Basement shop questions

[Ohmthis]

My wife and I are building a new house and it looks like I won't be getting a detached shop during the build. We looked at homes to buy and one had a 19x50 shop in the basement. The house will have a three car attached garage. This is the temporary (hopefully not too long) route we will be taking. I plan to fabricate, weld, auto body work, wood working, general mechanics, some painting/staining, and other debatchery. My questions to you guy are:
1) How would you seal off the shop from smells, smoke, noise (completely is impossible, but knock it down)?
2) How do I plan the shop to where it is easily converted back to regular household duty? Remember it will have a garage door.
3) Will this potentially void any type of insurance? I've already been through a major house fire in the last couple of years.
Add any thoughts you guys/gals may have on the situation.

 

[d.mcfarland]

Questions 1 and 2 contradict each other basically. And unfortunately anything you do nowadays will piss off the insurance company.

 

[Ohmthis]

I respectfully disagree with you. If thought out before hand, you could fairly easily convert the space back to another purpose without having to totally redo.

 

[jimreed2160]

My wife and I purchased a 3700 sq foot house so we could look after her mom. We lived upstairs and mom had the 1200 sq ft daylight (on three sides) basement. Big house--no shop. Fast forward a few years and mom is not there so the basement became mine. But it was carpeted. I rolled up the carpet in the dining room, covered the roll with heavy mil plastic, and tacked up paneling over the double door opening. My woodshop inhabited that room--RAS, lathe, bandsaw, DP. My workbench was in the adjoining kitchen, which was also used for sharpening and tools. I built a lumber rack from 2x4s in the bedroom. I confined my grinding to the small room outside the furnace room.

Fast forward a few years to the move out. I cleaned everything up. Hired a carpet crew to roll out carpet and pad. It looked brand new. There was lots of light sawdust around but most stuff was contained in the converted dining room. The only signs of my shop work were bits of steel melted into the outer furnace room carpet.

Message is to do anything you want to do. With care and cleaning you can easily wipe out most traces of your activity.

 

[GMCGarage]

My wife and I are building a new house and it looks like I won't be getting a detached shop during the build. We looked at homes to buy and one had a 19x50 shop in the basement. The house will have a three car attached garage. This is the temporary (hopefully not too long) route we will be taking. I plan to fabricate, weld, auto body work, wood working, general mechanics, some painting/staining, and other debatchery. My questions to you guy are:
1) How would you seal off the shop from smells, smoke, noise (completely is impossible, but knock it down)?

2) How do I plan the shop to where it is easily converted back to regular household duty? Remember it will have a garage door.
3) Will this potentially void any type of insurance? I've already been through a major house fire in the last couple of years.
Add any thoughts you guys/gals may have on the situation.

Im confused, is this a basement shop, or a garage shop, or a basement shop with a walk out??

 

[flushcut]

I would not be welding in the basement and yes it will void every insurance policy written. And if you can find one it will cost you.
Big *** fan for smells/ventilation.

 

[driftpin]

I think your separation of the HVAC system from the shop area would go a long way to keeping the dust, smell, and whatever out of the living quarters. Good sealing around and under doors should help. Using some type of cross-flow ventilation should help.

Using your home as a body shop is not what your insurance co. is expecting to insure, you better read your policy before setting this type of operation in-place. 'Hot-work,' i.e., welding of any type, or oxy-acetylene torch use is probably prohibited in your policy. Also, you should check your HOA covenants if you are building in such an area. Plus, your local zoning code probably prohibits the nature of what you're trying to do, and once you're on their radar, if you continue to operate, your days of happiness as a homeowner shop operator just ended. All it takes is a neighbor or someone complaining to city hall.

 

[bczygan]

I prefer an attached shop for a variety of reasons.

But being relegated to the basement is not acceptable.

It sounds like your variety of activities are central to your life, and should be treated as such.

An attached shop can use bathroom, eating, entertainment and cleanup facilities in the house, eliminating the need to provide them in the shop.

A basement to me, is for utilities and storage.

So design your house with three main areas, sleeping wing, central core and shop wing.

All three should be open and airy and full of light with views and openings to the surrounding landscape. They are all living spaces, so make them all inviting, No closed in industrial cells.

Bill

 

[wasfuzz]

Not to be a Debbie Downer but, you said you went thru a fire recently, do you really want to store the types of flammables all of the activities you listed in your dwelling? Now do you think your insurance company is going to be onboard with that either?

 

[jimgood]

I'm working out of a basement shop. I really don't like it but it's all I have for now. The only way I have for controlling fumes, dust, noise is to take it outside. I have an apron about 10 x 12 feet that extends out from the garage door. I do most of my grinding an cutting operations out there. Otherwise, I pick times to work when it won't disturb my wife upstairs. Sometimes, like in the dead of winter or when it's raining have no real choice if I want to get **** done.

 

[bczygan]

What is the layout of your lot?

Photos?

 

[driftpin]

If you lived in the country, I think that advice makes sense. In an urban neighborhood, I think you need to have a blockhouse style to keep prying eyes and thieves at bay.

I have a new space of a two-car garage, nothing elaborate, but it's windowless, well-insulated, including the OH doors. It's designed to be as secure as possible, alarmed and break-in resistant. As the saying goes, locks keep an honest man honest and delay the thieves. I have plenty of 'daylight' (5000K) lighting, which helps avoid the 'bunker' interior. No windows and plenty of insulation also helps keep-down noise from my work, from the rest of the house and from the neighbors. It's Florida, the cars can live outside, the garage is for my work.

You live in the Detroit area. I used to visit a friend who lived in Detroit proper, about 3rd and Warren. He had a good-sized 2-story house, separate garage in-back, and a full basement. They couldn't sleep with the windows open because the crack addicts would try to break in any open window. It was pretty-grim, but they were starting out, and that was what they could afford at the time while they saved their $, and eventually bought land in Oxford township, where they built a custom home on a lake. Phase II was an attached 2 story garage.

Yes, it would be great to have a multiple acre spread, but if you have to be in a closer setting, I think being as anonymous as-possible and having no way to easily see what's going on inside is the practical solution, and a way to keep what's yours, yours.

I prefer an attached shop for a variety of reasons.

But being relegated to the basement is not acceptable.

It sounds like your variety of activities are central to your life, and should be treated as such.

An attached shop can use bathroom, eating, entertainment and cleanup facilities in the house, eliminating the need to provide them in the shop.

A basement to me, is for utilities and storage.

So design your house with three main areas, sleeping wing, central core and shop wing.

All three should be open and airy and full of light with views and openings to the surrounding landscape. They are all living spaces, so make them all inviting, No closed in industrial cells.

Bill

 

[Showkey]

I have moved and purchased insurance several times in the last five years. The last two homes had wood shops in the basement and separate outbuilding shops for auto and motorcycle restoration and storage.

I was asked every time and extensively on heating sources specifically about any wood or sold fuel heaters any where on the property. Nobody ever asked about my hobbies or welding or metal work or wood working.

I do get if your running a business or it looks like running a business out of your home or garages .........that will raise all sorts of red flags with insurance.

 

[bczygan]

If you lived in the country, I think that advice makes sense. In an urban neighborhood, I think you need to have a blockhouse style to keep prying eyes and thieves at bay.

I have a new space of a two-car garage, nothing elaborate, but it's windowless, well-insulated, including the OH doors. It's designed to be as secure as possible, alarmed and break-in resistant. As the saying goes, locks keep an honest man honest and delay the thieves. I have plenty of 'daylight' (5000K) lighting, which helps avoid the 'bunker' interior. No windows and plenty of insulation also helps keep-down noise from my work, from the rest of the house and from the neighbors. It's Florida, the cars can live outside, the garage is for my work.

You live in the Detroit area. I used to visit a friend who lived in Detroit proper, about 3rd and Warren. He had a good-sized 2-story house, separate garage in-back, and a full basement. They couldn't sleep with the windows open because the crack addicts would try to break in any open window. It was pretty-grim, but they were starting out, and that was what they could afford at the time while they saved their $, and eventually bought land in Oxford township, where they built a custom home on a lake. Phase II was an attached 2 story garage.

Yes, it would be great to have a multiple acre spread, but if you have to be in a closer setting, I think being as anonymous as-possible and having no way to easily see what's going on inside is the practical solution, and a way to keep what's yours, yours.

I maintain that there are ways, on most every lot, to create open and airy work spaces while still maintaining strong security.

It's a matter of good design.

By suggesting this, I am trying to counter the blockhouse, industrial building mentality that most of the shops on this forum seem to follow.

I would want my leisure activity to feel more like a vacation. Working in some of these buildings with little or no windows and industrial colors and finishes, would be like working in a factory or commercial shop.

Not pleasant.

So in a case like this one, I recommend again, that the owner consider making the hobby areas more pleasant and integral with the other living spaces. Certainly do not relegate them to the basement with the utilities.

Bill

 

[bczygan]

Here's an example.
Would you put a sliding glass door in a bathroom? And put it in an outside wall, so the person sitting on the toilet could see outside?

My parents did. And it was done so that person could enjoy a beautiful garden, full of plants, and the bathroom would be awash with light in the daytime, and stars above could bee seen at night.

And this on a small lot in a development, with the neighbors house feet away.

A simple screen wall kept prying eyes away and people out.

Bill

 

[driftpin]

All it takes is one complaining neighbor or community busybody to put you onto the radar of the local government enforcers, and your life is gonna change, and not for the better.

One of my friends is a retired Ford line mechanic, he's been a biker as-long as I've known him (42 years), through one of my former co-workers, the co-worker is now deceased. They were all H-D bikers. I wasn't, I liked the performance of an inline-4. So my friend from work always complained about my "Yama-suki" or "Kawa-hama" or whatever, being in the apparatus bay, "where only American bikes should be."

So this guy retired when the Ford dealership he worked for was bought by a bigger chain, and that branch was closed-down, they've never gotten another tenant for the entire space, and it's a prime arterial route. Anyway, the retired mechanic had a separate two car garage, and a big lot (for a city lot) and he began doing Harley's which he had already been doing for a small number of friends. He avoided the local municipal code enforcement because he worked on the city police department's members' personal Harleys, and they wanted to get their bikes done. You can read between the lines.

Peeping toms and other people like drug-addled voyeurs I wouldn't want hanging-around my sliding glass bathroom doors waiting for a show. Yeah, I know, dogs and guns, I'd just rather avoid the drama. Our master 'en-suite' bedroom does have a large window, but it's impact-rated and obscure glass, and the impact french-light doors onto the pool deck have shades. The next-door neighbor is about 80 ft away and we're waiting on the landscaping to grow to provide a natural shield.

I agree with you, open and airy is great, but my desire for security is greater than the aesthetic consideration.

 

[matt_i]

I think you have to drywall thoroughly, walls and ceiling, I would investigate Type C, keep combustion intake air separate from gas fueled vehicles' parking, and throw out (sell you know) all welders except for a tig welder.

 

[firebirdparts]

You want it airtight, obviously, and that is pretty easy to do if you can see what you are dealing with. A lot will depend on the stairs. If you use a fan to create a vacuum on the basement then that should take care of the stairs.

For making things airtight I think sheetrock works fine, but sealing it for instance to block will require you to put something liquid in there, caulk or expanding foam. insulation boards will also work and they're a lot easier to work with than sheetrock, but harder to tape joints on.

It's certainly true that you could set fire to something welding and, considering you're right there in the middle of the fire, you could somehow fail to put it out. So if I were you I'd have a plan to succeed. You could also burn your house down with a trash can full of oily rags when you're not there. Again, I would just not do that.

 

[TractorJeff]

I've seen houses where there is a garage space in the bottom. Minor repair and maintenance work always got performed in them. Doing an off frame restoration? Probably not as that would be smelly and messy.
OP didn't specify welding as near I as I could tell? Lots of guys before most of you were born had woodshops in the basement/cellar as garages were for, Well? CARS!

 

[Ohmthis]

Thanks for the input guys. I'll add a little info that might make things easier to understand why I taking this route. We had (built) a 4000 sqft 4 year old house with 5 acres and a 30x40 pole barn on it. For several reasons we decided to sell. We've looked for several months for another place, we finally decided building again would give us what we need/want. In the time period that we moved my son was diagnosed with a non life threatening, but life altering issue. He needs to go to a special school at 20,000k a year (he's in the second grade and this will cost maybe 200,000 before he's done). So when we saw the place with the shop in the basement light bulbs went off. The house will have a 3 car garage that my larger roll around and mechanics tools will be. I need a space to store and use things like welders, plasma cutter, torches, welding table, band saw, 2 drill presses, table saw, large miter saw, router table, 80 gal compressor, and storage for plumbing, electrical, hvac, and carpentry tools. This is a private shop and the plan has been ok'd by the developer. The area is 14 x 45, mostly below grade and will have a garage door to the outside. I plan it's own ventilation and hvac. I hope this may help out with more input. If you have anymore questions please ask. Thanks again.