Another Mill Vs. Lathe Vs. New Vs. Used

Thumper68 · Jul 25, 2016

Okay guys I am reaching out for your wisdom here.

I have several jobs in the last few years where I needed parts that are either very $$$$ or unobtainable.

For one job I needed a splined shaft, I finally found one and the asking price was $525.00, a local machine shop quoted me $395 to make one. In the end I welded the old shaft back together and it is still working but it took me about 4 hours to weld and straighten it.

I have been searching for a good mill and lathe in a 200 mile radius for a couple of years and have yet to find one that either is made of gold or not so clapped out that it isn't worth my time.

Today I went and looked at a lathe that had all the features that I am looking for, ie quick change gear box, quick change tool post, tail stock, steady rest.

The ways had a lot of wear in the sweet spot .014 over about 18 inches, the cross slide had .006 of back lash and the travel had .009 of back lash. and he wanted $2200 for it.

I have had the same kind of luck with mills.

So I have 2 questions.

Which one would you buy first Mill or Lathe?

and second, would you keep looking for a good used machine or bite the bullet and buy a offshore machine like one form KBC or Grizzly?

I can see some of the benefits from buying a new machine 1ph motor and controls, parts availability, no more searching auction and CL listings.

Here are 2 of the mills new I have been looking at.

http://www.kbctools.com/products/MACHINERY/MILLING%20MACHINES/MANUAL%20MILLING%20MACHINES%20WITH%20DRO/10147.aspx

http://www.grizzly.com/products/9-X-49-Vertical-Mill-with-Power-Feed-and-DRO/G0796?utm_campaign=zPage

WhiffySpark · Jul 25, 2016

You know better this is garage journal. If you don't buy something from the 50s you're buying junk. I can almost guarantee every post won't be helpful and 9/10 of them will tell you how they brought some lathe for $500 on Craigslist put another $500 in it and it's 10x better than your Chinese ****. Nevermind the fact that you can't find anything worth buying.

PS I'm interested in grizzly too on a small scale. I want to build up another source of income for myself. Killing myself working 7 days

bsg · Jul 25, 2016

Thumper68 said:
Okay guys I am reaching out for your wisdom here.

I have several jobs in the last few years where I needed parts that are either very $$$$ or unobtainable.

For one job I needed a splined shaft, I finally found one and the asking price was $525.00, a local machine shop quoted me $395 to make one. In the end I welded the old shaft back together and it is still working but it took me about 4 hours to weld and straighten it.

I have been searching for a good mill and lathe in a 200 mile radius for a couple of years and have yet to find one that either is made of gold or not so clapped out that it isn't worth my time.

Today I went and looked at a lathe that had all the features that I am looking for, ie quick change gear box, quick change tool post, tail stock, steady rest.

The ways had a lot of wear in the sweet spot .014 over about 18 inches, the cross slide had .006 of back lash and the travel had .009 of back lash. and he wanted $2200 for it.

I have had the same kind of luck with mills.

So I have 2 questions.

Which one would you buy first Mill or Lathe?

and second, would you keep looking for a good used machine or bite the bullet and buy a offshore machine like one form KBC or Grizzly?

I can see some of the benefits from buying a new machine 1ph motor and controls, parts availability, no more searching auction and CL listings.

Here are 2 of the mills new I have been looking at.

http://www.kbctools.com/products/MACHINERY/MILLING%20MACHINES/MANUAL%20MILLING%20MACHINES%20WITH%20DRO/10147.aspx

http://www.grizzly.com/products/9-X-49-Vertical-Mill-with-Power-Feed-and-DRO/G0796?utm_campaign=zPage

You just not looking in the right places!

http://detroit.craigslist.org/mcb/tls/5675875829.html

I happen to know the owner. :thumbup:

Kevin

Wes J · Jul 25, 2016

So, why are you looking at $7000 new machines, but $2000 used machines?

If I had $7k to spend it would be on a nice used Bridgeport, Index, Lagun, Kondia, or Ex-cell-o. The German machines like Deckel, Maho, Abene, etc are very nice but also very expensive.

For a lathe, I'd be looking for a LeBlond, Monarch, or a Jap machine like a Yam or Takisawa. Lower on the list would be a South Bend or Clausing.
Don't forget the tooling. For your example of a splined shaft, you will need a lathe and a mill. You will also likely need a steady rest and/or follow rest. Then you need an indexer with a tailstock. Then you need the spline cutters and arbors.

Also, you will need a lathe with a large enough spindle bore for the shaft to fit inside so you can drill the centers.

This is a very deep rabbit hole. $395 sounds like an absolute bargain.

Whitworth · Jul 25, 2016

General shop use, Lathe first.

I would look around for quality used machines. But it will take some time and expect to shell out some money. The up side is for about the price of an import you'll be purchasing a true industrial piece of iron, with commensurate weight and features.

Now, if you choose to go with a new import, I can't find fault with that either.

Thumper68 · Jul 25, 2016

bsg said:
You just not looking in the right places!

http://detroit.craigslist.org/mcb/tls/5675875829.html

I happen to know the owner.

Kevin

Thanks for the link and if that machine was within 500 miles of me I would consider it, even though it only has a few of the things I am looking for.

Oh wait that was very much like the ad I went and looked at today and while the ad was what I was looking for the actual machine was a piece of ****. After looking at about 20 old used machines there is no way I would buy one that I couldn't inspect or have some one I really trusted inspect before buying and shipping.

Wes J said:
So, why are you looking at $7000 new machines, but $2000 used machines?

If I had $7k to spend it would be on a nice used Bridgeport, Index, Lagun, Kondia, or Ex-cell-o. The German machines like Deckel, Maho, Abene, etc are very nice but also very expensive.

For a lathe, I'd be looking for a LeBlond, Monarch, or a Jap machine like a Yam or Takisawa. Lower on the list would be a South Bend or Clausing.
Don't forget the tooling. For your example of a splined shaft, you will need a lathe and a mill. You will also likely need a steady rest and/or follow rest. Then you need an indexer with a tailstock. Then you need the spline cutters and arbors.

Also, you will need a lathe with a large enough spindle bore for the shaft to fit inside so you can drill the centers.

This is a very deep rabbit hole. $395 sounds like an absolute bargain.

I really don't have 7K to spend but it's looking like I might have to in order to get a nice machine in this area. I did just find a Wells Index on CL that I might make the 2 hour each way drive to look at, even though I am getting real tired of making drives like that to not bring anything home.

Whitworth said:
General shop use, Lathe first.

I would look around for quality used machines. But it will take some time and expect to shell out some money. The up side is for about the price of an import you'll be purchasing a true industrial piece of iron, with commensurate weight and features.

Now, if you choose to go with a new import, I can't find fault with that either.

I would love to get a USA built machine I just can't find one worth buying.

I am a complete noob when it comes to Lathes and Mills I haven't really even run one for 25 years so I have to go off the details learned from the web ie. what to look for and what to run away from. Maybe I am just being to picky, I don't want a machine that I am going to have to completely rebuild before I can put it to work.

454ragtop · Jul 25, 2016

Might want to read up here http://www.mermac.com/advicenew.html Also note that .006" and .009" backlash is pretty tight, be surprised if a new Grizzly is any better than that, you have to have some backlash. Not crashing on imports, have a Taiwan Jet as well as a K16 Monarch, the bigger brother to the one bsg posted above.
Good luck, Jim

Maui · Jul 25, 2016

What are the tolerances that you will need to meet for the higher tolerance parts you plan on machining or lathe turning? Will you need better than 0.005"? 0.001"? 0.0002"? This should be a consideration in your choice of machine.

Maui

rsanter · Jul 25, 2016

If you are going to buy both...
The first one you buy is the one that is a good deal

Bob

LXCam · Jul 25, 2016

Buy the lathe new since you really can't compensate for a worn bed. At least with a mill you can to a greater extent. And worn lead screws can be offset by using dial indicators for either application.

Adam.C · Jul 26, 2016

Thumper68 said:
I am a complete noob when it comes to Lathes and Mills I haven't really even run one for 25 years so I have to go off the details learned from the web ie. what to look for and what to run away from. Maybe I am just being to picky, I don't want a machine that I am going to have to completely rebuild before I can put it to work.

So this is the root of your problem right here. If you want a machine in new condition with add-ons and upgrades already installed, but want to spend used tool money, you won't find what you are looking for. And I think that's where you are.

The way I see it, you have 2 choices:
1) Spend pretty big money and get chi-com tools that may be mediocre.
2) Spend money on clapped out US machines, then refurbish them. This requires patience, skill, and careful operation technique, but can be very rewarding.

I've done both. The Chi-com tools are like partially assembled tool kits. They might run "out of the box" but you still need machine rebuilding skill to make them work properly. So in my experience, the rebuild skill is unavoidable.

One third option is buying a used Taiwan machine. These can be okay, especially if the guy who owned it knew how to fettle a machine so it would produce good parts. Because parts availability is iffy at best, these machines typically fetch pennies on the dollar. Of course, if you can't get parts, they may not be worth those pennies, particularly if you intend to keep the tools over the long haul.

If I had it to do over again, and I do, I would buy only old US tools and tooling. The quality, even of worn out machines, is just that much better. Replacement parts are available, refurbishment services exist and good machinists can produce good parts on worn machines.

The first thing I would buy would be a decent Swiss or Japanese (Mitutoyo) test indicator. Second purchase would be a big surface plate with a recent calibration. You will never be happy with any machine you can't inspect.

Maui · Jul 26, 2016

Where you are located plays a big role in what is available. In the Northeast machines are plentiful, so it's not that difficult to find a good used lathe. Milling machines are another story though. People who sell them here often ask a lot for them, and most of these machines have seen better days. It's difficult to find one in good condition for a reasonable price.

Maui

Whitworth · Jul 26, 2016

Thumper68 said:
I would love to get a USA built machine I just can't find one worth buying.

You're gonna have to spend a fair amount, and start out by checking out local used machinery dealers. Don't be surprised at $4000 - $6000 range for a used lathe in v good condition, with DRO.

Forget this nonsense about finding a diamond in the rough on Craigslist for $500. A little Scotchbrite and WD40 and you're in business. I'm sure it happens once in a blue moon, but......

You might fall into a decent vo-tech size lathe, 11 to 12 " for maybe $1500 - $2500 range, but if you expect QC toolpost & tooling, steady rest, nice chuck assortment, maybe DRO, etc. you're sure to be disappointed. You're more likely to get a bare-bones machine, with a stupid lantern & rocker tool holder and a basic 3 jaw chuck.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

Maui · Jul 26, 2016

Then there's this one...

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=246413&highlight=1917+south+bend+lathe

Maui

AmherstAndy · Jul 26, 2016

Maui said:
Where you are located plays a big role in what is available. In the Northeast machines are plentiful, so it's not that difficult to find a good used lathe. Milling machines are another story though. People who sell them here often ask a lot for them, and most of these machines have seen better days. It's difficult to find one in good condition for a reasonable price.

Maui

This is true. In VT, there's this guy: http://www.plazamachinery.com/

Is there nothing similar in your neck of the woods?

Ign · Jul 26, 2016

WhiffySpark said:
You know better this is garage journal. If you don't buy something from the 50s you're buying junk. I can almost guarantee every post won't be helpful and 9/10 of them will tell you how they brought some lathe for $500 on Craigslist put another $500 in it and it's 10x better than your Chinese ****. Nevermind the fact that you can't find anything worth buying.

PS I'm interested in grizzly too on a small scale. I want to build up another source of income for myself. Killing myself working 7 days

There are very few machine tools from the '50's I'd want. An American Pacemaker from the '60's, sure.

Anyway, OP, I'd buy a mill first. And 200 miles isn't far enough. I always set 400 miles, that puts me within 4 major cities. Don't get a Chi-com lathe. Any of the import knee mills can be "ok."

You're not gonna find any real machine in single phase. **** it up and accept that you'll have to run a converter.

ez-duzit · Jul 26, 2016

Found my Logan 12" x 35" lathe and Index Super 55 vertical mill, together, for $2,000, about 15 miles away. Lathe came with several boxes of tooling. Still had to buy rests, additional QC holders, toolpost grinder, etc. The mill was nearly bare.

Avoid new and bare machines.

If you are driving several hours, just to look at a machine, you're not using your head. When you find the machine you want, if it's some distance away, do everything you can using photos and emails and phone calls. Don't travel to just LOOK at it. Travel to pick it up and bring it home.

Sticky Grips · Jul 26, 2016

I bought a super clean 1980's vintage Taiwan Jet Full-sized Mill, and a 80's vintage 10x24 Jet Lathe. Id spend the money on what you envision using more. resale on big stuff is always better FYI

Kevin54 · Jul 26, 2016

I bought a new lathe when I went on disability. It was a 13x40 JET lathe. For $5000 it is a sweet lathe in a way, but in other ways I am very limited as to what I can do. It's a belt drive, and if I take a big cut I can stall it. For another I am limited to the size of long barstock I can run through the head. I'm limited to something like a 1 1/2" diameter. In the longrun, I wish I would have held out for a used LeBlond with quick change gears, variable speed, and so on. My JET is a pain in the *** when it comes to that. It seems that when I have to change belt speeds, I have every tool setting on top of the head.

If I were you I would continue the search for a good used lathe, and make a road trip out of it. And there is always the chance that a member on the other end can help out with transportation if you find one. Like IGN says....set your distance further. You and a friend can make a hell of a long run in a days time. I'm in Urbana, Ohio and my neighbor and I went to North Carolina to pick up a car for his mom. We left at 1:00 am, arrived at 10:00am, purchased the car, and made it back by 8:00pm. We were both a little tired, but all in all, it was a nice drive. It was 520 miles one way.

Now when it comes to a mill......it's a 50/50 crapshoot as to whether you get a good one, or one completely worn out. You absolutely have to know what to look for as far as wear, backlash, and so on. If you know anything about mills, which it sounds like you do, then you know what to look for. I found a sweet used Lagun, which is similar to a B'port for $2300. It has about .005-.008 backlash which is common, it has a readout, no power feed, and it has belt driven speed change. And it didn't come with tooling. But I couldn't have asked for a better mill, even if I bought new. And for a new mill that is worth anything, you are going to be in the $11,000 range and on up. Set you looking range to 400-500 miles and see what you find.

You probably want to set your price on a good used mill at about $2500 with some tooling. At least a vise and a readout. Collets are cheap to buy as are the clamping sets. You'll also need a phase converter to run a mill. Mine came with my mill, but most mills that you find, the PC won't come with it. Or you can get a static Phase Converter instead of a rotary phase converter, which will give you variable speed, but you have to wait on the mill to ramp up to speed somewhat. I'm thinking about switching over myself. But you can buy a rotary PC fairly cheap.

All in all, I would look for a good used mill and lathe. You can get both for a less price than one of a new mill or lathe. And as far as to which to get first......a mill. You can do considerably more on a mill than you do a lathe. And if you have a rotary table, that just adds all the more that you can do with a mill. On a lathe, you can make round parts and round holes, or offset round parts like a cam, but that's about it. You are very limited. With the mill, the shapes you can make are endless, if you know how to go about things. I'd say that when I do a job for someone, 75-80% of the work is mill work.

So take your time, don't get in to a hurry to buy something, and look a little further out than what you are currently looking, and something will eventually pop up. And like I said before, there may be some members willing to help you out by meeting you halfway on a delivery. You'd just have to meet up somewhere that has a wrecker, forklift, or some way to transfer the machine from one trailer to the other which shouldn't be a big deal to find. Heck, I'd do a 6 hour road trip for a few bucks to help you out

Ign · Jul 26, 2016

^^^Kevin's got a good point about DRO's. I consider a good working DRO to be worth $1k (unless you want to pursue I-gage, etc) but they don't reflect that in the used market. One machine with a DRO and one without might be priced nearly the same. People get excited about finding a clean Bridgeport and they justify the high price by saying "it's in really good shape." Well, your $5000 clean Bridgeport just became a $6000 machine after you install a DRO, which is the only way I'll own a mill. Add another $500 for a good vise too if that's not included. Now your bare-bones "clean" mill just got $1500 more expensive to be a bare minimum of functionality not including cutting tools.

My Old Tools · Jul 26, 2016

First figure out what you want to do with it. Then get some training on how to do it. Do you need to turn 5' between centers? Do you need 1.5" through the headstock for barrel work? Do you need a taper? Do you need collets?

I picked up my SB 13 from a jr. college auction. It was in the maintenance shop and didn't have much wear. My Sheldon 10 came from Gov Liquidations and looked like hell. It is very tight and no wear. My Powermatic Burke Milrite was used as a drill press in a small fixture company. Minimal wear. Dallas is not a hot area for machine tools. The SB was in San Antonio, 5 hours away. The Sheldon was 3 hours. The mill was under an hour.

Furious Filipino · Jul 26, 2016

Wes J said:
Don't forget the tooling. For your example of a splined shaft, you will need a lathe and a mill. You will also likely need a steady rest and/or follow rest. Then you need an indexer with a tailstock. Then you need the spline cutters and arbors.

Also, you will need a lathe with a large enough spindle bore for the shaft to fit inside so you can drill the centers.

This is a very deep rabbit hole. $395 sounds like an absolute bargain.

I'm quoting this for emphasis.

Unless you have some sort of items that you have had in your mind about making/selling, then any investment in a mill or lathe will mostly be to satisfy your own curiosity and for the satisfaction of learning the methods to operate that particular piece of machinery.

Kevin54 · Jul 26, 2016

And be sure to let us know what you find, or if you have any questions about what you find. :beer:

Kevin54 · Jul 26, 2016

I'm not pushing this lathe, but I found it to be pretty cool when I was finding the other links in CL http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/hnp/tls/5642878762.html

Know Wosad · Jul 26, 2016

I'd rather have a $3500 mill OR lathe and $3500 in tooling than one of each and a halfass set of tooling for both.Buy one. Sub your other out until you can afford to max out both. Learn to use it to its fULL capabilities and get the accessories to do it.

Pick one. Get the best your wallet can handle but, like all power tools, the accessories and quality-selecting the correct- consumables often mean nearly as much as the tool itself.
It's funny to see some idiot with a killer $$$ drill press or mill and McBitsRus drills,taps and a **** vice trying to "work" and a guy with a so-called"POS" China tool and killer tooling, proper lights, lasers,compounding vice, cooling, lubes etc is pumping it out like an assembly line.

It reminds me of idiots who buy a welder then blame the welder for not welding right when the **** doesn't have enough sense to read the manual and change the polarity over on the "kickass" blue or red.......or even look inside the door.
"My dads were more betterer-back when I were in skewl"

UH HUH. Y'all know who you is :lol_hitti

OH. Buy new or take a real machinist to evaluate the machine you're considering.If you need to ask you aren't the one to decide if a used machine is any good or not. As to new. Let your wallet be your guide.Unless you're making artificial limbs on moon rovers most any good name brand will do more precision than generally needed.

Jim Johnstone · Jul 26, 2016

I've worked in 2 shops that had brand spanking new kbc lathes. I wouldn't touch one for home use. My current boss keeps trying to sell it to me so he can go buy something used that will cut parts straight without a taper.

The other kbc I used, also cut a taper pretty badly, and was so gutless, we would regularly stall it out in mild steel, and this was a lathe with an 16" swing and supposedly 10hp.

zmotorsports · Jul 26, 2016

I went through this same dilemma about 3 years ago when I started looking to upgrade my small machining equipment. Unfortunately, I live in a machinery desert and it is next to impossible to find something used, especially old American iron that isn't completely junk. I looked for a year before biting the bullet and buying new. You are then still saddled with some serious decisions even buying new, probably more like especially when buying new.

I am sure you will get answers all over the map here as well as any forum for that matter. Many will tell you if you don't buy an old clapped out Bridgeport and "settle" for a new import you are un-American or you are buying junk, WHATEVER!!

There are good and bad out there in used import equipment as well as new. Personally, I feel there is a huge difference between PRC (People's Republic of China, ie. China)made equipment and the much better ROC (Republic of Chine, ie. Taiwan). Even then, the Taiwanese equipment is less readily available as the Chinese and the price also reflects that. I know many people who have some Chinese equipment and are able to do decent work on them, my old equipment was Chinese and it worked fine for the 16+ years that I had it but I knew the downfalls of it and worked accordingly when using it. Tolerances in the dials was a biggie so I usually used dial indicators vs. working from the dials. My new Taiwanese lathe is easy to duplicate off the dials alone and would be even easier to reproduce with a DRO. I will install a DRO on the lathe someday but for now it works perfectly as is. My Taiwanese mill I did set it up with a DRO and that was one of the best decisions I could have made.

As for which one first, it really depends more on your particular work envelope. In my shop most of the items I machined in the past were circular so a lathe made more sense. Now my work is probably split more 60/40 (lathe/mill) so both are necessary. I know others though that bought a mill first due to their doing more flat or odd shaped work.

Good luck in your search. Before you settle on Grizzly or KBC, can I recommend talking to Matt @ Quality Machine Tools, (Precision Mathews). He has a very good line of Taiwanese machines in addition to his Chinese line and I have been more than impressed with both the machines that he has offered as well and especially his customer service. Great guy to deal with.

Mike.

Steve from Socal · Jul 26, 2016

Furious Filipino said:
I'm quoting this for emphasis.

Unless you have some sort of items that you have had in your mind about making/selling, then any investment in a mill or lathe will mostly be to satisfy your own curiosity and for the satisfaction of learning the methods to operate that particular piece of machinery.

I couldn't agree more.

These threads come up regularly and I am not trying to discourage folks but, Reality Check.

Unless you HAVE the skill and knowledge to operate machine tools, buying them will not make a machinist. Learning how to do something like machine work on the internet is like learning how to do surgery. You may learn the intellectual aspects but, miss all the other things that make you a machinist or even an operator.

The idea that a lathe and turret mill are going to allow you to whip up any old doodad in three shakes of a stick is optimistic at best. Stuff like splined shafts are possible on a mill but nowhere near done with basic tooling. Then there are things like heat treat that get ignored?

Honestly; so many folks with an infrequent need for a part here or there would be way ahead if they simply jobbed out the work. You won't have to tie up money and space for machines that do little work. You get what you want without buying all kinds of special tooling you may only use once.

Buying machine tools to enjoy as a pastime is great, thinking that a few small maintenance grade machines are going to make anything and everything, is unrealistic at best. Not to mention the time involved to acquire the skills needed or, the extensive inventory of tooling to do even simple work.

Steve

Ign · Jul 26, 2016

Jim Johnstone said:
I've worked in 2 shops that had brand spanking new kbc lathes. I wouldn't touch one for home use. My current boss keeps trying to sell it to me so he can go buy something used that will cut parts straight without a taper.

The other kbc I used, also cut a taper pretty badly, and was so gutless, we would regularly stall it out in mild steel, and this was a lathe with an 16" swing and supposedly 10hp.

I ran a new 20x40 Sharp that was like driving a dump truck. Clunky, awkward, slow to respond - - the latter is scary!

I've also run new China knee mills and they're not that bad. The worst part might be the cheap import power feeds, they're slow and sound like a box of rocks.

Furious Filipino said:
I'm quoting this for emphasis.

Unless you have some sort of items that you have had in your mind about making/selling, then any investment in a mill or lathe will mostly be to satisfy your own curiosity and for the satisfaction of learning the methods to operate that particular piece of machinery.

Eh, you can turn (small) items in a mill with a boring head or by chucking up round stock in a collet & clamping the tool in the vise. Yes, you can also spin end mills in a lathe headstock and clamp work to your compound for flat work in a lathe, but it's more awkward IMO.

A mill is the win for being the most versatile, but it's still a PITA to have only a mill or a lathe - - you'll always be wishing for the other.

Jim Johnstone · Jul 26, 2016

Ign said:
I ran a new 20x40 Sharp that was like driving a dump truck. Clunky, awkward, slow to respond - - the latter is scary!

I've also run new China knee mills and they're not that bad. The worst part might be the cheap import power feeds, they're slow and sound like a box of rocks.

Eh, you can turn (small) items in a mill with a boring head or by chucking up round stock in a collet & clamping the tool in the vise. Yes, you can also spin end mills in a lathe headstock and clamp work to your compound for flat work in a lathe, but it's more awkward IMO.

A mill is the win for being the most versatile, but it's still a PITA to have only a mill or a lathe - - you'll always be wishing for the other.

I'll agree, the Chinese mills seem a bit better than their lathes, but I think most of that is because a mill is a bit more forgiving since the head can be aligned square to the table. When a lathe shows up with the spindle not in line with the ways, you have some serious issues right away.

Thumper68 · Jul 26, 2016

Great stuff guys keep it coming!

fsae0607 · Jul 26, 2016

I have the same dilemma. It's hard to find good, used American iron here in the Los Angeles area. I also have the problem of floor space.

For my needs, a small import lathe & mill or even a combo unit like the Smithy is perfect for me. I usually have the need for spacers, bushings, etc.

If I need precision parts, I have connections for professional machine shops.

Majordisorder · Jul 26, 2016

There will always be a shortage of good used lathes. Had a SB9" that suffered from being used too much when new. Ended up calling Grizzly and receiving new lathe in about 5 days, delivered right to shop.I don't make parts for NASA but am surprised how well it does. Its called a Gunsmith Lathe but I won't be putting any valuable barrels in it any time soon. Meanwhile I will keep searching for a mint 10EE like everyone else.

I was lucky and found a Bridgeport in very good conditions. But if you don't have either, start with the lathe.

rodm1 · Jul 26, 2016

The old models are better steel and a better machine overall. But you have to plan on rebuilding them if they are worn to bad. I would rather have a rebuilt old machine but a new import would work for my home hobby work just fine.

Wes J · Jul 26, 2016

Majordisorder said:
Ended up calling Grizzly and receiving new lathe in about 5 days....... Meanwhile I will keep searching for a mint 10EE like everyone else.

LMAO. I'll never, ever, figure out the 10EE thing. What's the point of a super accurate engine lathe? If it really needs to be right it should go on a grinder. If it doesn't need to be right (like 99.9999% of work you will do) any kind of decent engine lathe will work.

Jim Johnstone · Jul 26, 2016

Wes J said:
LMAO. I'll never, ever, figure out the 10EE thing. What's the point of a super accurate engine lathe? If it really needs to be right it should go on a grinder. If it doesn't need to be right (like 99.9999% of work you will do) any kind of decent engine lathe will work.

I agree that very few people in a home shop will ever use a 10ee to its max, but just for the sake of conversation for those that don't know, the 10ee was designed for hard materials and super fine finishes.

ez-duzit · Jul 26, 2016

The Monarch is a thing of beauty. But you don't need to start out with that. Just watch for a deal. Be patient. Have your funds instantly available so you can be first.

Jim Johnstone · Jul 26, 2016

Personally I'd love to find a standard modern 1640 or 1440 from a trade school and move that into my garage. They are made in canada and hands down the nicest lathes I've ever used. The trade school I attended had 2 standard moderns and a **** load of Chinese lathes. I was the only guy who recognized the standard moderns and used them. I could turn things faster and more accurately with better finishes than the guys on the ****** Chinese things.

Wes J · Jul 26, 2016

Lots of good American made lathes were built up into the late 1970s. LeBlond and LeBlond Regals were mostly good if you stay away from the servo shift. I've never seen a crappy American Pacemaker or Lodge and Shipley as long as you get a new enough example to avoid flat belts.

Tons of good Monarch lathes are around. Also, machines you may not have seen like Barber Colman (the gear hob company) made some really good lathes that were basically the updated version of Hendey lathes.

Good Japanese machines came here from Okuma, Mazak, Mori Seiki, Takisawa, Cadillac, etc.

Good European machines like Cazeneuve, Graziano, Leinen, Schaublin, etc. You see some British lathes like Harrison and DSG.

I know a shop locally who bought a brand new Hwacheon engine lathe. It's Korean and seems pretty nice.

I dunno if the Eastern European stuff is really much better than Taiwanese, but it's better than China. Haco, TOS, etc are burly, but they cheap them out and you can tell.

Jim Johnstone · Jul 26, 2016

Wes J said:
Good Japanese machines came here from Okuma, Mazak, Mori Seiki, Takisawa, Cadillac, etc.

I've never used a bad Japanese lathe. An older manual mori or mazak would be sweet.

Another Mill Vs. Lathe Vs. New Vs. Used

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