At what point is it overkill when insulating?

[4EyedTurd]

My shop is metal framed with no insulation, from reading as I’ve never had to insulate before, I’m leaning towards overkill. Tape all the seams of the metal for air intrusion, foam any big voids between the frame and sheets, then use some combination of foam boards/rock wool/fiberglass insulation before sheeting with osb. I could see adding some type of metal where the sheets meet the slab for moisture damage control.

I’m in Texas, shop is 20x30x10. Insulation and any/all sound deadening is ideal without going broke as I wrench into the night and don’t want to piss off the neighbors. At the same time if all the little stuff adds up in the end, I’m all for it.

 

[kTHREE]

Don't bother with rock wool if you're only going the sound deadening. The difference between rock wool and traditional fiberglass is so laughable that it's a downright crime they use that for marketing.

 

[Marctrees]

Just FYI 4 Eye -

We are soon getting a reputed foam contractor to do 7.5 " OC under roof and 4" OC on all walls - $3700 - in and out in one day 3 man crew - 38 x 35 x 10 Pole barn.

I would guesstimate like 60% of that for your size building... and turnkey done in one day !!

Marc

 

[SkeeterZX200]

I have a 30x60x14 pole barn. I insulated it with the help of a few friends. I used R19 Batt in the walls and blown fiberglass to R40 in the ceiling. It cost me just under $1800 dollars and 2 days worth of work.

 

[4EyedTurd]

I did check with one spray foamer and they charge $1.50 sq ft for closed cell. With roughly 1400sq ft of ceiling and wall it’s not to bad

 

[mike93lx]

I did check with one spray foamer and they charge $1.50 sq ft for closed cell. With roughly 1400sq ft of ceiling and wall it’s not to bad

Spray foam is sold by the board foot, not square foot.

1" thick of 12"x12" is one board foot. But most closed cell is 2"+.

Was that 1.50 for 2 inches per sq ft?

 

[rlitman]

Don't bother with rock wool if you're only going the sound deadening. The difference between rock wool and traditional fiberglass is so laughable that it's a downright crime they use that for marketing.

From a sound perspective, rock wool is only better because it's denser. You could always over-stuff fiberglass into the same cavity to get to the same density as rock wool and get the same sound results. However, once you realize that you'll need twice as much fiberglass for this to work, rock wool isn't so expensive any more. Plus rock wool has other benefits over fiberglass.

That being said, you'll get FAR more sound attenuation by putting up MLV, and per square foot, that may end up being cheaper. It's certainly easier to apply.

 

[4EyedTurd]

Spray foam is sold by the board foot, not square foot.

1" thick of 12"x12" is one board foot. But most closed cell is 2"+.

Was that 1.50 for 2 inches per sq ft?

I had to double check the messages, they quoted $1.50 a sqft but didn’t say a thickness

 

[Jagmandave]

MLV????

Could you guys use words instead of acronyms for some of us less experienced builders?

 

[Marctrees]

Closed cell is usually around $1.10 per "Board foot" - 12" x 12" x 1"

So, if you are getting for example 3" thick, it will be approx $3.30 per square foot.

Open cell is more like approx 25 cents per board food.

The prices above includes ALL costs for typical size jobs like most here would have ... A huge 10,000 sq ft footprint building will be a bit less/ sq ft than a 600 ft shop.-

For a typical workshop like we are talking about the best overall value is all Open cell.

Marc

 

[Marctrees]

Turd - Approx where are you in TX ?

Marc

 

[mike93lx]

MLV????

Could you guys use words instead of acronyms for some of us less experienced builders?

Mass loaded Vinyl

 

[Marctrees]

Mass Loaded Vinyl ???

I would bet 99% of us here are still lost.

Marc

 

[rlitman]

MLV????

Could you guys use words instead of acronyms for some of us less experienced builders?

Well, if you must know:

https://lmgtfy.com/?q=mlv

So, how exactly does knowing the words behind the acronym help you in your search for a product that's sold by the name MLV? Does knowing the chemical name of DNA or TNT help you in any way?

 

[Marctrees]

You must be talkin about like the "Tar" patches they put in car doors kinda thing.

I am pretty sure the OP is not going down that road.

He just wants a normal quieted down insulated shop.

Marc

 

[Marctrees]

rlitman - Thanks !

I'm gonna look into that for a compressor quieting wall.

Marc

 

[rlitman]

You must be talkin about like the "Tar" patches they put in car doors kinda thing.

I am pretty sure the OP is not going down that road.

He just wants a normal quieted down insulated shop.

Marc

Well, dynamat serves pretty much the same purpose.
It's a tar-paper resembling roll that will do a far better job at blocking sound if stapled up in a layer than any insulation.

The simple fact is that insulation is a lousy sound barrier.

 

[rlitman]

rlitman - Thanks !

I'm gonna look into that for a compressor quieting wall.

Marc

Hummm, looking on Amazon, the price seems to have gone up about 25% since I purchased a roll last year. It's over $2 / sq-ft now.

 

[4EyedTurd]

Turd - Approx where are you in TX ?

Marc

Waco

 

[foodie]

Rock wool does make a sound Board insulation also...just throwing it out there...

 

[moore87]

Waco

Call Green Insulation in Robinson. They just did my shop for $0.90 per board ft. Asked god 1” on walls and 2” in ceiling and ended up with 1.5-2” on walls and in some places it’s like 5-6” thick in the ceiling

 

[kj_mustang]

Then that worker spraying was pretty bad. Hope you don't have any voids in it.

 

[4EyedTurd]

Call Green Insulation in Robinson. They just did my shop for $0.90 per board ft. Asked god 1” on walls and 2” in ceiling and ended up with 1.5-2” on walls and in some places it’s like 5-6” thick in the ceiling

How big is your shop and what was the total if you don’t mind sharing?

 

[mike93lx]

Call Green Insulation in Robinson. They just did my shop for $0.90 per board ft. Asked god 1” on walls and 2” in ceiling and ended up with 1.5-2” on walls and in some places it’s like 5-6” thick in the ceiling

Not sure why you consider that good. You got 2-3x more than you asked for. Did they not charge for what they sprayed? If they are already below market rate and gave you that much "extra", I would question quality of material and work.

 

[Marctrees]

Kj and Mike have valid point.

The material is quite expensive... AFAIK average ballpark like 1/3 of the job total cost...If they do not have control of the amount they use, they may not have proper control of other things.


Marc

 

[Centex Hokie]

If you decide to have batt or blow in insulation, I would suggest Larry Witt at Think insulation. He did a good job for me in my former house, my office and the garage ceiling for my new home. Since my garage is attached to the house foam would have required a fire retardant so I insulated the garage walls with rock wool and the ceiling with blown in fiberglass. The home itself was done by thermo-dynamics, but I don't know if they will do a small job like a garage and they have a reputation in the area as the best and charge accordingly. Good luck.

By the way I put R-15 in the walls and R-30 in the ceiling of the garage and it seems to do a good job in this climate.

 

[dcg9381]

I’m in Texas, shop is 20x30x10. Insulation and any/all sound deadening is ideal without going broke as I wrench into the night and don’t want to piss off the neighbors. At the same time if all the little stuff adds up in the end, I’m all for it.

Well, only so nuts you can go in 600 sqft. Insulation and sound deadening not necessarily the same thing.

Sealing the doors and various nooks is a detail job that isn't that expensive, is well worth it, and you can DIY.

I'm in Texas. Our buildings could use R30 all the way around if you want to get down to it, but it really depends on the cost of that insulation versus how often you use the shop and HVAC costs. For me, I over-HVAC'd, under insulated a bit (R-12 to R15) and that makes it work for me. I would have had to spend another $7000 or so to get to R-30 and then 3x $5k per door to get well insulated doors... So instead, I pay a higher energy cost because I don't live in the shop... Yet...