Beginer MIG welding projects for cheap?

[The One]

I decided to learn how to weld and am in the process of finding a Miller 252. I need to weld brackets onto my Jeep, cage, and various patch panels to the body but I want the welds to look wonderful so I figured I'd learn first (and if that takes too long I'll just tack them and hire a mobile welder to finish them for me). How much practice do you guys think I'll need before I can lay dimes?

Anyway I'd like to start on some good small projects to learn on. Just something cheap but fun that if I throw away after I won't feel great loss, but also not something huge like a table that if I make mistakes on I'll have to live with. Any ideas?

 

[The One]

Also is there a good comparison and reviews of helmets and gloves?

 

[ishiboo]

I decided to learn how to weld and am in the process of finding a Miller 252. I need to weld brackets onto my Jeep, cage, and various patch panels to the body but I want the welds to look wonderful so I figured I'd learn first (and if that takes too long I'll just tack them and hire a mobile welder to finish them for me). How much practice do you guys think I'll need before I can lay dimes?

Anyway I'd like to start on some good small projects to learn on. Just something cheap but fun that if I throw away after I won't feel great loss, but also not something huge like a table that if I make mistakes on I'll have to live with. Any ideas?

I think you may be asking too much to start out with a test project or two and then get to laying dimes that fast. If you want it to look nice grind the welds when you're finished. Diablo, Pferd, etc. all have curved flap discs and the Diablo you can get at HD, Pferd at Menards, etc.

252 is a lot of welder for a body panel, and you'd probably have better luck with TIG... but you should be able to make a go of it.

 

[cvairwerks]

Will depend on how fast you can develop the skills. My nephew took about 60 hours of laying beads before he could lay a decent bead that didn't need grinding. I've seen others that pick it up in just a couple of hours. I've got probably a hundred hours between O/A, stick and TIG and if I'm lucky, I can do a quality looking bead here and there.

Some of the guys at the aircraft welding class I was at a couple of years ago managed to start laying some good O/A beads with about 2 hours of concentrated practice.

 

[jimgood]

Take a look through the Show us your welding projects thread. There are tons of useful projects in there.

One really easy project(that I actually need to do myself) is a "welder's third hand". Look it up on google images. There are lots of designs and it can be made from scrap. It's really useful for holding a small or awkward piece in place while you tack it.

 

[matt_i]

My Mig welder has been out of its hole approx 1 time in 7 years. Tig, however, used almost every other day. Mig welding is fast, like for production work, laying down a lot of metal in a hurry, which has its applications. But the Tig with its no splatter, weld-anything, is a lot more versatile. Its just slow when you have a 6 legged bench to put together.

 

[The One]

Interesting hearing about time it takes to learn. I've used a guy in town for some other welding last year and he seemed to do a nice job so as of right now I'll plan on tacking everything so I can get everything in place and do 98% of the work and having him finish the welds once my build in near completion or at the end of each big stage.

I still want to learn though and will be looking through the welding projects thread!

 

[The One]

My Mig welder has been out of its hole approx 1 time in 7 years. Tig, however, used almost every other day. Mig welding is fast, like for production work, laying down a lot of metal in a hurry, which has its applications. But the Tig with its no splatter, weld-anything, is a lot more versatile. Its just slow when you have a 6 legged bench to put together.

I basically have a bunch of brackets, braces, and tubes I need to tack before the final welds as I work on alignment, adjust, grind, reposition, etc. I expect tacking to be a required step in most of my projects going forward. This is regardless of my ability to weld. Would you recommend MIG or TIG for that step of projects?

When the time comes I will ask my welder if he can do TIG for my final welds. They'll probably look a lot nicer on the cage.

 

[crewchief888]

grab some scrap plate of the size you want to use for your brackets and tabs, and start burning wire.... most migs have a chart inside the cover that will get you in the ballpark for wire size, speed and heat.

with practice you'll get the hang of it.... i've never met a welder that was born wearing a welding hood and leathers...... we all started somewhere

think of it this way, when you next see all your jeep buddies, you can proudly state "i cut, formed, bent and welded this all myself" if you're nervous once you get past the fit up and tacking stage, tackle a weld in an inconspicuous place.

over the years,ive lost count of how many tabs, brackets, bumpers, rock sliders, and cage tubing ive welded together, as well as the SAS i did to my 10 blazer.

tig is great if your are using chrome-moly tubing, or are building your jeep to show...
personally i build for function 1st...


as far a protective gear, theres many choices out there, depending on your budget.
gloves all depend on what i'm welding and for how long.. anything from bare hands, brown jersey gloves, tillman fabricators gloves to heavy mig gloves. find a pair that fits you, and are comfortable.

i've never been much of a full leathers kinda welder, i wear green FRC pants and jackets, or sometimes just a long sleeve shirt.

seems like here on GJ theres 2 types of welders, the ones that have HF hoods, or nothing but a speedglass for me. hood fitment is a personal thing, i tried on a LOT of hoods that just didnt seem to fit "right"
personally i use a miller pro-hobby AD hood both in the garage and at work. it's under $150, (i got mine from cyberweld) and comes with extra cover plates.
if i'm feeling nostalgic i can choose from a jackson big J or fibremetal flip lens hood...

 

[LandofRath]

First project: Welding cart for your welder.
Second for me was a welding table

In between was just welding scraps together in different formations to practice.

 

[crewchief888]

i stick all kinds of "stuff" together for the wifes yard art.

 

[PNWguy]

Many, many hours.

However, you can get "good enough" in a few days to be able to weld strong, but not beautiful, welds.

As for "stack of dime" welds with MIG? I've seen very few non-professionals who can do that. Most of the weld **** is with TIG.

Build a welding table, welder cart, garage shelves... and after you've done a handful of projects, you'll probably be be OK. But don't throw away your grinder just yet.

 

[The One]

Here's the welds the fab shop in town did (where the body mount mates the frame, the weld of the body mount was done at an earlier time). I assume they're MIG since I found some lengths of wire stuck in a tight area when I painted after. These are nice looking enough for me and my use.

 

[The One]

Here's some holes he filled on the body. I should have taken a picture from behind too because there was a lap on that side.

 

[kazlx]

Mig is going to be way more suited for what you sound like you want. You won’t regret getting a 252.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Practice, practice, practice and having a good machine does make a difference when you're trying to learn. You can weld without having to fight the equipment.

An auto-darkening helmet will help also, I never got the grasp of trying to flip down a helmet .

 

[joe49]

Mig will be the easiest to pick up and get productive with.

Tig will be the longest to become proficient with, then stick, O2/Ac, and then Mig.

When you get good with Mig you're not a Welder, rather you can Mig weld.

 

[Lelandwelds]

Forget the TIG for now--for years really. Many more tons are welded with mig. The MM252 is an impressive machine. Weld a bit thinner than 16 gauge up to 1/2 in a single pass with the same .035 ER70S-6 wire and same 75/25. Just spin one dial.

https://www.millerwelds.com/industries/welding-projects

https://www.millerwelds.com/resources/video-library#/?filters[0].key=processes_sm&filters[0].value=2ee1e49f7bb749328c9b1fd8f9d5d0c5

 

[The One]

Forget the TIG for now--for years really. Many more tons are welded with mig. The MM252 is an impressive machine. Weld a bit thinner than 16 gauge up to 1/2 in a single pass with the same .035 ER70S-6 wire and same 75/25. Just spin one dial.

https://www.millerwelds.com/industries/welding-projects

https://www.millerwelds.com/resources/video-library#/?filters[0].key=processes_sm&filters[0].value=2ee1e49f7bb749328c9b1fd8f9d5d0c5

Leland thanks for the PMs a few weeks ago. I really have made no progress since then pricing out a machine. At this point buying online and having it delivered right to my door is looking like the easiest option if it's going to cost me the savings in gas driving to pick up the unit. And I get to avoid their judgement. I suppose I'll have to go there anyway to pick up gas though. And probably will need to get steel from them too.

Are there different qualities of ER70S-6 (cheapest is the same as expensive?)? Does it have a lifespan (any reason NOT to get the biggest spool now?)?

 

[BD1]

Here's the welds the fab shop in town did (where the body mount mates the frame, the weld of the body mount was done at an earlier time). I assume they're MIG since I found some lengths of wire stuck in a tight area when I painted after. These are nice looking enough for me and my use.

Why didn't they wrap the corners?? Maybe post and checkout Weldingweb.
http://weldingweb.com/forum.php

 

[The One]

Why didn't they wrap the corners?? Maybe post and checkout Weldingweb.
http://weldingweb.com/forum.php

For drainage.

 

[sberry]

I agree with Leland on this, the 252 is about as good as it gets for this. I am with this, I can tig, I have the machine, I dont. I fab on most work days and havnt turned my tig on in 15 years.
2nd pic has a stop to adjust a volt to try to get the spatter out. The first a Hobart 210 030, the second Linc 255 which is about a pain in the rear, I should have returned it. Never was much to write home about.

 

[BD1]

For drainage.

Never thought of that. Thanks

 

[darwyn]

Our local industrial supply house sells scraps, although they won't call them scraps . They have no issue dealing with the public, and their scrap prices are great.

 

[crewchief888]

Are there different qualities of ER70S-6 (cheapest is the same as expensive?)? Does it have a lifespan (any reason NOT to get the biggest spool now?)?

my suggestion is to stay with a brand name wire, hobart, lincoln, ect.
seems like off brand wire, (from a big box store or HF) just "refuses" to weld, and causes me more problems that what i "saved" buying cheap wire.

be aware that mig wire will "rust" how fast, all depends on humidity levels in your garage. i buy 10 lb spools of lincoln .035 flux core, (i can get them from HD for the same price as a LWS) i keep a couple 2lb spools of lincoln .023 if i need them, both are still factory sealed.

ive had flux core get dirty, and not want to run, i'll run out 10 or 15 ft of it, cut it off and continue on with business....

 

[sberry]

Wire is all over the place. I got some generic from the LWS I thought may be iffy, some of the best I have used, right there with the L56 then,,,,,, they were out of that and stock Washington Alloy so I think great,,, ****. The Hobart is good. I like about all the Hobart stuff. I bought some Radnor lo hy,,, do not think it was as good as the Hobart but I don't weld a lot anymore, I am not super fussy anyway.

 

[The One]

After watching some videos of TIG welding it seems like it'd be more relaxing and quiet. Having done a lot of electronics work, the process seems similar to soldering.

Is there a "one size fits all" for TIG setups, cups, wire, etc? I like that with MIG I'll be able to do basically everything I want to do (aside from body work) with a single wire and gas mix -- just need to adjust a few knobs based on a chart for metal thickness. If I can go with a single known setup for TIG and not have to play heavily with setting it up for each weld I might consider it more (or maybe 2 setups I can go between, one for structural, one for body).

I signed up for a two afternoon welding 101 class in a few weeks. Hopefully that'll help me get some hands on time so I can feel a bit more confident in my purchase!

 

[kazlx]

Tig is definitely more relaxing to me, but the learning curve is usually way steeper for most people. If you have decent hand/eye coordination, you can pick it up a little quicker. Tig is way more of a one size fits all than Mig. You can weld pretty much anything just using the correct filler. Mig is basically steel only unless you change setups. There are different cups and stuff for Tig, but most is based on need.

Unless you need to get to tight spaces or have other requirements, you can weld most stuff with 3/32 tungsten, something like a number 8 cup and whatever back cap you get. It's not very expensive to add stuff as you go if you need it for something specific.

 

[sberry]

While there are more things can be done with tig it is not the workhorse in small shops. I make 100's of repairs a year, able to do them with a wire feeder. In maintenance most stuff in the world that breaks is steel, its still a steel world, lighter than it used to be.
I can tig, rather well actually. I have one, havnt turned it on in 15 years. When I absolutely have to do alum to save myself I use a spooly on a mig.
The machine I use the most is in the second pic, 95% of the time followed by the AC/DC buzzer followed by the 255 mig on rare occasion that time is money and material cost make it a concern.

 

[sberry]

I got a lot of stuff most don't have, I have alum because I need it. I have 10 miles of pipe and hundreds of fittings but for the most part disregarding that I can count on one hand the other stuff I would have needed it to repair, a bud with 1 would have been just as well. With a feeder, hundreds of repairs on cars alone, really thousands over the years.

 

[The One]

Thanks for weighing in guys.

sberry, you are correct, 99% of what I will be welding is steel.

I don't necessarily need fast since most of my work will be as a hobby and not to keep a production running. Not having the splatter is attractive to me if it means that there will be less setup and less clean up. But I also don't want to quit my job and go to a welding school for a year to be able to use whatever method/machine I choose. Preferably I'd like to be able to consistently produce solid welds that look decent within the first several weeks.

 

[The One]

Some of my metals may be rusty/pitted. I can grind them down to solid metal but they aren't new obviously. Is that an issue for TIG and more than MIG?

 

[RM209]

I recommend that you consider taking a welding class at the local community college. Thy’ll teach the basics including metal prep, setting up the welder and metal, and will have plenty of steel for welding. Many are offered at night or on Saturdays.

RM209

 

[sberry]

Yes, it is a bit more of an issue. If the goal is to fart around then tig is good, if it is to build stuff then mig is where it's at, hence why it's so widely used. It's also used due to the speed and the cost. Materials and gas use are expensive for work that doesn't require it.
The reason I make these points is,,,,,,, I try to act like a value added salesman here and help you get the RIGHT machine for you. There is no loss of sale to me so I can emphasize that what you want may not really be it. Second, I relate my experience where it matches the need. I been at this a while and am a career welder so this has changed but if I related it from the perspective of being a specialty shop owner it may be different or where my legitimate expertise comes from as an Ironworker in stick or Innershield running a box of 5/32 or roll of wire in a day or welding rusty factory repairs,,, or welding pipe where the procedure was dictated then it may not be right for you.
If I relate from the perspective of general work, light fab, diy, maintenance and working on some cars and pickup trucks it probably matches closer to the needs of most first timers on a forum like this that is unsure of themselves and what they need barring a specialty.
Most people,,, with the disclaimer of most,,, that are getting a reccomendation of anything besides a 200 class mig are as likely to be getting poor advice as good.

 

[DakotaMan]

I recommend that you consider taking a welding class at the local community college. Thy’ll teach the basics including metal prep, setting up the welder and metal, and will have plenty of steel for welding. Many are offered at night or on Saturdays.

RM209

Do those teach enough for auto work? Like welding exhaust seams?

 

[fordkid88]

After watching some videos of TIG welding it seems like it'd be more relaxing and quiet. Having done a lot of electronics work, the process seems similar to soldering.

Is there a "one size fits all" for TIG setups, cups, wire, etc? I like that with MIG I'll be able to do basically everything I want to do (aside from body work) with a single wire and gas mix -- just need to adjust a few knobs based on a chart for metal thickness. If I can go with a single known setup for TIG and not have to play heavily with setting it up for each weld I might consider it more (or maybe 2 setups I can go between, one for structural, one for body).

I signed up for a two afternoon welding 101 class in a few weeks. Hopefully that'll help me get some hands on time so I can feel a bit more confident in my purchase!

My goal this year was to teach my self tig welding. The learning curve is steep but doable. I have found that tig welding out of position shows little to no forgiveness. Having been tig welding for a month I will say that it is really peaceful until you dip you electrode but it happens. As far a welder I got the everlast 206p, it has HF start and as good for anything but aluminum and it has a built plasma cutter making awesome for small fabrication

 

[sberry]

My neighbor is a master. He can run any of the machines at expert level. He hasn't been over but once in the last 15 years to weld a stitch of alum since he got a Miller 180. It's the only machine he has and it's not cause he can't use something else, it's that it does the work he wants to do. He is a poster case for this forum, home/hobby, some cars, pickup truck, some machine tools, a garden, a lawn, a few other things. Builds a metal brake or 2 and other tools. Maybe more than a lot could dream up but he doesn't let his past experience cloud what he wants to do now.
BTW, he did a fair amount of body work, me too,,,, so does the body shop down the road, not once used a tig for it. About 99 percent of the world's body work is done mig 023 wire.

 

[kazlx]

You just need to decide what you want to do. It is very easy to learn the basics of a Mig and from there, it's hood time. For what you want, there's nothing wrong with a 110V machine. If you decide you need more power, keep it loaded with small stuff for thinner metals and buy a 220V machine for other projects.

 

[ovrrdrive]

Go to Lincoln Welding Foundation's website. They have some assortments of steel coupons you can order relatively cheap (if you order multiple sets you get a break on shipping). they also have a few little model's you can buy to weld together to keep it interesting. The year I started welding I watched every video Jody had on youtube at Welding Tips and Tricks, and a a bunch of chuckie2000's videos as well. I came home from work everyday for months and hit the chair in the garage and ran beads. It's really remarkable how fast you can pick it up. As mentioned above you need seat and wire time. That's it.

I think I bought 5 boxes of coupons from Lincoln when I started and still have some it in my toolbox. The metal they send out is new and clean and sheared off. It's great metal to start with. See if this link works:

http://www.jflf.org/SearchResults.asp?Cat=79

 

[IMStuner]

Go to Lincoln Welding Foundation's website. They have some assortments of steel coupons you can order relatively cheap (if you order multiple sets you get a break on shipping). they also have a few little model's you can buy to weld together to keep it interesting. The year I started welding I watched every video Jody had on youtube at Welding Tips and Tricks, and a a bunch of chuckie2000's videos as well. I came home from work everyday for months and hit the chair in the garage and ran beads. It's really remarkable how fast you can pick it up. As mentioned above you need seat and wire time. That's it.

I think I bought 5 boxes of coupons from Lincoln when I started and still have some it in my toolbox. The metal they send out is new and clean and sheared off. It's great metal to start with. See if this link works:

http://www.jflf.org/SearchResults.asp?Cat=79

Thanks I just ordered.

I decided to learn how to weld and am in the process of finding a Miller 252. I need to weld brackets onto my Jeep, cage, and various patch panels to the body but I want the welds to look wonderful so I figured I'd learn first (and if that takes too long I'll just tack them and hire a mobile welder to finish them for me). How much practice do you guys think I'll need before I can lay dimes?

Anyway I'd like to start on some good small projects to learn on. Just something cheap but fun that if I throw away after I won't feel great loss, but also not something huge like a table that if I make mistakes on I'll have to live with. Any ideas?

How much are you looking to spend on the Miller 252? I just purchased a HTP pro pulse 200 myself since all the used miller stuff are over priced in my area.