Arc Welder with a Generator?

[Johnny A]

I have a job to do that requires me to use a Lincoln Arc Welder, I need to wels up an old tractor that is 1/4 mile in the woods. All I have is a 5000watt (6250watt surge) generator. It has a L14-20R twist 220 on the generator. Its a 20 amp twist plug. Will this work on the Ac225 arc welder if I make up a adapter cord (similar to the one pictured).


I was hoping someone knew if it will work



Thanks in advance...










http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/Equipment/Pages/product.aspx?product=K1170

 

[nehog]

It will kinda work for a few seconds. Once the smoke clears, you can consider perhaps a bigger generator? The welder requires 50 amps at 240 volts, which is about 3 times what that generator can put out on a really good day. A much smaller welder (which may not do the job) or a bigger welder is in order.

 

[tcianci]

It will kinda work for a few seconds. Once the smoke clears, you can consider perhaps a bigger generator? The welder requires 50 amps at 240 volts, which is about 3 times what that generator can put out on a really good day. A much smaller welder (which may not do the job) or a bigger welder is in order.

This is a shoot from the hip answer. The welder does not "require" 50 amps at 240 volts. It will draw about 50 amps if you're using the welder at it's maximum rated welding current of 225 amps. The amount of primary current, i.e. the current that the welder draws from the source (in this case your generator) is totally determined by the welding load , which is the output setting you're using for the welding rod you choose. You will probably never see a welding rod that needs 225 amps to make it weld. The numbers say that you could indeed weld at about 2/3 the capacity of that machine for short periods of time. That would allow you to run the welder at up to 130 amps or so. You can weld with 1/8 rod at currents considerably less than 130 AMPS.

Set it up and verify the operation. You will not experience smoke, the output of your generator is protected by circuit breakers. The worst thing that could happen is you would trip the breaker.

 

[Rookie2]

how much welding are you going to do in order to drive the tractor to the shop ?

If its only for a quickie, I've used 2 car batteries to mig weld (generator running 120v to drive) and have a few attempts at stick welding but it takes a little practice.

 

[619DioFan]

I used a set up just like this to fix a broken steering knuckle on a go kart. the generator keep fluctuating causing power surges for the welder. was able to finally get a solid weld but it was a pain.

 

[Buckgnarly]

I ran my Thunderbolt Xl with 6011 rod to weld a snowmachine bridge a few years back. The bracing was about 3/16, ran just fine with my neighbors 6000W HF generator amd plug adaptor just like you described...still standing and no sleds in the drink 4 years later!

 

[A**holes Garage]

http://makezine.com/projects/car-battery-welding/

 

[Johnny A]

guys, thanks for the advice. I need to get the wheel axle buttoned up to get it back. It's something I haven't seen in person. This is what happens when you have relatives that expect you to solve all problems..

I might look into a Harbor Freight or Clarke 120volt arc welder.... Any advice on that?
For 70.00 it will be cheaper than the cord adapters

 

[AndyA]

I don't think any of your ideas are going to work. That's probably not going to be enough generator to run the AC225 even with it turned down. The little 120volt welders may not pop the breaker on the generator, but I wouldn't expect them to do much to the tractor axle either.

There may be another problem even if you had a proper engine driven welder. Is the tractor axle cast? Or is it high carbon forged steel?
If it's cast iron and you try to weld on it, there's a good possibility you'll just crack it more. It'll need to be heated up (maybe 600F) evenly and slowly. You probably won't be able to do this in the field with it still attached to the tractor.
If it's high carbon steel, you may still have problems getting a good weld. Most likely you won't destroy the piece, but you may have problems getting the weld to attach without cracking. The weld area will be quickly quenched by the large bulk of the axle. This will make that location hard and brittle and prone to cracking.

Can you fine someone with a proper engine driven welder? This will give you the best likelyhood of success. You might also check your local equipement rental place. A one day rental may not be too expensive.

 

[justin1795]

around here you can rent the welders on the trailers that have the built in generator. not sure on pricing. may beable to do a 4hour rental

 

[MagKarl]

The welder does not "require" 50 amps at 240 volts.
The amount of primary current, i.e. the current that the welder draws from the source (in this case your generator) is totally determined by the welding load , which is the output setting you're using for the welding rod you choose.

.

Tcianci is correct in my book and I would give you the same advice. Give it a try at home and please come back to tell us whether or not you were successful. I run 1/8" 6011 at 100A. You could always go with smaller rod.

 

[MoonRise]

Short answer, no.

Longer answer, right from Lincoln, is no.

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/support/welding-how-to/pages/generator-size-detail.aspx

As to how to do your welding job, a bit depends on just what you mean by 'wheel axle buttoned up'.

A 'little' 120V wire-feed welder, running off a generator? Possible, if you are just welding up sheetmetal.

Then (as mentioned above), you have the possible issue of just what material you are trying to weld up.

Mild steel, with 'enough' machine, is usually weldable without too much difficulty.

Alloy steel may be rather iffy (special electrodes and/or pre-heat/post-heat often needed).

Cast iron tractor axle, in the field with a small generator? Even more iffy (special-special $$$ nickel electrodes, usually SMAW unless you have a 'big' industrial-type wire feed machine and then you would be out big $$$$$ for a spool of special-special nickel wire, probable preheat and post-heat needed unless you try the run-small-small-weld-dots-and-peen-and-let-cool-and-repeat-800-times technique for welding cast iron).

So, short answer to your original question on running a 'tombstone' transformer AC225 SMAW machine off of a 5000 Watt generator is no.

Longer answer, how to do the 'job' depends on some more specifics about exactly what you have to weld.

But a small wire-feed 120V H-F welder is almost certainly not going to be the tool for the job.

An inverter-based 120/240V SMAW machine running off of a generator may or may not be a possible solution, with the appropriate electrodes (depending on exactly what has to be welded on the tractor).

Or rent an engine-drive SMAW welder and use the appropriate electrodes (depending on exactly what has to be welded on the tractor).

 

[mtmgtz]

You can rent a smaller gas powered welder around here for $35 for 4 hours or $50 for 24 hours. I think I'd go that route.

 

[Zeke]

guys, thanks for the advice. I need to get the wheel axle buttoned up to get it back. It's something I haven't seen in person. This is what happens when you have relatives that expect you to solve all problems..

I might look into a Harbor Freight or Clarke 120volt arc welder.... Any advice on that?
For 70.00 it will be cheaper than the cord adapters

Sounds to me like the job would be most easily accomplished by taking said axle to the machine/welding shop. You're going to end up there anyway.

 

[lynnbilodeau]

I know you weren't trying to be funny,... but this made me laugh out loud.

"This is what happens when you have relatives that expect you to solve all problems.."

I know EXACTLY what it is like to be that guy. Don't get me wrong, I love helping my family and solving problems. Can be challenging sometimes.

 

[Bigplum]

lots of rachet straps , tie it all together and drive it home .. slowly

 

[nehog]

Short answer, no.

Longer answer, right from Lincoln, is no.

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/support/welding-how-to/pages/generator-size-detail.aspx
...

humm... From the hip answer, at that!

 

[sberry]

Buy a Miller Maxstar S, run dandy from the genset and you got a real portable welder setup. You could do the same Import with Longevity I think for under 300$.

I am a career welder and got 4 portables but if I had to do it again for light maintenance,, diy,, etc I would score a multi volts inverter for field work. As\ll that runs so cheap and most of the time you can plug it in to the wall,,, they are super.

 

[marinepride]

Buy a bobcat 225 and be done with it

 

[sberry]

If I was going in biz where I needed it I would be one thing but modern engineering made some alternatives so much cheaper than a Bobcat. So much cheaper to run too. That 5K in the pic above would be dandy for the right machine,,, an AC225 aint it though. Want it fast and cheap maybe welder rental,,, but if you got to ask,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, says a lot about this already starting off on wrong foot.

 

[marinepride]

It would run a hobart 140 or miller maxstar150

 

[crf731]

I've rented these before, they work pretty good and are about the size of your 6500 generator.

Call around to your local rental stores, they will probably have something similar.

http://www.multiquip.com/multiquip/GAW180HE.htm

 

[Johnny A]

Guys,
I told the "family" that they need to spend some money & have someone else deal with it. They expected me to fund this project.
I became the "*******" on Monday when I told them I can't do it.

Thanks again guys.

You all made me realize I need to start saying no

 

[ibedayank]

winch the damn thing up on a trailer and haul where you have the proper tools to fix it

 

[kf4zht]

I have stick welded with a buzzbox and a generator about that size. Worked fine, though striking an arc was fun since you had to wait for the generator to spin up to match draw.

Also ran a MIG off it with good results. Be careful with new migs though, the output of the generator can fry the control boards.

 

[Johnny A]

I have stick welded with a buzzbox and a generator about that size. Worked fine, though striking an arc was fun since you had to wait for the generator to spin up to match draw.

Also ran a MIG off it with good results. Be careful with new migs though, the output of the generator can fry the control boards.

how was it using the Buzz box with the generator? What was the size generator?

Just curious

 

[TractorJeff]

First off; what was the tractor doing in the woods?
Not that I need to ask as most "Relatives" think they are of the Log Skidder family or Bulldozer family.
Fixed one of those poor tractors once!(thought it was a bulldozer cause you could attach a blade to the 3 point)
As far as Axles, they are Steel not Cast Iron!
Welding with a 6k watt or smaller on a BuzzBox, most do not respond well to the surge of arc strike which is why the recommendation is typically a much larger than expected generator.
Rentals?
Yes, in a case like this it is the way to go!
Now brings to the point of what is actually broken?
Chances are you will indeed need to haul your drill, grinder and torches out there to do even a simple repair that will get it back to the shop.
What they should do is take tools out there, remove broken/damaged part, take to town, get it fixed, go back out and put back on! Fixed lots of Log Skidders, Bulldozers and such this way! Big machinery, you don't just pick it and haul back to repair, you take the Field truck out there and fix it!

 

[Lassen Forge]

...I told the "family" that they need to spend some money & have someone else deal with it. They expected me to fund this project...

I've had issues like that before; someone (family or "family") ask for your help, then expect you to foot the bill for helping, and then you become the patsy that always gets called because they realize they can ask for continuous "favors" and mooch off your goodwill to fix their stuff for free (so they can go back out and break it up again).

I don't mind helping out in a pinch, but like I tell relatives when they think they can abuse this (or expect me to pay for their f***ups) my name isn't Auntie FEMA... it's called responsibility, and they need to practice some.

When I was young I thought I needed to buy my friends and relatives love and respect. Learned early on (when being "nice" meant no rent or food money because I was "helping someone") I was being used, and they didn't care. as long as they got what they wanted for free. Sure, some people call me a cast-iron B!t<# after I tell them no way and grow up... but people like that are neither friends or "Family"...