Asphalt Millings + Geo Grid

[VSICCA]

Hello all.

After receiving some astronomical asphalt paving costs here in NE Tennessee we're looking at other options. Have been quoted up to $15k for a 1400 sq ft drive with no tear out (we demo'd the old concrete drive ourselves) and with minimal grading. Drive is basically one large rectangle with minimal site issues so the cost to pave it just isn't justified.

Looking at adding 4" of compacted pug mix with a 4" geocell over it filled with screened and compacted asphalt millings or crushed concrete (prefer millings) surrounded with a RR tie or 6X6 PT border.

Worked for a builder for a number of years so I'm pretty handy, and all of the work would be done by ourselves. Anyone go a similar route? Thanks in advance for your advice!

 

[TomC750]

I also live in NE Tn and facing same issue, except I have in excess of 5K sq ft, so I'm interested in any and all input.

 

[VSICCA]

I also live in NE Tn and facing same issue, except I have in excess of 5K sq ft, so I'm interested in any and all input.

It's crazy isn't it? Local asphalt contractors wanting more $$$ than what you could do it with concrete for. $7K+ for a 1400 sq ft chip and tar drive and $15k for asphalt. Plumbers wanting $7500 to replace a 50' sewer main to the house (did ourselves $650), $6000 for 35' water line to the house (did ourselves $250), $8000 for 100' of gutters and 3 downspouts (will do ourselves $500), $5000 to remove a single 50' oak tree (10 quotes later done for $600.)

It's just insane and have sent every single contractor packing. We live in what's considered "the old money" section of town which is why I believe we get quotes like these, but TBH our home is just an average one in a nice location. If we were in a different side of town I'm sure the quotes would be much different, but such is life.

Our driveway project is a 2 year temporary as we have plans for expanding it, adding a retaining wall and ultimately installing pavers. We've done the numbers and our 4" base + 4" GeoCell + millings or crushed concrete will run between $2000 - $2500 depending on our choices, so we're about to get started this week.

 

[Hooked]

I'm not familiar with using geocell but our drive is milled/shaved asphalt which provides excellent compaction and stability over the years (40+). When summer rolls around it will harden to almost solid asphalt if the temps are anything like we have in SE Texas.

 

[bb29510]

one of the problem with asphalt milling, all the chemical, oils, and other trash that leaked unto our roadways are now in your front yard

 

[35k0]

I don't know about geocell, but we put down milled pavement on our 1/4 mile driveway last summer and it's the bomb.

 

[VSICCA]

Finding that there’s a supply issue here in far NE Tennessee with millings. Can’t find them anywhere within 45 min, and none of the local haulers will bring them to us. May have to go with plan B of using crushed concrete or 57 gravel. Really wanted millings though, but refuse to contact the local pavers as every single one has wanted a 2 - 3 hundred percent markup on laying asphalt. Just not playing that game.

 

[VSICCA]

… And it does get warm here in the TN mountains, just not the warmth that those south of us get, plus it’s a lot less humid here as well. We don’t even have AC here at the house and can sometimes count the # of days it hits 90 on one hand here.

Believe millings would setup and compact just fine though as it’s not entirely cool here all year long either.

May end up using crush and run to fill the cells of the geocell temporarily then lay clay brick / concrete pavers within the next year or two as our home reno plan takes shape. We have options though, none of which entail paying $10+ sq ft for asphalt.

 

[VSICCA]

Compacting before laying down the crusher run and geo grid. Did find a supplier of screened asphalt milling fines for $60 ton last minute yesterday. Guess when you have an area under wrap you can charge what you want so we ordered 20 tons. Still a better driveway material versus crush over the long haul IMO and didn’t break the bank.

 

[VSICCA]

Update. Wife and I removed our failing driveway to replace the sewer main then prepped the area for its replacement. Graded and compacted the clay soil then laid down a 6” layer of crusher run with compaction in 2 separate lifts.

Must have moved 200+ wheelbarrow loads of dirt around our property to fill in other areas, which look nice now.

Have the geo grid partially installed with 20 tons of screened asphalt milling fines being dropped today then will finish the grid, spread and compact. Been a lot of manual work moving 40+ tons of material with 2 shovels and a wheelbarrow but we’re nearing the end now.

Interested to see how well the geo grid and millings work with each other over time.

 

[VSICCA]

 

[zak77]

Why the Geo Grid?? I thought the product was used if you wanted to grow grass in an area that'll see compaction. I would thing Geotextile fabric would be a better choice for this application. I used it under a section of driveway turn around i put in years ago under millings and it's still flat as the day i put it in. Are you having the milling compacted? I had mine compacted and i still have small stones getting pulled out by tires so if you dont get it compacted, i see issues.

 

[rjacobs]

Why the Geo Grid??

Doesnt look like his driveway is flat at all. Probably trying to keep his millings from sliding down the hill...

 

[Ran58]

Nobody can call you a slacker!

 

[VSICCA]

Lol. My wife was like “This will be the last driveway we replace … by ourselves!

The pictures don’t do it justice but we’re on a 25 percent grade / slope going down the street into town with awkward entry and exit angles so I wanted to make sure the millings stayed in place.

The grid can be used for a variety of applications (soil stabilization and driveways included). We almost resigned ourselves to using crusher run to backfill the grid as millings are near impossible to find here in the mountains but came about some yesterday.

Once in place and leveled out we’ll be compacting them with a plate compactor with @ 1/2” of millings above the level of the grid.

Thought about the geo fabric but don’t believe it would have solved the side to side movement of the millings with vehicles coming and going, plus the geo grid only added about another $700 to the $2800 project total. Much better than $14k!

 

[jblnut]

Looks like a nice place !!

I don't have experience with asphalt millings but have had over 200 12yd loads of crushed concrete hauled in and put on driveways on the farm and love every bit of it. After a few years the dust/powder works its way to the top but other than that it's great stuff.

I'll have to look into asphalt millings when we get the house driveway in it's final spot. That stuff you have sure looks nice.

We have geofabric under a few thousand feet of driveways and you can tell where it ends. It's great stuff.

 

[HaiKarate]

I think if I was going through all of that work, I'd go ahead and pour the concrete myself as well.

Interesting to see how the asphalt millings work out, though.

 

[VSICCA]

I think if I was going through all of that work, I'd go ahead and pour the concrete myself as well.

Interesting to see how the asphalt millings work out, though.

We were thinking of going that route too but have plans to extend the driveway alongside and around the back of the house with a retaining wall and carport off the end of the house. This means the new driveway is only a 2-3 year thing then will be yanked and replaced with the above and decorative concrete pavers, so we wanted to keep our costs right now as low as possible. Laying concrete ourselves would have ended up somewhere near $7k.

 

[Hooked]

With your prep work, I think you will be very pleased with the millings. In addition to the stability and compaction of the asphalt, you won't have the dust issues of crushed concrete/rocks.
Sounds like your wife is much like mine, right alongside me on any project of this nature. Very nice.

 

[theoldwizard1]

I would not want any big trucks on that driveway ! I would be afraid they would crush the geocell !

You will likely have to do another layer compacted fines in a couple of years. Sink should slow down after the second application.

 

[VSICCA]

We think so too and are glad now we added the grid. Think the stability over time will be to our benefit.

My wife is always there by my side shoveling, grading, moving wheelbarrows and doing whatever it takes to get the job done, then will go inside at night and cook the family dinner. Sometimes she’s working so hard I start to feel guilty as she never quits. Lol.

 

[VSICCA]

Millings arrived this afternoon and must say they were even better than expected. Coffee ground like consistency and really dark and rich looking. Definitely not the dirty and dried millings you hear horror stories about from people.

Can now see why they were $60 ton and feel good about our purchase. They’re spreading and compacting perfectly and we feel even better now with the geo cell as it’s holding them in place as we thought it would.

The only issue with the cell is when dumping the millings the cell contorted horizontally some from the force of the dump (plus the driver killed my clean out :/ ) but all in all happy with the results. The cell is still anchored down properly and working as it should and will be fully covered with the millings when finished so we’re good with it.

 

[jonesg]

all those saving qualify you for a free bobcat.

Shop now !

 

[VSICCA]

all those saving qualify you for a free bobcat.

Shop now !

You and I are on the same page!

… Unfortunately my wife is not.

 

[rockettauto]

Hello all.

After receiving some astronomical asphalt paving costs here in NE Tennessee we're looking at other options. Have been quoted up to $15k for a 1400 sq ft drive with no tear out (we demo'd the old concrete drive ourselves) and with minimal grading. Drive is basically one large rectangle with minimal site issues so the cost to pave it just isn't justified.

Looking at adding 4" of compacted pug mix with a 4" geocell over it filled with screened and compacted asphalt millings or crushed concrete (prefer millings) surrounded with a RR tie or 6X6 PT border.

Worked for a builder for a number of years so I'm pretty handy, and all of the work would be done by ourselves. Anyone go a similar route? Thanks in advance for your advice!

I did millings over existing #57 gravel. Had an area with giant mud holes I could only get through on 33+ tires and 4wd that had never been graveled / or it long since sunk in I filled with maybe square foot chunks from demoed concrete/ corduroyed it then abc on top. Then on the part where nothing previously existed I went geofabric covered with abc topped with millings.

Couldn't be happier with the millings as a top surface.

I'll say this though, that part where it practically looks like regular asphalt right now, won't last that long. Within a year it starts to look more like fines over a dark base....but you can also spray it with sealer right when it gets where youre happy and it's back.

Just for a bit of suckage.....theres a supplier 1 mile from my house and I pay $60 per 4 ton load of whatever I choose, from abc to millings.

 

[jumbojak]

I would not want any big trucks on that driveway ! I would be afraid they would crush the geocell !

You will likely have to do another layer compacted fines in a couple of years. Sink should slow down after the second application.

That grid is way, way stronger than you'd think just looking at it. We have sections at work that support turf grass with propane trucks that go over it. It's not fun when you hit it with a trencher though.

 

[Fav Onefour]

Pretty impressive work. The physical side of that work alone is brutal. Moving material changes a lot when you add in grade.
I wouldn't have guessed 25% grade. I have a drive that I was told is 16% average grade and it's a challenge. Honestly, I'm not sure if the number might be in degrees? My math skills are close to retirement. It's steep as heck. Rocks and dirt just roll to the bottom. Doing concrete is really challenging.
Bobcat would have been tricky too. You only haul in one direction, carry low, and take it easy with that kind of slope.

In the big picture, I think your surface may help slow down the water flow toward the structure.

 

[like2wheel]

I've been debating millings for quite some time, but if I ran across some that looked like that, I'd buy it in a heart beat.
Keep us posted

 

[VSICCA]

I did millings over existing #57 gravel. Had an area with giant mud holes I could only get through on 33+ tires and 4wd that had never been graveled / or it long since sunk in I filled with maybe square foot chunks from demoed concrete/ corduroyed it then abc on top. Then on the part where nothing previously existed I went geofabric covered with abc topped with millings.

Couldn't be happier with the millings as a top surface.

I'll say this though, that part where it practically looks like regular asphalt right now, won't last that long. Within a year it starts to look more like fines over a dark base....but you can also spray it with sealer right when it gets where youre happy and it's back.

Just for a bit of suckage.....theres a supplier 1 mile from my house and I pay $60 per 4 ton load of whatever I choose, from abc to millings.

That's a great deal ... and what we were expecting to pay. Summers-Taylor though has a lock on the millings here in the mountains and charges accordingly. Was surprised with the quality though in the end so we feel good with the purchase.

 

[VSICCA]

Pretty impressive work. The physical side of that work alone is brutal. Moving material changes a lot when you add in grade.
I wouldn't have guessed 25% grade. I have a drive that I was told is 16% average grade and it's a challenge. Honestly, I'm not sure if the number might be in degrees? My math skills are close to retirement. It's steep as heck. Rocks and dirt just roll to the bottom. Doing concrete is really challenging.
Bobcat would have been tricky too. You only haul in one direction, carry low, and take it easy with that kind of slope.

In the big picture, I think your surface may help slow down the water flow toward the structure.

Yeah, the pics don't look as though it's that steep but it is. Our drive from skirt to skirt is just shy of 31' and it drops @ 7.5 feet across the span and continues down the street the same until reaching the road below us. From the edge of the road to our garage FF drops almost 9' over the 56' (from the upper skirt) so we had to take both slopes into consideration when grading the drive.

 

[VSICCA]

Some of the nearly finished pics. Still have @ half yard to collect up in the center to set aside and some tampering along the road trans and skirts this evening. Going to let it settle some this week and bake in the sun then hit it with a few rounds of compaction over the weekend. Should be ready to drive on by weeks end.

 

[VSICCA]

Next up will be power washing and painting the brick, new decks front and rear and FINALLY getting our garage in order just in time for college football season. Plan to epoxy the floor, replace the windows, foam insulate and new wall / ceiling coverings. May also mount our 100" projector screen out there as well. Have all of the supplies to do so in the corner staring me down and twitching to get going. Can't wait to finally have my workshop back.

 

[Fav Onefour]

Looks pretty good. Have you had a chance to see how heavy rains flow?

Your numbers make more sense now. It also makes me thing mine are wrong with my drive. It's too bad I'm a math idiot. I have a 46' length with 14.5 drop. The main section is awful steep. End dumps could not get enough angle to drop a load. I pushed a lot of wheelbarrow loads up that dang hill. Believe me, I do understand how much work it is to work with elevation.

 

[Hooked]

That looks great!! Wish the milled/crushed asphalt I get was as nice as that.

 

[VSICCA]

Looks pretty good. Have you had a chance to see how heavy rains flow?

Your numbers make more sense now. It also makes me thing mine are wrong with my drive. It's too bad I'm a math idiot. I have a 46' length with 14.5 drop. The main section is awful steep. End dumps could not get enough angle to drop a load. I pushed a lot of wheelbarrow loads up that dang hill. Believe me, I do understand how much work it is to work with elevation.

We had two good stress tests once everything was laid out and graded … 3+ inches of rain in a 6 hour span one night then two nights later another 3” more.

First round was a descent wash out diagonally across the drive. About 2’ wide and down to the grid for @ 25’ long. We regraded then made some adjustments with our borders and landscaping, and when the second downpour happened it washed out again but only a foot wide and inch deep for @ 10’.

This though was before we compacted, so yesterday and today we compacted the entire drive six times front to back and added a 2” asphalt hump across the driveway at the street. Compacted the hump as well and looks great while still sitting around and inch and a half above our drive.

Here is the end result. Think it looks great.

 

[VSICCA]

Believe we now have the washouts figured out as adding the lip along the street for the length of the drive should keep the water out on the street.

The only part of the grid that you see are the tops of it here and there (pictured) but honestly you can hardly see it. Our cars also hardly leave a mark on it when driving on it which wasn’t expected but cool to see.

What we really love is that by simply using the backside of a wire rake back and forth across the drive you have what looks to be a brand new drive again in only 10 minutes.

 

[ZRX61]

My back hurts just looking at the pics

 

[VSICCA]

My back hurts just looking at the pics

Lol. Ours too! When all said and done wife and I totaled it up and we’ve moved somewhere between 750-800 wheelbarrow loads of dirt, crusher run and millings around our property and driveway for a total of 90+ tons … by hand with 2 shovels and a wheelbarrow and the occasional assist from our demo jackhammer. The clay soy here in TN is no joke once it hardens, and the steep grade of our property made it a fun one as well.

 

[Walkers]

I would not want any big trucks on that driveway ! I would be afraid they would crush the geocell !

You will likely have to do another layer compacted fines in a couple of years. Sink should slow down after the second application.

I am on a commercial job that they are putting down plastic geogrid, dumping AB into it, then driving heavy equipment on it. It doesn't seem to be a big problem.

 

[VSICCA]

I am on a commercial job that they are putting down plastic geogrid, dumping AB into it, then driving heavy equipment on it. It doesn't seem to be a big problem.

Been a non issue with us as well. The grid is rated at something like 1900 psi once backfilled, and by having it down I’d have no issues driving heavier vehicles across it now. A little weird as we trimmed it with scissors when installing it, but can tell it’s not going anywhere.