of the time it would take if i used a ratchet.)

get you a good set of screw drivers, too. craftsman, husky, kobalt, etc...


for drill bits, just get a set with lots of different sizes. titanium coating is better, but black oxide will work if it's a good set. i would go home depot or lowes instead of harbor freight on that.



i have a really nice bamboo handled hammer from home depot. i like it a lot. i also have a $4 hammer from harbor freight. they both drive nails. i don't use either very often. the bamboo hammer is nicer but was $10 or $15. just any 16oz claw hammer should do. you can get fancy later.


once you get a house, you'll need a whole new set of tools. in apartment living, you should be fine with all that above.


if you get into working on your car, you'll want to get some ramps at some point. i prefer metal ones to plastic ones, but they're harder to find these days.



and you'll need a jack and jack stands. you can get a basic 2-ton jack and stands from oreilly for cheap. even less if it's on sale. regular price for the gm performance is $50.



pep boys sells all this stuff, too. so check their ads.



i would get a jack and stands before ramps, for sure. ramps are luxury. jack is necessity.



if you change oil, you'll need a recycling container.



and you'll want a set of jumper cables. or maybe the new style cigarette lighter to cigarette lighter chargers. haven't looked into them, though. no matter what, get something longer than 12 feet. you want 20' if you can get it. if they're longer, you don't have to have your cars so close together, which can be surprisingly tricky.



skip nut drivers that go in the drills. instead get one 3/8" socket driver bit for the drill and use your sockets. that'll save money.


go get you some mechanic gloves, too. try on different sizes and styles. sears has a variety. sometimes they go on sale. also harbor freight has them. i have some that don't fit very well, but that's my fault for not trying them on.



and a level. those are surprisingly expensive. i would get one at harbor freight.



i got to go. this should give you more to think about outside of sockets / wrenches.



oh, and maybe a soldering iron if you like to try to fix things. it took me a while to get good at soldering. but i am pretty good now. if you do get one, get some flux to go with your solder. it's like a primer when you paint. it makes a world of difference.

 

[socket_wrench]

i've linked my cousin to this thread. i know he'll read. don't know if he'll join...

 

[pipsters]

When I was out of college I didn't give a flip where tools were made I just wanted stuff that worked. This guy needs to pick up or have someone pick up for him the 255 or 263 pc Craftsman set and go to Harbor Freight for the rest of it. Hand tools, multi meter, etc. The novelty stuff can come later when he is making good money and wishes to blow it on name brand tools. Seriously guys Chinese or not any tool will perform these days, even the dollar store stuff. i used a 3/8" set from Dollar General on my first ever brake job.

 

[shoturtle]

The craftsman pliers are made by western forge USA made still. Avoid the Asian pliers from kolbalt, they are no where as good as the craftsman or channellock.

Hd is closing out Vaughn claw hammers for 5 dollars. So he should keep an eye on the big box stores as well.

Avoid the kolbalt asian screwdrivers, tips are very soft and cam quickly. Hd husky pro drivers are good and made in the USA. Get the USA ones from kolbalt they are the same as the clear plastic handle craftsman from Pratt and reed.

Since he has a craftsman drill. Find out what he has. If it is a c3 or nextec then just build on them. They have the new li ion battery out for the c3. And overall for someone not going to wrench. The craftsman power tools does a good job.

Drill and impactor do different. Soft or brittle wood a drill is better. Also better for drill metal. Impactor for driving nails into hardwood and breaking fastener. Need both.

 

[critter]

Secondhand? Perhaps ebay or CL would be good starting point.
OE / ring spanners, 3/8 socket set, screwdrivers, hex keys, pliers, and a flogging stick. Thats a start. Buy tools as needed thereafter or as skills increase. Alot of what you have mentioned is well meant advice I know but if all he is going to do is change the oil in his car then jacks, ramps, stands etc etc would be better spent on quality oil and parts.
Your trying to put your old head on his young shoulders.

 

[Man of Many Vices]

As much as I like to hear myself talk, I don't think a lot of good information was exchanged for the amount of typing involved, judging from the youngster's reply. My advise, for a starter set, would be as follows:

USA made tools exclusively. If you can't afford new, buy used.

Combo wrenches in sizes from 1/4" to 1" and 8 to 19 mm.
Sockets 3/8" and 1/2" drive to cover the same ranges.
3/8" and 1/2" ratchets, breaker bars, t-bars
Spark plug sockets.
3" and 6" extensions, universal in both 3/8" and 1/2"
Slip joint pliers, Channelocks, diagonal cutters
Adjustable wrenches in 6", 8", 10" and 12"
16 oz. and 32 oz. ball pein hammers
Screwdriver assortment
Hex key wrenches
1/4" drive tool assortment
etc., etc.

He could buy everything he needs for a basic set for less than $100 used.

Better yet, uncle, put such a set together for him.

 

[ChevyEFI]

For your cousin:
Have him read the tool section at the beginning of one of those repair manuals they have at the front of the parts store for $20. Basically "buy the cheap one that you actually need. If it breaks or otherwise fails to do the job, then spend more $ on bigger / better."

There are some things better bought in sets. Others are better bought on an as-needed basis. My 1/4" and 3/8" stuff was bought in sets and serves me well. I think everything I own in 1/2" or 3/4" had a specific job need warranting it's purchase.

Organization is helpful. When I was in apartments, renting, and just generally interested in being able to take my stuff with me for work or on a whim, a stanley organizer with the fold down sides made a LOT of sense. Steel boxes are better later in life when you're working out of a shop or truck.

For you:
Take a business writing class for the sake of brevity. I'm not trying to be rude. It's the kind of thing that you'll find pays off later in other classes, business, and life.

 

[socket_wrench]

The craftsman pliers are made by western forge USA made still. Avoid the Asian pliers from kolbalt, they are no where as good as the craftsman or channellock.

Hd is closing out Vaughn claw hammers for 5 dollars. So he should keep an eye on the big box stores as well.

Avoid the kolbalt asian screwdrivers, tips are very soft and cam quickly. Hd husky pro drivers are good and made in the USA. Get the USA ones from kolbalt they are the same as the clear plastic handle craftsman from Pratt and reed.

Since he has a craftsman drill. Find out what he has. If it is a c3 or nextec then just build on them. They have the new li ion battery out for the c3. And overall for someone not going to wrench. The craftsman power tools does a good job.

Drill and impactor do different. Soft or brittle wood a drill is better. Also better for drill metal. Impactor for driving nails into hardwood and breaking fastener. Need both.

yea... i thought about the possibility of his drill being C3 after i emailed him. it turns out it is. i'd have to look at the cost of a loose impact driver + the batteries, though. batteries make up so much of the cost of a kit. i'm not sure if it would be worth it. but i'll mention that to him for sure.

Secondhand? Perhaps ebay or CL would be good starting point.
OE / ring spanners, 3/8 socket set, screwdrivers, hex keys, pliers, and a flogging stick. Thats a start. Buy tools as needed thereafter or as skills increase. Alot of what you have mentioned is well meant advice I know but if all he is going to do is change the oil in his car then jacks, ramps, stands etc etc would be better spent on quality oil and parts.
Your trying to put your old head on his young shoulders.

i am trying to keep the scope relative to his needs while still giving some input for future tool growth. and that's why i said metric only... to start.

As much as I like to hear myself talk, I don't think a lot of good information was exchanged for the amount of typing involved, judging from the youngster's reply. My advise, for a starter set, would be as follows:

USA made tools exclusively. If you can't afford new, buy used.

Combo wrenches in sizes from 1/4" to 1" and 8 to 19 mm.
Sockets 3/8" and 1/2" drive to cover the same ranges.
3/8" and 1/2" ratchets, breaker bars, t-bars
Spark plug sockets.
3" and 6" extensions, universal in both 3/8" and 1/2"
Slip joint pliers, Channelocks, diagonal cutters
Adjustable wrenches in 6", 8", 10" and 12"
16 oz. and 32 oz. ball pein hammers
Screwdriver assortment
Hex key wrenches
1/4" drive tool assortment
etc., etc.

He could buy everything he needs for a basic set for less than $100 used.

Better yet, uncle, put such a set together for him.

not uncle. cousin.

For your cousin:
Have him read the tool section at the beginning of one of those repair manuals they have at the front of the parts store for $20. Basically "buy the cheap one that you actually need. If it breaks or otherwise fails to do the job, then spend more $ on bigger / better."

There are some things better bought in sets. Others are better bought on an as-needed basis. My 1/4" and 3/8" stuff was bought in sets and serves me well. I think everything I own in 1/2" or 3/4" had a specific job need warranting it's purchase.

Organization is helpful. When I was in apartments, renting, and just generally interested in being able to take my stuff with me for work or on a whim, a stanley organizer with the fold down sides made a LOT of sense. Steel boxes are better later in life when you're working out of a shop or truck.

For you:
Take a business writing class for the sake of brevity. I'm not trying to be rude. It's the kind of thing that you'll find pays off later in other classes, business, and life.

buying and replacing what breaks is great, unless your stuff breaks when you need it and you end up stranded. that is just faulty logic in my book.

lol @ the business writing class.


this thread is losing steam and i've received the useful information i was hoping to get. and it turned out to be a little more entertaining than i thought it would be.

thanks for the input, even if i don't follow your advice.

 

[shoturtle]

For about 90 dollar, he can add a c3 impact gun with the 1/4 hex and have a spear battery and charger. Or pay 120 for the 1/2 dr, get the 2 extra batter and go get a dewalt impact rated bit adapter and it has plenty of power for lug nuts.

And the bare tool is cheaper.

 

[StevePgh]

When I was out of college I didn't give a flip where tools were made I just wanted stuff that worked. This guy needs to pick up or have someone pick up for him the 255 or 263 pc Craftsman set and go to Harbor Freight for the rest of it... i used a 3/8" set from Dollar General on my first ever brake job.

I actually agree with pipsters quite a bit, although I'd still do a comparison on a cman (or any) USA set and see where it sits price-wise. I like to support USA when it is practical. I picked up some set fillers when HF had the Pittsburg Pro individuals (needed a few for a Ford Ranger that aren't usually in sets) and was impressed by the quality. I also picked up some Kobalt 6 points from Lowes when they went on sale a few months ago. Also impressed. Both Taiwan. When I was out of college, I got a made in India set as a gift. I think I must have split 4-5 sockets before I trashed them. All of my garden tools are USA-made, as there was only a slight price premium (yes, I spreadsheeted every brand/store when I became a homeowner and bought them all at once from a local store for a slight discount).

 

[StevePgh]

Last follow-up. I mentioned a torque wrench without explaining why. My dad always told me I'd be able to 'feel' it when a fastener had enough torque. Turns out that I can't. Given that a somewhat accurate torque wrench is available for under $20, I'd go there. I wish I had one much earlier in my tinkering. Turns out a HF torque wrench is WAY cheaper than a set of LH drill bits, EZouts, heli-coils kit, aggravation, etc. You definitely don't want to overdo torque on a spark plug or an oil pan bolt.

I also believe that everyone should be able to change their own oil and do a brake job. My wife was raised with that philosophy and won't even let me do these things for her. Get him/her a 4-way lug nut breaker bar and some jack stands as a graduation gift. With the rest of the stuff you recommended, there will be no issues with these kind of jobs.

Sad to see your cousin/nephew (forget which) already has a drill. I'd suggest Lithium stuff exclusively, because they hold a charge over long periods of time and are worth the extra cost. I do recommend that the batteries are stored indoors to maximize this in the winter. I hate going to my uncle's house and getting a project to do unsuspectingly as he has a NiCad drill (a nice one) that is guaranteed to have no charge. Usually I bring my set if I know I have some task to perform for this reason.

 

[AL`]

When I started out, I just bought what I needed as I needed it, but I did buy some general purpose stuff that I knew would be useful no matter what. I'd worked with tools enough growing up to have an idea. Later, I inherited my father's tools, but I didn't get to take any of those when I spread my wings. Like pipsters said, when starting out, a guy might be tight on the budget. I made minimum wage and was putting myself through school so I bought whatever to get by and only went for great USA stuff once I had nose far enough above water. However, the internet makes buying used good stuff over time a lot more convenient than back then. Building a set over time is absolutely easier to do today. Make a list of target acquisitions and check it off as he goes if he wants to.

Did I miss it, or did no one mention vise-grips and an adjustable crescent wrench? Neither is the ideal tool, but they sure will make a situation doable at an affordable entry-level cost. I'd get a large and small crescent wrench and maybe just a large set of vise-grips. Get a set of phillips and flathead screwdrivers. A bit set and driver is versatil, but I like having dedicated drivers too. Definitely get some stubby phillips and flathead screwdrivers. Heck, I'll just make a list that by no means will be perfect or complete - GRIN.

Crescent wrenches, large and small
Vise-grip, at least one large
Phillips, flathead and torx screwdrivers (be sure to get stubbies for flathead and phillips for sure)
Claw hammer
Rubber Mallet or deadblow hammer
Pry bar (I'd start with a general purpose pry bar like this one instead of a set: http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00937341000P?vName=Tools&cName=HandTools&sName=Pry%20Bars%20&%20Nail%20Pullersmv=rr)
Tape measure
Wire brushes (toothbrush size and a large one. And get a round brush to for cleaning holes and tubes)
1/4" and 3/8" ratchets and socket sets (shallow and deep, make sure he knows to use a wrench or breaker bar for breaking loose heavy torque)
SAE and Metric Combination wrenches
Pliers
Needle nose pliers
Pipe wrench
Flat ******* file
Hacksaw
General purpose handsaw
A few clamps
3/8" power drill or cordless drill
Circular Saw
Oil filter wrench (select appropriate. Strap wrenches might serve as an all-rounder with other uses too)
Oil drain pan. I use any old container for taking to drop off oil to recycle at Oreilly auto parts or Autozone. You can use the original oil container, old milk jugs, wiper wash jugs, etc.)
Assortment of funnels
Battery post cleaner/brush tool.
Digitial Multimeter

Toolboxes. I think the Stanley fatmax with gasket seal is a great general purpose box for tools on the go. It may not be ideal for organization of a mechanics set, but it's tough, won't mar or gouge your vehicle and will keep your tools dry when stored. They make them in a few different sizes. Great product.

A guy could revise and add to a starting list forever and not get it totally right but that's a good starter set. His own experience once he starts using tools, budget and specific needs will shape and dictate his future acquisitions.