Band saw drive wheel help

[Kaizen]

Tuning up a Wf wells horizontal metal bandsaw. Ordered new blades so I could tune correctly. New blades got from reputable source and they had a 3/4 blade listed as opposed to current one which is like half inch or so.
On the drive wheel which has a lip it is rubbing on the back of the case. Looks like this happened before from the groove cut. The bearings are solid and held to the case with a bolt. Any ideas what is wrong? Parts schematic does not show spacing washers nor does the machine look like it ever had any. It looks like I could shim the plate holding to case, below the bearing, or under bolts holding wheel to gear wheel. Not sure if that is what is acceptable as I never had an old machine like this before. Yes I adjusted the tip adjustment on the wheel and no help.

Sent from my iPhone using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[cvairwerks]

If the blade is on the correct direction, it probably wasn’t tracking right and wandered off the wheel some. Try setting the tension and track the blade with the covers off and see what’s going on.

 

[matt_i]

I'm not sure if I'm seeing it correctly. In the first pic it looks to me like the blade is riding on top of the lip/step in the drive wheel.

But then I don't see it in the 2nd and 3rd pics. Not sure if covered up?

The back/smooth edge of the blade, opposite of the teeth, should be in contact with the lip of the drive wheel. Possibly the blade guides could be holding the blade back from its proper line. The guides do have to twist the blade. But move the guides close together, maybe only 2" apart, if you have this adjustment at first to make sure they aren't skewing the tracking. When you say you changed blade widths you may have also changed blade-stock-thicknesses, and the guides might need to be opened up to accommodate the new thickness. Not sure if you have solid or ball bearing guides.

The driven/(non-drive)/takeup wheel uses its "dish" adjustment to drive that smooth edge of the blade so its just kissing the lip/step on the drive wheel. It shouldn't be scrubbing hard because it will wear it out. You should rarely to never need to adjust the setscrews that adjust the plane of the drive wheel, I think those are basically to allow solid contact between the machined wheel asm and the rough casting of the housing.

I'm not sure if I helped or not. The blades can take more tension than you'd put on a woodcutting blade.

 

[akasrick]

Tuning up a hf wells horizontal metal bandsaw. Ordered new blades so I could tune correctly. New blades got from reputable source and they had a 3/4 blade listed as opposed to current one which is like half inch or so.
On the drive wheel which has a lip it is rubbing on the back of the case. Looks like this happened before from the groove cut. The bearings are solid and held to the case with a bolt. Any ideas what is wrong? Parts schematic does not show spacing washers nor does the machine look like it ever had any. It looks like I could shim the plate holding to case, below the bearing, or under bolts holding wheel to gear wheel. Not sure if that is what is acceptable as I never had an old machine like this before. Yes I adjusted the tip adjustment on the wheel and no help.

Sent from my iPhone using The Garage Journal mobile app

Are these supposed to have the rubber tires for the blades to ride on like the vertical models I see have?

akasrick

 

[Speedbird]

#1-Turn the blade over
A wider blade may or may not work because of the guide rollers. Too much exposed below the guides will cause the blade to tilt along with other issues.


^ ^ No. Metal band saws do not have rubber tires.

 

[akasrick]

#1-Turn the blade over
A wider blade may or may not work because of the guide rollers. Too much exposed below the guides will cause the blade to tilt along with other issues.


^ ^ No. Metal band saws do not have rubber tires.

I wouldn't know.

https://www.grizzly.com/metalworking-bandsaws?msclkid=3425482bd637196584e816437c4d8c36&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=%5BADL%5D%20%5BNonBrand%5D%20%5BUS%5D%20Manufacturer%20-%20(Exact)&utm_term=vertical%20band%20saw%20metal&utm_content=Metals%20-%20Bandsaw%20-%20Vertical&adlclid=ADL-095fd6f9-6af8-440a-8fbe-ff3f5655fafd

https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-18-2-HP-Variable-Speed-Vertical-Metal-Cutting-Bandsaw/G0807

https://cdn0.grizzly.com/partslists/g0807_pl.pdf

akasrick

 

[Mohawk Dave]

SNIP...

^ ^ No. Metal band saws do not have rubber tires.

My Leten has tires....and it's a 1" capacity metal bandsaw,,


OP, doesn't that plate the the wheel is bolted to have the set screws to push the plate and wheel away from the housing, and then the nuts and bolts tighten it down after you adjust it? Or is that what you meant by the "tip adjustment"? My saw has adjustments like that...

 

[gungatim]

LGR!

 

[Kaizen]

Thanks for the responses. Let me clarify a few things.
The allen screws were tried but only affects tracking. It won't raise wheel off of case.
This saw does not use rubber tires. The wheels have an indent that the blade runs in.
The narrower blade i just took off worked fine.
The correct wider blade i'm putting on rubs on the case when in the wheel indent. I did not run it like this. Someone previously had an issue and evidently just got a narrower blade instead of fixing the problem. You can see that in picture 2 which is just to show the groove cut in the case by previous person. Picture 3 shows the blade in the correct position on the wheel and touching the case.
In other words something happened to make the entire wheel assembly move closer to the case. The bearing bottom appears to be also indented a few thousandths into the metal plate. Like it froze and was run and ground out the base plate.
So can i just put some washers under the previously mentioned bolts and move the wheel off the case? Is this a definite no go or is there one place that is better to put them? figured i'd start under the bearing with one and see how that raises it.
Once off the case i have to then mess with the allen screws to get tracking right and the roller bearing gaurds. right now they are just in place to mock this up.
This blade tracks so it just kisses that lip on the wheel like in picture 3. It does not run in the middle like my wood bandsaw.

 

[Kaizen]

My Leten has tires....and it's a 1" capacity metal bandsaw,,


OP, doesn't that plate the the wheel is bolted to have the set screws to push the plate and wheel away from the housing, and then the nuts and bolts tighten it down after you adjust it? Or is that what you meant by the "tip adjustment"? My saw has adjustments like that...

correct. the two screws are only on one side so does not raise off the case unilaterally. I'll have to reset those to zero and get the clearance fixed first.

 

[Kaizen]

#1-Turn the blade over
A wider blade may or may not work because of the guide rollers. Too much exposed below the guides will cause the blade to tilt along with other issues.


^ ^ No. Metal band saws do not have rubber tires.

Really trying to get this new blade working as its the correct size that came on the saw. I'll have to revisit the guide rollers after i get it moving and tracking to see what is exposed.

 

[Speedbird]

What scored the case? The blade or the wheel? What is the HF part number for your saw?

 

[MJD1]

I have that same saw. A 5/8" blade is optional but requires different components to be used. I would say the blade was previously ran when it wasn't tracking correctly. Another thing is they may have tried the 5/8" blade. If the teeth were severally worn on one side, causing a real crooked cut, it could pull itself away from the lip on the drive wheel causing it to cut like that. Keeping your guides set as close as practical is the best method to prevent that from happening again.

 

[Kaizen]

What scored the case? The blade or the wheel? What is the HF part number for your saw?

looks like a blade did. again this was not right now. i did not run it with the new blade yet due to this issue.
Its a WF and Sons Model a-7 bandsaw. serial 828121. Not harbor freight.

 

[Kaizen]

I have that same saw. A 5/8" blade is optional but requires different components to be used. I would say the blade was previously ran when it wasn't tracking correctly. Another thing is they may have tried the 5/8" blade. If the teeth were severally worn on one side, causing a real crooked cut, it could pull itself away from the lip on the drive wheel causing it to cut like that. Keeping your guides set as close as practical is the best method to prevent that from happening again.

sawblades.com is who i bought this new one from. they have a tool that shows this 3/4 inch blade is the right one. The previous one that was not hitting was not as thick. I can't find anything in the manual stating a 3/4 can or cannot be used.
Item: 601 - Q601 M42 Bimetal Bandsaw Blade 0.750 (0.035) x 6-10
Qty: 1
Length: 7' 11 "

 

[SGKent]

The allen screws were tried but only affects tracking. It won't raise wheel off of case.

WF and Sons Model a-7 bandsaw. serial 828121.

I am having problems putting your statement with the photos. To me it looks like the drive wheel is closer to the frame at the top and farther out at the bottom, like negative camber on a tire. But, your statement implies to me the equal of a tire rubbing on a fender well although the photos show something different. In the photos, the wheel appears to me to need to come in towards the case at the bottom.

That said, here is what appears to be a pictorial of that saw as you described the model number. It is old (1960's to 1970's, perhaps as late as 1982) from what the articles say about it. In this drawing someone has written part numbers for 1/2" drive wheel and idler, and 3/4" drive wheel and idler. http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2214/3646.pdf

There is also a thread here from 2009 on how and who to contact at the manufacturer regarding tuning it. https://www.practicalmachinist.com/...wells-model-7-bandsaw-operator-manual-186229/

Google is your friend for questions like this on old equipment.

 

[gungatim]

LGR!

 

[MJD1]

sawblades.com is who i bought this new one from. they have a tool that shows this 3/4 inch blade is the right one. The previous one that was not hitting was not as thick. I can't find anything in the manual stating a 3/4 can or cannot be used.
Item: 601 - Q601 M42 Bimetal Bandsaw Blade 0.750 (0.035) x 6-10
Qty: 1
Length: 7' 11 "

1/2" blade standard, 5/8" optional. I would say sawblades.com has misinformed you. The newer A-7 saw uses a 3/4" blade, possibly where the misinformation came from.

 

[Kaizen]

ah hell. just double checked on that sawblades.com blade picker and now it says 5/8th. Maybe i was putting in wrong model somehow??seems pretty idiot proof but i proved that wrong.
They list this......
We recommend for a WF Wells A-7 a blade size as follows:

Width 5/8" (0.625)
Length 7' 11" (95.0")

Sorry for wasting your time everyone. They give this and then allowed me to choose and i had 3/4 stuck in my head as i ordered 2 nonreturnable blades. Sorry again

 

[MJD1]

The newer model is an AC-7. In order to use the 5/8" blade, an 1/8" needs to be machined of the drive wheel flange and either new guide blocks or an 1/8" added to one side and an 1)8" milled on the other side of the guide blocks