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Bearded respirator?

barrysuperhawk

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I have a goatee, and need a respirator. What I'd love to have is one that was good for everything from painting and Welding Vapors to mold and dust. I found the resp-po-rator on Amazon and then a bunch of videos about it on YouTube of all the modifications people made, fixing everything from a spit cup to being able to use different filters.
Given the amount of modifications that this product seems to need for my uses, I figured I'd ask if there was something better out there for us bearded folks before I jump on this train.
 
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SGKent

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shave your beard down just a little from under your nose to create room for the mask to seal. Or shave it off like firefighters and military do. I used to wear a mask and dive with a beard. You only need a little tiny shave under the nose area - no one will notice.
 

u2slow

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Pick a respirator with larger coverage, and trim your goatee back till you have a seal.

I get away with a 'frank zappa' setup at work because it doesn't interfere with the seal. That's half-mask (working with airborne contaminants) or full mask w/ positive-pressure (fire-fighting).

The chin area is the main thing, and sideburns that come too far forward.
 

bdk1976

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Shave the prison p*ssy if you want a perfect seal. I don’t have to wear a respirator often, but when I do I always shave that morning so I get a good seal.
 

PelicanPines

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I have a full goat at zztop length. I have no issues getting a half mask to seal. It has particle cans... I also have an organic vapor full face... but have not needed it in years. It sealed fine back when.

I do love the link OP. Will consider it in the future.
 

jmarkwolf

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Shave the prison p*ssy if you want a perfect seal. I don’t have to wear a respirator often, but when I do I always shave that morning so I get a good seal.

LOL!

They say the reason Hitler wore a little square moustache is because the handlebar moustache he sported in World War One nearly killed him when his gas mask wouldn't seal against his handlebar in a gas attack.

There. A little Sunday morning history on GJ! :)
 

brianh

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I have been using the resp-po-rator for years just keep in mind it is for dust not fumes I work with wood and it is very convenient.

You could modify the filter mount for vapor filters, what I like about it is no fogging of glasses and once you get used to it in your mouth it is more comfortable than anything else I have used.
 

NUTTSGT

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You need a good seal for it to work properly.


Even with positive pressure face pieces for our SCBAs, it'll have issues. While the positive pressure should keep stuff from coming in the mask area, you'll still go through more air then a the next guy as you done nothing more than create an air leak.
 

Yankeefarmer

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We were always told that a good seal could not be assured with facial hair. I use a Turbine Products Breathe Cool system with a sandblast hood and a tyvek painting hood. Bought it 10 years ago after being diagnosed with asthma in my mid-50’s. It wasn’t cheap, but replacement lungs are a lot more expensive.
 

crewchief888

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FWIW,

there are times when i'm on service calls, when the customer's safety people have rules regarding respirator fitment.

foundry's, steel mills, refineries, ect.

no long mustaches or goatee's
any facial hair in the respirator's sealing area cant be more than 1 days growth

yea, there are places i'm NOT allowed to be working.


:beer:
 

Two Speed

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I have a 3m mask (now discontinued) that fits snugly around my facial hair. If you pass the breathing test (plugging the intake/exhaust) its sealed.
This anti-facial hair crusade is a royal pain. Its so bad they refuse to fit me at work for a new mask because I refuse to shave. Hey, the last mask you fitted me for before the no facial hair b.s. came to be fit just fine around the hair and passed the intake/exhaust test, so stuff your anti-facial hair rules.
 

rlitman

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LOL!

They say the reason Hitler wore a little square moustache is because the handlebar moustache he sported in World War One nearly killed him when his gas mask wouldn't seal against his handlebar in a gas attack.

There. A little Sunday morning history on GJ! :)

Almost. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/1550768/Hitler-was-ordered-to-trim-his-moustache.html

He, along with everyone on the front with mustaches was ordered to trim it to fit the issued masks. Even so, the mask didn't end up preventing him from being temporarily blinded, leading to a life-long fear of chemical weapons.

The problem with the above account is that a photograph from 1919 shows him with a wider mustache, though still narrower than the "Kaiser" he wore before the war that would have interfered with a mask.

An equally likely guess is that as a Charlie Chaplin fan, Hitler was copying the style from the silent films starting from about 1914. In any case, it was a popular style of the day in the US, and was carried over to Europe because of our involvement in the Great War, so it could just as well have been "stylish", and nothing more.
 

SGKent

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Funniest part of this thread is that in 5 years guys will laugh at men with beards and say what an old dude. I'm close to 70, had a full beard most of my life until about 5 years ago, and can't tell you how many times they came in, and went out of style. Like I said, if you trim 1/16th of an inch under your nose most masks will seal perfectly.
 

u2slow

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Like I said, if you trim 1/16th of an inch under your nose most masks will seal perfectly.

Any half-mask I've used seals over the nose :headscrat

Expertise-Content-Thumbnail-Image116-rgb.jpg
 

like2wheel

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You need a good seal for it to work properly.


Even with positive pressure face pieces for our SCBAs, it'll have issues. While the positive pressure should keep stuff from coming in the mask area, you'll still go through more air then a the next guy as you done nothing more than create an air leak.

Don't see why that should be an issue.
Safe to say no one is using a bottle to breathe in a shop. Any supplied air turbine or compressor should easily provide more air than consumed.
 

e36jon

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I bought a PAPR system when I bought my house, knowing that I would have plenty of mold, asbestos, and lead paint to deal with, and I didn't want to shave my beard. I got a nice safety-shield for my eyes in the bargain... It wasn't cheap but it has proven it's worth plenty over the years.

When I was researching my PAPR purchase I stumbled across a clever fellow that had made a snorkel based filter that he could use for the short amounts of time he needed it. No straps or seals, just grip it in your mouth and go...
 
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NUTTSGT

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Don't see why that should be an issue.
Safe to say no one is using a bottle to breathe in a shop. Any supplied air turbine or compressor should easily provide more air than consumed.

Some places will have incipient fire brigades and they wear SCBAs.



The mask, respirator or what have you needs a tight seal to work properly.
 

kaiser715

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I, too, have the beard problem.

I went with a supplied air system, mfg by Allegro.

https://www.zoro.com/allegro-supplied-air-pump-package-1-ppl-14-hp-9245-01/i/G1394321/?q=G1394321

They have different kits, single- or multi-person. Different hoods, etc. I got the standard face shield, painting hood, and welding helmet.

Added benefit: much, much cooler working in the summer. Especially if you run a couple of loops of hose in an ice chest.

Not cheap, but cheaper than a trip to the ER.
 
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barrysuperhawk

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And now it seems we're back to the resp-po-rator. I guess that's what I will end up getting oh, and then immediately 3D print some filter adapters so I can use standard filters. Those are pump systems seem really cool but I know from trying to seal my cpap that I can't even use Vaseline to fake a seal, apparently my beard is too thick. Plus I have a lot wider of a range that I want to be able to use this set up to be Tethered to a tank or a pump
 
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kaiser715

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Those are pump systems seem really cool but I know from trying to seal my cpap that I can't even use Vaseline to fake a seal, apparently my beard is too thick. Plus I have a lot wider of a range that I want to be able to use this set up to be Tethered to a tank or a pump

No seal to worry about. On the hard facepiece for example, there is a fabric flap/collar that has elastic edge that fits loosely under your jaw. Positive air flow from top to bottom keeps the nasties out. Same with the paint hood. Air enters up top, comes down across your face, then out at the bottom part that's about shoulder level.

The hose isn't bad to work with at all. I got 100'. Recently used in a basement, in and out total distance was about 75'. Hose is light, but stiff enough to follow you without getting tripped on or hung up on stuff. It attaches to your belt, so it's not tugging at your neck/head/upper body all day.

My shop has a dedicated welding room, 20x20. When I get it fully set up, I will run a shorter air supply hose from the ceiling, maybe on a swing arm or balancer, so can reach pretty much the whole area without the hose being down where I can get my feet tangled up in it, etc.

It's a great solution, but definitely not the cheapest solution out there. One step up are the self-contained battery powered ones, but real $$$$...
 

rlitman

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And now it seems we're back to the resp-po-rator. I guess that's what I will end up getting oh, and then immediately 3D print some filter adapters so I can use standard filters. Those are pump systems seem really cool but I know from trying to seal my cpap that I can't even use Vaseline to fake a seal, apparently my beard is too thick. Plus I have a lot wider of a range that I want to be able to use this set up to be Tethered to a tank or a pump

A CPAP needs a minimal seal because it has a dedicated leak path (the exhaust vent). The PAPR has no such requirement and EXPECTS a minimal amount of leakage around the edges, so you're good to go.
 

e36jon

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Also, there are a bunch of PAPR systems that are self-contained, with a battery powered air pump that you wear on a waist-belt. That's what I bought so that I didn't have to worry about managing a hose as I used ladders or crawled around in enclosed spaces.

And, as mentioned above, there isn't a seal to deal with. Even so, with the organic cartridge on, I can't smell paint fumes at all.
 

boley

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Forum new guy, but long time safety and health guy here. Typically the best bet to provide respiratory protection for a bearded person is going to involve a positive pressure hood system as others have mentioned. This could be a supplied air system via a hose, or a belt mounted PAPR system. The belt style PAPR is likely the simplest and safest set up for a non-professional.

Any type of negative pressure face mask style respirator (paper mask, half face, full face) is not going to work properly with facial hair. The term negative pressure is key here. These face masks all work because our inhalation creates a negative pressure inside the sealed face mask. This negative pressure forces (***** in) air in through the cartridges. Facial hair is going to interfere with the seal. This will result in not enough air going through the cartridges and/or unfiltered air coming straight in via the broken seal.

The hood/helmet systems work for two reasons. First is they don't seal around the face. They typically loosely seal around the neck or don't seal at all. Second is that these systems constantly supply positive pressure to the breathing area. So even if there is a bad seal it is less of an issue because air is always being forced out and away from the user's breathing area.

The biggest issue with beard friendly systems is cost. You are going to spend $500 to $1500 for a proper PAPR or Abrasive Blasting setup. Please go this route and get appropriate training if you are going to be doing serious work with serious exposure to hazards such asbestos, silica, welding fumes, high concentrations of solvents such as when painting a car or other hazards. These are the types of set ups that commercial car painters tend to use.

All of that said, I have a full beard and have used paper dusk masks (n95), half face and full face respirators. I do this with the realization that the effectiveness is greatly reduced. I only do so in situations where I could probably go without any respirator. Even if the protection factor is reduced 80%, at least some of the bad stuff is being filtered out. However, I would not suggest this if working with solvent hazards such as painting cars in a poorly vented garage. Or mold remediation. Or welding stainless. Or asbestos. Or any real hazards.

I cannot post links, but if you google "assigned protection factors" you will find info a handy OSHA or NIOSH resource on the types of respirators and how much they protect you.

Also, in regards to that Resp-O-Rator thing. Please don't use that for anything but nuisance dust. It likely has basically the same use case as a paper dusk mask. It would not be appropriate for solvents, welding fumes, or basically anything but annoying wood dust.
 
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rlitman

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...Also, in regards to that Resp-O-Rator thing. Please don't use that for anything but nuisance dust. It likely has basically the same use case as a paper dusk mask. It would not be appropriate for solvents, welding fumes, or basically anything but annoying wood dust.

I've never seen one of these before, but looking at it now, I have to ask: How on earth can you justify that statement? It uses an exhalation valve and standard P100 filters. While not appropriate for solvents, all welding fumes that I am familiar with are adequately filtered by N95 filters, so a P100 is only better than that.
 

bradpac

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Just get a half mask, put it on, take a sharpie and mark around the edges, take it off and then trim any hair to the inside of the marks.
 
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barrysuperhawk

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I've never seen one of these before, but looking at it now, I have to ask: How on earth can you justify that statement? It uses an exhalation valve and standard P100 filters. While not appropriate for solvents, all welding fumes that I am familiar with are adequately filtered by N95 filters, so a P100 is only better than that.

I think what he's referring to is that the stock filters are not actually rated by anybody other than the manufacturer, and they are definitely not organic filters 4 Vapors. But I know that and that's why almost everybody that has these replaces the stock air filters which are expensive as hell with real filters using a little 3D printed adapter or some other type of adapter if they don't have a 3D printer. I do have a 3D printer so I don't think this is going to be an issue I just had to get nervous about things that are sold everywhere for exactly the same price, and use all proprietary parts. What I was hoping for in this thread was some other alternative that does the same basic function and maybe a little bit better format that did not require so much modification
 

rlitman

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I think what he's referring to is that the stock filters are not actually rated by anybody other than the manufacturer, and they are definitely not organic filters 4 Vapors. But I know that and that's why almost everybody that has these replaces the stock air filters which are expensive as hell with real filters using a little 3D printed adapter or some other type of adapter if they don't have a 3D printer. I do have a 3D printer so I don't think this is going to be an issue I just had to get nervous about things that are sold everywhere for exactly the same price, and use all proprietary parts. What I was hoping for in this thread was some other alternative that does the same basic function and maybe a little bit better format that did not require so much modification

My point is that organic vapors are not something produced by welding, and that activator carbon is not called for.

Also, Resp-O-Rator doesn't make their own filters, and the P100 rating is real (the OEM is not difficult to find on Google if you want to buy fitting filters by the case). 3M is by no means the end-all-be-all of respirators, even if they're one of the biggest.

If I could get my CPAP at a positive pressure of EIGHTEEN to seal 100%... my beard could stay IMHO.

What pressure do the SCBAs push?

Try a CPAP at 18 then talk about seals... You guys/gals must wear your mask loose.

A CPAP is designed to leak out of a defined leak path (the exhilation port), and has no exhilation valve. It takes a surprising amount of leakage for your machine to realize that it's leaking at all, since it is always flowing to some degree or another.

A negative pressure mask is absolutely undermined if there is any leakage. Totally different scenario.
 

NUTTSGT

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If I could get my CPAP at a positive pressure of EIGHTEEN to seal 100%... my beard could stay IMHO.

What pressure do the SCBAs push?

Try a CPAP at 18 then talk about seals... You guys/gals must wear your mask loose.

Our old Survivor Panther/Sigma had two regulators, the first stage regulator took it down from 4500 to about 100 PSI. The second stage brings it down to something like .03-.05 PSI or 1" of water column. With out breaking out a Survivair book, that's about as close as I get remember.


If you look on Govdeals, you could possibly find some SCBA stuff with the right group of part that would include some hip-packs and supplied air stuff for confined space. The right group of parts, you maybe able to build a concoction of sorts. The worst thing about that is using air that is not filtered. You might be surprised how dirty that air could be coming from your compressor.


Be careful out there. :beer:
 

PelicanPines

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.... snip ...


A CPAP is designed to leak out of a defined leak path (the exhilation port), and has no exhilation valve. It takes a surprising amount of leakage for your machine to realize that it's leaking at all, since it is always flowing to some degree or another.

A negative pressure mask is absolutely undermined if there is any leakage. Totally different scenario.

Wait... a negative pressure mask... do you mean a vacuum? Never heard of an actual negative pressure mask.

Heard of positive pressure and normal valued masks.

CPAP venting thru the port you speak of is pre calibrated. The machine knows exactly how much is forced thru the port. There is an inhalation valve that is not used when the machine is pushing air.

Most CPAP machines today have some type of pressure "relief" when it detects you are exhaling.

The machine in turn knows of the tiniest leak beyond what it expects from the port. Said port is there to prevent rebreathing air trapped in the cycle. Ensuring fresh air is always available to breath.

The data a CPAP machine gathers is mind boggling. I read my detailed report monthly. Which gives a minute to minute leak value.
 
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rlitman

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Wait... a negative pressure mask... do you mean a vacuum? Never heard of an actual negative pressure mask.

Heard of positive pressure and normal valued masks.

CPAP venting thru the port you speak of is pre calibrated. The machine knows exactly how much is forced thru the port. There is an inhalation valve that is not used when the machine is pushing air.

Most CPAP machines today have some type of pressure "relief" when it detects you are exhaling.

The machine in turn knows of the tiniest leak beyond what it expects from the port. Said port is there to prevent rebreathing air trapped in the cycle. Ensuring fresh air is always available to breath.

The data a CPAP machine gathers is mind boggling. I read my detailed report monthly. Which gives a minute to minute leak value.

If there is no pump, then it is a negative pressure mask. It relies on the relative negative pressure underneath the mask to draw air through the filters.

The vent port is only relatively pre-calibrated. The tolerances are shockingly low, but it shouldn't come as too much of a surprise considering that the machine is designed to accept a wide range of hose and mask combinations.

I don't see how the exhalation pressure "relief" feature, which goes by various trade names depending on the brand, is at all relative here.
 

kaiser715

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You might be surprised how dirty that air could be coming from your compressor.

Correct... Definitely don't use standard air compressor air for breathing. Suspended oils, no matter in what quantity, will ruin lungs. Permanently kind of ruined.

The supplied air systems use a dedicated compressor, that is designed for breathing systems.
 

Robbie B

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Positive pressure hood. It generates its on filtered air and pumps it in to a good making a positive pressure system. About 100-150 IIRC on Amazon last time I looked. If I start doing more painting on my woodwork projects I’m considering getting one.


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