Am I crazy? Workshop Expansion Worth the $$$

[Fav Onefour]

I have a decent sized garage at home. 31.5' by 23.5' interior dimensions. One front corner 5' by 13' is lost to mud room/laundry and entry into the house. I've been using the third stall as a small workshop but it's tight when I have mowers or snowmobiles sitting on the floor.

Over the years I've also built up a workshop in the basement. That room is 40' long but only an average 12' width. It has full length workbenches along one wall. The space is used primarily for woodworking and small engine work. The basement shop is a nice setup but access is bad. I have an L shaped stair and three 32" doorways to get from the garage to the basement shop. I can get 4X8 sheets down there if I flex the sheet and tip it steeper than the stair. Even with the convoluted maneuvering, I'm still banging the walls and doorways. When I build cabinets or large furniture, I have to haul it upstairs before assembly. Another issue is that I'm going through the "nice" part of the house. The basement shop is getting to be a back breaker from trying to move sheet goods etc. I'm also getting tired of swapping shoes when going back and forth between the garage and basement shop.

The question about crazy is multi faceted. We have been shopping for houses and property but the wife wants something close by. Fine, but there aren't many houses around that have potential for easy access or large shop spaces. We've found a few but the price is nuts or the property is junk. We looked at properties that were good without a decent building. Most of those would be tear downs. (Open lot prices are really nuts.)
Would you buy the property and tear down or lay out the big bucks on a full package?

The other option is where it's real crazy. We fixed up the house to our tastes over the years. Lots of little things that add up. Geo multi zone heating, floor heat in the garage and snowmelt driveway. I did a lot of custom work inside and I have the basement shop space. It's in a great neighborhood.

I'm throwing around the idea of staying in the house and doing the maximum allowable addition possible. It's not a huge amount. I have 4' more room alongside my garage before hitting required property line setback. I also have room behind my full depth third stall to add about 13' by 22' of space. I'm tossing around the idea of bumping out the sidewall and adding on to the back. The addition would be smaller than my basement shop but it would be open into my third stall. Some of the disadvantages would be that I'd be covering a living room side window and struggling to make the addition look decent. I think I'm stuck with a different low slope roof line for that portion. Doing an addition also ties the woodworking shop into the garage and metal working area. I'd like to have it one open space and probably do a moveable barrier to isolate dust etc.

The addition would be over 100k even without getting too fancy. Probably at least $250 per sq. ft. It would technically be a 4th stall. On paper that would translate into maybe 1/4 the cost when it comes to selling the place. Overall, the project wouldn't be a simple check writing deal. I'd still be on the hook to do a pile of odds and ends. On the other hand, I can't see any chance of finding a property that would be turn key.

Am I crazy to think about doing the addition?

 

[PoorUB]

Am I crazy to think about doing the addition?

How long do you plan to live there? The cost of the project gets forgotten if you stay there for many years.
If you like the neighborhood and the house and you plan on living there for many more years I don't have an problem with spending the money.

 

[Sumboodie]

100k for 350ft is beyond crazy money.

Could tear down the garage and build it 40x30 or whatever your size is for under that.

 

[Sumboodie]

I just priced materials for a 30x30 addition, 14ft walls, and I'm at about 25k. Plus slab and truck door.

 

[Fav Onefour]

How long do you plan to live there? The cost of the project gets forgotten if you stay there for many years.
If you like the neighborhood and the house and you plan on living there for many more years I don't have an problem with spending the money.

I appreciate the perspective.
We have talked about the time frame extensively. We'd like to stay in the house until we can't handle the stairs and steep lot. We invested the dollars into snowmelt on the steep drive to make it easier to stay. The home does not have bedrooms on the main level. That's probably the biggest factor. Doing the workshop on the main level would help extend the time frame for me using the shop.

 

[PoorUB]

I appreciate the perspective.
We have talked about the time frame extensively. We'd like to stay in the house until we can't handle the stairs and steep lot. We invested the dollars into snowmelt on the steep drive to make it easier to stay. The home does not have bedrooms on the main level. That's probably the biggest factor. Doing the workshop on the main level would help extend the time frame for me using the shop.

It might not make sense dollar wise, but moving isn't cheap either.

We just about put a $100,000 addition on our home. Similar situation, did it make sense? Nope! But we have no desire to move. We had drawings done and were getting quotes and one day my wife tells me the whole idea is crazy and lets just improve what we have. Since then we have remodeled the main floor, the lower level had been done a few years earlier. Some of that would have been done with the addition, but done differently.

 

[BombShelter]

Car condos are popping up everwhere around here, that might be another option.

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[Skellyii]

I just priced materials for a 30x30 addition, 14ft walls, and I'm at about 25k. Plus slab and truck door.

Location, location, location.

Cost varies widely deepening on where you live. My cousin who lives about 80 miles from me can get things done for generally 30% less than I can.

 

[PoorUB]

Car condos are popping up everwhere around here, that might be another option.

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For storage, it is fine, for shop space it needs to be handy. If I had to hop in the car and drive a few minutes to go to my shop it wold get old very fast.

 

[dukes909]

What will happen to your basement shop if you move the shop elsewhere? Can you cut the sheet goods down to smaller sizes first instead of trying to tote 4x8 sheets down there? Can you build a separate access to the basement besides the garage/3 door access? By the way I hope that access that you described to the basement is not the only way in or out....

 

[PoorUB]

I just priced materials for a 30x30 addition, 14ft walls, and I'm at about 25k. Plus slab and truck door.

Location, location, location.

Cost varies widely deepening on where you live. My cousin who lives about 80 miles from me can get things done for generally 30% less than I can.

$100K seems high to me too, but I would definitely get a 2-3 quotes.

 

[The Metric System]

We spent $400k on 1,300 sqft of high-spec shop space that is well-integrated into an existing house we love. The location is great and we intend to be here for decades.

No regerts, would build again.

If you can afford it I vote build what you want.

 

[Fav Onefour]

100k for 350ft is beyond crazy money.

Could tear down the garage and build it 40x30 or whatever your size is for under that.

I won't argue one bit about the crazy money statement. I hate living in the city for a lot of reasons and that falls right on top of the list.

Simply going bigger is tough because I'm constrained by lot line setbacks from simply going to a nice big shop. The specifics for a variance would be hard to overcome. First, I'd have to prove the property can't be reasonably used in the current configuration. We tried to get a variance years ago before installing the snow melt. The driveway is dang steep and we wanted to build a garage in front and cut into the hillside down one level. The city didn't go for the idea of building into the setback even with the argument of making the driveway flatter and safe for use.

If it wasn't for my wife, this topic wouldn't be happening. She has always been a city gal and can't break away. I've learned to live with that reality.
The strangely ironic part is that I move to the farm for two months doing planting and harvest. I go up north to play in the snow alternating weeks during winter. I have workshops available but they are not close and handy. The house in the city isn't a do or die workshop need but I do like having a nice setup to get stuff done. I do most of my woodworking stuff at the city house. In between snowmobile trips I work on the sleds at home. It's easier with nice floor heat, dry equipment, and staging space for tools, parts, etc.

 

[Fav Onefour]

$100K seems high to me too, but I would definitely get a 2-3 quotes.

We are just starting the process of getting bids. I have not seen firm numbers yet. I'm honestly concerned it may be higher than 100k.

 

[u2slow]

l feel like my shop build cost me a stupid amount of money. But property values skyrocketed well beyond expenditure so it didnt matter much.

In hindsight, it was money well spent. It would cost ferociously more today, and even more red tape.

 

[Skellyii]

I won't argue one bit about the crazy money statement. I hate living in the city for a lot of reasons and that falls right on top of the list.

Simply going bigger is tough because I'm constrained by lot line setbacks from simply going to a nice big shop. The specifics for a variance would be hard to overcome. First, I'd have to prove the property can't be reasonably used in the current configuration. We tried to get a variance years ago before installing the snow melt. The driveway is dang steep and we wanted to build a garage in front and cut into the hillside down one level. The city didn't go for the idea of building into the setback even with the argument of making the driveway flatter and safe for use.

If it wasn't for my wife, this topic wouldn't be happening. She has always been a city gal and can't break away. I've learned to live with that reality.
The strangely ironic part is that I move to the farm for two months doing planting and harvest. I go up north to play in the snow alternating weeks during winter. I have workshops available but they are not close and handy. The house in the city isn't a do or die workshop need but I do like having a nice setup to get stuff done. I do most of my woodworking stuff at the city house. In between snowmobile trips I work on the sleds at home. It's easier with nice floor heat, dry equipment, and staging space for tools, parts, etc.

A few years ago when I was planning on buying my retirement house, I floated the idea of moving back to the small town where I was raised. I could get a good piece of land, and a nicer house than what I could get for the same price where I live now.

My fiancée's response was "I'll miss you".

 

[Sumboodie]

We spent $400k on 1,300 sqft of high-spec shop space that is well-integrated into an existing house we love. The location is great and we intend to be here for decades.

No regerts, would build again.

If you can afford it I vote build what you want.

Better have gold plated floors for that $$!

 

[Sumboodie]

$100K seems high to me too, but I would definitely get a 2-3 quotes.

I neved considered having someone else do it, my price was with me doing it.

 

[Fav Onefour]

What will happen to your basement shop if you move the shop elsewhere? Can you cut the sheet goods down to smaller sizes first instead of trying to tote 4x8 sheets down there? Can you build a separate access to the basement besides the garage/3 door access? By the way I hope that access that you described to the basement is not the only way in or out....

Definitely some good points. The basement has one egress window but it's not large enough to fit sheets.
I have started sizing sheets before bringing them into the current shop. It makes it hauling them manageable. I thought about doing just a table saw in the addition to make sizing easy. I'd still be stuck with cabinet and large furniture assembly outside the basement shop.

Funny that you mention a separate access. Most of the homes built down in farm country have straight stairways from the garage into the basement. It makes a lot of sense and I dream about having that setup. We've looked a quite a few homes before thinking about doing a shop addition. Garage stairs or even a straight configuration is relatively rare around the city. I'm a practical farm guy at heart and all these fufu looking multi landing stairs drive me nuts.

I'm trying to figure out how I could incorporate a stairway into the design if I go ahead with the addition. I've thought about it quite a bit. The shared wall has a full depth fireplace footing right in the middle and some of my Geo lines run in along that wall. It would be a tight fit if I can get a stairway into that wall. I want to avoid giving up valuable floor in an addition. There is the alternate option of doing an outside stair but I'm not a big fan of the issues. Water management is a biggie. I'm not sure how I'd do drainage? We can't tie exterior into the house sewer. In our climate we need 42" of frost footing. If I went with an outside stair, it looks like I'd have to underpin the basement foundation to bring an unconditioned stairwell.

You guys are bringing up some great new perspectives. It helps a lot. I've wrangled with a head full of ideas on this whole dang subject. Cripes, I find myself waking up in the middle of the night with some crazy thing that hadn't occurred to me earlier.

 

[Fav Onefour]

A few years ago when I was planning on buying my retirement house, I floated the idea of moving back to the small town where I was raised. I could get a good piece of land, and a nicer house than what I could get for the same price where I live now.

My fiancée's response was "I'll miss you".

We have had very similar discussions. I've mentioned building near the farm or up in the woods. Available land, space, and material costs would make things easier. Her response was the same as your fiancee.
I'll give her credit though. She doesn't give me too much grief when I do those things. I invite her to come down to farm or go snowmobiling. It's just not her thing. I'm not much into some of the highfalutin stuff she does either. It pains the **** out of me if I have to put on a suit for "social" events. I'm not comfortable and it's not my thing. In other words, I need to get this shop nailed down so I can hang out in there more. It'll help me get over wearing a suit.

 

[Fav Onefour]

It might not make sense dollar wise, but moving isn't cheap either.

We just about put a $100,000 addition on our home. Similar situation, did it make sense? Nope! But we have no desire to move. We had drawings done and were getting quotes and one day my wife tells me the whole idea is crazy and lets just improve what we have. Since then we have remodeled the main floor, the lower level had been done a few years earlier. Some of that would have been done with the addition, but done differently.

The costs of buying and selling are a factor.

We got rid of a property last year doing FSBO just because. It was a bunch of work and still cost us over 24k for the buyer's agent. I look at those costs as something that has to have enough value to make the move. I can only imagine how much we'd have to recoup if we sold the house and bought another one we liked.

 

[finn]

Depends on your age, but sooner or later it’s probable that one or both of you won’t be able to deal with the stairs anymore, making an eventual move almost inevitable. It might be prudent to move.

Also, some of the features described on your current home aren’t so much desirable upgrades as they are remedies to inherent deficiencies with the property, eg the heated driveway.

I would intensify the search for a property that better suits your current, and especially future needs. I understand it’s hard to come to grips with that, though.

Alternatively, consider what I did: our property is on the lake, so the lots are relatively deep, but narrow. I outgrew my 32’x54’ building, so I found another a mile from the house that was 48’x75’ on an acre plus. Problem solved. Now if I can get the old lady next door to that building to sell me about ten acres, I’ll be set.

 

[APEowner]

Can you do the addition in such a way that you can convert it to a bedroom or other interior space when it's time to sell? That could make the long term financial aspect more reasonable.