Basement water issue

[tskills10]

I realize this isn't garage related but this is the best place for information I know of.
So for the problem.
A couple of years ago I had some waterproofing done on my basement along with 26 feet of wall replaced. Two weeks after signing job complete my basement flooded during a big storm. I couldn't find any thing that indicated it was the contractors fault, even though I wanted to blame him. I believe the water just came into the sump too fast and over ran the pump. This has happened one other time since then and almost happened last night. I was lucky enough to have just gotten home and went to check the pump to find It was filling up faster than the pump could work. Lucky for my packrat abilities. I kept my old pump, that was 6 months old, and had bought some hose to use for empting the pool. I dropped the extra pump into the sump crock and the hose into a floor drain. I managed to keep the water from overflowing while the storm passed us.

The solution??
I'm trying to think of a way to prevent this from being an issue again. The sump pump is less than a old. It is a battery back up dual pump system. I was thinking maybe I could cap the 4 inch inlet pipe and restrict the flow a bit. I've also thought about digging a second crock with pump and having the primary overflow into the second crock and having it just discharge into the yard.

Anybody with any feedback on this situation and these solutions would be appreciated.

 

[Hornman]

Some questions: 1) that floor drain you used, where does it drain to, sanitary sewer? 2) where is the water coming from, downspouts close to house? 3) are there any codes in your area that constrain you from pumping the water into your yard? From what I remember of Painsville, it is pretty hilly, so you should use that to your benefit to keep water away from the house. If you minimize the amount of water getting in, that will minimize the amount of water you have to pump. Short term I would leave the second pump hooked up and maybe add a second sump to handle the pumping chores until you get a handle on the whole water management picture.

 

[The Cobbler]

add a second pump higher than the main one so it kicks in when this happens.
Also use good quality submersible with higher output

 

[Kevin54]

Where is the inlet pipe originating from? By that I mean....do you have something like a walk out basement that you have to keep the area drained around the entrance way?

Is there room in the sump pit to put in a secondary pump and tie into the outlet?

If you restrict the water coming in, will you get into trouble with the water backing up at the origination point since it won't drain as fast?

Is it possible to get a larger sump pump that will pump more GPM's that your current pump?

Lastly, if per chance things do flood in the basement, will it damage anything, as in the basement being finished off?

And I was also going to mention about having a secondary pit, or if you can't fit two pumps in one pit, enlarge the pit to be able to accept two pumps.

And I'm not certain, and you may want to look into this with your insurance company, but if you are not in a flood plain, and your sump pump fails, I'm not so sure insurance will pay for damages if you don't have flood insurance. It sort of a gray area. I know of a couple incidents where the insurance company didn't pay for repairs when a pit backed up and flooded the basement, but another was paid on when the city was cleaning out the main sewers and blew a lot of waste back into peoples basements.

Good Luck, and let us all in on what you decide.

 

[tskills10]

Some questions: 1) that floor drain you used, where does it drain to, sanitary sewer? 2) where is the water coming from, downspouts close to house? 3) are there any codes in your area that constrain you from pumping the water into your yard? From what I remember of Painsville, it is pretty hilly, so you should use that to your benefit to keep water away from the house. If you minimize the amount of water getting in, that will minimize the amount of water you have to pump. Short term I would leave the second pump hooked up and maybe add a second sump to handle the pumping chores until you get a handle on the whole water management picture.

1. unsure of where the drain goes to, could very well go into the sanitary system.
2. There are three down spouts that do feed into the sump system.
3. not sure about any codes.
Where I'm at in the township is fairly flat. No real hill to run the water down. Things changed when they did the waterproofing since they backfilled with mostly stone. It allows the water to run into the system at a much fast rate of flow. And there in a 4 inch inlet pipe with a 1.5 inch pipe from the pump.

add a second pump higher than the main one so it kicks in when this happens.
Also use good quality submersible with higher output

That is basically what I did last night. I would need to make a more permanent setup than what I did last night.

Where is the inlet pipe originating from? By that I mean....do you have something like a walk out basement that you have to keep the area drained around the entrance way?

Is there room in the sump pit to put in a secondary pump and tie into the outlet?

If you restrict the water coming in, will you get into trouble with the water backing up at the origination point since it won't drain as fast?

Is it possible to get a larger sump pump that will pump more GPM's that your current pump?

Lastly, if per chance things do flood in the basement, will it damage anything, as in the basement being finished off?

And I was also going to mention about having a secondary pit, or if you can't fit two pumps in one pit, enlarge the pit to be able to accept two pumps.

And I'm not certain, and you may want to look into this with your insurance company, but if you are not in a flood plain, and your sump pump fails, I'm not so sure insurance will pay for damages if you don't have flood insurance. It sort of a gray area. I know of a couple incidents where the insurance company didn't pay for repairs when a pit backed up and flooded the basement, but another was paid on when the city was cleaning out the main sewers and blew a lot of waste back into peoples basements.

Good Luck, and let us all in on what you decide.

Hey There Kevin, hope you guys had a good time at Canfield, sorry I missed it.

No walk-out basement to keep cleared out. I tried to fit the two pumps in the crock last night and it was a no-go. I can rig something up and have the second pump on top of the main. But I'll need to work up a plan for where it pumps to. About once a year we get these big storms that just blow everything out. I'm thinking of just capping the inlet pipe with a few holes in the cap to reduce the flow. But not sure what this will do on the other end.
As for damage. That is fairly minimal. The basement is partially finish, but I am looking to finish it as a rec room. Well gotta go for now, thanks guys.

 

[mtmgtz]

2. There are three down spouts that do feed into the sump system.

Your downspouts should never feed into your foundation drainage system!! If you don't want them to dump on the surface, they should be tied together in their own drain tile system, definitely not into your sump pump pit. That is why your sump pit is filling faster than the pump can get rid of it.

 

[GTO]

OMG,leaders running into the sump system,I think your contractor f*cked that job up,

I think post #6 sums it up.

 

[Kevin54]

Your downspouts should never feed into your foundation drainage system!! If you don't want them to dump on the surface, they should be tied together in their own drain tile system, definitely not into your sump pump pit. That is why your sump pit is filling faster than the pump can get rid of it.

^^^^THIS^^^^

THat's a lot of water feeding into a sump system. THere are various ways to drain the downs from the house. One is through PVC buried in the ground. Not the cheap corrugated stuff, but like the schedule 40 pipe. My wifes building is tied into drain pipes and run out to a box in the middle of the backyard that has a grate on it.

Or you can get drop down gutter that hooks onto the downs. Flip them down and leave them as they will take the water a few feet away from the house, then flip them up when you have to mow.

Another way is to put the automatic rolling downs on. These hook to the bottom of your downs, and will roll out when it rains, then they roll theirself back up when done.

Or just put some long downs on that takes the water away from the house.

But you do not want your downs hooked to your sump pump. If when you had your basement backfilled, and they tiled at the bottom, that should be the only thing tied into a sump pump. If you disconnect the downs from the sump pump, you probably won't have any problems at all.

Our downs were tied into corrugated pipe. Over the years they slowly filled up with dirt and debris. They used to empty into the pond, when we had the pond. At times, we would have water shooting up three foot into the air where the downs connected to the pipes. We did away with the pond, and just added long extensions to get the water away from the house. We have sidewalk all the way around the house though, so the end of the downpipe lays right on the sidewalk. And with that, there is no need to take them off to mow.

We had a good time at Canfield. We missed you as I thought you were going to be there. Maybe we'll all hook up in the Fall meet. I may have to take momma's ride the next time though. That POS Dodge Ram only gets 12mpg when going downhill with a tailwind. So with 400 miles round trip, I'm looking at over a hundred in gas up and back. Then there was the extra 10 miles or so trying to find a restaurant, that Larry mentioned but didn't know where it was at.

It was fun though, and great to see friends together

 

[p_mori7]

2. There are three down spouts that do feed into the sump system.

There's your problem right there !

Cut those downspouts shorter, and add elbows. Then arrange for the water coming off the roof to be directed away from the foundation.

If possible, downhill to the street. City storm sewer are made to handle that kind of flow volume...and it probably where you are trying to send it via the sump pump.

 

[ratdoggy]

I realize this isn't garage related but this is the best place for information I know of.
So for the problem.
A couple of years ago I had some waterproofing done on my basement along with 26 feet of wall replaced. Two weeks after signing job complete my basement flooded during a big storm. I couldn't find any thing that indicated it was the contractors fault, even though I wanted to blame him. I believe the water just came into the sump too fast and over ran the pump. This has happened one other time since then and almost happened last night. I was lucky enough to have just gotten home and went to check the pump to find It was filling up faster than the pump could work. Lucky for my packrat abilities. I kept my old pump, that was 6 months old, and had bought some hose to use for empting the pool. I dropped the extra pump into the sump crock and the hose into a floor drain. I managed to keep the water from overflowing while the storm passed us.

The solution??
I'm trying to think of a way to prevent this from being an issue again. The sump pump is less than a old. It is a battery back up dual pump system. I was thinking maybe I could cap the 4 inch inlet pipe and restrict the flow a bit. I've also thought about digging a second crock with pump and having the primary overflow into the second crock and having it just discharge into the yard.

Anybody with any feedback on this situation and these solutions would be appreciated.

I have 2 diagonally opposite in my basement. One has the back up and one doesn't. Mine discharge into my gutter pipes and then into a creek behind my house. I can't see anything wrong with pumping it out on the ground as long as you have some slope. Mine pump into the gutter piping not the other way around.

 

[ratdoggy]

We had a good time at Canfield. We missed you as I thought you were going to be there. Maybe we'll all hook up in the Fall meet. I may have to take momma's ride the next time though. That POS Dodge Ram only gets 12mpg when going downhill with a tailwind. So with 400 miles round trip, I'm looking at over a hundred in gas up and back. Then there was the extra 10 miles or so trying to find a restaurant, that Larry mentioned but didn't know where it was at.

It was fun though, and great to see friends together

Yep.....Sorry you didn't make it....

 

[tskills10]

Looks like a call to the contractor is in order. I can't be sure that the downspouts flow into the sump, I just assumed that they did. Hopefully that isn't the case. Maybe I could run a hose down the downspout right by the sump and see if it runs into the crock. That should tell me if they really do run into the sump crock. Then I can figure out how to fix it from there. We'll see how this goes. Thank guys for your input.


Kevin, Ratdog, keep me in mind for any other get togethers. If I can make it I will. I had a good time at the spring meet.

 

[Kevin54]

Looks like a call to the contractor is in order. I can't be sure that the downspouts flow into the sump, I just assumed that they did. Hopefully that isn't the case. Maybe I could run a hose down the downspout right by the sump and see if it runs into the crock. That should tell me if they really do run into the sump crock. Then I can figure out how to fix it from there. We'll see how this goes. Thank guys for your input.


Kevin, Ratdog, keep me in mind for any other get togethers. If I can make it I will. I had a good time at the spring meet.

I think the next one is in September, mid month possibly? I may try to make it back up that way, if just to see everyone again. And if that doesn't happen, maybe we just all need to have a get together for a day at some in between place for a day.

 

[rburke65]

The next swap at Canfield is Sept. 12, 13, 14. I went back Sunday and it was DEAD. Hardly anyone there and the 'sellers' were packing up early it seemed. It was great meeting all you guys.

 

[tskills10]

I think the next one is in September, mid month possibly? I may try to make it back up that way, if just to see everyone again. And if that doesn't happen, maybe we just all need to have a get together for a day at some in between place for a day.

Yea, I'll be working that weekend. So I'm out. I know there is a meet in Canton in November I might be able to make.

 

[jimindm]

And I'm not certain, and you may want to look into this with your insurance company, but if you are not in a flood plain, and your sump pump fails, I'm not so sure insurance will pay for damages if you don't have flood insurance. It sort of a gray area. I know of a couple incidents where the insurance company didn't pay for repairs when a pit backed up and flooded the basement, but another was paid on when the city was cleaning out the main sewers and blew a lot of waste back into peoples basements.

Good Luck, and let us all in on what you decide.

Any one can buy flood insurance, and the cost reflects were your location. Usually for flood insurance to kick in several of the same kind of flood events need to happen close.

Most all insurance companies offer some kind of protection against what the OP has got. We have sump failure and sewer back up insurance. It has paid twice. Both times in sump pump issues.

The first time was a pump failure that amounted to some water crawling across the carpet, before I could get the pool pump in the pit.

the second time was in the flood of 08. I had five pumps running, not cycling, when the river crested. I think it was when three pumps could not keep up and I was late getting the fourth in the pit.

The first time it was a $5K policy that had a $1k deductible. It cost something like $35 a year. We collected the whole thing. The second time it was a $10k policy, with $1k deductible. That was like $50-60 a year. We collected on it.

The adjuster showed up, the day the river crested, about the time the fifth pump started not shutting off. He took his pictures, shook my hand, and said two things. I am praying for you and when this is over just come get the check. What is weird, they would not pay the cost of any of the pumps, only the cost of the damage. Although the adjuster took the pictures to show what we were doing to keep the loss at a minimum. I know that came from a bean counter above him, but he gave me some great ideas to collect the whole policy amount. Which I did.

 

[Reg1952]

What if you dumped some food colouring in the down spouts outside and see if the water at the pump turns that colour.

 

[PT Doc]

I was wondering how a sump pump could not keep up with rain. Then read that that gutters are draining. So all the square footage of the roofs and the natural weeping is going to one location. How is that even remotely logical? I have never seen that and I hope I never do. This should be a good lesson for all.