ANOTHER Acetylene tank EXPLOSION!!!

[e-tek]

Anyone hear of this incident? One LUCKY plumber.

I was just there this week and it was quite the story. Happened a couple blocks from where I used to live too!!

NEVER leave gas tanks in small spaces!!!

I transport tanks in my vehicle all the time - but I tie them down and NEVER leave them in there for long - especially overnight!

 

[Rodhotz]

Yep that boy wins the Darwin award!! Like i say the lack of common sense these days is amazing, You got to wonder how some of these people have made it in life as far as they have without killing them-selfs.

 

[jhelrey]

Happened at 7am.... That **** will wake up the neighborhood!

 

[Clik]

I carried bottles for cutting and welding for many years but always ventilated the tool body bin they were in and kept the steel caps on when driving in case of accident.

A buddy of mine had a momentary lapse of judgement. All they found was 15 pounds of him. Several cars and trucks were blown up and the brick and block building had to be condemned due to structural damage.

 

[G_P]

If at all possible keep the gas bottles out of the passenger compartment. If you have to transport them inside or in the trunk make damn sure the valve is closed and not leaking and that the safety transport cap is on the bottle.

Too often I see trucks driving around with tanks stood up in the bed with no caps on them and just a bungee cord or piece of rope holding them up.

 

[BJ42LX]

Well, at least the guy was off to work bright and early. Not a slacker!

 

[Norcal]

If at all possible keep the gas bottles out of the passenger compartment. If you have to transport them inside or in the trunk make damn sure the valve is closed and not leaking and that the safety transport cap is on the bottle.

Too often I see trucks driving around with tanks stood up in the bed with no caps on them and just a bungee cord or piece of rope holding them up.

I have been told in CA that that is a $1500 per tank fine for not having the caps on while transporting them on the road. Just plain common sense to do so, but common sense is not so common.

 

[djjsr]

I always thought the Canadian mafia just beat guys with hockey sticks.

 

[Mr onetwo]

I have been told in CA that that is a $1500 per tank fine for not having the caps on while transporting them on the road. Just plain common sense to do so, but common sense is not so common.

If it was a plumbers "B" tank it doesn't have a cap.He probably laid the tank down in the trunk,forgot to shut the tank off and the torch hose & handle were still attached....3 strikes and you're out!!!

 

[jrsulo]

That *****.....been carrying a "B" and "MC" tank for years,both in the cab of my truck.....kinda got me thinking right now !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Mr onetwo]

That *****.....been carrying a "B" and "MC" tank for years,both in the cab of my truck.....kinda got me thinking right now !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I have been a master plumber for a long while and have carried these small tanks in vans and trucks forever.We were trained to always carry them upright with the tank valve closed and the torch handle evacuated and shut off.Sort of a double safety system.Others may have been trained differently, but I think the key is not to lay them down....very bad!

 

[jrsulo]

I have been a master plumber for a long while and have carried these small tanks in vans and trucks forever.We were trained to always carry them upright with the tank valve closed and the torch handle evacuated and shut off.Sort of a double safety system.Others may have been trained differently, but I think the key is not to lay them down....very bad!

I never lay them down....always shut them off,purdge them and strap them upright......also how ive been doing it for over 15 years !!!!!

 

[doan]

Best quote from the CBC news site:

"My mother-in-law drives a 2013 Lexus. It has a remote control. How big are these tanks?"

 

[akdiesel]

I always thought the Canadian mafia just beat guys with hockey sticks.

Good one.
It seems these have to reiterated every now and then, just good no one got hurt to make a point sorta speak.

 

[BJ42LX]

I never lay them down....always shut them off,purdge them and strap them upright......also how ive been doing it for over 15 years !!!!!

Is there something inherently bad about laying them down?

I've alsways been taught to secure them upright. But I thought that was simply to minimize the possiblity of knocking the valve off.

The tanks themselves don't explode. The gas is leaking out because somethings not tight, or there's a defective part. Due to the confined space the F/A ratio becomes just right. When there's a spark - boom.

 

[jrsulo]

Is there something inherently bad about laying them down?

I've alsways been taught to secure them upright. But I thought that was simply to minimize the possiblity of knocking the valve off.

The tanks themselves don't explode. The gas is leaking out because somethings not tight, or there's a defective part. Due to the confined space the F/A ratio becomes just right. When there's a spark - boom.

Not sure,my boss from 15 years ago always had the tank laying down,but when i went out on my own,i stand mine up and strapped !

 

[AndyA]

Laying them down during use lets the acetone come out. Acetylene is not a free gas in the tank. It's dissolved in acetone (think soda and carbon dioxide). Acetylene above 15 psi as a free gas can self decompose producing heat and boom (even without oxygen). Something about the triple carbon-carbon bond being unstable. I think the acetone acts as a heat sink and prevents a chain reaction. Somebody with a little more chemistry knowledge will have to explain it. I've never experienced this first hand, and I don't intend to test the theory.

Transporting them layed down isn't a problem, but you may have to wait 30 minutes or so with them upright before using them (depending on what media is in the tank, and how fast the acetone can flow away from the valve).

 

[galute]

I would be curious to know if the tanks themselves exploded or if leaking gas into the passenger compartment caused the car to explode.

 

[MikeTHIS]

I'm an HVAC service mechanic, I have two MC tanks and a B tank stored in my van at all times. I've been in the trade for 15 years, my father for 40 - never had an issue but heard stories. Mine are standing up and are in tank holders, tanks are closed.

 

[MikeTHIS]

Laying them down during use lets the acetone come out. Acetylene is not a free gas in the tank. It's dissolved in acetone (think soda and carbon dioxide). Acetylene above 15 psi as a free gas can self decompose producing heat and boom (even without oxygen). Something about the triple carbon-carbon bond being unstable. I think the acetone acts as a heat sink and prevents a chain reaction. Somebody with a little more chemistry knowledge will have to explain it. I've never experienced this first hand, and I don't intend to test the theory.

Transporting them layed down isn't a problem, but you may have to wait 30 minutes or so with them upright before using them (depending on what media is in the tank, and how fast the acetone can flow away from the valve).

The acetone will also shoot flaming "balls" out depending on the mixture in the tank if you lay them too long.

 

[Thruxton]

My dad taught me to store it in the vertical position ALWAYS. This is why:

"WHILE STORAGE IN A HORIZONTAL POSITION DOES NOT MAKE THE ACETYLENE LESS STABLE OR SAFE, IT DOES INCREASE THE LIKELIHOOD OF SOLVENT LOSS, WHICH WILL RESULT IN A LOWER FLAME QUALITY WHEN THE CYLINDER IS USED. THEREFORE IT IS ALWAYS PREFERABLE TO STORE AN ACETYLENE CYLINDER IN AN UPRIGHT POSITION."

That, and a lot more, is available here:

http://www.msha.gov/alerts/hazardsofacetylene.htm

 

[Zeke]

I would be curious to know if the tanks themselves exploded or if leaking gas into the passenger compartment caused the car to explode.

If the remote key triggered, you figure it out.

I doubt a plumber had an acetylene tank. That much concentrated acetylene might very well have done more damage than reported. It's really powerful as in take down buildings powerful. The plumber's usual MAPP (or whatever it is that they sell now) would be more likely.

But, how would a news reporter know that?
Maybe it was acetylene. I don't understand why that much heat for a plumber.

 

[Zeke]

Is there something inherently bad about laying them down?

I've alsways been taught to secure them upright. But I thought that was simply to minimize the possiblity of knocking the valve off.

The tanks themselves don't explode. The gas is leaking out because somethings not tight, or there's a defective part. Due to the confined space the F/A ratio becomes just right. When there's a spark - boom.

Acetone can come through the gauge ruining it if not at the bottom where it holds the gas. The pressure keeps the acetylene dissolved in the acetone, The upper volume of the tank allows the acetylene become a gas before entering the gauge. Acetylene only becomes unstable when allowed to expand too quickly. The ratio is 1/7th of the volume which isn't reached at 15 lbs going to atmospheric pressure.

HOWEVER, when you get right to the end of a bottle, you should not be using a lot of gas at a high pressure like 10-15 lbs. You will approach the 1/7th ratio as the bottle empties. This is why a flashback arrestor needs to be installed at the gauge.

Better yet, watch your tank pressure and when it's low, quit while you're ahead. Never bleed off acetylene from the tank w/o the gauge installed!

 

[e-tek]

I would be curious to know if the tanks themselves exploded or if leaking gas into the passenger compartment caused the car to explode.

As said earlier, the tank or hose was leaking and filled the car overnight. The electrical spark at door lock relay ignited it.

That *****.....been carrying a "B" and "MC" tank for years,both in the cab of my truck.....kinda got me thinking right now !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Check the valve, evac the hoses and crack a window......then open the doors from across the street like this lucky guy did!!!

 

[Kevin C]

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/01/27/car-explosion-rocks-parking-lot-in-stoneham/

Near where I grew up a few months back... I guess if you get enough people its bound to happen.

 

[Junkman]

What I don't understand about lying the tanks in a horizontal position, is how did the acetylene headlamps in the cars of the teens operate with the tank in a horizontal position on the running boards. What has changed? Tank design???

 

[rustybutt]

The cars of yesterday used an acetylene generator to operate head and tail lights. That is the horizontal tank you see. Carbide pellets and water were mixed to create acetylene, which was then piped under it's own pressure to the lamps.

 

[e-tek]

The cars of yesterday used an acetylene generator to operate head and tail lights. That is the horizontal tank you see. Carbide pellets and water were mixed to create acetylene, which was then piped under it's own pressure to the lamps.

There's always someone who knows the answer - very good!

 

[Thruxton]

If the remote key triggered, you figure it out.

I doubt a plumber had an acetylene tank. That much concentrated acetylene might very well have done more damage than reported. It's really powerful as in take down buildings powerful. The plumber's usual MAPP (or whatever it is that they sell now) would be more likely.

But, how would a news reporter know that?
Maybe it was acetylene. I don't understand why that much heat for a plumber.

B tanks were once standard for plumbers (worked in a P & H supply when I was a kid which my dad managed, got my first Prestolite setup then, which I still have. Besides torches, it includes one very large soldering iron that goes in the torch handle).

 

[Mr onetwo]

Still standard for brazing work in the air conditioning trade.I know a lot of guys who use acetylene for repair work...the extra heat is great if you know what you are doing.

 

[mustanginky]

look up the toyota fj acetylene explosion from a few years ago. i think the guy was inside when his popped. he was very lucky from what i can remember. few ounces of precaution are worth a ton in safety.

 

[gatchel]

When I hear of Acetylene explosions I can't help but remember this one:

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/8348387/ns/us_news/t/fire-blasts-rock-st-louis-plant/#.UaQwpNj-vJE

Talk about tanks flying.....

 

[wrench409]

Talk about tanks flying.....

Here's an incident local to me.

 

[DynoDave]

Good thread guys. Never hurts to have a reminder. I have a small set like this...

http://www.harborfreight.com/portable-torch-kit-with-oxygen-and-acetylene-tanks-65818.html

...thought not an HF set. Bought from an HVAC guy. Are these the "B" sized bottles some of you have spoken about? And am I understanding that there are NOT transport caps or these?

 

[jrsulo]

Good thread guys. Never hurts to have a reminder. I have a small set like this...

http://www.harborfreight.com/portable-torch-kit-with-oxygen-and-acetylene-tanks-65818.html

...thought not an HF set. Bought from an HVAC guy. Are these the "B" sized bottles some of you have spoken about? And am I understanding that there are NOT transport caps or these?

Nope,thats a MC bottle(10cf),,,,,B tank is 40 cf.

 

[CNGsaves]

Here's an incident local to me.

Holy **** that 2007 Dallas, TX must have been a big welding supply yard as it had giant explosion right after giant explosion for 7 minutes straight!!

Burning bottles were flying everywhere and cars / trucks were still driving by on the nearby streets!! Crazy.

 

[A1an]

Riddle me this, guys. What is the best way to store the tanks for home use? I have an oversized one car garage with no venting. Can't store the tanks outside as it is against code (although maybe I could go with a small garden/storage shed). Aside from the obvious of chaining the tank(s) to the wall when not in use, what else should be done as far as venting the space goes? Granted this isn't a small confined space like a car but it is still a confined space and I don't want to end up being that guy with a half exploded house due to an overnight valve leak.