Anyone have experience using Zinsser B-I-N Shellac Based Primer?

[Cobra4B]

I'm researching the best way to paint my kitchen cabinets white. The cabinets have real wood faces and doors that are stained fairly dark w/ a gloss on them. The cabinet boxes themselves are particle board w/ a veneer. BIN comes up over and over and over in the online how-to's. On Zinsser's website they say sainding isn't needed at all w/ BIN even on glossy surfaces so long as it's cleaned properly? That would save lots of work, but I'm skeptical. Anyone use it? Experiences? It also seems that clean up is a ***** so basically be prepared to dispose of brushes and a resperator is a needed item.

Thanks,
Brian

 

[dps]

It's all about the adhesion, and on a glossy surface you will only get a chemical bond, not a physical bond. And of course that assumes a very clean surface. I would start with a mineral spirits wash, followed by a TSP rinse, and a final wipe-down with alcohol.

On the faces, which receive the bulk of hard wear, I would sand with 320 grit after the cleaning to give it the stronger physical bond with the primer.

 

[tcianci]

BIN is the way to go, it'll stick to air. If you have the time and the inclination, it would certainly not hurt to wash them with a strong detergent first. Another plus for BIN is that it sands beautifully. You can BIN your cabinets and then hit them with some 400 in prep for paint. If you apply your paint with a very dense foam roller, you'l get a finish that's close to looking like they were sprayed.

 

[JMURiz]

I agree, used it when we repainted our laminate kitchen cabinets and has worked like a charm (with those I had to scuff a bit before priming). 5 years later not a scratch or chip on them. Heck I even used it to paint over some frilly backsplash tiles in the kitchen too...same results.

 

[Cobra4B]

BIN is the way to go, it'll stick to air. If you have the time and the inclination, it would certainly not hurt to wash them with a strong detergent first. Another plus for BIN is that it sands beautifully. You can BIN your cabinets and then hit them with some 400 in prep for paint. If you apply your paint with a very dense foam roller, you'l get a finish that's close to looking like they were sprayed.

I agree, used it when we repainted our laminate kitchen cabinets and has worked like a charm (with those I had to scuff a bit before priming). 5 years later not a scratch or chip on them. Heck I even used it to paint over some frilly backsplash tiles in the kitchen too...same results.

Thanks guys... looks like the way to do this is wash the cabinets, light scuff sand, then wipe down w/ a tack rag and go to town.

Here's what I'm working on...


Kitchen before... but with bar allready cut down.

Old range/oven removed, cabinet doors off, tile demo underway, new garbage disposal came in.

Cabinets will be white, granite counters in St. Gabriel black w/ 1/2 bullnose edge and 30x17 single basin undermount sink are ordered. New Frigidaire Gallery 5-burner gas range, OTR microwave, and dishwasher should be here Monday.

Backsplash will be multi-colored slate mosaic and the floor will be a grey slate/tile of some kind. Will do undercabinet lighting on a dimmer and replace the stupid flourescent main fixture with some cans and two pendant lights over the "bar".

 

[gesoffen]

Funny - I've been researching paints as well mainly because I'm planning a furniture project (built in bookcases) and have yet to be able to find a suitable furniture grade paint. Ben Moore, Duron, SW, etc have all let me down with visible brush strokes, sticky finish, easy scuffing, etc.

I'm curious to try Fine Paints of Europe - it seems to be the the best paint out there from all the reviews. Their website is a bit lacking in their descriptions (all it says is they use the most expensive pigments not why they use them). Anyway, at $140+ a gallon, it ain't cheap but for a high profile, low square foot project like cabinets or other furniture, I am curious enough to give it a try.

 

[mhm993]

So, there was this time that I spilled a quart of BIN on the wood floor. The guy who said it sticks to air is right on!!

Anyone ever use one of those de-glossing chemicals? I have some formica garage cabinets that I'm going to paint Guards Red, and I'm in "should I sand them to cut the gloss?" mode.

 

[ron in sc]

The primer you reference is very good, however when I have a problem with adhesion I go to an XIM primer. I forget which one I used by it was zylene based and I wore a respirator mask because the smell was very strong. I used it on a fiberglass door that I could not use anything else I had. I also used it to cover a bathroom that was previously painted with the old aldehyde emamel. It was very smooth and shiney but the XIM stuck to it fine.

 

[tcianci]

To the poster that is looking for some paint for furniture...try some Benjamin Moore Satin Impervo OIL BASED. Mix in a little penetrol and it will lay out like glass. If you have large flat areas use a dense foam roller, re-roll it with extremely light strokes after you cover the area and it should look almost sprayed. I just did an antique secretary piece for my daughter and that was done with rattle can sandable primer and satin Krylon...looks great.

 

[dps]

Funny - I've been researching paints as well mainly because I'm planning a furniture project (built in bookcases) and have yet to be able to find a suitable furniture grade paint. Ben Moore, Duron, SW, etc have all let me down with visible brush strokes, sticky finish, easy scuffing, etc.

I'm curious to try Fine Paints of Europe - it seems to be the the best paint out there from all the reviews. Their website is a bit lacking in their descriptions (all it says is they use the most expensive pigments not why they use them). Anyway, at $140+ a gallon, it ain't cheap but for a high profile, low square foot project like cabinets or other furniture, I am curious enough to give it a try.

Other poster is right; use oil based products, huge difference over water-based. Try Benjamin Moore's alkyd underbody over raw wood, coats beautifully, sands like plaster. Top coat with gloss of your choice or for superior look and feel use high gloss and sand/rub/polish it to your desired gloss. On flat surfaces it's not as time consuming as it sounds. Find a video at your library called "Fine Furniture Finishing", has it all.

I use the Dutch paints from Fine Paints of Europe on the exterior of our house; an old Victorian with lots of trim, some of it black, which really takes a beating in the sun. It is easily the best paint for longevity outside, so well worth the extra cost. It is harder to use than other paints.

 

[gesoffen]

I've avoided anything water based for furniture. However, the oil based stuff from Duron (can't remember the exact names of them but I've tried 3 different ones) as well as one each from Ben Moore and Sherwin Williams have provided less than satisfactory results. Of course this was a few years ago following some tips from Taunton's FHB or FW (can't remember which).

You guys have posted a couple of other techniques to try so I'll give them a go on one of my test pieces - application error is certainly a possibility in my past attempts! No worries though, I gotta finish a master bath reno before I tackle this furniture project.

 

[Kevin54]

I'm researching the best way to paint my kitchen cabinets white. The cabinets have real wood faces and doors that are stained fairly dark w/ a gloss on them. The cabinet boxes themselves are particle board w/ a veneer. BIN comes up over and over and over in the online how-to's. On Zinsser's website they say sainding isn't needed at all w/ BIN even on glossy surfaces so long as it's cleaned properly? That would save lots of work, but I'm skeptical. Anyone use it? Experiences? It also seems that clean up is a ***** so basically be prepared to dispose of brushes and a resperator is a needed item.

Thanks,
Brian

We are in the process of changing out all the trim and doors in our house. Going from the cheap 3" standard '70's-80's trim to beaded trim and wide baseboards. Anyways I did not want to change out all of the door casings and they need to be painted white. I picked up a bottle of Finish Deglosser (used to be called "Liquid Sandpaper") from Lowes. Brush it on, takes the gloss down and adds some teeth for the paint to adhere to. The wife is doing it and states that it works great. I'll post up some pics when I get a chance.

 

[Cobra4B]

Wish I'd known about that when I was painting the trim in the rest of my house. Just finished re-doing my dining room/eating area adn all of the dark wood trim took 1 coat of kilz and 3 coats of top of the line SW trim paint to adequately cover.