Air conditioning hose crimper

[Sparkyjack]

I’m preparing to revive the air conditioner on my ‘90 Audi coupe.

As part of this project I need to replace all the hoses and modernize the condenser.

Anybody have any experience with the hydraulic hose crimpers that come in around $100 on eBay as compared to the similar Mastercool product that comes in over $700.

While I’m sure I can find a local place that will crimp hoses for me, I’m not sure I can get all the plumbing out to have the ends installed.
As part of this project I’ll be upgrading the condenser and will to figure out new hose routing for that.

Thanks,
Jack

 

[Ign]

No idea but cool project!

 

[monkeyspanners]

The hydraulic hose crimpers don't put the right kind of crimp on the hose to work with ac fittings.

Years back had a job of piping up a load of ac systems on some Mitsubishi fork lifts with aftermarket cabs, company had us use their hydraulic crimper, pretty much every joint leaked after the machines had run some hours though the passed initial leak testing.

Think a Mastercool 71550 model crimper is available cheaper as a manual one for about a third of the price.

 

[B_Bimmer]

I used the mastercool when I had to make some NLA hoses and it worked fabulously. I found a gently used one rather than trusting the knockoffs. They look awfully similar so one would hope they would work just as well but that hasn't always been my experience and I didn't want to do this job twice.

 

[Radio Flyer]

I've used the manual style mastercool tool with good results. I was able get it on loan from the local hyd. store where the repair parts were purchased.

 

[bctexas]

I need to do this same project on my '86 MR2, so will follow with interest!

 

[Sparkyjack]

I need to do this same project on my '86 MR2, so will follow with interest!

Do your plans include modernizing the condenser?
My first step on this road involved reading ‘Just needs a recharge’ by Rob Siegel, it’s his suggestion to modernize the condenser.

 

[rlitman]

The hydraulic hose crimpers don't put the right kind of crimp on the hose to work with ac fittings.

Years back had a job of piping up a load of ac systems on some Mitsubishi fork lifts with aftermarket cabs, company had us use their hydraulic crimper, pretty much every joint leaked after the machines had run some hours though the passed initial leak testing.

Think a Mastercool 71550 model crimper is available cheaper as a manual one for about a third of the price.

I don't know about the knockoffs, but I got my Mastercool manual crimper for $150 a few years back. The hydraulic isn't necessary.

 

[bctexas]

Do your plans include modernizing the condenser?
My first step on this road involved reading ‘Just needs a recharge’ by Rob Siegel, it’s his suggestion to modernize the condenser.

Hiya Jack - The engine in the MR2 is in the middle, and the rad and condenser are in the front. There isn't much room in front - not sure I can fit a bigger condenser in there. One of the issues will be cleaning the lines out from front to rear. The compressor failure was catastrophic (and years ago) and the lines from front to rear are likely full of debris. I also want to repair and update of the inoperative AC in my '65 Cadillac. My plan with that one is to turn the refrigeration part over to Old Air in Fort Worth, and go with modern stuff.

I just ordered the book - thanks for the tip!

Happy Motoring!

 

[Pntyrmvr]

Ordered the book as well. Thanks for the introduction.


“Talk is cheap. Whiskey costs money.”

 

[gkring]

amazon/ebay special one works fine for me. Used it on a few cars. Also used for airlines in the shop and other relatively low pressure (under 500 psi) type lines.

 

[AA/FC]

.....and modernize the condenser.

What does "modernize the condenser" mean?

I've been in the automotive A/C business for over 15 years and I've never heard that phrase before. Do you mean install an new condenser? Install a larger condenser? Clean the old condenser? I'm just not sure what "modernize" means when talking about an automotive A/C condenser...

As for the crimper? ALL crimp hose crimp fittings require the EXACT crimp die that is designed to work with a specific crimp fitting. In fact sometimes different product lines of hoses (within the same brand) will require different product lines of crimp fittings. Not to mention crossing between brands of crimper/hose/fittings will almost certainly quarantine a leak, too.

This is why most hydraulic shops advertise only one brand of fittings. Sure, they are a usually a "dealer" for that brand, but it's also because a PARKER crimper (for example) is only designed to work with PARKER hose and PARKER fittings. Now, pick any other brand of hose/fitting company and the situation is the same. The technical crimp spec is down to the thousands of an inch.

You need to use ONE BRAND of hose, fittings and crimper if you want things to be properly crimped. In the hydraulic world, NOT doing things correctly can cause hoses to catastrophically blow up and cause sever injury and even death. Hydraulic pressures are typically FAR higher than automotive A/C systems but I've seen high side pressures over 500+ psi on a malfunctioning system on a hot day. 500+ psi is no joke and can easily hurt someone.

Do yourself a favor, use the correct crimper, on the correct hose, with the correct fittings. If the crimper is over your budget...... find a guy who does automotive A/C and find out what crimper he uses, then order a bunch of hose and fitting designed to work with HIS crimper. Figure out your new hose routing and get everything cut to length with your fittings dry fitted onto the hose. Use a sharpie or white paint pen to put a witness mark on each hose end where the fittings slides on. Then take everything back to your crimper guy and have him make the final crimps. The witness marks will ensure all fitting are "clocked" correctly on the hose so there will be no torsional twist built into the hose when it's installed onto the car.

Good luck!

 

[Wrench97]

What does "modernize the condenser" mean?

I've been in the automotive A/C business for over 15 years and I've never heard that phrase before. Do you mean install an new condenser? Install a larger condenser? Clean the old condenser? I'm just not sure what "modernize" means when talking about an automotive A/C condenser...

As for the crimper? ALL crimp hose crimp fittings require the EXACT crimp die that is designed to work with a specific crimp fitting. In fact sometimes different product lines of hoses (within the same brand) will require different product lines of crimp fittings. Not to mention crossing between brands of crimper/hose/fittings will almost certainly quarantine a leak, too.

This is why most hydraulic shops advertise only one brand of fittings. Sure, they are a usually a "dealer" for that brand, but it's also because a PARKER crimper (for example) is only designed to work with PARKER hose and PARKER fittings. Now, pick any other brand of hose/fitting company and the situation is the same. The technical crimp spec is down to the thousands of an inch.

You need to use ONE BRAND of hose, fittings and crimper if you want things to be properly crimped. In the hydraulic world, NOT doing things correctly can cause hoses to catastrophically blow up and cause sever injury and even death. Hydraulic pressures are typically FAR higher than automotive A/C systems but I've seen high side pressures over 500+ psi on a malfunctioning system on a hot day. 500+ psi is no joke and can easily hurt someone.

Do yourself a favor, use the correct crimper, on the correct hose, with the correct fittings. If the crimper is over your budget...... find a guy who does automotive A/C and find out what crimper he uses, then order a bunch of hose and fitting designed to work with HIS crimper. Figure out your new hose routing and get everything cut to length with your fittings dry fitted onto the hose. Use a sharpie or white paint pen to put a witness mark on each hose end where the fittings slides on. Then take everything back to your crimper guy and have him make the final crimps. The witness marks will ensure all fitting are "clocked" correctly on the hose so there will be no torsional twist built into the hose when it's installed onto the car.

Good luck!

His was probably a R12 system and the euro condensers were small and inefficient when used with 134a, older Volvo's and Saab's had a lot of issues with that.

 

[chipjumper]

Where could I get the fittings and hose at? I see it’s like $330 for a pre made hose kit for my Tahoe. There’s no way the parts would cost me even half of that.

 

[Wrench97]

Here is one of many, but don't expect to find the exact fittings you have and most of the time it's worth buying premade so they fit correctly especially if you have rear AC.
https://coldhose.com/?gclid=CjwKCAj...QG9c9V-TpP-tBxMiauv8acptPYn-SBrxoCDv8QAvD_BwE

 

[Sparkyjack]

His was probably a R12 system and the euro condensers were small and inefficient when used with 134a, older Volvo's and Saab's had a lot of issues with that.

Yes the car was originally R12 with an original condenser that is a single serpentine tube.
It’s my understanding that automotive air conditioning systems engineered for R134 use condensers with multiple parallel tubes and sometimes multiple passes.

As with most things discussed here at Garage journal I’m hoping to leverage knowledge that others have gained and share what I learn to pay it forward.

Jack

 

[Sparkyjack]

I don't know about the knockoffs, but I got my Mastercool manual crimper for $150 a few years back. The hydraulic isn't necessary.

While I’ve never touched one I’m under the impression that the manual crimper kind of needs to be clamped in a vice. There is one hose to metal pipe assembly mounted to the firewall that appears to be challenge to move in order to crimp a fitting on being able to crimp in place will make life easier.

Maybe I’ll get lucky and find one or local guy that will help me crimp things.

 

[Sparkyjack]

Hiya Jack - The engine in the MR2 is in the middle, and the rad and condenser are in the front. There isn't much room in front - not sure I can fit a bigger condenser in there. One of the issues will be cleaning the lines out from front to rear. The compressor failure was catastrophic (and years ago) and the lines from front to rear are likely full of debris. I also want to repair and update of the inoperative AC in my '65 Cadillac. My plan with that one is to turn the refrigeration part over to Old Air in Fort Worth, and go with modern stuff.

I just ordered the book - thanks for the tip!

Happy Motoring!

I’ve been looking at condensers at vintage air and other vendors focused on classic car air conditioners parts, there are a lot of options.
One of my challenges is finding a condenser for a ‘side mounted’ radiator that is 20” tall but only 16” wide, fortunately all of the condensers I’ve found are only an inch or less thick. I’d think your search for a new condenser will be easier than mine.

Keep us informed as you progress.

Jack

 

[rlitman]

While I’ve never touched one I’m under the impression that the manual crimper kind of needs to be clamped in a vice. There is one hose to metal pipe assembly mounted to the firewall that appears to be challenge to move in order to crimp a fitting on being able to crimp in place will make life easier.

Maybe I’ll get lucky and find one or local guy that will help me crimp things.

Fair point. All of the hoses I've had to do were easy to remove and crimp on the bench. Hydraulic would be far more desirable for crimp in place.